FWC overhang

[Dave]

What are everyones thoughts on using an FWC Eagle in a 5' truck bed? The tail gate would have to be in the down position of course. I went to the FWC dealer in Wisconsin today to look around at some different sizes. The owner of the dealership that was showing me around seemed to think the larger Eagle would be the way to go, but I'm not sure I like the overhang.

My immediate concerns are the obvious overhang as well as the additional weight that much further behind the axle.

Any other thoughts?

[kcowyo]

Dave, for distraction.....

Similar but different. You might like to see these - (http://www.mrjohnson.org/FWC.html)

http://www.mrjohnson.org/fwcphotos/20.jpg

http://www.mrjohnson.org/fwcphotos/15.jpg


It may not be as neat asthetically as a bed length unit, but I doubt you would be unhappy with the extra space. The Falcon is nice but the larger Eagle may be a better fit for the two of you. Add in a couple of dogs and the space gets gobbled up fast.

There are several owners who run a slightly longer camper with the tailgate down. ExPo member Tomas Tierra runs his Ranger on a xcab Tundra with a slight bit of overhang. It doesn't stop him from going to some amazing places. If you beef up the rear suspension with airbags, an add-a-leaf or helper springs, I doubt it would have a big effect the trucks handling.

FWIW, I'm guessing there is a larger resale market for the bigger Eagle than a Falcon. I'm guessing...

You can't go wrong either way, with a 5' or 6.5' model.

[Dave]

KC,

Thanks for weighing in once again. Your FWC bookmark folder must be massive! It does not look like the overhang is much of hinderance at all

The better resale on the Eagle was one of the reasons why the dealer in Wisconsin was suggesting we go that direction, plus the obvious gain in space. He also had an Eagle shell in stock.

[kcowyo]

Your FWC bookmark folder must be massive!
It's rather embarassing...


He also had an Eagle shell in stock.

Is this the sole reason you went to Wisconsin...? :lurk:

[Dave]

Is this the sole reason you went to Wisconsin...? :lurk:

Yep. We spent the weekend in Chicago visiting friends, but the main reason we went north was to look at FWC's in the flesh. We came home with a lot to think about and a greater appreciation for our relatively tame winters. Natasha likes the camper itself and is even coming up with pro's that I had not thought of, but the sticker shock is a tough one.

[Ursidae69]

It's rather embarassing...


That's funny. :xxrotflma

Dave: Any pics from the factory?

[kcowyo]

We came home with a lot to think about and a greater appreciation for our relatively tame winters. Natasha likes the camper itself and is even coming up with pro's that I had not thought of, but the sticker shock is a tough one.

Another selling point for an Eagle. More selection on the used market unless you have specific needs and "must have" a new unit....?

Did I send you links for shopping purposes?

If the spouse is on-board that makes a big difference. I'm sure you will appreciate the ease of set up and the capability of the camper. She may likely appreciate the comfort and security of it. The only complaints I ever read from FWC owning couples is when they are ready to move up in size to something more luxurious.

Oh and as a duck guy, you will certainly appreciate the "animal blindness" of a FWC. I see more cool critters from my windows, meandering through my campsites, unaware that I'm inside. Another benefit you won't find in the brochures.

[Dave]

Dave: Any pics from the factory?

We visited a dealership in Wisconsin - not the factory. http://www.go-anywhere.us/ Basically it consisted of a small heated metal building filled with FWC's, two wheel drive motorcycles, and those weird kayak/jet ski hybrids. I didn't take any pictures.


Another selling point for an Eagle. More selection on the used market unless you have specific needs and "must have" a new unit....?

Did I send you links for shopping purposes?

If the spouse is on-board that makes a big difference. I'm sure you will appreciate the ease of set up and the capability of the camper. She may likely appreciate the comfort and security of it. The only complaints I ever read from FWC owning couples is when they are ready to move up in size to something more luxurious.

Oh and as a duck guy, you will certainly appreciate the "animal blindness" of a FWC. I see more cool critters from my windows, meandering through my campsites, unaware that I'm inside. Another benefit you won't find in the brochures.

Yep, you sent a long list of links to me a couple weeks ago. I've been monitoring them here and there. ;)

I certainly don't require a new unit, but it's unlikely that I'll find a used one that is close. The dealership in Wisconsin is probably the most convenient option I have...and that's over 350 miles away!

I thought I might be able to save some money by buying a new shell and then adding options. For instance, we don't need a sink, an ice box, or a standard fridge. I'd rather do another Engle, a heater, Yakima tracks (since I already own the rest of necessary Yakima equipment for a canoe rack), aux battery, and an awning. But then you look at the price of shell (which doesn't even include curtains), plus the options we want, and it's nearly cheaper to buy the standard unit and get all the cabinetry and the stove along with it. In fact, the shell Falcon with the options we wanted was right around the same price as if I were to buy a standard Eagle plus a few more bells/whistles (three way fridge and awning). Not to mention the Eagle has a fold out couch, which is not even an option on the Falcon!

