Would somebody let me in the cooler secret?

[vanguard]

I've just started camping again after being a boy scout as a kid. I mention that to let you know my level of experience, very little. Aside from a refrigerator in the truck, what's the best way to keep things cool?

In April I put the ice in a ziplock bag and it actually worked. Later in April it failed. Ziplock bags are a great idea for holding ice but a really bad idea for holding cold water. You would think the upcoming transformation would have occurred to me but you would be over estimating me. :)

On my third try I used loose ice. However, this time I was hip to all the crafty tricks that ice will pull and I put the food in zip lock bags. That didn't work either. Maybe if I could get *all* of the air out of each bag it wouldn't open the seal after it gets squeezed but that's hard to pull off on some items.

What's your best trick, short of equiping your truck with a refrigerator and all the eletrical upgrades along with it, for keeping food cold. I rarely camp for more than 3 nights.

[chet]

ditch the zip locks and use palstic containers. They are sealed and keep things fresher longer. Also use block ice. Drain the water each morning as it aids the melting process.

A friend of mine built a rack that sits above his ice blocks and keeps his food seperate. Also keep the cooler in the shade under a blanket to shield it from the sun (light colored prefered.) those are all my tips and I can get 3-4 days out of a block in a proper cooler.:jump:

[Wanderlusty]

Drain and repack as you go. Sometimes that is easier to do than others. Depends how far out you are. I am in the same boat. Maybe one day, when the expedition gods smile upon me, I may have an onboard 'fridge, but until then, just kinda have to make do.

There are some high end coolers available. I just have a cheapie Coleman myself, where I do the drain and refill method, with loose ice and ziplocked food items. I can't speak to how much better the high end coolers work.

There is a reason people are willing to pay $600 + for one of those fridges, and you and I get to find out every time we go :camping:

Good luck.

[paulj]

While draining the melt water makes it easier to keep the food dry, I doubt if it helps slow down the melting of the ice. That melt water is at 0C, and still can absorb a lot of heat. I tend to drain the melt water only when adding new ice.

paulj

[njtaco]

I've just started camping again after being a boy scout as a kid. I mention that to let you know my level of experience, very little. Aside from a refrigerator in the truck, what's the best way to keep things cool?

In April I put the ice in a ziplock bag and it actually worked. Later in April it failed. Ziplock bags are a great idea for holding ice but a really bad idea for holding cold water. You would think the upcoming transformation would have occurred to me but you would be over estimating me. :)

On my third try I used loose ice. However, this time I was hip to all the crafty tricks that ice will pull and I put the food in zip lock bags. That didn't work either. Maybe if I could get *all* of the air out of each bag it wouldn't open the seal after it gets squeezed but that's hard to pull off on some items.

What's your best trick, short of equiping your truck with a refrigerator and all the eletrical upgrades along with it, for keeping food cold. I rarely camp for more than 3 nights.

Vanguard,

We (my family) have used plastic milk jugs, with a screw-on top, 3/4 or so filled with water (of course!) and frozen. Depending on the cooler and length of trip, anything from a quart to a gallon works. This also acts as an "emergency" source of water, as it stays clean in the container. A high quality cooler and what is essentially "block" ice will last a long time.
Other points to ponder:

1. Filling the jug to the top will often split it when frozen.

2. The cooler will not "recover" when opened frequently using blocks, due to little surface area. Four, one-quart containers keep better cold than one gallon container, but do not last as long.

3. The emptier the cooler, the more air exchange each time the lid is opened, so the ice does not last as long. Better to keep empty, sealed containers in there than none at all. Better yet take up any extra space at the start of the trip with nearly-frozen drinking water.

4. I use square tupperware or rubbermaid to use the space most efficiently (works for me) and to keep food dry in case of leakage. Ziplocs, plastic bags, and the like are just one more thing for the landfill when I get home, and an added, (albeit small) expense to the trip.

5. Many, if not all, of the same tips apply that you have read about concerning the fridges. Keep shaded, extra insulation (old quilt), open as little as practical, and don't go cheap on the fridge (cooler).

Just my experience on the relatively cool east coast. The desert guys will probably have more imaginative advice! :D

Bob

EDIT- I've got to type faster... 3 posts in the time it took me to type one... sheesh!

[erin]

I have had good luck with dry ice and saw dust over longer trips. It is a bit of a hassle becuase of the saw dust, but it holds the cold very well. Layering is very important with this method though. It does help no matter what method you use to get the best cooler you can.

