An M8000 Warn weighing less than 50lbs.?

[Scott Brady]

I am working on a project to get a my Warn M8000 winch with fairlead and controller to less than 50lbs.

The winch body and 80' of steel cable weight 48lbs.
The controller and wiring weighs 9 lbs.
Fairlead weighs 11 lbs.

So right now I have 80' of synthetic 5/16" line on order and I am looking for aluminum fairleads. When these items start arriving, I will let everyone know what the weight advantages are as things develop.

The main reason for this little effort is to reduce some of the mass from the front end of my Tacoma. With the ARB bumper and winch hanging out in front of the tires, it really changes the suspension dynamics.

More to come :)

[Jonathan Hanson]

I wonder how much a titanium spool would take off. . .

[BajaTaco]

I can really relate to that Scott. Having tried the ARB bumper on my own Tacoma (and the fairly heavy bumper I have now) I think your efforts on this are really worthwhile. And my prediction is that you will end up with good results and probably help a lot of people with low GVWR vehicles in the process by improving their vehicle's efficiency. Good job ;)

[Desertdude]

I mounted the warn 9000 on the front of the Tacoma along with a Demello offroad tube bumper - the 100 foot steel cable wieghed approx 18lbs the fairlead approx 10. The synth line appox 4 and the alum fairlead approx 2 - I saved about 22 lbs - and added maximun saftey

[Scott Brady]

I have 80' of 5/16 synthetic line coming, which weighs about 4lbs. with the thimble.

I also found this fairlead (http://www.fourtreks.com/composite_fairlead.html), which weighs less than 1lb. :D

http://www.fourtreks.com/cgi-bin/image/templates/FLEADMOUNTED.jpg



I think I might hit my 50lb goal...

[Desertdude]

thanks for that link - a pound is a pound :D

When I was in Moab I met a guy who worked for warn - he mentioned a way for me to place my controler box under the hood and run an remote extention to my bumper for a cleaner set up - have you seen this? I have searched the net to death and have come up empty. I failed to get his card at the end of the trail run...

[Scott Brady]

I did this on my Jeep. After my move to Prescott, you can come down and check it out...

basically, it involves getting three new wires made at the length required to fit the controller under the hood. It was pretty easy.

For my set-up, I am going to use one of these, which will allow winch controll from within the cab (http://www.roadlessgear.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?page=TOY/PROD/M/RG631):

http://www.roadlessgear.com/Merchant2/graphics/global-products/winchctrls.jpg

I have one of these controllers coming with the winch line...

[Desertdude]

Thanks again link-master!

Quote:
After my move to Prescott, you can come down and check it out...

Roger that neighbor ;)

[The BN Guy]

So you mount the solenoid under the hood, mount that switch in the cab, run the wiring into the engine bay and it simply plugs into the solenoid? Or do you have to crack open the solenoid and wire it up there?

[Scott Brady]

You need to remove the cover of the control box and hook up three wires. The installation is actually quite simple.

This project is proceeding along nicely now. I have the remote winch controller and the 80' of synthetic line (both supplied be Roadless Gear (http://www.roadlessgear.com/))

http://www.expeditionswest.com/equipment/tacoma/winch/images/roadless_gear_controller.JPG

Now, all that is left is the fairlead. This has proved to be a fun project...

[The BN Guy]

Wow that's pretty sweet. Of course getting the wires through the firewall...oh boy.

[Scott Brady]

Patrick,

Yes, the firewall is an issue. I have made one 3/4" pass through, but it is getting full.

My next big project will be a "whole" truck auxilliary system wiring harness. I now have too many systems coming on line, so it needs to be all done at once, documented and easily serviced. With the aux. battery, three more gauges, winch controller, lights, etc. etc.

Lots to do by November! :eek:

[goodtimes]

Scott, a whole vehicle harness for all your aftermarket/custom accessories is a wise decision. Unfortunately, we never seem to know we really need one until we are years into the modification game. As I am sure you already know, this usually leads to a hacked together electrical system at worst, and a pain in the butt to troubleshoot at best.

One comment on the winch controller (the in-cab portion). Select your switch location carefully. You likely won't be seated squarely in your seat, facing forward as if you were driving, when you actually use it....you'll be leaning out the window watching tire placement, looking over your shoulder checking rear quarter panel clearance, etc., making it difficult to place a switch where it will be easily reached no matter where you are at. This situation caused me to not install a switch inside like you are planning. Instead, I am considering 2 other options. First, wireless (available from Warn, Tmax, and others). Second, I am thinking about adding a plug for my wired remote inside the jeep. This way I can just plug the remote into the dash, but still have limited mobility inside. I will likely get a second remote and shorten the cable up to about 24"....maybe with a self coiling cord (like the old phone cords)......

I'll be looking forward to see how your wiring harness turns out.....any thoughts about adding any sort of automation to it (automatic fuel transfer at a certain level, automatic water transfer, air compressor, etc)?

[Scott Brady]

Second, I am thinking about adding a plug for my wired remote inside the jeep. This way I can just plug the remote into the dash, but still have limited mobility inside. I will likely get a second remote and shorten the cable up to about 24"....maybe with a self coiling cord (like the old phone cords)......

I like that idea. That would work out very well IMO and be simple.


I'll be looking forward to see how your wiring harness turns out.....any thoughts about adding any sort of automation to it (automatic fuel transfer at a certain level, automatic water transfer, air compressor, etc)?

Funny you should say that. Jack and I spent some time brainstorming about running a small PLC and programming in some of the functionality you describe. Then I just slapped myself, and came back to reality. I could just see me pumping all of my water reserves down MEX1 :eek:

[goodtimes]

...Then I just slapped myself, and came back to reality....