Basically, we're just looking for a place to sleep that sets up easy and is off the ground, has room for the dogs to crash, and has storage for our all of our food. Natasha is not interested in cooking inside of it and I don't want to have to pull a trailer.

FWC fits, but the new unit prices seem weird when you start comparing the shell vs. standard models.

[kcowyo]

Interesting news about the prices. Maybe because they make less Falcons than Eagles...? I really don't know.

Re the options - it sounds like you both have put a lot of thought into what your needs are. I could live without the 14 gallon water tank although I like the sink a lot. I would rather have a stand-up fridge in the galley than a seperate Engel taking up floor or cab space. The heater, absolutely. I use the stove inside quite often. It's nice to step out in the chilly morning and greet the day with a hot cuppa, already in hand.

I wish I had the awning. For me to add it now would entail relocating one of the roof clasps. The aux battery is key, especially with the heater and electric thermostat. I know erod has his pups sleeping on his couch and they're good sized dogs. That way they're out of the way in the middle of the night when you have to hop down and run behind a tree.

I wish I could be more help than just a sounding board. I had a lot of pre-buying jitters as well (mine was used, no warranties) but Jonathan Hanson did some stellar salesmanship to alleviate my concerns. But it still took me 2 years of looking regularly before I found one in my neighborhood and budget.

Just out of curiosity, did the folks in WI talk to you about financing? I'm curious if these can be financed for a longer term like other RV's...?

[OutbacKamper]

My immediate concerns are the obvious overhang as well as the additional weight that much further behind the axle.
Any other thoughts?

Dave;
I know that the Eagle is much roomier than the Falcon, but I would be very careful. The amount of rear overhang is not a critical issue in my opinion, but the centre of gravity v rear axle is. I would check with Stan at 4wc HQ and get his opinion. The Falcon was specifically designed for your style of truck, while the Eagle was designed for a longer bed (and more importantly a longer rear axle to rear of cab dimension). No disrespect to the owner of the Toyota in the above pics is intended, but I would not even consider that to be safe! BTW check out the rear cargo carrier on the Toyota!!

Good luck with what ever you decide.

Cheers
Mark

[Dave]

Re the options - it sounds like you both have put a lot of thought into what your needs are. I could live without the 14 gallon water tank although I like the sink a lot. I would rather have a stand-up fridge in the galley than a seperate Engel taking up floor or cab space. The heater, absolutely. I use the stove inside quite often. It's nice to step out in the chilly morning and greet the day with a hot cuppa, already in hand.

I think we've thought through what our needs and wants are, but it's always tough to be sure until you've gone through the paces a few times. We have zero experience camping in anything except for a small ground tent. It's tough for me to transfer that experience towards making smart decisions when outfitting something like an FWC.

I hear ya on the stand-up fridge vs. Engel. I guess the reason I was leaning towards an Engel is for efficiency purposes. The more I step back and look at that logic, the more I think it doesn't matter unless the the stand-up fridge is a lot less efficient. I am planning on charging the aux battery off the truck charging system, so I'm probably over thinking the fridge option. And to be truthful, I have not even done my homework to see what the specs are on the stand-up fridge.

I feel the opposite on the water situation. Since we're planning on doing our cooking outside (Natasha's decision and I won't cross what a lady thinks on that topic...), I don't see us using a sink too often. However, I would think a water tank would be great! Right now we use two 7 gallon portable water containers that are a hassle to refill. Of course, what good is a big water tank without a way to get the water out in a graceful manner? Another point for the sink!


I wish I had the awning. For me to add it now would entail relocating one of the roof clasps. The aux battery is key, especially with the heater and electric thermostat. I know erod has his pups sleeping on his couch and they're good sized dogs. That way they're out of the way in the middle of the night when you have to hop down and run behind a tree.

I wish I could be more help than just a sounding board. I had a lot of pre-buying jitters as well (mine was used, no warranties) but Jonathan Hanson did some stellar salesmanship to alleviate my concerns. But it still took me 2 years of looking regularly before I found one in my neighborhood and budget.

The awning is one of those things I thought Natasha would balk at, but to my surprise, she actually brought it up first. Since she wants to do the cooking outside, it makes sense to have an awning in case it's raining.

We're also planning on putting the dogs on the couch if we end up with a fold out couch.

Having you and the rest of this forum as a sounding board has been a huge help, both to alleviate the pre-buying jitters you speak of as well as to help me think through some of the decisions involved with outfitting one of these campers. Very helpful to say the least.


Just out of curiosity, did the folks in WI talk to you about financing? I'm curious if these can be financed for a longer term like other RV's...?

They did not talk about financing, but it's my understanding that a slide in camper can be financed on longer terms like an RV. That is something we'll be looking into more once we do our taxes this year and figure out where that puts us.