[ducktapeguy]

Depending on what kind of stuff you're keeping cold, dry ice works great. I've done a week in the desert at 100+ degrees with two coolers. One was filled with dry ice and regular block ice, the other for food and block ice. When the ice in the main cooler melted, I just transferred ice from one cooler to another. You just have to minimize opening the cooler as much as possible, just open once a day to get what you need to transfer, then shut it.

Water frozen with dry ice is much colder than normal ice, and last longer. So you can still have popsicles up until the third day :D. Another advantage to dry ice is it doesn't get everything wet when it evaporates, it goes straight to a gas state, so your food doesn't get soggy.

[njtaco]

Erin-

How much is dry ice, and how much do you get for an "average" cooler? I haven't bought dry ice since college, and that wasn't even for a cooler! Do you have to chip away the "glaze" from time to time, or does that work for you?
Hope this isn't a hijack...I think it still applies? :confused:

Ducktapeguy-

Is it feasable to re-freeze jugs of water in the cooler with the dry ice? (I realize it should be possible.)

Bob

[whitethaiger]

Draining will make the ice last longer. Water just conducts heat so much better than air. Harry Lewellyn of Eco4WD (http://www.eco4wd.com/) actually did some experiments with various setups and proved it.

We employ all the points mentioned by njtaco above: ice in plastic bottles, limit open/close, don't add warm stuff, stock with stuff from fridge/freezer at home, cover in blanket. We have good success out here in the South West deserts even in summer with this approach.

Of course one of these day's we want a fridge also, but until then we sneak drinks into those big fridges of your travel companions :ylsmoke:

[awalter]

I use 2 liter soda bottles, leave 2 " from the top when you freeze along with a loose cap. When frozen, tighten the cap & you will not contaminate your food with water. Once melted you have emergency water available. This lasts for a good 4 days with my Coleman Extreme cooler here in the Southwest, even during the summer months.

[vanguard]

1. Filling the jug to the top will often split it when frozen.

Thanks for the tips everybody. FWIW, if most tall and thin containers resist splitting a lot better if you lay them on their side.

[justfred]

Here's a simple suggestion that hasn't been mentioned, from an 8-year Burning Man veteran (12 days in the desert, no place to get food, can get ice if you must but then you have to carry it with you back to camp):

Minimize food that must be refrigerated; eliminate if possible. Get canned or dried or packaged or other foods that don't need refrigeration. Milk, butter, eggs, cheese? Go without.

Food that must be refrig'd, such as fresh meat? Freeze it. Test at home first that it can be defrosted and stay edible. Remember that when it starts to defrost, you have to eat it.

If you alter your diet a little, you can eat fine without having to use a cooler at all. Alternatively, this leaves more room in the cooler for essentials like beer.

[Nullifier]

Keeping the cooler covered also works well. It keeps the direct sun coming in from the windows off it and really makes a big difference. Last time my wife and I went out west in the truck we were in utah and Az for 3 weeks. We had a "5 day" cooloer. The ice actually lasted 5 days which was amazing. We kept the cooler as full as possible, used block ice, drained it daily, and kept it covered.

[erin]

:coffee:
NJ Taco, not sure how much dry ice is anymore, haven't bought any in years, not even sure how readily available it is anymore. As to the amount we used to use, I would have to check with a friend that turned me on to this method, I haven't used it in years, and don't remember exactly. I know it wasn't alot though, maybe something like three layers, one hunk per layer, and we never chipped it down.

[Scenic WonderRunner]

It's been pretty much covered here.....so I will just mention what works for me.

I use empty 64oz. Juice bottles (like Ocean Spray)......rinse them clean.....fill with water I can use to drink later. Place in freezer several days before I head out on my trips (when my truck is working!...UG!).

I bring as many as I think I need and that will fit.....typically 6 bottles....sometimes more.

I keep my cooler covered and out of the sun. I limit the opening of my cooler.

I also bring frozen meat....and in winter I bring my world famous Pork Veggie soup! (frozen)....oh yea baby!

In the winter my ice can last 7+ days. In the summer 5-6 days.

All with no watery mess at the bottom of my cooler.

Also....I have a built in emergency supply of drinking water that takes up no extra room in the truck.

............:ylsmoke: .........:elkgrin:

[calamaridog]

The SWR method works well with those heavy duty plastic juice containers. They are certainly more durable than milk cartons.

[Scenic WonderRunner]

Well thanks for noticing Bryan!

I found this pic of the exact bottles I use.

The tops screw on very tight. I also like them because they are kind of rectangular and fit together well when stacking in a cooler, they seem to take up less space....much better than huge round milk jugs.

