should I buy a G?

[rdb4Runner]

I have the chance to buy a 1985 280GE petrol british spec G, what do you guys/gals think...not too excited about the petrol part but it comes with some decent BFG AT's, possibly MT's but I haven't seen it in person yet. Its a 9 seater, expo white:exclaim:, 5 door...they want 1750 GBP but it has been for sale for awhile...4x4's aren't exactly popular right now. I could probably get the price way down. Anyone have any experience/opinions on this model?

[haven]

1750 GBP = 2575 USD

In USA, asking price for mid-1980s 5 door petrol Gelandewagens is more than $10K, usually more than $12K, sometimes as much as $20K for very clean low mileage examples.

Because of the USA emissions and safety rules, this 1985 vehicle would have to wait until 2010 (or whenever 25 years from the date of manufacture would be) before it could legally be registered in USA. Assuming your G-Wagen is in good condition without too many miles driven, you could buy the G-Wagen, drive it for a year, then sell to a USA buyer with a profit of as much as 10,000 USD = 6800 GBP.

Just a thought!

Chip Haven

[Rovertrader]

Hold out for a 300 D- better truck, and way better resale- jm2c.

[mauricio_28]

Educate me: How's a 300-series better? Which one has the rear-, front- and center-locking differentials?

[Gurkha]

The diesels are more tractable when doing off road, all of them have front and rear lockers standard as well as PTO.

[rdb4Runner]

a little more info on the G, 126,000 mi on the clock, new gearbox at 112,000 mi, bull bar...extensive service and ownership history. I think I need to go see it in person, if at least for the investment possibilities. Theres no point in holding out for a 300D because I wasn't really looking for a G, this one just happens to be available. I'll probably buy it and start sinking money into it and then not want to sell it again.

[Root Moose]

The only thing that would put me off a petrol G is the fuel consumption. Diesel would be a keeper.

[michaelgroves]

... all of them have front and rear lockers standard as well as PTO.


In 1985, that became true. I am pretty sure that prior to that, the front diff-lock was a factory fitted option.

[shogun]

Lots of silly opinions on this one. Look, for a lousy $3k, anything that runs is a bargain. And who cares if its petrol, he has no choice, this is the vehicle thats available and unlikely to stumble upon a diesel for this (or any) price. And who cares about resale value? Thats what caused alot of this financial mess.

Buy what you want and use it, use it up for this price. Lifes too short.

[BKCowGod]

Wow, Shogun - woke up on the wrong side of the bed?

$3000 for a truck you don't want/need is $3000 more than you should spend on it. While it is a screaming deal here in the US, I would still only buy it if I was in the market for another truck.

After all, unnecessary consumption is what got us into this mess :P

[michaelgroves]

$3000 for a truck you don't want/need is $3000 more than you should spend on it. While it is a screaming deal here in the US, I would still only buy it if I was in the market for another truck.


I'm with you on this one. The OP's here in the UK, and while Gs are still silly money here, they are not as silly as over there. On the other hand, petrol is well over US$5/USgal.

[zimm]

Buy what you want and use it, use it up for this price. Lifes too short.

x2

[michaelgroves]

x2

Er.. this from a guy with 2 FJs, an FJ55, an LX470, and a Defender 110... Personally, I still find $3K a lot to spend and "use up" a vehicle, no matter how nice it may be.

[G-force]

Regarding diffs and PTO.

I think this differs between the different countries.

Here in Norway, both front and rear difflocks, and PTO was optional, at least up to -91.

A friend of mine owns a 230GE without any lockers or PTO. Do belive its an -85

My -87 has difflocks both front and rear. No PTO though . . . .


And regarding fuel consumption? Get ready for 1,5 or more for every 10 kilometers.

But what anice sound on that straight six

[zimm]

Er.. this from a guy with 2 FJs, an FJ55, an LX470, and a Defender 110... Personally, I still find $3K a lot to spend and "use up" a vehicle, no matter how nice it may be.


where do you live, that 3k can even buy a vehicle that runs for more than a year w/o having to dump 3k or more into it? i really fail to see where my hoard has any bearing on your point, when 3k is below the reliable 4wd threshold anyway. unless youre damn lucky, thats beater truck fundage.

