Excursion Lockers

[jdholder]

Ok, newbie question here - be gentle.

I have an 01 Excursion that I have started actually using (yes it's large on the trails) and would like to try and give it a little more ability off road.

I have been looking at lockers. I have had a 78 Blazer with a detroit locker in the rear and it use to pop and grind like crazy. Tough to have it as a daily driver.

My question is, has there been development in the Detroit Locker line that eases this popping noise? Or is there a better but almost just as strong and as high performace unit that I should be considering.

My Ex has the factory LSD, which works ok. Should I just leave that in the rear and lock the front? Or should I change out both.

Lot's of questions. Help. :)

Thanks!

FYI, I think the Excursions have Sterling 10.25 in the back and Dana 50 fronts. Whats out there available?

[OutbacKamper]

ARB air lockers are the ultimate mod, sorry I have no experience with detroit lockers.
http://www.arbusa.com/Products/Air-Lockers/10.aspx

Cheers
Mark

[maximumrob]

Any locker that's selectable is ideal for a DD.

Were it me, I wouldn't lock the front since your truck is so heavy. One miscalculation with the throttle and steering wheel could have you doing dangerous trail repairs. I use "dangerous" because BIG trucks usually break BIG parts!

Post pics, brother!



.

[jdholder]

Any locker that's selectable is ideal for a DD.

Were it me, I wouldn't lock the front since your truck is so heavy. One miscalculation with the throttle and steering wheel could have you doing dangerous trail repairs. I use "dangerous" because BIG trucks usually break BIG parts!

Post pics, brother!



.


So would an LSD in the front help at all? Or would you not even think that would be a good option?

I will post pics ASAP. Have to get some non-poser ones (that's all I have right now :)).

[ujoint]

I have the same axle in the rear of my van, Sterling 10.5" with a Detroit. I've always loved them, even though you have to modify your driving style. It's great here in LA since all the roads are straight, and I love it in the desert and on trails. Mine has started popping a little more lately, and it's starting to get annoying. I also plan to relocate to the east coast soon, and I know the detroit won't be very happy about the mtn roads. So I'll be switching to an ARB soon. Also, I'm not too confident with the Detroit on ice or snow covered roads.

For the front, you have a Dana 50, so rule out a full locker right now. A good L/S will be great, like a Detroit True trac or a Powerlock. I run a powerlock in mine, and it's awesome. If you plan to use the rig offroad for the future, consider the Dynatrac free spin hub conversion. It will eliminate the unit bearings, and comes with stronger, 35 spline stub shafts. Hope this helps!!!

[jdholder]

Thanks for the advice.

Is the Detroit Locker popping when you get out of the throtte? That's what my old one use to do in the 78 Blazer - it got old fast.

Beautiful Van Build! I would love to see it in person some day.



I guess it's ARB in the Rear and an LSD in the Front for me.

Now I just gotta schedule the work.

Thanks all!!!!

[OutbacKamper]

I'm not trying to talk anyone into anything here, but I am very happy with my front ARB locker. Mine is a D60. The rear gets used more often than the front, but the front locker has got me out of some really tough spots. I have only gotten the truck into one situation that the front locker would not get me out of, and that was when the truck was buried to the frame in soft sand.

Cheers
Mark

[ujoint]

It's random...... sometimes under acceleration, or decel. I think the width of my tires is a factor. I had a Detroit in my old van, GM 14 bolt. It never acted up, but barked the tires more since they were 12.50's as opposed to my current 15.50's.

Also, with the D50 & 40's, a full locker will guarantee carnage........... no guarantees even with the L/S!!!!

I was just in Irvine last week!! I'm rebuilding an F350 for a long time customer, and I'm using the shop @ Extreme Trucks to do it. I'll be back down there in a couple weeks, so I'll let you know so we can hook up.

[jdholder]

It's random...... sometimes under acceleration, or decel. I think the width of my tires is a factor. I had a Detroit in my old van, GM 14 bolt. It never acted up, but barked the tires more since they were 12.50's as opposed to my current 15.50's.

I was just in Irvine last week!! I'm rebuilding an F350 for a long time customer, and I'm using the shop @ Extreme Trucks to do it. I'll be back down there in a couple weeks, so I'll let you know so we can hook up.

Awesome - pm me or e-mail jon at h3dv dot com.

Love to check the van out!

[FROADER]

I was just in Irvine last week!! I'm rebuilding an F350 for a long time customer, and I'm using the shop @ Extreme Trucks to do it. I'll be back down there in a couple weeks, so I'll let you know so we can hook up.



Awesome - pm me

Love to check the van out!

Me too! :)


I've got a Detroit in the rear of my Explorer and the Detroit TrueTrac L/S in the front and they work very well together.

[ujoint]

Looks like we'll have to do a little get together in Irvine!!!

[jdholder]

Looks like we'll have to do a little get together in Irvine!!!

Nice!! Looking forward to it!

[JeepN95YJ]

I'm not trying to talk anyone into anything here, but I am very happy with my front ARB locker. Mine is a D60. The rear gets used more often than the front, but the front locker has got me out of some really tough spots. I have only gotten the truck into one situation that the front locker would not get me out of, and that was when the truck was buried to the frame in soft sand.

Cheers
Mark


I agree with the front ARB (rear too for a DD).

When used properly, full lockers are LESS likely to cause broken parts. Especially selectable lockers. I wouldn't rule one out for fear of breaking, that is for sure. In my experience, locking front and rear give you the ability to slowly and easily crawly many obstacles that might require momentum or wheel speed in an open or LSD application. It is usually the shock loading that breaks parts and understanding proper driving technique will minimize the risks.