HA! Your not alone in that one Scott. There have been several times I have had to do that in the last couple years..... :o

[Scott Brady]

I have decided the location of the winch controller:

http://www.expeditionswest.com/temp1/console.jpg

I need to start spec'ing out the wiring harness...

[VikingVince]

I have a winch compatible ARB bumper on my '98 Tacoma and I'd like to add the Warn M8000(with synthetic rope and alum. fairlead) ...just haven't gotten around to it (got tired of spending money!)

Scott, with the added weight of the bumper and winch, do you intend on leaving your swaybar off? I've had mine disconnected for the last several months and with the front Donohoe coilovers it doesn't feel like that big a difference. (although I'm aware that in certain situations it could be) I was thinking that if I add the 50 pounds of synthetic rope winch and remove the 30lb. (approx) sway bar, I'd be adding the winch for a net gain of 20 pounds!!!

[BajaTaco]

I was thinking that if I add the 50 pounds of synthetic rope winch and remove the 30lb. (approx) sway bar, I'd be adding the winch for a net gain of 20 pounds!!!

I like your way of thinking Vince! :p (insert laughing smiley here)

Regarding the controller, I really like the idea of wireless. What is the reason you guys aren't using it? Cost?

Anyone know what this "Boomer Box" (http://www.t-maxwinches.com/accessories.htm#wireless)is from T-max?

[Scott Brady]

I have used a wireless controller in Alaska, on one of the two speed Mega-winches. It seemed to work pretty well.

This guy had a sweet older Bronco with every goodie know to man on it. He coordinated this three winch recovery of a rolled (bigger) Bronco and was never near his truck. He could walk around and look at things as they were developing, all while making small winch corrections 60' from his rig.

I have a video of that somewhere... I will find it.

I just have never winched without being inside the truck, so I guess that is my thinking. A more mechanical connection, which should be more reliable.

[BajaTaco]

... A more mechanical connection, which should be more reliable.

C'mon, think "cell phone" ! Look how reliable they are! :D

Seriously though, thanks for the reply.

[kevin]

There is a remote winch controller available that works by a rf radio signal. It is completly wireless and can be used inside or outside of your vehicle. It has a 300 ft range, and runs on a sigle 9 volt battery. The reciever weighs only 12 ounces and can be mounted almost anywhere. There are numerous manufactures of these systems, do a google search for "wireless winch controller" I used one from applied electronics for many years without failure. Good luck.

[Scott Brady]

Here is the winch rope, available from Roadless Gear. It is 80' x 5/16". I will weight it later in the week for an exact amount, but it seems to be in the 3-4lb range :victory:

The weigt savings of all of this is going to be worth it... :lurk:

[Desertdude]

Nice color! - I was able to squeeze 85' on my 9000 - the synth rope is kinda puffy - with the 50' synth rope extension we should be good to go :Wow1: Saving lbs :luxhello:

[Scott Brady]

Yeah Pasquale, I think you have the perfect combination.

I have never understood the fixation with really long rope lengths on the winches. With a pully block and proper extension the 80-90' length is most ideal. A winch only generates its greatest capacity at the first layer of cable on the drum. Long winch lines make it difficult to attain full pulling power. That, and the line will nearly always pull to one side and require a respool anyways.

[goodtimes]

I have never understood the fixation with really long rope lengths on the winches.

Same as the fixation with 18" lifts and 44" tires. Bigger is better....right? ;)

Actually, I can think of a couple situations where longer would be better.....basically, any place that would require a LOOOONNNGGGGG pull, such as a long mud pit, or a long stretch of very soft sand with a heavy vehicle.....assuming you are pulling strait ahead and can keep your cable spooling up properly. Huh, now that I think about it, during the trip up to Jerome, an extra 10' of cable would have been nice. We wouldn't have had to stop and pull the strap out from between my cable and the tree saver, then winch my jeep up that last 10' or so.....

But for most pulls....I don't think I have ever actually needed to unspool more than 20 or 25' of cable.

[droppdwn]

Guys, I just got that 4runner and it has a Warn M8000, an aluminum fairlead, and 100' of MileMarker Synthetic... I was poking around on one of your sites the other day and ran across a winching FAQ/primer. I can't find it now and was wondering if any of you have the link to one that you like?

Scott, how heavy do you think my setup is? It's all already installed so I don't have the luxury of weighing it... The controller is right smack dab in the middle of my front bumper. I like the idea of mounting it under the hood (making theft a _bit_ more difficult), but I want to have room for a second battery some day.

[goodtimes]

It really doesn't matter where you mount the winch controller, from a theft standpoint. A thief will simply cut the cables and sell the winch for $15 less because it doesn't have a controller.

A simple and very effective theft prevention mod would be to tack weld one of the mounting bolts in place. Just enough to keep a thief from removing that bolt.....when/if you need to remove the winch, just grind the tack weld off (be sure to tack a bolt that is easy to get a grinder at.....).

[Scott Brady]

That is another reason why I like the ARB on my Tacoma. In order to remove the winch, the entire bumper needs to be removed, which would be a hell of a job without air tools.

The tack weld idea is a great one GT. I did that with my expensive lights a few years ago (on an old Jeep). Worked well.