[BKCowGod]

Zimm - $3k will get you a pretty nice FSJ, several 90's American pickups, a somewhat rough Disco or a nice RR classic, an 80's Toyota, most Isuzus or Mitsus from the 90's... At least here in California, any of the above will be clean and rust free, passing smog, with all accessories working. This is not just anecdotal. I have never paid more than $5k for any vehicle... The BMWs and all my 4x4's were all under $2k.

[zimm]

Zimm - $3k will get you a pretty nice FSJ, several 90's American pickups, a somewhat rough Disco or a nice RR classic, an 80's Toyota, most Isuzus or Mitsus from the 90's... At least here in California, any of the above will be clean and rust free, passing smog, with all accessories working. This is not just anecdotal. I have never paid more than $5k for any vehicle... The BMWs and all my 4x4's were all under $2k.

if you say so. id love to see a full size 4x4 pickup that you could reliably put 15000 (1year) miles on, and not have repairs adding up. toyotas? been buyin them all my life. with the resale they have, you cant find a clean 3k one. you can find good runnin rust bucket though. land rovers? please. the brakes cost 4x more than a chevy's. i would NEVER buy a 3000 dollar disco.

so how much do you think you spend on 4wd rig, thats road worthy, and you could drive till the wheels fall off?

thats a 3k truck, fella. a 3k truck aint a keeper, unless its some emotional attachment.

the last sub 3k truck i bought was an fj 60. it was the perrrrrrfect rig to drive the wheels off of. 2 years cost me 200 bucks cause a fella bought it for parts.

[BKCowGod]

if you say so. id love to see a full size 4x4 pickup that you could reliably put 15000 (1year) miles on, and not have repairs adding up. toyotas? been buyin them all my life. with the resale they have, you cant find a clean 3k one. you can find good runnin rust bucket though. land rovers? please. the brakes cost 4x more than a chevy's. i would NEVER buy a 3000 dollar disco.

so how much do you think you spend on 4wd rig, thats road worthy, and you could drive till the wheels fall off?

thats a 3k truck, fella. a 3k truck aint a keeper, unless its some emotional attachment.

the last sub 3k truck i bought was an fj 60. it was the perrrrrrfect rig to drive the wheels off of. 2 years cost me 200 bucks cause a fella bought it for parts.

Not to get into a pissing match, but every vehicle pictured below (including my dad's Jeep and my friend's Toy) was under $3000. True, the orange one was a project vehicle, but the rest were dirt reliable in all weather in all conditions for many miles. The baby in my fleet is my wife's M3 with only 150k on it. The rest of my vehicles generally had at least 200k.

http://www.kuhgott.com/gallery/d/16366-2/DSCF2683.JPG
http://www.kuhgott.com/gallery/d/14674-2/IMG_1754.JPG
http://www.kuhgott.com/gallery/d/14144-2/DSCF2414.JPG
http://www.kuhgott.com/gallery/d/10290-2/IMG_0869.JPG
http://www.kuhgott.com/images/f250.jpg
http://www.kuhgott.com/images/trooper.jpg
http://www.kuhgott.com/images/audi.jpg

[michaelgroves]

where do you live, that 3k can even buy a vehicle that runs for more than a year w/o having to dump 3k or more into it? i really fail to see where my hoard has any bearing on your point, when 3k is below the reliable 4wd threshold anyway. unless youre damn lucky, thats beater truck fundage.

What you were endorsing was this comment: "Buy what you want and use it, use it up for this price. Lifes too short." In other words, the 3K is well spent, just to play with the truck, no matter what.

What I'm saying is that 3K is too much for the likes of me to spend on a toy that I will just "use up". If I were to spend $3K (or any amount, really - "spare" money is an alien concept to me!), it would have to be on something I really want, and will last a reasonably time. And I'd think long and hard about it first.

