Budget expedition

[jmeadows]

Since I'm new to this forum ill give you the low-down on me, I live in Calgary Alberta, 19 years old and love my truck to death, also trying to make it in the music business.

So here is the deal, I’m young and poor, I was given a 78 GMC sierra Grande by my grandpa as he cannot drive. I’m relatively new to the whole expedition thing, however I do spend a fair amount of time in the rockies especially during the winter. I’m planning a wheel/rim upgrade to some BFG all terrain’s and to do some light bodywork on my truck. I’m toying with the idea for some sort of camper type setup in the bed but I am not sure. I’m looking for suggestions and ideas for every aspect of this vehicle with 2 restrictions to keep in mind:
1- I’m a student so I’m not always swimming in cash
2- this is my only vehicle besides a motorbike so I will be using it for city driving for about 6 months a year.

Thanks,
Jordan

[bootzilla]

Because you aren't trying to spend a ton of money, and because this will be a daily driver for you - I'd think that starting with a cap would be more economical. That way you can stow a bunch of gear securely, and you can always use the bed with the cap as a sleeping shelter at a campsite if you don't want to use a tent. You could try to find a cap that would allow you to attach roof rails, then you could put a spare tire or other gear on top, or add a roof-top tent later on if you want to and have the money. Those with pickups may want to chime in, but that seems like it woule be more economical than a camper in the bed.

It you Sierra 4wd? Since it is essentially a Chevy, I would think you should be able to find parts for better off road capability.

[asteffes]

Any reason you want to change the wheels? I would just not spend the money on wheels and put better tires on. The money you save could go toward the other gear you want/need.

I think I would just spend some time and money on making sure the truck won't leave you stranded. Make sure all the fluids are good, the brakes are good, battery is fresh... that sort of thing. Start with a good platform.

[flywgn]

... I would just not spend the money on wheels and put better tires on. The money you save could go toward the other gear you want/need. ...

I agree, and BTW welcome to the forum.

You can see from my sig that two of our vehicles are full-size trucks, albeit both are 4WD, and from the photo it looks as though your Sierra is 2WD.

Not to worry, we drove our '60 Ford longbed 2WD all over Baja in mid-sixties and though I stuck us a couple of times in sand (Baja) and mud (Wyoming) we had recovery gear aboard and extricated ourselves each time it happened.

You'll find that there are limitations to every vehicle, no matter how tricked out we make them.

Follow the advice from bootzilla and asteffes. Make the truck mechanically sound and then maybe add a cap to the bed. If you can afford a shell that has windows that open upwards (in addition to sliding screens) you'll enjoy the extra side access these offer. BajaTaco has this type on his 'Yota and we do also on the '04 F-250. I like being able to load and unload from the side.

You should be able to find a used one that you can modify if it's not to your specs. I would suggest, however, that the one you acquire have a strong roof so that you can carry gear on top if you want.

Have fun with your project.

Allen R

[goodtimes]

I had a very similar truck from '94 up until last year. Mine was also a 2wd. 1980 GMC Sierra Grande C-2500 (complete with the 454, t-465 transmission and 14 bolt full floating rear axle). This truck was severly limited in what it could accomplish "off road". The biggest problem was it was a 2 wheel drive, had 1 ton springs, and an open differential. Those 3 things added together work great on relatively smooth surfaces with a load...but take it off the improved surfaces, it lost traction very easily.

I won't coat this next comment in sugar. If you plan on spending alot of time "off road", you are better off with a different vehicle. Trust me. I've been there, and done that. The key here is resisting the urge to take it down every trail you see. This truck has alot of limitations. Live within these limitations and you are in for a good ride. If you get outside of the limitations, have a winch and shovel handy. You're going to need them.

What you have is fine if you are spending your time on improved roads, but the first time you hit crossed axle terrain, you are going to have trouble. Adding a winch can get you out of trouble fairly quickly, but you certainly don't want to winch yourself down long trails....it won't be any fun. You may enjoy it the first time, maybe twice, but after that, it just plain sucks (again....I've been there).

