Roof top sleeping idea

[snowbrock]

I have been lurking for months and am very impressed with all of your rigs and adventures. A few weeks ago, I got a 2006 Tacoma Doublecab short bed 4wd sr5 and have been thinking about alll the ways I want to modify it to be tough enough to participate in a Baja trip.

Anyway, in considering sleeping accommodations I have an idea that hasn't been discussed too much in the forums. I would like to weld up a ladder rack (one that would rest on the bed rails and attach to the new tacoma rack system) The top (expanded steel mesh) would be at least 4x8 to accommodate plywood and drywall sheets when necessary but also big enough for a small rectangular 2-man tent. I believe that a rack like that would be more functional and much less expensive than a roof-top tent (hannibal, maggiola, ezy-awn, etc.).

I wouldn't carry weight up there on the trail (maybe just a fabbed-up ladder) I would use the bed for all the heavy stuff. The ladder/safari rack would also make a great place to attach lights, showers, solar panels, etc..

It would get me off the ground in case of rain, critters, rocks, etc. like a $1500 roof-top tent would, but also be rigged up to accommodate kayaks, canoes, bikes, etc.

I am posting because I am sure that you all have opinions and I would like to know what you think. I have some experience, but would like to hear what you all think.

[Scott Brady]

Welcome to the forum, and great idea. I have seen several vehicles do similar.

You may also want to consider a solution like this:

Tent Cot:
http://www.tentcot.com/images/64069_ts.jpg

I would also consider just sleeping out in the elements on the roof, and if the rain or bad weather comes, use the ground tent idea you mention.

Oh, and congrats on the Tacoma :rappel:

[flyingwil]

Greetings, and welcome!

In reponse to your quest for input, I am insure of how you plan to do this.

Are you planning a regular or tube tent on your roof rack?
If so I could forsee temperatures, and winds being an issue that you would have to adress. For example the wind is going to blow under the tent with it on a roof rack and flooring would become the issue.

I am sure others will chime in.

[Mlachica]

I've been thinking about this for a while as well. You can have your steel mesh for regular storage such as camping eqpt. If you know you're going to put a tent up there I'd have some plywood as the base. I'd most likely use the same tent everytime, if I'd use a tent at all (like what scott mentioned), so you know where to put some anchoring points for the tent. As for the plywood, I'd cut it to the size of your platform to protect your tent flooring from the elements and use it as a means to secure the tent. You can cover the plywood in marine grade fabric to protect the underside of the tent/or tent footprint. Or maybe you can find some sort of acrylic, have it custom cut.

I think I'm still leaning towards an eezi-awn. One reason being, ease of setup - no tent 'pitching.' Something about the eezi-awn and other tents seem safer than a traditional tent on the roof???

[robert]

I had thought about something similar too. My idea was to build the rack as a ladder rack, etc in the same OD (outside diameter ~1.129") as Yakima tubes so that I could use their accesories.

For setting up a tent or having a platform for photography, watching horse racing, etc all you would have to do is have a sheet of thin marine grade plywood (really any outdoor rated plywood would work) and cover it with outdoor carpet for slip resistence and to protect the tent from splinters. You could easily attach it with conduit straps from the hardware store.

Attaching light to the rear is easy enough if you weld a couple of tabs on it.

It is easy to clamp another piece of tubing to the rack to hang a solar shower or water bag from as well as attach an awning. You could make it as elaborate as you wanted but I would try to keep the weight down (aluminum maybe) so as to keep your center of gravity down.

As an added note, I had designed mine with a horizontal bar or two on each side so that it would prevent folks from breaking in and getting stuff out and you could always tie stuff on RatPatrol style :arabia: . The ladder would secure in brackets across the rear window of the camper to help keep it secure. Yes, I daydream a lot more than I should.

[snowbrock]

Thank you fellas for your timely responses. I had thought that the expanded steel mesh (even if rhinolined as I have planned) would be tough on the bottom of a tent and that it might also require some thermal insulation. Instead of plywood, I was thinking about closed cell foam- half inch or thicker, cut to size- like a tent footprint. I could roll it up and stow it in the bed or even up top when on the road.

Of course, an ezy-awn, hannibal or other roof-top tent, being made of heavy canvas and insulated from the bottom is going to be much warmer. Weight isn't much of an issue to the companies who produce them, comfort is. I think the right tent for my application would be a 3-season backpacking tent, lightweight and not well insulated. Does everyone think that wind blowing below as well as above the tent could make it much colder than a roof-top tent or colder than setting up the same tent on the ground?

[Scott Brady]

I always thought it would be interesting to use an aircraft structural honeycomb panel for roof rack flooring. This type is also insulating and VERY light. http://www.nida-core.com/english/fusion.htm

[robert]

That Honeycomb material is pretty amazing stuff- isn't that what they used as panels for the latest Turtle Exp truck?

