Troy's '98 XJ

[troy]

Hi all,

It is raining here and I'm a little bored at home watching a sick kid today. I haven't posted my expo/DD XJ, so I thought I'd take the opportunity.

It started out as a cheap winter beater for the wife that I bought about 4 years ago. I got it for a steal $1,600 back in 2004 because the fuel pump was going on it. I tuned it up and put it into duty at 150K. It now has 215K and is my main vehicle.

I've owned jeeps since I was 17 and so I had a few parts laying around from other projects. I didn't want to get to extreme as I've never been a rockcrawler, but more of an expo guy.

List of mods:

Suspension:
- OME lift (Used OME coils and leafs)
- Cheap Shock not sure of brand (they ride terrible)
- JCR HD tie-rod (Used from local Jeeper)
- 5 Moab wheels (used local jeeper)
- 255/70/16 BFG ATs (bought new)

Interior:
- Heated Seats (from old project)
- Auto Dim rear view mirror w/ compass and temp (from old project)
- Painless wiring 9 circuit waterproof fuse box (from old project)
- Raingler backseat barrier net (bought new to seperate kids from cargo)
- Lockable tool box with 4 drawers (from tool outlet store, meant for a truck)
- Husky liners in front & rear (bought fronts new, was given rear passenger for free)

Body:
- Pretty stock
- Brush Guard (it is pretty worthless, but it was free)
- Yakima rack, bike, kayak, ski attachments

Sorry I couldn't find better pics:

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z236/tlongtine/S5001339.jpg
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z236/tlongtine/S5001340.jpg

[ExpoMike]

Welcome to ExPo and glad to see another XJ. Looks good.

[troy]

The reason I finally posted a pic, is that I've decided to keep the Jeep another couple years at least. This next couple weeks I'm going to do a major tune-up. All new fluids, brakes, bushings throught, and a new set of OME shocks.

Since I'm going to be spending some money, is there anything I should think of upgrading? Example: do a rear disc conversion instead of just replacing the stock set-up?

I've also thought about upgrading for saftey aspects as well. Would rock rails and a bull bar really help me in a crash?

I've also been contemplating gears (4.10), but I don't know if they will pay for themselves with mileage savings.

Open to any thoughts or suggestions.

[IH8RDS]

Troy, glad to see another XJ. :victory:

I would recommend the disk swap in the rear. Easy and cheap from a ZJ. Rock rails will protect the body from unseen rocks or stumps. I wouldn't depend on them to really protect you in a crash, but I waited to long to get mine and I have two nice dents in my rocker panels from rocks. Rock rails are not just for rock crawlers. They keep other vehicle doors at bay too.

Sounds like you already have a good start.

[troy]

I actually went to the junkyard this past weekend to see if I could find a ZJ brake donor. There were a bunch of pre -96' and only one with rear disks, but someone took it apart to get some differntial parts and left the parts lay all over the place.

[Root Moose]

You could do 4.10s and disk brakes in the rear all at once by getting a junk yard 8.8 axle out of an Explorer.

That'll commit you to 4.10s for the front at that point but if you are running over size tires you really need to re-gear eventually anyway. Didn't 4 cyl XJs have 4.10s in the axles - possible junk yard front axle donor. Mileage savings is not the reason for re-gearing btw. Reducing work load on your drivetrain and making the gearing work better off-road (among others) is the reason. If you plan on bigger tires you may want to nail down your ratio before doing this though.

For a tool box consider getting a canvas roll up to put tools in. They don't rattle like a mofo on the trail. :)

[IH8RDS]

I ended up going the 8.8 route.

[XJBANKER]

The main thing that you need from the junk yard is the backing plate. Just buy new rotors anyway and if you can snag any year of calipers use them as core trade ins and get new calipers. One of the best modifications I ever did on my Jeep. I would not hesitate to do it again

[IH8RDS]

I did the disk brake conversion when I had the 8.25 rear axle. I turned the junk yard rotors because they were in decent shape. They are pretty cheap though so you can just pick them up at the local parts store. I think it came out to a wash when I added up the junkyard price and the price to turn them. I also grabbed the backing plate, calipers and all of the bits and pieces for the emergency brake. Make sure that you grab a brake proportioning valve from a V8 ZJ. You don’t need the whole valve, just take the internal needle out of it.