So, assuming you are spending most of your time on improved roads, here is what I would do.


Install a good set of tires on the stock wheels. Tall, narrow with aggressive tread.
Install a winch, carry the appropriate straps, tree saver, snatch block, shackles, etc., and know how to use it all.
Install a cap (camper shell) on the bed. Make sure it seals well (no water leaks), and can be locked (secure your gear).
Enjoy travelling on improved roads (innumerable places to see travelling in this fashion)
Take notes (yes, write it down!) on things that you want to improve in your next vehicle while travelling.Don't let anyone tell you that you must have a 4x4 to travel the back roads and have a good time. I put over 100,000 miles on my GMC, the majority was travelling the back country (primarily on improved roads). For awhile I had a 1969 Open Road Manhatten model slide in camper (big heavy SOB) that served as base camp for many fishing, hunting, hiking, biking, and backpacking trips. I had a great time with it, you should do the same. When the time comes to replace it, you will have a good idea about what features you want on your next one. Just be selective about what trails you point it down. That truck is heavy, wide, and can be hard to recover. With a bit of self control, you can have alot of enjoyable trips in it. It would take you an entire lifetime to see everything there is to see in that truck. So take your time and enjoy it.

*BTW--when I say "improved roads", I do not mean "paved" roads. Basically any road or trail that is maintained with a grader or blade, in addition to paved roads, will be fine in a 2wd, assuming you don't find any huge mud-holes. Most roads in Baja fit here too. Alot of the 2-tracks in the plains are suitable as well. It won't take long to figure out what works and what doesn't. If it doesn't work, back out and find a route that does work, simple as that.

[DaktariEd]

Jordan!
Welcome to the forum.
I'm not one of the mechanically inclined guys here...you'll get that kind of help from others.
I just wanted to say hi :wavey: and welcome...
Enjoy the place. There are so many incredibly talented folks here it will blow your mind! :yikes:
Cheers :friday:
Ed

[haven]

Goodtimes wrote:
"[my truck] was a 2 wheel drive, had 1 ton springs, and an open
differential...take it off the improved surfaces, it lost traction very easily...
If you plan on spending alot of time "off road", you are better off with a
different vehicle."

By this criterion, 99.9% of the trucks in Mexico should not leave the pavement. Yet the 2wd pickup truck is the standard mode of transportation throughout a country filled with unpaved roads and two-track trails.

No doubt 4wd is better than 2wd (and locked 4wd better still) for situations with limited traction. But there is lots of "manageable trouble" (to use Joaquin Suave's turn of phrase) to get into with a 2wd.

Chip Haven

[mountainpete]

Jordan!

Just wanted to say Hi and welcome to ExPo! Nice to see another Calgarian around! :friday:

Pete

[jmeadows]

thanks for the interest and welcomes. I've pretty much decided yes on the cap so thank you for the input to stregnthen my desicion. Now as far as tires and wheels go, i completly understand what everyone is saying about not spending mony on wheels and get better tires, I guess part of my wheel descision will also be based on asthetics. Im looking at BFG all terrain my current tire sizes are 225 75r15 , not sure of the exact demensions of my wheels, which if any BFGs will fit this or another tire as well?

Thanks again,

Jordan

[mountainpete]

BFG All Terrains are an excellent tire for our area. They are excellent all-around performers and also do amazingly well on snow & ice. They are pricey though in comparison to some of the other brands - like the Roughrider at Canadian Tire. You might want to look at them to save some cash.

I would strongly suggest watching the for sale section of sites like http://www.4wheeler.ca and of course http://www.buysell.ca and http://www.usedcalgary.com. You can often find deals on tires and parts for trucks like yours on there.

On 4wheeler.ca there is a guy selling 4 fairly new 31x10.5x15 for $300 including rims (that's what his final low price was). I believe you should be able to fit those fairly easily, but you may want to confirm that first. Check here: http://www.4wheeler.ca/index.php?showtopic=23790 A package like that would be ideal if the fit is right...