[Outback Expeditions]

Love the winch set-up Scott! I was thinking on the same lines as you in regards to long winch lines. Ive always had I guess 50' to 60' on my other winches and never needed anything longer. Then I bought the new Power wagon and my first stuck caught me about 94' from the nearest winch point (4" tree). My winch line was 90'. Even after adding my tree protector I was still 8" to 12" short. Anyway no big deal I just used my 30' recovery strap as a tree protector but still what if I had not had that extra line on my winch. Anyway I guess no matter what you have there will be a situation where it wont be enough. My next purchase will be a pull pall. :D Nice forum by the way!

[Scott Brady]

The limiting factor for length on my set-up is the winch cage. The synthetic lines are so light, I would have gone longer if possible. I just carry a 50' extension and a bunch of straps. My set-up is more to the fast and light side of the scale.

[Desertdude]

The 9000 I installed can handle 100-ft of cable I was only able to spool 85-ft and as time goes on the the rope is used it might not all fit on the spool. Unlike the 8274 on my FJ40 which can hold 125 of cable - have not yet reloaded it with synth rope yet - I am guessing I can get a full 100 ft on it.

I am looking forward to moving my control box under the hood with a cable remote socket on the front bumper and a dash switch inside the cab...

[Scott Brady]

I also plan to move the control box under the hood. It is a pretty easy mod. With the in cab controller and new hand throtle (can be locked at a specific RPM), I should be set.

Do you want me to make an extra set of cables for you?

[Scott Brady]

Here is an image of the fairlead. It really is a thing of beauty and is made of graphite impregnated nylon. It weighs only 10.5 oz :Wow1:. The winch rope only weighs 2.2 lbs.

http://www.expeditionswest.com/equipment/tacoma/winch/images/fourtreks_fairlead_rope.JPG

So here are the preliminary numbers:

M8000 without controller or rope: 33lbs.
Controller and cables: 6lbs.
synthetic rope: 2.2 lbs.
Fairlead: .65 lbs.
Hook: .9 lbs.

TOTAL WINCH WEIGHT: 42.75 lbs. :luxhello:

What was removed:

Roller Fairlead: 12 lbs.
Wire Rope: 18 lbs. (5/16 x 100')
Gross: 30 lbs
Net Weight Savings: 27 lbs.

I will be moving the controller behind the front wheels, which will also improve weight distribution.

[BajaTaco]

TOTAL WINCH WEIGHT: 42.75 lbs. :luxhello:

... Net Weight Savings: 27 lbs.




:Wow1: :eek: :Wow1: Where is the bow-down smiley? hehehe

WHOA!!!! I can handle that! Now I want one! I think that is an acceptable addition out front (weight penalty for my truck) for the payoff involved. NICE!

[Desertdude]

[QUOTE=Do you want me to make an extra set of cables for you?[/QUOTE]

A very generous offer! - not sure when I will be back in AZ. Might not be until end of Oct before I can focus back on the Tacoma. I do hope to get the GPS and the Maggiolina mounted while I am out here in California :jump:

[Scott Brady]

Here is the contact information for the composite fairlead:

FourTreks (http://fourtreks.com/index.html) 805-583-8255

Fairlead (http://fourtreks.com/composite_fairlead.html) The unit is only $49, which I think is a great deal for the quality and functionality you get.

For those of you who were with me on the Mojave Road trip, we met one of their Chief engineers, Luke at the gas station (he had the sweet vintage Bronco). A good group of guys!

[Scott Brady]

Just a quick update. The weight out of the front end has helped, and the leverage of the winch is less apparent than before. I also like the more subdued appearance too. The next project (hopefully this weekend) will be to install the in-cab winch controller, and relocate the control box to the engine compartment. Moving the controller will shift another 5 lbs. behind the front tires... :D

[offroad_nomad]

I mounted my wich control box up in the engine compartment near the firewall to keep it high and dry and so no one would mess with it:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/DC_Magoo/Winch1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/DC_Magoo/Winch2.jpg

[p1michaud]

I mounted my wich control box up in the engine compartment near the firewall to keep it high and dry and so no one would mess with it

I had posted this in Scott's Tacoma mod thread but it's well suited for here as well...
...if your engine bay is anything like mine, space is at a premium so this is what I came up with for a mounting solution for the winch controller.

Cramped Engine compartment
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y12/p1michaud/Warn_M8000/DSC02772.jpg

Controller location pic 1
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y12/p1michaud/Warn_M8000/DSC02774.jpg

Controller location pic 2
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y12/p1michaud/Warn_M8000/DSC02775.jpg

Some of the pros/cons to relocating the winch controller are:
1-Keeps people from playing with your winch and possibly damaging the truck (i.e. mischievous people that is). I've read of people using paper clips to operate a winch (have not verified if it can be done, plus you would have to know what you are doing). This could also be avoided by a winch power interrupt kit.

2-Brings some weight back from the front bumper althoug it might be off set with the extra 18' of 2 guage wire used (i.e. over all weight of the controller and wire is greater by about 5 lbs)

3-Hotter in the engine compartment.

4-Less likely to be submerged that on the front bumper.

5-You have to open the hood to use the winch, but that will be remedied via an "In Cab" Winch Controler. Coming soon to my Taco... :D

Any others?

Cheers :beer:,
p

[p1michaud]

This was originally taken from the Expeditions West 2004 Tacoma thread under: "Expedition Vehicles > Toyota (Truck, Tacoma, 4Runner)" but is was also applicable for this thread with some additional information.


When I was first instructed on the use of a winch I was told to always raise the hood of the vehicle during winching. The hood would then serve as a shield if the cable snapped. Your set-up with the contol box under the hood would actually force this practice which is not always the easiest thing to do.

Excellent point, having the hood up is an excellent practice, but not always easy or possible in some situations as you mentionned. I have also added an In Cab Winch Controller as another alternative.