Dave;
I know that the Eagle is much roomier than the Falcon, but I would be very careful. The amount of rear overhang is not a critical issue in my opinion, but the centre of gravity v rear axle is. I would check with Stan at 4wc HQ and get his opinion. The Falcon was specifically designed for your style of truck, while the Eagle was designed for a longer bed (and more importantly a longer rear axle to rear of cab dimension). No disrespect to the owner of the Toyota in the above pics is intended, but I would not even consider that to be safe! BTW check out the rear cargo carrier on the Toyota!!

Good luck with what ever you decide.

Cheers
Mark

Yeah, I was more concerned with the weight behind the axle more then the actual overhang. I've done some reading on the WTW board and it seems to be a back and forth issue (no pun intended).

I'm far from knowing what I'm talking about when I ask this, but what kind of problems could I anticipate by having more weight behind the axle? I know unloading the front could be more of an issue, but what else? I am planning on airbags for the rear suspension.

[Dave]

Interesting news about the prices. Maybe because they make less Falcons than Eagles...? I really don't know.

Just wanted to clarify what I was trying to say about the prices. The price I was quoted for a Falcon shell with the following options was $11,735

Furnace
Mechanical Jacks
Screen Door
Aux Battery
12v Outlet
Curtans
Awning
Swing out jack brackets


If I buy a standard Falcon with the following options, my price comes to $13,315

Furnace
Mechanical Jacks
Screen Door
Aux Battery
Awning
Swing out jack brackets


So for an extra $1,580, I get a sink, water tank, stove, 110 system, propane, ice box, water and battery monitoring system, and the cabinetry that goes along with those options. The kicker, to me, is that the larger Eagle equally equipped PLUS a fold out couch is the same exact price as a Falcon.

I added $1,315 to the price of both to include tax, freight, and documentation fees.

I guess the idea behind a shell is to buy it empty and build it out completely by yourself (or not at all), but I'm not sure that would even save you much money.

[fisher205]

Dave,
Nova Kool and Norcold both have frig's that use a danfos compressor same as an Engel. A chest type freezer just doesn't gain as much heat when you open it.

As far as the stove goes. If you plumb a gas fitting into the camper and you can use a propane stove both in and out of the camper. Mine is a stove/oven so I end up carrying an extra gas stove, but a nice quiche is good wjile your camping.

I prefer to cook outside, but on cold mornings it's nice to start the coffee in a warm camper. - Brad

[Northern Explorer]

Dave

Did they have any Falcons in stock at the dealer in Wisconsin? I was thinking of checking them out next time I was in that area.

[Dave]

Dave

Did they have any Falcons in stock at the dealer in Wisconsin? I was thinking of checking them out next time I was in that area.

Unfortunately, they did not. The only FWC they had in stock that was for smaller trucks was the shell model Eagle. He did say that if an order is put in soon, he would have it in by April.

[Four Wheel Tom]

Hi Dave,

There's another alternative... go with the Finch. It's a new model just released, and is 10 inches shorter than the Eagle. Fits the quad cab bed better, cabinetry is almost identical, ans the roll over couch bed is shorter.

Hello to all out there on the forum... this is my first posting, and I'm new to forums, so please bear with me. I'm Tom, the owner of Four Wheel Campers, and I would like to help with any questions you may have for me.

I was referred to Expedition Portal by a number of folks, including a potential customer today... so here I am!

Give us a call, or respond with more questions about the Finch...

Thanks...

Tom

[Four Wheel Tom]

message to KCOWYO....

adding the awning and relocating the roof latch is no big deal... we seal the holes from the original roof latch.

I like the awning for two reasons... protection from the elements sitting outside, and shade from the sun on the side window in sunny climates...keeps it cooler inside.

thanks...

tom

[kcowyo]

Thanks Tom and welcome to ExPo - :beer:

The awning is on my wish/to-do list. I'm eyeing the options from Fiamma. It's really the only thing I still 'want for' with my FWC. Everything else is ideal. Your company makes a stellar product.

Glad you're here -

[Four Wheel Tom]

Thanks for the warm welcome, kcowyo !

Fiamma awnings are excellent. We changed over from the Dometic Horizon shortly after I came on board, as the Horizon is astonishingly annoying... hard to deploy, hard to adjust, and prone to breaking. Until recently, Fiamma made products for Dometic, but Dometic is making their own awning much like the Fiamma now. We're sticking pretty close to Fiamma for the most part - they're easy to deploy and retract, provide good shade, leg assemblies are easy to work with, and they hold up well. Occasionally have a bit of difficulty with tuning/adjusting, but not frequently.

thanks

Tom

[Rockcrawler]

Tom,

Are you going to have the awnings and other options displayed in Phoenix this weekend? My wife and I are coming up to look at the FWCs at the Sportsman's Show and I would like to see/show her as many of the options as possible. Stan said on the WTW forum that you'll have several different models, but I forgot to ask him how they were equipped.

Kyle

[Four Wheel Tom]

Kyle...

sorry for the late reply... just got back from driving a truckload of campers from Phoenix up to the SLC show... long drive up through AZ and through southern UT... but astonishingly beautiful...

tom

[Rockcrawler]

No problem... you did a perfect job of answering all my questions at the show.