Like everyone is saying, focus on the tires and then canopy. For a canopy, Bargain Finder (www.buysell.ca) is the best place check. I am sure you can find something for less than $200 pretty easily.

Then throw a cheap Zellers air mattress and some blankets in the back of the truck with water, food, gas, etc and start travelling. Might I suggest the Forestry Trunk Road (FTR) from Highway 1A up to Nordegg. I just came back from 2 nights exploring the FTR from about Caroline to the South Ram River and then over to Rocky Mountain House. I just love that area - great if you like to fly fish too! Free random camping is available in lots of areas, lots of little trails to explore, and some nice, basic campgrounds too. Highly recommend Peppers Lake Campground - was there last night and loved the view from the campsite.

One more thing before I go to bed... Go to the Fishin Hole by Sunridge Mall and pick up this book: http://www.backroadmapbooks.com/index-bm.php?bookId=swalb&region=AB I say the Fishin Hole because their big sale is on right now and all the books are at least 20% off. Otherwise you can get the book at Canadian Tire, MEC, Ribtor, Campers Village, etc. That map book will help you find all those great roads.

Enjoy :D

Pete

[Life_in_4Lo]

I actually like the steel wheels & stock hubcaps on there- looks good. What about just spray painting the stock steel wheels a nice gloss black, grey or white? That would look great imo, and only cost some elbow grease and a few $ for paint cans.

Everyone else has it covered I think. It's boring but making sure all the maintence is up is probably the most important thing you can do to start.

oh yeah, maybe cut your exhaust pipe back a bit- so if you come off a ledge you dont squash the pipe into the body or tweak it.

[jmeadows]

.... Might I suggest the Forestry Trunk Road (FTR) from Highway 1A up to Nordegg. I just came back from 2 nights exploring the FTR from about Caroline to the South Ram River and then over to Rocky Mountain House....


that starts right west of cochrane going north goind through waiprous correct?

[mountainpete]

that starts right west of cochrane going north goind through waiprous correct?

Yes, that is the area I am speaking of. The Waiparous area is very nice and there are a lot off off-road enthusiasts there. The trail to Margaret Lake is a great first trail if you don't have a lot of experience. The big downside of the area is the traffic - it gets really busy. If you want a map of the area, go here: http://www.aurs.org/

For myself, I usually avoid Waiparous. It gets too busy for me and is especially crowded on long weekends. Also a lot of the trails are deep mud and ruts, designed for the serious huge jeeps and bogging trucks - just not what my truck is designed for. I like to keep going north up towards Nordegg. It gets quieter and the view along some parts of the road is great.

Pete

[calamaridog]

4wd would be ideal of course what with all the snow up North a 4wd is more usefull. This should not stop you from getting out and having a good time however:wavey: Use what you've got and have fun. You should be able to add a limited slip type product if you want more traction, it would be better than nothing.

I would say that wheels and tires are a decent idea. You should be able to upgrade the wheels VERY cheaply if you shop around a bit. You might even find a nice set of newer chevy wheels AND tires. Any good LT rated truck tire with a relatively aggressive tread pattern is better than what you have. I would not spend the cash for BFG ATs as they are very expensive you may shop for a better tire value such as Nitto Terra Grapplers, Yokohama Geolander ATII, or several other less expensive brands.

You should be able to find a deal on a used truck cap too. As stated, you can set up a simple sleeping and cargo configuration under the cap.

You can get one of those Superflow MV50 12volt air compressors for around $50 at Pep Boys. They are great for the price. Air you tire pressure down for additional traction in the dirt.

[91xlt]

save the $$$ for the wheels, add new tires...the $$$ for wheels, drop in a detroit tru trac.
the maintenance items should be numero uno!
have fun!