A few other cons with having the winch controller under the hood as I have discovered lately:

1-You will want to ensure that the remote wire can't get tangled in the fan when using the winch with the engine runing. :Wow1: This can easily be remedied by carefully routing the wire when pluging in the controller.

2-With all the mods under the hood (second battery, battery isolator and winch controller) perfoming regular maintenance or repair can be challenging. I have made an attempt to make the mods with minimal impact, but for some work they will be bothersome. I'm thinking of alternator replacement for example.

Just a few thoughts, sorry for the ramblings... :rolleyes:
Cheers :beer: ,
P

[p1michaud]

Here is the contact information for the composite fairlead:

FourTreks (http://fourtreks.com/index.html) 805-583-8255

Fairlead (http://fourtreks.com/composite_fairlead.html) The unit is only $49, which I think is a great deal for the quality and functionality you get.

For those of you who were with me on the Mojave Road trip, we met one of their Chief engineers, Luke at the gas station (he had the sweet vintage Bronco). A good group of guys!

Scott,
I purchased my composite fairlead from SKY-Manufacturing (http://www.sky-manufacturing.com/) and it's made from UHMW. Look under the "Accessories" section and scroll down a bit, they are only $25!

I do have one comment/concern about mounting a composite fairlead. Did you have any problems properly torquing the mounting bolts that go through the fairlead and bumper to the winch?

I noticed that the bolt was starting to compress the UHMW so I added a larger washer to spread the load and try to get to the required torque (about 30 ft-lbs). I also added some medium strenght Loctite for extra security (the mounting bolts for the winch came with lock washers). I did not quite get to 30 ft-lbs because the plastic fairlead was starting to compress quite a bit so I stopped because I was afraid to break it. :eek: Did you experience the same issue with your fairlead?

I would suggest that they change their design slightly to press in a metal sleeve where the bolt hole is so that you could achieve the proper tightening torque without damaging the composite fairlead while having the fairlead solidly mounted. :coffee:

Just a heads up to the folks on the forum who are considering composite fairelads, some people on Yotatech have experience problems where the composite fairleads were distorting during winching. One or two reports of this happening from what I read. Might be justification to go to aluminum, not sure.

Cheers :beer:,
P

[Scott Brady]

The composite fairlead I am using has the bolt holes recessed, and included hardened washers. They also use graphite impregnated composite to improve hardness and rigidity of the fairlead.

But I really love the 10 oz weight :)

[Scott Brady]

After searching for some time, I have found a new roller fairlead, which is designed specifically for synthetic line. It is just hitting the market. Several on this forum have seen it in person, and it is quite impressive:

It is from a company called Viking Off-Road (http://www.vikingoffroad.com/)

http://www.expeditionswest.com/equipment/general_equipment/viking_offroad/DSCF1543.JPG

Here are the details from Thor, one of the owners and the R&D guy:
"Yes the rollers are Delrin, Genuine DuPont Delrin. There are other materials that are basically the same but the name Delrin is a registered name for DuPont’s polymer recepie. The aluminum housing is 5052 aluminum (regular variety) harder aluminum will crack on the bends. The anodizing is a Type II military specification with CO2 laser engraved logo which preserved the anodizing, it just bleaches it out. Also, we do our part for the environment and pay extra fees to properly dispose of the anodizing chemicals. The pins are a medium hardness - high quality stainless steel, as are the hex bolts/nuts. The retaining rings are of high strength zinc coated steel."

The unit weighs just over 5lbs., which is 1/3 the weight of a Warn roller.

[Desertdude]

Well there you go spending my money again :hehe:

That looks real sophisticated - I look forward to getting rid of the rust prone warn model - I have the replacement rollers installed all ready - wonder if I can just order the housing?

[UncleChris]

I out the Delrin rollers on my original WARN farlead.

The ARB for the 05 Tacoma is desgined to be used with a roller fairlead. The mount is recessed into the bumper. A bunch of us were planning on using a hawse, until we realized that using a hawse would lead to bumper interference with the winchline at an angle. This could also have been fixed by fab'ing a mount that puts the hawse out further, but I am pretty lazy.

They swap out directly with the stock rollers. Minor weight savings as you keep the steel frame.

The whole Viking assembly might be the way to go to save weight.

[Grouseman]

Scott,

The main reason for this little effort is to reduce some of the mass from the front end of my Tacoma. With the ARB bumper and winch hanging out in front of the tires, it really changes the suspension dynamics.

More to come :)[/QUOTE]

Scott,

I got a catalog recently that had a small set up on a bumper, where you could install the winch as needed. (Warn Multi Mount) from Performance Products. It would hold up to 9500 lbs winch. I' m guessing it weighs 30 pounds or so. Have you seen that set up before? I really like the looks of the ARB bumper but it is heavy.

Grouseman

[madizell]

I have never understood the fixation with really long rope lengths on the winches. With a pully block and proper extension the 80-90' length is most ideal. A winch only generates its greatest capacity at the first layer of cable on the drum. Long winch lines make it difficult to attain full pulling power. That, and the line will nearly always pull to one side and require a respool anyways.

There is no single answer and no "ideal" in my opinion. Certainly most winch recoveries are short pulls, and if we are not traveling alone in remote country, there is usually someone at hand to provide an anchor point. However, using a snatch block can reduce available line by half, and if you have to use an extension to make the connection, you will have a shackle in the line that you will need to work around, since it won't spool past the snatch block. It also places a steel projectile in the middle of your recovery line, which you need to keep in mind, and deal with.