I liked the idea of a tubular rack- think of a Yakima Load Warrior without the sides, just flat- for everyday use (less wind resistance, could clamp stuff to it etc) but if it had enough cross bars (wouldn't have to be many really) it would distribute the weight on the plywood (which will support a good bit itself)- I figured a 1/4" sheet would be plenty unless you really wanted to jump around up there. The carpet would provide minimal insulation and keep things from sliding. It would be very easy to secure with those conduit clamps when you needed it and remove when you didn't.

For insulation inside the tent, I would look at getting some closed cell foam. The stuff is expensive but insulates better than the open cell and won't absorb moisture- you might try picking up some sleeping pads from an army navy store. When sleeping in the back of my old Tacoma, I had plywood down with carpet on top and I'd throw an old wool army blanket down and then two Thermorest pads and then climb in my sleeping bag. It worked well enough for me. A couple of my friends in the VW bus club (I have an old Westy too) use those battery powered electric blankets hooked into their auxilliary battery. In my bus, I have that so called "NASA" insulation on the metal beneath the open cel sleeping pads and I just pile the blankets on top of me.

Speaking of wool army blankets, if you can find the Italian wool officer's blankets they are awesome- they weigh like 5 pounds each and are nice and thick and large. If you are really worried about being cold you could line the inside of the tent with that and/or get one of those Coleman Catalytic heater (be sure to vent).

Honestly, I drove my Tacoma down Baja without a ton of mods (I think at that point it only had the camper shell on it and plywood in the back- my cousin and I live out of it for three weeks that way); they can make the trip more comfortable, but unless you're running hard they aren't mandatory. Carry the extra stuff you normally do including extra fuel, food and water and you'll be good to go.

[paulj]

There is a lighter weight roof top tent, that looks like a two person cot tent

http://www.everythingsuv.com/oasis_tents_main-esuv.asp

[Scott Brady]

There is a lighter weight roof top tent, that looks like a two person cot tent

http://www.everythingsuv.com/oasis_tents_main-esuv.asp

Paul, you always find the coolest stuff :) That would be interesting to trial.

[Mlachica]

Instead of plywood, I was thinking about closed cell foam- half inch or thicker, cut to size- like a tent footprint. I could roll it up and stow it in the bed or even up top when on the road.

Does everyone think that wind blowing below as well as above the tent could make it much colder than a roof-top tent or colder than setting up the same tent on the ground?

I think if you have the right sleeping bag, and a thick 3" mattress, you'd be warm enough.

[snowbrock]

yeah, I was thinking that I would mostly be sleeping up there in warmer climates, southern utah, arizona, baja. It probably wouldn't need to be very well insulated. It would be great to sleep, as scott mentioned earlier, under the stars on nice nights. The tent would be good for rainy or windy nights or for privacy. A 3-inch open cell pad would make the inside pretty cozy, though.

[Scott Brady]

This is still my favorite sleeping method...

http://www.expeditionswest.com/adventures/2005/mojave_road/images/images/DSCF7579_JPG.jpg

[Nullifier]

:camping: On a cot no doubt Thats hilarious Scott! I do not think I have slept on one since pre scouting days LOL! I use a 3" Paco Pad for sleeping on. I guess the cot is a plus to help the ground critters stay off you.

Unfortunetly since I have a no boat, no trip rule. I can not run a roof top tent. I think they are cool but can't see rigging a rack that is tall enough to fit the heavy tent and then even higher for a boat! Or having to hassle with loading and unloading boats to set up the tent. I guess I'll be a ground camper for a long time.

[snowbrock]

Yeah, the more I think about this safari-rack the more I like it. I like the idea of the rack being something like a turtle shell (easily removed and replaced again), especially since I am not excited about cutting up or otherwise permanently changing my brand new truck. Since I obviously use the tacoma as a daily driver, being able to attach the rack in order to make it expedition ready seems like a pretty cool idea.

[Super Doody]

There is a lighter weight roof top tent, that looks like a two person cot tent

http://www.everythingsuv.com/oasis_tents_main-esuv.asp


Wow that thing is cool and light weight. Looks like I still storage surfboards on top. I wonder comfortable it is. Thanks for the link.

[devinsixtyseven]

I like the idea of the rooftop "shelf" where you can put anything you want, as long as you're ok pitching a tent up there (or pitching on the ground and hucking it up) it sounds like a very good solution.

I do think tho that the difference between a "standard" rooftop tent and pitching a normal ground tent on a roof rack is ease of pitching and stowing, and comfort. Personally I'd be more inclined to just leave a ground tent on the ground rather than try to pitch it or move it on top of the vehicle. I do see a benefit tho in that 3-season, you can put an air mattress up there, get off rough terrain, get a better view, and probably sleep more comfortably...plus you're guaranteed a place to tie it down, extend the fly and whatnot.