[jeepmedic46]

Welcome to the Expo:ylsmoke:

[troy]

What's all involved with the explorer 8.8? relocate spring pads? Driveshaft changes?

Also, is width different / need for spacers?

I won't be going any bigger, I figure I can get another 50K out of my BFGs and then I'll consider if I want to keep it longer. 255/85 KM2s are tempting.

Also, I'm contemplating Blistein 5100s vs. OMEc (c is for the comfort version), any thought? They are about the same price and reviews on the web are about the same.

Thanks,
Troy

[Root Moose]

Yeah, it's mostly springs pads and the brake lines. IIRC the width is within an inch or so (narrower). Not a big deal.

You should go over to naxja.org to research this if you haven't already. Any question you could conceivable ask about an XJ has been answered over there already. :) But don't take that the wrong way - if you are looking for pointers to cut the cruft of searching through noise over there ask here first so we can set you into the right direction for searching quickly. :)

[Root Moose]

For the dampers, either is top notch equipment. I'd be inclined to go with the cheaper ones (Bilstein?)

[DaJudge]

Troy,

Unless you have ABS you have a 29 spline 8.25 which is plenty strong. I wouldn't waste the money and time switching to an 8.8.

[Root Moose]

But then he has to re-gear if he wants 4.10 gears.

Agreed otherwise.

If you plan on running a TAD then you'll be re-gearing regardless. That said, an 8.8 is stronger but it is a moot point unless you turn into a rock-crawler or something. 8.25 is plenty strong.

[troy]

You should go over to naxja.org to research this if you haven't already. Any question you could conceivable ask about an XJ has been answered over there already. :) But don't take that the wrong way - if you are looking for pointers to cut the cruft of searching through noise over there ask here first so we can set you into the right direction for searching quickly. :)

I am a member over on naxja, but I trust the responses here a little more. Naxja seems to have a lot of younger members that share their opinion without real knowledge.

I go to the junkyard every few months and am was able to find 4.10s in cherokees on a couple occassions, but they either were missing parts or were the dana 35 rears.

I'll probably stick with my 8.25 and get ZJ rear disks. I hate to put too much money in it, because of the high mileage and cars don't last too long with the salt on the roads. It still is pretty tough to replace for what I have in it.

Thanks,
Troy

[Root Moose]

I am a member over on naxja, but I trust the responses here a little more. Naxja seems to have a lot of younger members that share their opinion without real knowledge.

Yeah, seems to be a common complaint lately. It's turning into a bit of JU over there. Rule of thumb: if the poster is a club member (name in red) versus a forum user (name in black) they tend to be more creditable. There's exceptions to everything but generally if someone is willing to pony up the cash to support the club over there they are a little more serious about it.

That said, there is a huge amount of excellent info over there if you can "cut to the chase" quickly.


I go to the junkyard every few months and am was able to find 4.10s in cherokees on a couple occassions, but they either were missing parts or were the dana 35 rears.

I'll probably stick with my 8.25 and get ZJ rear disks. I hate to put too much money in it, because of the high mileage and cars don't last too long with the salt on the roads. It still is pretty tough to replace for what I have in it.


I hear you. Same situation here. That said, when the time comes to replace your XJ getting another one in better shape will be cheap if you wanted to stay with the platform. They built a brazillion of these things so they are cheap to replace. Would be easy to transfer your desirable parts into the new body donor. That's my intention anyway. That plus since the Jeep is no longer in daily driver mode it isn't getting the wear, tear and corrosion that it was.

[IH8RDS]

Just for reference, I had to run spacers to clear the leafs because I run stock steelies. My back spaced rims where fine. I would of kept the 8.25, but I got a sweet deal with an 8.8 already set up for an XJ with 4.56's and an ARB. Another route is the elusive Dana 44 that came stock in XJ's, but when people have them they usually know what they have and demand a pretty penny.

With what you plan on doing the 8.25 will be plenty.

NAXJA is a really good reference. I was a member since 2005, but I let my subscription lapse and I haven't renewed. By far it is the XJ authority.