A lot of the discussion about line length has to be dictated by the winch you use. Many, like the M8000, won't take more than about 80 feet of line anyway, and they don't like having the line packed on one end, as will happen in a long recovery. If you use a hi-mount as I do (8274-50), it will hold 160 feet of 3/8 synthetic line easily, and I have made full length recoveries without resetting the line because the drum has an amazing ability to self-regulate and will handle a great deal of line packed to one side and still function. The longest recovery I have made was approximately a quarter mile up a 35 degree slope (t-case destroyed, tailshaft sheared, leaving us with only front wheel drive). Obviously we reset the line many times to pull that far, but we ran full length pulls each time without respooling or repacking. 80 feet of line would not have gotten us to some of the anchor points, and using an extension that needed to be put in line and taken out repeatedly would have used up a lot of recovery time. So, it just depends on your equipment and the situations you find yourself in whether you need or can use longer lines.

Not mentioned in the string here is the heat generated by lay down winches, and the effect that can have on synthetic line. Most of the high modulus poly ropes begin to break down at only 140 degrees, and beyond that temperature, the rope can quickly lose half of its rated strength. For lay down applications, particularly in ARB-style bumpers where the winch is enclosed and heat can build up, synthetic line is not a good idea unless you never do sustained pulling and never, ever, do reverse winching (power out to back down a slope) as reverse operation generates more than the usual heat due to stress on the internal brake. If you operate in desert heat, 140 degrees is easy to achieve with only light usage of the winch.

If you must use synthetic line in an enclosed laydown winch in hot country, use a kevlar based rope, such as X-line, which will take temperatures over 400 degrees without deformation. Actually, you can't really melt X-line with a torch the way you can high modulus poly rope such as Plasma rope. Warn offers a two-tone rope that is actually a combination of heat resistant rope for the first wrap and a poly outer length for the balance of the rope. I don't use the X-line only because of its handling characteristics, and not because it is inferior in strength or anything like that. X-line tends to jam a lot, and it makes spooling out after use a real *****.

The other comment, about greatest pull on first wrap, is true, but not really an issue most of the time. I have yet to stall my winch on the trail, so I rarely find myself demanding all the winch will produce in order to get unstuck (you have to be seriously, deeply, and gloriously stuck to offer 8,000 pounds of resistance, even with an 8,000 pound vehicle). Since it usually takes only one or two thousand pounds of pull to get moving from your standard trail stuck, it does not matter that I might be using wrap number 5 instead of number one. The winch pulls well enough even with the drum stuffed, as a rule.

Bottom line is that I have come up short on line, even with 150+ on hand, but have never been unable to recover simply because I had a lot of line on the drum.

[Life_in_4Lo]

This is a great thread:peepwall:
loosing weight on this is a critical factor for me. I think a pound # in front of the axle is like 2#'s behind it (between the axles). not scientifically, but you get what i'm saying! :)
anyway, under 50lb winch setup is great- that's my goal.

question- how is the syn line quality from winchline.com compared to the roadlessgear.com (line by the foot)? pricing looks similar

I am thinking 5/16x50'

Winchline goes from 50' to 90'... I was thinking of 50' for best performance (carry extension if needed)

recommendations on the end attachment? thimble thing looks cool but I dont like the idea of a big metal loop sticking straight out the front.

love the idea of moving the controller box into the engine bay. is there a writeup on this or more detailed suggestions?

[TACODOC]

This is a great thread :iagree:

My front end is noticeably heavier with all my junk up there, this could really help me out.
Damn that synth rope is expensive though! :yikes:
Where are the good deals at?

[vanguard]

Where are the good deals at?
I recently bought 5/16" amsteel blue for my M8000. I would argue against that thought that the M8000 can only hold 80 feet of line because there seems to be a lot of extra room with 100 feet. That's not a bad thing because you typically can't lay it down as nice during a recovery (or course).

Anyway, this is the best deal I could find: https://peakempire.com/store/product_info.php?products_id=198&osCsid=1a275ed971525e2152a01a59f14deca9

My friend and I both had the exact same experience at different times. We ordered it and didn't get any kind of confirmation, nothing. Two weeks went by and we didn't even know if our order was taken. We wrote to them but they didn't write back. In my case, the rope showed a few days after the email. I've still never heard from them.

On the positive side, the rope is great, it comes with instructions on how to spool it, etc. It's not pictured but it came with a really nice big red hook attached to it too. I'm really happy with the product and the price but Peak Empire needs communicate better.

[p1michaud]

love the idea of moving the controller box into the engine bay. is there a writeup on this or more detailed suggestions?

I did a few searches on YOTATECH and TTORA before doing this and found a bit of information. This is a realatively easy mod, all you need to do is figure out where you want to mount your controller box, then measure out the new wire distance. Buy the wire, open the controller box, remove one wire at at time (you can even label them with tape to be safe) then replace with the longer wire. Hook everything back up and presto you have a relocated controller box! :elkgrin:
Cheers :beer:,
P

[Willman]

I got a catalog recently that had a small set up on a bumper, where you could install the winch as needed. (Warn Multi Mount) from Performance Products. It would hold up to 9500 lbs winch. I' m guessing it weighs 30 pounds or so. Have you seen that set up before? I really like the looks of the ARB bumper but it is heavy.

Grouseman

Great question!!! :D

I am currently running the Warn Multi mount system! It is a great setup! I love how i can move the winch to the front to the back! It is also a great weight saver where i can store it in the bed. One thing that is cool about it is that it stays out of the weather!