[CLynn85]

Yep, as everyone said so far get a good reputable mechanic to go over it with a fine tooth comb. As for wanting to upgrade the wheels, I'd look for a set of latemodel wheels with decent tires to bolt up if you must, or otherwise lose the hub caps and paint the steelies black. If the rear diff is open, a posi would be very high on my list. Add recovery gear, a shell, and a smart sleeping setup and you should be good to go. You'd be amazed where you can take a 2wd with a limited slip rear, some skill, and a lot of common sense. Oh, and lose the running boards... lol.

[jmeadows]

Yep, as everyone said so far get a good reputable mechanic to go over it with a fine tooth comb..... Oh, and lose the running boards... lol.

Ive had somone recently look at it, damn good condition only 130,000k need a new u-joint though, and the running boards have just been removed, I didnt like em much either

[1976K5Chalet]

Since i am here in calgary...and happen to have way to much 73-91 CKRV knowledge i'll tell ya what i can do.... full on inspection of said truck and list of items to be repaired to get her to 100% as you have time and money allows. Staying at the travelodge across from the ranchman restaraunt. Can't miss my truck....just look at my avatar and think 70's gm burnt orange and cream....with a colorado plate...

Waiting on a phone call to clear calgary for the next gamma well in hinton so i'll be out of the loop for a bit....970-250-3800 is my cell and my email is k5nutt@hotmail.com.

DW

[jmeadows]

Since i am here in calgary...and happen to have way to much 73-91 CKRV knowledge i'll tell ya what i can do.... full on inspection of said truck and list of items to be repaired to get her to 100% as you have time and money allows. Staying at the travelodge across from the ranchman restaraunt. Can't miss my truck....just look at my avatar and think 70's gm burnt orange and cream....with a colorado plate...

DW

DONE!
Ill give you a ring here within the day

[1976K5Chalet]

I'm in room 632....got about two weeks worth of reciepts to catch up on and work into an xls sheet....but otherwise i'll be around as i have not recieved word yet that its time to high tail it to hinton yet....


DW

[jmeadows]

I will let you know asap, Ive come across some snags in my scheduel over the past few days. So if I dont get a chance to drop by, dont hold your breath. But I definitly do appreciate the offer.

-Jordan

[1976K5Chalet]

Heading out to a job somewhere north of edmonton in the am...not sure how long this one will be but usually they are 5-6 days long.....

DW

[jmeadows]

Heading out to a job somewhere north of edmonton in the am...not sure how long this one will be but usually they are 5-6 days long.....

DW

ill be driving out of town tonight as well, just post here or msg me when ya get back

[1976K5Chalet]

Will do...doin a job out by fort assiniboine....

DW

[jmeadows]

alright, so I finally have the money for tires, as I had indicated before im pretty sure ill be picking up bf goodrich ATS, i currently have 225 75r15 s on my truck and thus i was looking at either the 215 75r15 or the 235 s (bf goodrich does not make 225s). However I was also wondering that with the currnet set up i have would I be able to increase my wheel size to 16"S with minimal problems?

Thanks
-Jordan

[Scott Brady]

My uncle has a truck very similar to yours. He switched to LT 30x9.5 R15 and has been very happy with the road manners and overall fit. No rubbing.

That would be my recommendation.

THanks for keeping us updated :)

[Grim Reaper]

235 x 85x 16 (roughly a 32) is a stock size on 3/4 ton 2wd in that body style. Thats what came on my 88 burb.
A 31x10.5 should fit without a problem. You could probably squeeze a 32x11.5 on it. It will fit the rear no problem but the width might get you a little contact with the rear of the wheel opening on the front. Little time with a sawzall and it will fit. Probably take no more then an inch. 33x10.5 would probably work with about the same amount of trimming.

[jmeadows]

235 x 85x 16 (roughly a 32) is a stock size on 3/4 ton 2wd in that body style.

mines only a 1/2 ton, stock is 225 75r15 thats the one thing im sure of

[Grim Reaper]

mines only a 1/2 ton, stock is 225 75r15 thats the one thing im sure of
It will fit. Just showing that the wheel well can clear that size without a problem with no modification.

I would concider bumping up to a 3.73 or 4.10 if you get near a 33 inch tall tire.