JMHO. :arabia:

(will be wheeling my 2500 Ram Quad Cab Long Bed next summer)

[ujoint]

I agree with the front ARB (rear too for a DD).

When used properly, full lockers are LESS likely to cause broken parts. Especially selectable lockers. I wouldn't rule one out for fear of breaking, that is for sure. In my experience, locking front and rear give you the ability to slowly and easily crawly many obstacles that might require momentum or wheel speed in an open or LSD application. It is usually the shock loading that breaks parts and understanding proper driving technique will minimize the risks.




You're right, for most vehicles.........but we're talking about a 9000+lb Excursion with a Dana 50. The stub shafts taper down, and they're prone to breaking with an open diff!! Add a strong diesel & 40" tires, and a locker will make things go pop. Also, it depends on what type of wheeling will be done and the part of the country/terrain.

[jdholder]

You're right, for most vehicles.........but we're talking about a 9000+lb Excursion with a Dana 50. The stub shafts taper down, and they're prone to breaking with an open diff!! Add a strong diesel & 40" tires, and a locker will make things go pop.

I wonder what I should put in the front to help assure something DOESN'T go pop? Dana 60?? 70??

[ujoint]

Just do the Dynatrac free spin kit. You'll eliminate the small stub shafts and have better locking hubs. Then the only weak spot is the ring & pinion, which I've never seen break, so you should be fine. If it were mine, this is what I'd do:

Dynatrac kit
Powerlock front diff from Randy's R&P (aggressive)
Hydraulic ram assist (your sector shaft may already be cracked or twisted and you don't even know it) About 70% of all lifted superduties have this problem, the ram will eliminate that.

The powerlock is aggressive enough to act as a locker, but if one of the front tires grab something, it will give, so the tire will slow down, saving an axle shaft.

[JeepN95YJ]

What about the 30-spline inner axles? Wouldn't they also be a weak link? You're talking about over $2500 in mods to his D50. Admittedly the 40s are not likely to be nice to that axle. A D60 starts looking better and better.

Does an Excursion really way 9000+ pounds? My V10 Quad Cab long bed 4x4Dodge only weighs 6500 empty.

[ujoint]

The inner axle shafts are OK, same as the 60's of that era. The stub shafts are the ones that taper. Yea, Excursions are HEAVY.

[jdholder]

What about the 30-spline inner axles? Wouldn't they also be a weak link? You're talking about over $2500 in mods to his D50. Admittedly the 40s are not likely to be nice to that axle. A D60 starts looking better and better.

Does an Excursion really way 9000+ pounds? My V10 Quad Cab long bed 4x4Dodge only weighs 6500 empty.

Excursions start at 8800 lbs. I have undoubtedly added over 1000lbs of stuff to mine, so I would say that I am approaching 10k lbs before I load up for a weekend. Add me and 3 kids, and all our junk and I bet it would be 11k lbs easy.

Gotta get to a scale.

[JeepN95YJ]

WOW!

That is crazy! I'd never have guessed their weight that high.

Learn something every day:hehe: .

[I Leak Oil]

A locker in just the rear will go a LONG way to improving the trucks ability. I'd start there and see if you really need something in the front or not. I've barely ever really needed to use my front locker. If you don't have one already you might want to think about putting the money set aside for the front locker into a winch. At 9000 lbs a really big winch.....
Jason T.

[DBS311]

I was under the impression that the Excursion weighed between 7100-7700 lbs. and that its GVWR was 8500+. Still not a lightweight by any means, but I don't think they rolled off the lot at 8500 lbs. stock.

[jdholder]

Ok, just to put the rumors and hearsay to rest - I have no idea what my Excursion weighed when it was stock. It wasn't stock for long after I got it.

I do know what it weigs now. Are you sitting down?

Front Axle: 4370
Rear Axle: 5290
TOTAL: 9660

That's with me in it, and a full tank of Diesel. 2 Jerry Cans Full of Diesel, and 1 of Water.

My Ex has Custom front and rear bumpers, 40 inch Goodyear MTR's on Steel Wheels, On Board Air with a 5 gallon tank, AMP steps, Lights, a Truck Vault Full Width Drawer with tools in it, etc.

So - look like I need to find a winch (12lb one minimum - right??), and put a locker in the rear. I think I am going to leave the front open right now to save the axles as best I can, until I can afford the $2k for the Dynatrac kit, and also the $1000 for a good LSD in the front (so another $3k).

I am going to do the Hydraulic Assist Steering though, as this thing is tough to turn at slow speeds.

When I load this thing up with all my other stuff, kids, etc, I am sure I will be over 11k rolling down the road. CRAZY.

[ujoint]

Told ya!!! I knew that sucker was pushin 9500!!! The normal formula for a winch is 1.5x your vehicle weight, so you need to step it up to a 16.5. Is your bumper winch ready?? Also, we still haven't seen any pics, have we?!?


Another note: Excursions have a 45 gallon tank BEHIND the rear axle, so that's a few lbs....

[DBS311]

If I were to get a family size expo rig, it would be a 7.3 Excursion for sure. That is some SERIOUS weight you are pushing around.

I funds allowed, I would put a Sunray 1550 in the front with a truehi9 diff and run an Atlas II. Forget the Engel fridge, with all that room in the back I'd use the Whirlpool from my kitchen!

Waiting for some pics............

:safari-rig:

[jdholder]

I added some pics with descriptions HERE (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30337974@N05/sets/72157607206651954/)