[troy]

I hear you. Same situation here. That said, when the time comes to replace your XJ getting another one in better shape will be cheap if you wanted to stay with the platform. They built a brazillion of these things so they are cheap to replace. Would be easy to transfer your desirable parts into the new body donor. That's my intention anyway. That plus since the Jeep is no longer in daily driver mode it isn't getting the wear, tear and corrosion that it was.

Over the past weekend I finally gave the old girl a little tune-up since I've decided to keep her in the fleet for as long as the body holds out and then will likely buy a replacement to transfer parts in a couple years. Items reaplaced:

- 4 new OME shocks
- New lower control arms complete with busings.
- New upper control arms with busings.
- New stock style sway bar links.
- New sway bar bushings front and rear.
- New Alternator (bearing happened to go right before the scheduled garage time).

It rides great. Very solid. With all the new rubber and shocks it is very confindence inspiring. I should have done this long ago, but I didn't know it would improve this much.

During my inspection, the rear axle appears to have the bearings going on it. they are noisy seem to have some play. Other than fluid changes it is stock and has 225K on it now. I will likely just replace the wheel bearings and new fluid, but what does expo think of this:
http://www.teamgrandwagoneer.com/parts/Detailed/2895.html

- It would give me a "new" assembly since mine has 225K and there may be more repairs down the road besides just wheel bearings. I currently have a snapped lower shock mount that I've welded up.
- Would save on the cost of fluid/gasket/wheel bearings
- My current diff needs brakes in the new few months.
- 4.10 gears
- track loc (I'm open right now)

Dana 30s with 4.10s are easier to come by or I could pay to have the gears changed in my current HP30.

New axle assembly $1,400 plus shipping.
Savings repairing old axle (Brakes, lube, gasket, bearings, time) $200.

What are your thoughts?

[ExpoMike]

During my inspection, the rear axle appears to have the bearings going on it. they are noisy seem to have some play. Other than fluid changes it is stock and has 225K on it now. I will likely just replace the wheel bearings and new fluid, but what does expo think of this:
http://www.teamgrandwagoneer.com/parts/Detailed/2895.html

- It would give me a "new" assembly since mine has 225K and there may be more repairs down the road besides just wheel bearings. I currently have a snapped lower shock mount that I've welded up.
- Would save on the cost of fluid/gasket/wheel bearings
- My current diff needs brakes in the new few months.
- 4.10 gears
- track loc (I'm open right now)

Dana 30s with 4.10s are easier to come by or I could pay to have the gears changed in my current HP30.

New axle assembly $1,400 plus shipping.
Savings repairing old axle (Brakes, lube, gasket, bearings, time) $200.

What are your thoughts?

Here is the same axle that you have listed above but for $1137.95 + shipping.
http://www.discountjeepparts.com/product_info.php/cPath/3121_3126/products_id/23160

I bought this one for my Jeep (this vendor/product I listed). To me it was the perfect deal. Since I regearing to 4.10's by the time I spent the money to get the gears, installation, replace bearing and seals and do a fresh brake job, I was looking to spend almost that much and that did not include the LSD. Since I was also doing an SYE, I bought a new front driveshaft from this vendor so it all bolted up no problems. Allows me to use the same driveshaft front or rear. Only need one spare then.

Only downside most people complain about the 8.25 is limited on gear ratios (I think 4.56 is max) and limited on type of lockers available. If these are no issue, then it is a good setup for up to 33" tires.

[Root Moose]

Only downside most people complain about the 8.25 is limited on gear ratios (I think 4.56 is max) and limited on type of lockers available. If these are no issue, then it is a good setup for up to 33" tires.

IIRC there is now a 4.88 gear set available. It's "recent" news.

[troy]

Wow, that is $250 cheaper than the place I was looking at. Enough to cover shipping. Thanks.

Now I have to locate a front with 4.10s in it, or maybe I can find a local gear guy to swap in gears. I have no idea what to expect for cost on a gear swap.

Once I started adding up what the repair parts and time were going to be, it looks like this is more of an option than I first expected. I'd hate to drop $2-300 into an old axle and have something else fail after than. This way I can keep this axle for the next XJ.

[ExpoMike]

Glad to help.

Also good to know about 4.88's... not that I am going to need them. If I ever move up tire size, it would be to 33" and that would be max for me.