That Oasis II is really nice! But is it 3-season or 4-season? Anyone know?

[rusty_tlc]

The Oasis is neat, but it looks a lot like a double size Tentcot.

Oasis $985
Double Tent Cot $310

I think I could saw the legs off a Tent cot and figure out some clamps to save $675.

Edit: I just saw the other pictures of the Oasis, when it is setting on the ground it looks almost exactly like the double tentcot. Legs and all.

[LUISJG]

double tent cot is 200 on amazon

[Bergger]

5220

I love my tent cot. It certainly has some disadvantages over the high quality roof top tents, not breathable fabric (condensation), can't fold it up with your bedding in it. But hey for the price, $260 with the rain fly, it's a great deal. I've been completly taking it down when I travel but this year I'm going to try to bolt it to the platform so all I have to do is unfold and throw in the comfy 4" sleeping pads and sleeping bags.

[devinsixtyseven]

How much condensate do you get in there? Is there a way to vent it, or install a ventilation panel...even if it's a piece of mesh near the top, under the fly?

Honestly I don't know which I'd prefer. I've camped in warm, humid climates when the night temp goes below the dew point, and frankly it just feels sticky in the morning.

[Bergger]

How much condensate do you get in there? Is there a way to vent it, or install a ventilation panel...even if it's a piece of mesh near the top, under the fly?

Honestly I don't know which I'd prefer. I've camped in warm, humid climates when the night temp goes below the dew point, and frankly it just feels sticky in the morning.


As far as the condensation, it all depends on the weather. The tent cot has screens on all four sides so if it is warm enough out and you have them partially open the condesation is not bad at all. I did camp once last year and had the rain fly on, due to an absolutely terrible storm and cool weather, and the condensation was pretty bad. The rain fly does not allow for good ventitlation so I only use it when absolutely necessary. All in all i've been happy with it. I've got two 4" thick self inflating pads and a double sleeping bag that I use and it is very comfortable. the domed roof is also nice for sitting up and changing. I got in one without the domed roof and hated it. I plan on using it a lot more this summer. I've got a few more pics of it on my web page and when I bought mine Amazon was the cheapest.

[K2RVR]

Just saw this thread on the Oasis. If anyone has questions on it and would like to see pictures, let me know. The Oasis is a very high quality tent, and extremely comfortable. It is hard to tell by the pictures but everyone who lays in it is impressed. A far better option than the Tent-Cot. I have a tent cot as well and am not very impressed.

If you are concerned about a lot of weight affecting your COG, but want a high quality and comfortable RTT, this is a great option. It is also very easy to mount with only the 2 bars and can go in any direction on your rig.

Anyone who has slept in one should chime in, they are amazing.

[Schattenjager]

OK - I'll bite - where is the $ difference between the Oasis and the Tent Cot? Why would I be happy I spent the extra $ for the Oasis?

Once I get home to CO, I plan on getting an RTT but price is is a huge factor. It takes a lot of $ to get ready for an RTT - suspension, ARB bumper, lights - you know - gotta make sure the tent has a good home and all. I really like the idea of being able to easily remove the tent as my Tacoma is a DD too. Hurking an Ez Awn around can't be fun - or good for the tent.


If anyone has questions on it and would like to see pictures, let me know. The Oasis is a very high quality tent, and extremely comfortable. It is hard to tell by the pictures but everyone who lays in it is impressed. A far better option than the Tent-Cot. I have a tent cot as well and am not very impressed.

...they are amazing.

[Super Doody]

All those who are interested in oasis rtt should read this thread here:

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=78941#post78941

The oasis 5 from the pictures looks like a quailty RTT with the half the weight of other popular and more $$ models .

[stevenmd]

The Oasis is a pretty cool RTT. I thought about purchasing one for my boys to sleep in instead of buying two RTT's - one for me & the Mrs. and one for the kids...

[Mike S]

If you are determined to develop a usable tent/sleeping platform fo the roof, there are a couple materials that would work well as a deck - Baltek is perhaps the best and lightest. It is end grain balsa laminated with fiber glass cloth and resin. Very light and strong, and used in boat building when these properties are important. Avalable in several thicknesses - 5/8" or 3/4" would insulate and be very strong.

Baja has a lot of wind. Chose a tent with a low 'sail' area, and think about the tent only as a place to sleep - not to use like a larger traditional tent. Provide plenty of attachment points so that wind stress is well distributed. The best mattress is probably closed cell foam with a zip-off, washable cover.

Be careful to select tent materials that are breathable and still waterproof. Separate insect screens are very important as well.

Good luck with your project!

Mike S

[lowenbrau]

I used a four season tent on the lid of my trailer for years. (and bivouacked on the bare roof for years before that) It was really not much different than the RTT which I bought to try and make more room in the truck. In retrospect a roof rack like you are talking about and a roof top box for the tent and bedding would have been nearly as effective.