I have a warn trans4mer brush guard up front that houses the reciever hitch..(FORSALE).I just bought an ARB bumper for my Tacoma. I am now fabbing up a plate with the reciever hitch to bolt right into the ARB so i can cont. the porable winch idea. I will post a thread of the buildup in the coming weeks!

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f374/nicwillman/DSC00920.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f374/nicwillman/DSC00980.jpg

:cool:

[Life_in_4Lo]

I just noticed winchline.com only sells the replacement delrin rollers but not the entire roller fairlead. Any leads on where they sell the entire roller fairlead?

I have a ARB w/ the 'wings' that support roller fairleads... I am thinking of using a Hawse instead for weight and simplicity.

[BajaTaco]

I just noticed winchline.com only sells the replacement delrin rollers but not the entire roller fairlead. Any leads on where they sell the entire roller fairlead?

I have a ARB w/ the 'wings' that support roller fairleads... I am thinking of using a Hawse instead for weight and simplicity.

How about the uber-cool Viking (http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=17630&postcount=43) unit?

EDIT: I see Viking has merged with Winchline. And the fairlead is not shown on the product listing. I would give them a call. I bet they have them.

[Outback]

I have used a wireless controller in Alaska, on one of the two speed Mega-winches. It seemed to work pretty well.

This guy had a sweet older Bronco with every goodie know to man on it. He coordinated this three winch recovery of a rolled (bigger) Bronco and was never near his truck. He could walk around and look at things as they were developing, all while making small winch corrections 60' from his rig.

I have a video of that somewhere... I will find it.

I just have never winched without being inside the truck, so I guess that is my thinking. A more mechanical connection, which should be more reliable.




How do you respool your winch line after you have used it. I always run mine back out and winch it back on correctly. I watch it as it rolls back on and make sure its all aligned. Whats your secret? Thanks.

[Life_in_4Lo]

thanks Chris,
I decided to go w/ a hawse uhmw fairlead. Less weight, no moving parts and alot less $$ (only $25)

I will probably have to do something to the ARB as the opening is larger- maybe the center of the fairlead will not be supported... gotta get it and see, it will be close.

If that's the case, maybe i'll get a alloy hawse and it will not bend- or put a backplate to close down the hole...

I got 80' of syn line. I figure that will be good...

[Life_in_4Lo]

My M8000 is in and hooked up! OEM dash controls too :)
It took awhile to finish all the wiring- bit here and there as I had time. Really happy w/ the result!

Now from this thread I know I am approx. at 45lbs. which is great.

I have a cutoff at the battery so the winch wil not work even if you mess w/ the control box or interior controls.

see here for pics
http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=106252

[BajaTaco]

That is looking great. I love the controls in-cab. Very nice. Who makes the fairlead?

[Desertdude]

Nice work James! This incab winch control using the 80 series antenna switch is on my short list. Do you have more details on the wiring process?

[Life_in_4Lo]

Hi guys, the fairlead is from okoffroad.com A really good site, good service. They are the only place I found a ARB bumper compatible hawse fairlead.

In the website, the hawse has "ok offroad" engraved into it. Thankfully, it arrived w/ no such advertising.


Pasquale,
My friend Andries really helped me out w/ the wiring as I'm a total dork w/ electrics.
Basically, if you get the Land Cruiser antenna switch, you need 2 DPDT relays(double pole, double throw) b/c it has 2 seperate buttons you can accidentally press at the same time. Wiring diagram on Slee's tech site

If you get the 4Runner antenna switch, you dont need that b/c it's a rocker switch.

I have the diagram all sorted out, will scan it for you later today.

[Desertdude]

Thanks James - I have read through the Slee tech article and will follow it to the tee :coffee:

have you thought about offering up the icon labels on your site? :D

[Willman]

My M8000 is in and hooked up! OEM dash controls too :)
It took awhile to finish all the wiring- bit here and there as I had time. Really happy w/ the result!

Now from this thread I know I am approx. at 45lbs. which is great.

I have a cutoff at the battery so the winch wil not work even if you mess w/ the control box or interior controls.

see here for pics
http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=106252

Great looking setup man!!!

Where did you get your all your rocker switches???..link???

[Life_in_4Lo]

willman, thanks!
I got the light switches from the TOyota dealer part #00550-35976

you can see at the bottom of page here (w/ shipping $ it is same price as dealer)
http://www.rallylights.com/hella/switches_illuminated_rocker.asp

The winch control switches I got on ebay. They are from a 89-90 4Runner, I think. Although many different Toyota models will probably fit. For example the rear defrost (winch on/off) I think is from a old Corolla or Camry...

Good thing on ebay, the OEM switches are cheap!

[Lost Canadian]

M8000 without controller or rope: 33lbs.


Ok so I've taken some notes from Scott's playbook and have incorporated some of the idea's with my truck.

Now I weighed everything and all my before weights matched Scott's, all except the winch itself. My M8000 with everything removed weighed in at 38lbs. My question is did something change with the M8000 that would account for the 5 extra pounds? Does the CE designation make a difference? I am happy with my outcome as I removed 22 lbs of cantilvevered weight going with synthetic rope and delrin rollers. Moving the controler back near the fire wall also moved 9 lbs of weight that was cantilvevered from the front for better distribution. I was hoping to get everything down close to 50 lbs total but at the moment the best I could muster was 57 lbs, still not bad, I'm glad I did it. Thanks for the idea Scott.
Here's the pics.
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/adventurenorth/Truck%20stuff/Winch.jpg
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/adventurenorth/Truck%20stuff/Winch004.jpg

[Beowulf]

That is one pretty fairlead. Might have to add that to the list.