[troy]

A little update:

As I stated in another thread, I picked up a 4.10 LP30 from a '98 TJ. To replace My 8,25 rear with a bad bearing and broken shock mount I ordered a new suprlus OEM axle from this guy:

http://www.vintagejeepparts.com/Specials_2010Q2_1.asp

It is the same deal as other vendor have listed, where you get a new OEM 8.25 with 4.10 gears, trac-loc, complete with brakes and parking brake cables. They are surplus items meant for quick install on the assembly line. Apparently they are all drop shipped from one company in Georgia, that bought all the surplus inventory from Jeep. I found six different websites that were selling them, ranging from $1,900 to $970. Shipping is a flat $125. So, it should be here in 4-5 days.

I contemplated the 8.8 and another 8.25 and then have it geared and possibly locked, but this was an easy solution for me and time is money. I'm just happy I got the Dana 30 for $86.

I conveniently have vacation coming up the last week of June and will be installing these and a new torque converter for the AW4 (lock-up clutch is shot).

I've come to the realization that I really like this vehicle and will continue to keep it for the foreseable future. I paid $1,600 cash for it 5 years ago, so it owes me nothing.

Future Mods:

- Iceland Offroad Flares (if they can get there act together)
or
- Buschwackers new cutout tube flares
- TJM rear tire carrier (Rusty's offroad)
- 265/75/16 Goodyear Duratrac load range C (current 255/70/16 BFGs have about a year left in them)
- Winch bumper - not yet determined, will depend on flares chosen
- AJ offroad stage I sliders
- New paint job (I will paint myself)

That is all for now.
Thanks,
Troy

[baca327]

- Buschwackers new cutout tube flares

I think I read they are not cut-out flares. On their website it says that if you have previously installed their cut-out flares they will not fit. I think there just stock replacements, but I may be wrong.

[troy]

I think I read they are not cut-out flares. On their website it says that if you have previously installed their cut-out flares they will not fit. I think there just stock replacements, but I may be wrong.

I read thru their install instructions and they are cut-out, but not as much as their others. Their is a PDF of install instructions on the product page for them. It appears to be about 1/2" removed on the top, and about an inch along the sides. Not sure I'm that excited about the looks, but I have some small rust issues that this would take care of. Iceland Offroad is my main preference, but I can't find any "good" experiences and only a couple actual installs on the web.

[baca327]

I read thru their install instructions and they are cut-out, but not as much as their others. Their is a PDF of install instructions on the product page for them. It appears to be about 1/2" removed on the top, and about an inch along the sides. Not sure I'm that excited about the looks, but I have some small rust issues that this would take care of. Iceland Offroad is my main preference, but I can't find any "good" experiences and only a couple actual installs on the web.

I wanted the Icelands, but I heard too many horror stories about them. Those bushwackers sound good now that I know they are cutouts.

[troy]

I wanted the Icelands, but I heard too many horror stories about them. Those bushwackers sound good now that I know they are cutouts.

I noticed that Motion Offroad is now a dealer for Iceland. Only one that I know of. I've thought about giving them a call to see what their experience has been and maybe placing an order through them as they may be treated differently than average joes. It sure seems like there is a market for a more stock looking cut-out flare. Something like Icelands in plastic like the stock flare would sell great if it was priced reasonably.

[troy]

Installed the new 8.25 this weekend complete with ZJ discs. I can't believe what a difference the correct gearing makes (4.10). It's been so long driving with essentially 31's and stock gearing. Also tested out the trac-loc, and it works as advertised.

For what they cost (~$80), they ZJ discs are a great upgrade. I've ordered explorer parking brake cables and will install the prop valve to finish it up. I also added a new tool to the arsenal, it's a Motive Power bleeder. Made bleeding brakes a one man job and it took probably 10 min. to do bleed all 4 corners and replacing all the fluid. Highly recommend one:
http://store.motiveproducts.com/pro-bleeder-kit--0250-p56.aspx

The 4.10 D30 will be freshened up this week and installed next weekend. I was going to freshen up the steering and front brakes, but it drives and stop straight and true, so I'll save that for when I get new tires later in the year.

Notice a lot of guys posting their odometer pics. 100K is still a baby. Mines at 236K and running great.