I know of people who have put 35's on them with NO lift and fiberglass fenders.


I haven't seen much discussion on lifting the truck yet. There are lift kits avialable for the 2wd's.

Some people will put a 3/4 ton front springs in it. Honestly I would concider a custom spring. While the 3/4 would gain you about 2 inches over the 1/2 ton its a very stiff spring so it would kill articulation. The rear actaully runs the same spring as the 4x4. Whats different is the spring mounts. You could swap the spring mounts from a 4x4 and gain about 2 inches inthe rear. Honestly thats a lot of work. I would look at a 4 inch spring from say Procomp. They flex pretty good, better then stock thats for sure. It would net you the 2 inches with minimal work. Now you may find you need to lift a little more then you thought depending on the gear you plan to travel with regularly. So take that weight into concideration.

If you want to go with used parts then swap the brackets and run a mid 80's 4x4 spring. They have friction pads at the tips of leafs.

If you haven't figured it out I have reseached this a GREAT deal. I was going to build a prerunner 2wd K5 at one time. The set up I was going to go with was 33's, 4.10 in the diff with a Eaton electric or a ARB and a built 700r4 tranny. That combination will give good slow speed performance.The 700r4 has a nice deep 1st gear. With the 4.10's it would put the motor right in it's sweet spot in trail conditions. The overdrive and the 33's will still make it a good hwy cruiser and keep the RPMS inline. Should let you stroll down the hwy getting 15mpg.

I'm at work. I use to have a bunch of links to prerunner stuff that would fit your truck. I'll see if they are still in my computer at home when I get there tonight.

[njtaco]

Not to deviate from the tire discussion, but...

Patience is your friend, especially on a budget. I've been spending a lot of time seeking "free" or "almost free" upgrades lately, with some success. I've picked up a 22 ft travel trailer (free), an 8 foot pop-up (75 USD), sunbrella canvas to repair the pop-up (5 USD), two fiberglass truck caps (one free, one 60 USD), set of four stock rims and tires with 1/2 tread (50 USD)... all in the last 3 months or so.

Point is... keep your eyes open and ear to the ground, and parts will come to you. If you want a gear change and locker/LSD, shop for a truck with one and swap the whole rear, then sell the donor truck (done that, too.) I agree with the 3.73 gears, easy to source in a stock truck to swap, and a good match with 31 or 32 inch tires. My K5 had 33-12.50-15 and 3.73 with a 700R4, and got 14-15MPG reliably.

IMHO, nothing "wrong" with the rims you have, pick up/find some salvage yard tires and try them out. 31-10.50-15 tires are a dime a dozen around here, and may be worth a try.

Good luck with the build.

:campfire:

On edit... I see now you have $ for tires set aside. Would it be worth it to "try out" salvage tires for cheap first, run them for a while to see how they work for you, and then buy the new ones later? A least you would not have to tolorate a potential "mistake" for the life of the new tires. Also, Yokohama tire has a 30-day money back guarantee. Not sure of the details, but this may be an option if you can get them near home. The Geolandar A/T + 2 may be my next "new" tire.

[Jonathan Hanson]

Jordan, that is a great truck. It will give you years of adventure.

I agree with most of what's been said here: good tires first, perhaps a size larger but not too big, a good fiberglass shell, and when you can afford it, a locker or limited slip.

Too many people miss out on adventures because they fool themselves into thinking they need more equipment. The only thing you need to have adventures is an adventurous spirit, and it's obvious you have that. So go have fun!

[jmeadows]

Just to update my progress if anyone is interested. Picked up some BFG All Terrains 235/75/15 brand spank'n new and was able to dig up a used high-lift and a blitz can. Also had a "clunk" sound looked at that my truck makes when I shift into reverse, the U joint(s) have been pretty much ruled out so im gonna take a look at my diff, silver lining of this is I might have to end up getting a limited slip (or locker) sooner than I had anticipated. Ill throw up a pic so you can seer the progress in the next couple days.

-Jordan