I just thought of this.....I wonder if it would work just as well to just drink down the juice drink a bit (could just include one with juice in it)......then freeze it. Then when it's almost melted I have a cold juice drink....that had been used as an ice block!..........:ylsmoke:


http://www.oceanspray.com/images/products/Light/Light_Group.jpg

[strap22]

This works for me. It is a big investment but if you do alot of off-roading it is well worth the investment. Doesn't use much to keep it cold.

[VikingVince]

I used ice for years before getting my Coolmatic fridge/freeze and I agree with all the tips posted here. I have a little different take/suggestion on the block ice, though, which I don't think I saw here...I made my own block ice with a small wastebasket...obviously, just fill it with water and put it in the freezer for 3 days or so (it takes considerably longer to freeze through than an ice cube tray plus you may have to remove a shelf in the freezer) The larger the block of ice, the longer it will last...(duh!) So you can tweak the size of the block you want to make depending on the wastebasket size. Of course, the trade-off is that the larger the block of ice the less you can get in your cooler...I had a big cooler! The frozen plastic bottles are a clean, neat, and easy way to go (no daily draining) but they won't last as long as a large block like I used to make. Also, one large block will last a day or so longer than two set-apart smaller blocks equaling the same size as the larger block...something to do with mass and thermal dynamics! Best tip: save your $$$$ for a fridge/freeze :wavey:

[Grim Reaper]

Pack in layers and plan your meals.

We have a food saver vacuum packer deal. We freeze our marinate then throw it in the bag with our stakes and vacuum and seal. They will help keep things cool while frozen and after they thaw a day or so later they are already marinated ready for the grill.

We drain off a little off the juice bottles and again freeze.

We carry a couple coolers....one for foods that is only opened to get out meals and a small one with beverages for day use.

We also use Tupperware for produce that we cant pre freeze and keep the empty container to minimize airspace. Its pretty easy to get 3-4 days meals in one regular sized cooler with some planning without hte need to get more ice.

on 2-3 day trips we can usually get buy with a small block and the prefrozen drinks and food. 3-4 days we go to dry ice or big blocks. After the 4th day we hit a local grocery and restock. I have gone longer with a third cooler packed as full as possible with ice and a little food but 2 regular sized coolers and a small cooler tent to take a lot of space so in most instances its not real practical unless you are really out in the boonies.

In the vehicle we set the cooler on a closed cell pad to insulate it from any heat coming off the floor and cover it in a blanket and keep it in the shade whenever possible.

It was mentioned before but anything that goes in the cooler must be pre cooled. I even precool the cooler by packing it full of ice a few hours early before I put the food in.

[perterra]

New guy here, be careful with the dry ice in a closed vehicle. As it sublimates you can displace the 02 in your vehicle.

Also, I go with block ice, and have never had a problem with warm butter or cheese. Never had it go bad in a reasonable amount of time. Cheese can be wrapped in cheese cloth and washed down with vinegar and keep at room temp for weeks. Butter has hardly ever gone rancid, might turn liquid, but it hasnt gone rancid.

Trying to remember my times on cold beer and soda in dry ice. From 80º to frozen in 3 minutes on the soda, 5 minutes on the beer.:p

[Scott Brady]

New guy here, be careful with the dry ice in a closed vehicle. As it sublimates you can displace the 02 in your vehicle.


Great advice.

Welcome to Expedition Portal. Great to have you here! :camping:

[perterra]

Thanks, so far I can see my self going broke looking around in here.

[pskhaat]

something to do with mass and thermal dynamics!

Just that the the smaller the block, the more surface area/volume ratio allowing for greater heat transfer.

One problem with block ice is that it does not cool as fast as crushed ice though it lasts of course significantly longer. If you need to chill something fast, crushed ice is a quicker way.

[paulj]

I use empty 64oz. Juice bottles (like Ocean Spray)......rinse them clean.....fill with water I can use to drink later. Place in freezer several days before I head out on my trips (when my truck is working!...UG!).


These flat sided juice bottles worked quite well on my recent 2 week trip in BC. 3 of them in a small Igloo (5 day) cooler lasted a week in cool weather. After that I bought block ice, and used the bottles for camp water. As water bottles they turned out to be a very convenient size and shape. They are easy to handle, and to fill at campground faucets and pumps. They also fit nicely just inside the tailgate when on the road.

paulj

[Scenic WonderRunner]

Paul.....

Some nice country you are exploring there! (from a former Seattle boy!).

I'm glad the "ice bottles" worked well for you on your recent trip!

I used my ice bottles as I headed out Sept. 2nd for Arizona, Utah and Colorado.

Mine only lasted just over 5 days because my first afternoon was spent heading through Arizona in over 110* heat.

I had my cooler covered with two towels....but I don't think this is enough.