[LAW]

since the old thread was dug up ill share some control relocations :D
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid220/p519192417aa5afc2e3d392e6665ee648/ebd86a2f.jpg
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid207/pc6fcbaf2e49b5dd353b2fb581d72ba85/eeb20c13.jpg

[ntsqd]

Since this has been pulled out of the archives......

I originally intended to wire a second control socket in the cab of the YJ from Hell, but the owner wanted switches so he got Contura to match the rest of the added switches. I had to 'manufacture' the exact reversing switch from a couple Conturas as there are none cataloged that do what we needed it to do.
On my 'glass bodied dune buggy I put the only remote control socket directly under the steering column and the relays (4 Ford Starter relay solenoids - 2.5k lbs winch) under the body just above the transaxle. With a 20' self-coiling cord from McMaster I can be in, on, under, or around the DB and still operate the winch from the one socket.

Surprise Canyon is one reason for long winch cables. The cable length of an 8274 is nearly perfect there. Can do the whole falls in 2 pitches if you set the first one correctly.
Somewhere around here I posted about testing synth line to failure. The reason for the test was to see what it took to fail some of the 1/4" stuff. I have a local marine vendor who can supply Amsteel in 1/4" or 3/8" (no 5/16") and the 1/4 got me to thinking about how much I could spool on an M8k if it were up to the job. It's rating is such that I wasn't sure about it. The test proved it to not be viable on an M8, but on the DB's winch.......

Then again, I've owned my M8 since buying it used at the second ever LeDuc Off Road Swap Meet and fixing it's motor (paid $25 for it) it's been trampled under foot, sans cable, in my garage.

[Willman]

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l242/adventurenorth/Truck%20stuff/Winch004.jpg

Where did you get your winch line saver? (The black rubber thing)

Something like this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Winch-Line-Saver-WARN-RAMSEY-JEEP_W0QQitemZ200126930392QQihZ010QQcategoryZ43984 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Seems like a little to much $$$$$$$........

I too am working on getting a M8000 and getting it to weight less than 50 lbs.........

[bigreen505]

I have a local marine vendor who can supply Amsteel in 1/4" or 3/8" (no 5/16") and the 1/4

Not to be the terminology police here, but make sure you post the full and correct name of the line you use. There is a huge difference between Amsteel and Amsteel Blue. The difference in breaking strength in the 1/4" size between Amsteel (SK-60 Dynema) and Ultrex (high quality SK-75 Dynema) is 3,000 lb. I think Amsteel Blue is somewhere in between. The difference in price between Amsteel and Ultrex in the 1/4" size is only 20 cents a foot.

EDIT: Just to clarify, breaking strength of 1/4" Amsteel is listed at 6,600 lb. and the same size Ultrex is listed at 9,600 lb. Amsteel in 1/4" is $1.13/ft and Ultrex is $1.37/ft.

[big sky trapper]

I love that roadless gear controller, I havnt used the hand held controller since i installed it. ( http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4917&page=4) I still use it for resetting the line back on the spool to keep things tidy. But still running the stock 55 amp alt, it makes keeping the RPMS up a little to not totally kill the battery/charging. and still run the winch. In and old (84) cab it tucked beutifull in one of the dash pockets.

[ntsqd]

Not to be the terminology police here, but make sure you post the full and correct name of the line you use. There is a huge difference between Amsteel and Amsteel Blue. The difference in breaking strength in the 1/4" size between Amsteel (SK-60 Dynema) and Ultrex (high quality SK-75 Dynema) is 3,000 lb. I think Amsteel Blue is somewhere in between. The difference in price between Amsteel and Ultrex in the 1/4" size is only 20 cents a foot.

EDIT: Just to clarify, breaking strength of 1/4" Amsteel is listed at 6,600 lb. and the same size Ultrex is listed at 9,600 lb. Amsteel in 1/4" is $1.13/ft and Ultrex is $1.37/ft.

I used the correct name of the line locally available to me.

The Amsteel page at the time of my test listed the "Average Breaking Strength" of the Amsteel, Not the Amsteel Blue, in 1/4" as being quite a bit higher than the number you list. I do not recall the exact number, but it was sufficiently close enough to the M8's capacity to make testing a sample worthwhile.

If I do ever load the M8's drum with 1/4" it will be Blue. At this point that's unlikely. Over the span of about 5 years I built a winch bumper for my '84 yota, then bought the winch. The two have never met & now I'm contemplating removing the bumper & selling it. If the winch ever makes it into the field with me it will be on a 2" slider.

[Jacket]

Where did you get your winch line saver? (The black rubber thing)

I too am working on getting a M8000 and getting it to weight less than 50 lbs.........

If I'm not mistaken, Trevor (Lost Canadian) is out on an extended trip across eastern Canada, and may not be checking in here? Just an FYI

I thought I read that the line was Master-Pull - but nothing specifically about the saver.

[Willman]

Just ordered my Warn M8000 4wheelparts.com.......$530 out the door....not bad.....

Now time to put her on a diet.........

:chowtime:

[Jacket]

Just ordered my Warn M8000 4wheelparts.com.......$530 out the door....not bad.....

Now time to put her on a diet.........

:chowtime:

That's a great deal! Now I'm tempted....

[Westy]

Thats a real good price.

A couple times a year Offroadoverstock has a sale, $499 shipped but it just ended a month or so ago.

[mountainpete]

You just can't beat their regular price... 4wheelparts is probably the WalMart of offroad and they have enough quantity to push the price down. It's a shame because I would much rather support other vendors like the ones on this board. But in the end, sometimes you just have to snag the best price.

But now I need to rant...

Earlier this year I had a great trip to Seattle and picked one up at 4wheelparts for $525 exactly - didn't even pay local taxes. That's about $550 CAD (todays rate the Canadian dollar is at 95.4 cents USD) Since the product is made in the USA, it's duty free. But I was over my import limit (did some other shopping too) and ended up having to pay a total of $11 taxes on the winch. So in total, I paid about $560 CAD for it.

In Canada, M8000's regularly sell for between $900 and $1100 (which is why those cheap Champion winches at Costco sell so well). I have actually seen places ask and SELL them for close to $1200. There must be MASSIVE mark-ups on these products here.

So for any Canadians out there considering if it's worth it to purchase winches or recovery related products and even have them shipped to Canada, the mess is YES. IT'S WORTH IT!

End of rant ;)

Pete

[asteffes]

If I'm not mistaken, Trevor (Lost Canadian) is out on an extended trip across eastern Canada, and may not be checking in here? Just an FYI

I thought I read that the line was Master-Pull - but nothing specifically about the saver.

www.winchsaver.com

[kjp98TJ]

sometimes they have blowouts on the M8k. 4wd or 4wheelparts. got mine for $476 shipped last year.

another safety option, and lighter, for rope users...
http://www.toughstuffproducts.com/jeep/winch_safety_thimble.html

[p1michaud]

But now I need to rant...

Earlier this year I had a great trip to Seattle and picked one up at 4wheelparts for $525 exactly - didn't even pay local taxes. That's about $550 CAD (todays rate the Canadian dollar is at 95.4 cents USD) Since the product is made in the USA, it's duty free. But I was over my import limit (did some other shopping too) and ended up having to pay a total of $11 taxes on the winch. So in total, I paid about $560 CAD for it.

In Canada, M8000's regularly sell for between $900 and $1100 (which is why those cheap Champion winches at Costco sell so well). I have actually seen places ask and SELL them for close to $1200. There must be MASSIVE mark-ups on these products here.

So for any Canadians out there considering if it's worth it to purchase winches or recovery related products and even have them shipped to Canada, the mess is YES. IT'S WORTH IT!

End of rant ;)

Pete

Pete,
I have to echo your sentiments here. I went this route as well because the cheapest I could find a Warn M8000 in Eastern Canada was $1100. Way too much especially if I can drive 1 hour and reduce the cost by half! I always try to support local vendors if the mark up is reasonable. I don't mind paying 10-20% more if I can get it locally.
Cheers :beer:,
P

[Willman]

Just ordered my Warn M8000 4wheelparts.com.......$530 out the door....not bad.....

Now time to put her on a diet.........

:chowtime:

Rope is now on the way........

:jumping:

http://www.amsteelblue.com/item.cfm?itemid=44843

[Jacket]

^That's pretty funny. I just ordered the same thing for my M8000....

[Willman]

^That's pretty funny. I just ordered the same thing for my M8000....

Good deal.....I also got their alum fairlead as well

:)

[Willman]

Now I weighed everything and all my before weights matched Scott's, all except the winch itself. My M8000 with everything removed weighed in at 38lbs. My question is did something change with the M8000 that would account for the 5 extra pounds? Does the CE designation make a difference?

Ditto on the 38 Lbs.....I'm wondering the same thing.........

I should still be able to stay under the 50 Lbs. mark.......


:sombrero:

[Mike S]

I like the "ARM" button. Looks like some type of weapons system -- could come in handy.

M

[Jacket]

Rope is now on the way........

:jumping:

http://www.amsteelblue.com/item.cfm?itemid=44843

Did your rope come with a new (longer) allen bolt to secure the rope to the winch drum? The Warn bolt on mine wasn't long enough - had to buy a new one and cut it to size.

[Willman]

Did your rope come with a new (longer) allen bolt to secure the rope to the winch drum? The Warn bolt on mine wasn't long enough - had to buy a new one and cut it to size.

Have not got their yet....Oh boy.........It better fit....by the way...what size is that little allen bolt just in case......I'm sure if you got the M8000....we have the same problem ........

Right now........I'm battling with the fairlead that master pull send me......bolts are 7/16" and my winch only takes 3/8".....


Keep ya posted!

:costumed-smiley-007

[Jacket]

It's a 1/4" bolt - length is tiny, maybe 1/4" or less. I think I ended up with a 1/2" or 3/4" length replacement, then cut it down to fit the new rope + 3 turns of thread. No big deal I guess - I just hate missing/wrong hardware, and all the extra trips to the hardware store that go with it...

Good luck with your fairlead - guess you might be drilling out those holes huh?

[Willman]

It's a 1/4" bolt - length is tiny, maybe 1/4" or less. I think I ended up with a 1/2" or 3/4" length replacement, then cut it down to fit the new rope + 3 turns of thread. No big deal I guess - I just hate missing/wrong hardware, and all the extra trips to the hardware store that go with it...

Good luck with your fairlead - guess you might be drilling out those holes huh?

Thanks for the bolt size........Still thinking of what i'm going to do......drilling doesn't sound to bad.......Is the case of the m8000 made out of cast or just plain steel where it bolts up to the ARB????...I think it is steel......

:REOutArchery02:

[ntsqd]

Were it me I'd just use the 3/8" bolts of the winch. If it's the design I'm think it is you don't have much option anyway.
The difference is 1/16" so the fairlead can only be a max of 1/32" misaligned. Buy some hardened heavy washers (like MMC (http://www.mcmaster.com/) p/n 98099A031) and you're good to go.