Your "hoard" is germane because you evidently have a fair amount of money to put into vehicles, and so don't have to make as many choices as some others. It's a nice position to be in, but don't assume everyone is as fortunate! :)

Btw, again, your assumptions about pricing must be very local to you. Here in the UK, a good diesel Discovery 1 can be had for well under £2K, and run very very cheaply, since LR parts are incredibly cheap.

[4Rescue]

Man I say go for it. If It's got F/R lockers and it runs (and the 4wd works) it's worth at LEAST 3k. Like someone said, that truck here in the states would go for 10K plus. The G-Wagen is built Hell-for-stout so no matter what engine it has in it you're at least starting with some good quality running gear. What's to stop you from throwing in the diesel of your choice shoulod you deem it nessescary??? If for nothing else, just buy it so we can all drool over it ;)

For point of reference:
Bought my 1st Gen 4Runner 22RE 5spd and in IMACULATE shape for 1500 (admitedly from a friend who knew how much it meant to me), droped in a clutch for 200 and away I went for 2.5 years before I had to replace the 22RE (@ 250+K) for another 1800 that brings the grand total to 2k spent ... So so 3500 bucks get's a very collectable truck that'll last another 200K at least...

I'd say a 3k truck is very attainalble, you've just got to be patient adn keep your eyes open. Course it helps if you start with the right truck (I doubt you could get a Disco for the same money that'd run/last as long...)

Cheers

Dave

[michaelgroves]

The problem in the UK is the relative running costs. The MB trucks are reliable, but things do break and wear out. If you off-road one for kicks, it will start to cost an arm and a leg. If you're considering it for expedition use or a DD, then you probably want to start with one that's a bit newer or in better condition, and spend quite a lot more than $3K.

You can buy a Discovery with a pair of ARBs, which will more competent off road, for a LOT less money than a G-wagen in similar condition. You don't get the quality and reliability, but even so, the Discoveries are dirt cheap (by comparison) to run, maintain, and kit out.

[Gurkha]

The G Wagen is indomitable off road so even of its a bit more costly to run, its over engineered, breaks far less and can take hits which will bend others. Best of all, it is a dream off road, will do things in 2WD mode that will need 4WD mode on others.

[4Rescue]

The G Wagen is indomitable off road so even of its a bit more costly to run, its over engineered, breaks far less and can take hits which will bend others. Best of all, it is a dream off road, will do things in 2WD mode that will need 4WD mode on others.*Cough*... 70 Series Landcruiser...*cough*

I agree the G is a really neat truck but there are certainly a few others that are right there with it in terms of quality and capability. Hell, an LJ Rubicon will GO anywhere a G will (might even do better in the mud/goop with the 4.0L I6), it just might not be in as good of shape when or if it comes home ;)

Cheers

Dave

[michaelgroves]

*Cough*... 70 Series Landcruiser...*cough*

I agree the G is a really neat truck but there are certainly a few others that are right there with it in terms of quality and capability. Hell, an LJ Rubicon will GO anywhere a G will (might even do better in the mud/goop with the 4.0L I6), it just might not be in as good of shape when or if it comes home ;)

Cheers

Dave

Agreed. The G-wagen is excellent in its own way, but it's not in a class of its own. Like any 4x4, it has weak points, and at least three spring to mind: 1) it's heavy; 2) it has mediocre axle articulation; 3) it lacks power. Futhermore, its main offroad party trick is having lockable axle diffs - which these days isn't such a big deal. I'm not sure what "it will do things in 2WD mode that will need 4WD mode on others" means, exactly, but I expect a Rubicon or a Disco 1 or 2, or a Defender fitted with axle lockers would all acquit themselves very well against a G on any trail.

My point to the OP about the viability of the G as an off-road "banger" plaything, though, was more about the cost of add-ons and the inevitable breakages and maintenance that need to be factored in. It's about why someone would buy a G-wagen as opposed to another truck, which is an even more complicated question than "which is the best off-road".

In fairness, one thing that is heavily in favour of a G-wagen, is that depreciation is relatively low compared to similarly priced vehicles. However, again, that is more an advantage if one is not buying the truck as an offroad plaything!