So my new idea was to also hang a towel for shade at my rear window, on a bungee cord directly in front of my cooler to block the direct sunlight. This helped a lot....and is my new strategy for summer time!

This is just the width of one towel which hangs directly behind the drivers head and does not block the rear view.


I thought about using the dry ice. But what I did was also bring a smaller cooler that fit well up on my passenger side floor. It was easy to just head into a McDonalds......have a burger.....then fill the smaller cooler with free ice for a few brewskies later at camp!:beer: .........:ylsmoke:


You can see my Towel for shade, hanging down in the back window of this pic. If you can say "Bears Ears" 10 times Really Fast after you've had way too many beers.....I'll take you to my secret campsite with a view of ALL of SE Utah!:sombrero:
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i156/ScenicWonderRunner/2006_0919Summerinthesanjuans0045.jpg


.

[vanguard]

Hey look my thread from this spring has come back to life. Since then I've found the secret to a long lasting but cheap cooler.















































Camp when it's cold out. :shakin:

[devinsixtyseven]

lol!

there is a ton of great advice on this thread...the only thing i might add is that getting a cooler with a drain spigot, as tight a seal as possible and as good insulation as you can afford is critical. i had three coolers in the truck for a july Maze trip, we were in the maze for three full days, and a prior day at Elephant Hill in the Needles district of Canyonlands Natl Park. Peak temp was around 105 every day. The smallest of the coolers, about 1.5 cubic foot, did not have a good seal nor good insulation, no spigot, and the ice cubes inside would melt in a matter of hours. It was relegated to cold drinks and cube ice, and we used the melt water for hygiene. The medium-sized cooler had a tighter seal but again not terribly effective insulation, probably owing to "feature creep" (wheels, three handles, cup holders, blah blah etc) rather than sticking with good, simple insulation everywhere. Also, the small cooler is dark blue with a white lid, and the medium cooler is orange everywhere. The cooler I actually paid for is one of those "Extreme Cool" things, it's silver with a white lid, doesn't have cupholders, the handles are mounted outside the box rather than flush when hanging, the seal is extremely tight, and the insulation is great. The orange cooler still had ice at the end of the first day (half-melted block), but again was relegated to drinks and wash water. The KISS-principled, silver & white (color is important too) cooler was eventually loaded with a pair of blocks and the cracks filled with cubes. Tupperware, even the cheap thin disposable stuff, is perfect...with a little air space, it even floats :p. If the cooler is clean, the melt is great for putting ice cold water direct to the camelbak via the spigot, and there's no need to open the cooler--solves the runoff problem and conserves water.

We worked each day with two coolers, the large silver one and the medium cooler. In the morning, at or before sunrise (coolest temps), we'd switch the evening's food (frozen) from the large cooler to the medium cooler with some ice (water for washing up) and drinks (frozen in advance). by the end of the day, everything would be thawed, but still cold, and with the tupperware the food was uncontaminated. we pretty much just ignored the small cooler after the first day in Moab. The block ice in the large cooler was still intact at the third day, and we were able to put somewhat melted cubes in the camelbak the second and third days.

Another good trick we used was packing frozen burritos (homemade and precooked) in the smallest (mostly useless) cooler...beans+rice+chicken+salsa+cheese will freeze rock solid to the point that if it's in a cooler and wrapped in aluminum foil it will last for days. They kept the drinks cool, and we also found we had to leave them on the dash all day long if we wanted them to be warm all the way through by evening. Any food you can precook, freeze, and use the sun or the vehicle to reheat is a good thing, plus they taste a lot better than MREs.

The color of things makes a huge difference, as does insulating material like a blanket or tarp like someone mentioned. I have a black canvas topper, with the top down it's downright suffocating in 105* heat. The white top would be better. The silver cooler with the white top is better suited to sit in a hot bed than the blue or orange coolers. As for insulating material, after eight hours hiking in the Maze at 110F+, I and a buddy of mine both had ice remaining in our camelbaks--insulated inner water pouch, surrounded by the canvas pack and emergency gear. A "cooler cover" would probably be a great investment...just grab some fleece or neoprene or something at the fabric store and sew it up.

On future trips I'll be doing the same two cooler deal, pre-freezing everything I can.

-Sean

[coloradocarlisle]

Good cooler the extremes work good for the money. My extreme will last two to three times longer than my regular cooler

Fill cardboard milk containers with water and freeze, then peel the cardboard off for good cheap block ice

drain water

Keep in shade

Keep closed

Containers

Dont store in your tent or truck

[slepe67]

While draining the melt water makes it easier to keep the food dry, I doubt if it helps slow down the melting of the ice. That melt water is at 0C, and still can absorb a lot of heat. I tend to drain the melt water only when adding new ice.

paulj
me 2, I hauled deer meat from MT to FL in November. It's cold in MT, not FL. Put ice on in Great Falls, MT; then in Omaha NB. Worked like a champ. 32 hours of windshield time. Bad weather....