[Gurkha]

*Cough*... 70 Series Landcruiser...*cough*

I agree the G is a really neat truck but there are certainly a few others that are right there with it in terms of quality and capability. Hell, an LJ Rubicon will GO anywhere a G will (might even do better in the mud/goop with the 4.0L I6), it just might not be in as good of shape when or if it comes home ;)

Cheers

Dave


I have owned 80 series TLC, I still respect TLCs and find them quite competent and reliable but they can't take punishment like the G and the G has quite an edge with two lockers engaged. Also I find the G has far better powertrain, in terms of engine, I will give the HINO build diesel on TLC equal footing with OM616/617 and better rating than the other MB engines.

If you just want to bang around off road for cheap, nothing and I mean nothing comes close to a rebuilt Willys JEEP. They are light, cheap to fix even though they break often and very easy to run.

[michaelgroves]

If you just want to bang around off road for cheap, nothing and I mean nothing comes close to a rebuilt Willys JEEP. They are light, cheap to fix even though they break often and very easy to run.

Here in the UK, a Willys would be horribly expensive to run! (And, like a G-wagen, they are too valuable to be just a toy). The most popular 4x4 bangers are old Land Rovers (Series, Defenders, RRCs, Discoveries, and hybrids). Also Suzuki SJs, Daihatsu Fourtraks, and Lada Nivas.

[mauricio_28]

Gurkha, out of curiosity, if I were looking for a 1990s TDI "G", what would be the year and model number/letter to get?

[Gurkha]

Gurkha, out of curiosity, if I were looking for a 1990s TDI "G", what would be the year and model number/letter to get?

300GD, stick your sights to that. Check for rust and proper functioning of diff locks, also look for excessive steering shake, little bit is fine, excessive, walk away from it.

[Gurkha]

Here in the UK, a Willys would be horribly expensive to run! (And, like a G-wagen, they are too valuable to be just a toy). The most popular 4x4 bangers are old Land Rovers (Series, Defenders, RRCs, Discoveries, and hybrids). Also Suzuki SJs, Daihatsu Fourtraks, and Lada Nivas.

Michael,

In India there are a lot of them and you can find them being used by enthusiasts in various JEEP off road events. In fact JEEP guys are rabid fanatics here and in their motto, nothing else will do. If they can't afford Willys then they go for the JEEP made by Mahindra using Peugot diesel or modified JEEP petrol engine which Mahindra converted to OHC from side valve.

[michaelgroves]

300GD, stick your sights to that. Check for rust and proper functioning of diff locks, also look for excessive steering shake, little bit is fine, excessive, walk away from it.

I've never owned or even driven a turbo diesel G-wagen, so I can't comment on whether the 300GD is better. But I own a 300GD (it's a 1985 LWB model 460), and without a turbo, it's very underpowered, even by Land Rover standards. This doesn't matter too much to me, but it would make it less of a pleasure as a DD.

[Gurkha]

I've never owned or even driven a turbo diesel G-wagen, so I can't comment on whether the 300GD is better. But I own a 300GD (it's a 1985 LWB model 460), and without a turbo, it's very underpowered, even by Land Rover standards. This doesn't matter too much to me, but it would make it less of a pleasure as a DD.

You have the 5 cylinder n/a OM617 which develops 80bhp, granted its under powered but that engine is bullet proof, like its smaller counterpart the OM616, its over engineered and under rated, that means a lifelong proposition with minimal basic maintenance. The G is geared properly and does well off road with those 80bhp. The 90s G has six cylinder 3liter turbo diesel which develops way more power.

[michaelgroves]

You have the 5 cylinder n/a OM617 which develops 80bhp, granted its under powered but that engine is bullet proof, like its smaller counterpart the OM616, its over engineered and under rated, that means a lifelong proposition with minimal basic maintenance. The G is geared properly and does well off road with those 80bhp. The 90s G has six cylinder 3liter turbo diesel which develops way more power.

OK, thanks - the misunderstanding was that the newer engine is the GD300, not the 300GD, if I understand correctly. And I think there were two diesels in the 1990s? Both xxxGDs, one turbo charged and one not?

No argument with the 300GD performing fine off road with only 80hp. It wouldn't be ideal in sand, especially with hills or dunes, but in other off-road respects, it's no problem.

[daniel ruops]

I respectfully recommend that anyone considering purchasing a G wagon research repair and maintenance costs. Our diesel required $15,000 in repair costs over 3 years. Strength and durability were not relevant without reliable functioning.

[4Rescue]

I have owned 80 series TLC, I still respect TLCs and find them quite competent and reliable but they can't take punishment like the G and the G has quite an edge with two lockers engaged. Also I find the G has far better powertrain, in terms of engine, I will give the HINO build diesel on TLC equal footing with OM616/617 and better rating than the other MB engines.

If you just want to bang around off road for cheap, nothing and I mean nothing comes close to a rebuilt Willys JEEP. They are light, cheap to fix even though they break often and very easy to run.
A Willys is hardly an easy thing to find let alone knock around. But yeah, your principal idea is a good one. I completely agree Willy's make great trail toys for your listed reasons.

AS for an 80 series not being up to the task... As I said that's what the 70 series is for... It's built more akin to American 1 Ton P/U's and is litteraly the benchmark of it's class... Right along next to the G-Wagen. But in reality, 80's are very tough rigs too, I'm sure you've seen G's abused in some nasty terrain, and I in turn have abused 70 Series in the bush in Australia wich is a pretty good testement to how robust they are. Let me tell you, the other most prevelent rigs in Oz??? The 80 and 105... I think to some degree that Merc. Prices themselves out of the market to some degree, although there sure are alot of the running around Germany like the good old farm/millitary trucks they're meant to be ;)

Anywho, back to the OP, Yes you should buy a G, but as others have said repetedly, you should really make sure, like with any vehicle purchase, that you know what you're getting.


I respectfully recommend that anyone considering purchasing a G wagon research repair and maintenance costs. Our diesel required $15,000 in repair costs over 3 years. Strength and durability were not relevant without reliable functioning.

This man makes a very good point. Well put.

Cheers

Dave

[mauricio_28]

300GD, stick your sights to that. Check for rust and proper functioning of diff locks, also look for excessive steering shake, little bit is fine, excessive, walk away from it.

You mean the 1990-1994 (463) GD300, right?

[Gurkha]

You mean the 1990-1994 (463) GD300, right?

Thats right.

[zimm]

Your "hoard" is germane because you evidently have a fair amount of money to put into vehicles, and so don't have to make as many choices as some others. It's a nice position to be in, but don't assume everyone is as fortunate! :)

Btw, again, your assumptions about pricing must be very local to you. Here in the UK, a good diesel Discovery 1 can be had for well under £2K, and run very very cheaply, since LR parts are incredibly cheap.

the hoard would be germane if my behavior changed with my position in the market. ive never bothered to put money into a 3k truck, rich or poor. (lookin much poorer lately. easy come, easy go)

LR parts cheap. heee. location location location.

[rdb4Runner]

I forgot about this thread for awhile (too much eXpo browsing:ylsmoke:), but I didn't end up buying the G. Last I checked though its still for sale. It's only advertised on base and I don't think there's anyone that's aware of what it really is. With the 4runner and the Golf needing new tires, oil, filters, diff fluid(4r), brakes/bearings(Golf) I think my funds are allotted for the time being. This thread is still pretty entertaining though.:coffeedrink: It should never stop.

[dclee]

I respectfully recommend that anyone considering purchasing a G wagon research repair and maintenance costs. Our diesel required $15,000 in repair costs over 3 years. Strength and durability were not relevant without reliable functioning.

Would you mind telling us which year and model truck you own (or better yet, which engine that was) (I'm assuming your problems were mostly engine-related, since almost everything else on that truck in serviceable by a decent shade-tree mechanic)?

[G-force]

15000.-!!!!!!!

This you have to tell me all about!