[paulj]

Dont store in your tent or truck

I usually keep my cooler in the car, especially when away from camp, and even at night. On rare occasions I've put it on the roof rack at night. This is to keep it away from critters, whether it be nimble fingered coons, or heavy handed bears. However if it is a sunny day and everyone is hanging around camp, it makes sense to keep the cooler in a shaded ventillated area.

paulj

[devinsixtyseven]

Picked up a new cooler yesterday...a Coleman Ultimate Uber Super Duper Extra Extreme Marine cooler (now with additional superlative descriptors). After peeling the Ultimate Super Uber Duper stickers off, I got to looking at the inside.

Looks like with the purchase of additional adjectives, they include a cutting board sort of thing that doesn't quite fit on the shelf and doesn't quite sit in the slot on the inside left of the cooler. There's also a sliding tray that isn't really held in place by anything...one good shake and it's in the bottom.

Enter "Colorado Plastic Products". They sell scrap by the pound, and polycarb can be cut easily with a carbide blade. Polycarb = Lexan, what those indestructible Nalgene bottles are made from. Polycarb comes in colors, clear, opaque, whatever. It's easy to work with, won't shatter like acrylics (ie Plexiglass), and cleans easily. It can be used as a cutting board as well, as it's resistant to abrasion.

One piece will turn in to a divider, fitting in the slot on the inside left of the cooler. Now I have two deep compartments, great for storing block/bulk items or ice in the large section, and food in the small section...or block in the large section and cube in the small section. Next, a large layer fitted to the lip on the inside of the cooler. On the marine cooler, there are actually two lips, one is about halfway in, the other is near the top where the "built in tray" normally sits. Either would make a good divider...food on the bottom, sealed block ice on top, a couple of holes in the divider for air circulation. Now the cooler has three separate compartments, if I want.

They're checking the scrap bin right now to see if there's something laying around that's the right size :).

[rusty_tlc]

I have used the three cooler system mentioned above.
Cooler One; Drinks snacks and that days dinner
Cooler two; Remaining food items, freeze as much as possiable.
Cooler Three; Extra Ice.
I never open the third cooler until needed.

The first couple of days only open cooler two once a day to get dinner and snacks out for the day.

The next couple of days repack everything from #1 and #2 into a single cooler.Keeping the coolers full is more efficient.

The last couple of days replenish ice as required from the last cooler.

All my ice is drinking water. I use a mix of 750mL and juice bottles. Go ahead and put those .750mL bottles straight into the freezer full, they can take it. I also keep my home freezer full with the squarish cranberry juice bottles. A full freezer works better, less dead air space to cool down after you open the door. Funny that it works at home too, huh?;) In the field I re-fill the 750mL bottles from the juice bottles.

As mentioned above covering the coolers with blankets etc helps a lot.

Minimizing the amount of fresh foods is also helpfull.

[sinuhexavier]

Nothing beats an ARB fridge...

[Rubi-Khan]

I often keep my ice chest in my drivers side floorboard as it keeps it close at hand and helps to extend the front seat area to make a nice bed/platform for my 4-legged travel companion.

I've noticed that in the warmer months the floor board gets quite warm especially if I'm on a technical trail moving slowly in low range.

If you keep any of your coolers on your floorboards in the front half of the vehicle where it would be pretty close to the engine/tranny heat, stick your hand under the ice chest after a few hours and make sure your floorboard isn't heating up the bottom of the cooler.

Also, one small thing in regards to freezing bottles........I often drink from mine as they are melting to get a nice cold drink. I find that if I leave an airspace in the bottle before freezing it that the expansion of the ice compresses the air and pressurizes the bottle. This sometimes results in water going all over when I open the bottle.

Instead, I fill the bottles about 5/6 full and then squeeze the bottle bringing the water line up to the neck. As the water freezes it simply expands the bottle as needed.

[SeaRubi]

not sure if it was covered but ... i've gotten relatively good mileage out of the "blue ice" packs from rubbermaid. they're self contained and re-usable; seems to stay cold a bit longer than water. could just be my imagination though :)

i've vowed to stop bringing beer or iced drinks on trips, but a bottle of wine just doesn't have the same satisfaction of a cold one at the end of a hot, dusty day.

someday we'll be cool and join the arb/engel ranks :elkgrin: