Project Grand Expedition

[WickedZJ]

Hey guys! I just found this place and am sooo glad I did. I have a 1994 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo. Power everything, 5.2L V8, Wilderness roof rack w/ 2- 6" Dayliters and a 3.5" F>R lift. It also has a LP D30 up front and a D35 in the back. I am planning on replacing the front axle with a HP D30 and the rear with a trussed and skid plated D44A from a 98 Grand. I am wanting to turn it into an expedition vehicale but have no idea where to start. I am planning on buying all new adjustable RE control arms and am trying to decide whether to add 1" spacers or get 4.5" lift springs. I plan on putting on 32" Maxxis Bighorns for tires and Cragar soft 8s. Please help me in getting my build planned out so it can be the best expedition rig I can make it.

Thanks in advance for the feedback.

[FishPOET]

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d109/FishPOET/Jeep/IMG_1648zj.jpg

1996 ZJ
5.2
Clayton LAs
RE 4.5 springs
ACOS front & rear
33" MTRs
HP30 & 44a

Lots of ZJ info at nagca.com and mallcrawlin.com


I am trying to decide whether to add 1" spacers or get 4.5" lift springs. I plan on putting on 32" Maxxis Bighorns for tires and Cragar soft 8s.

IMHO 3.5" is about all the lift you want on short arms. Any more lift makes for noticeably steep control arm angles. These steep angles suck because they do not allow the suspension to work properly and make for a harsh ride.

[winkosmosis]

I say go long arm in front or stick with 3.5" and trim if the tires don't fit. Low COG is cool

[WickedZJ]

LOL I am on NAGCA to Fish Just figured with this type of offroading there maybe some different things I need to know in setting up my grand. Sounds like I need to get some 32's and just see if they fit and go from there tire wise.

[modelbuilder]

I put 32" MT's, 1.5" wheel spacers, and a 2.25" lift on my 05 Grand.

I also bought the super chips programmer so I can get a 20hp increase and a 20 Lb Torque increase.

[slomatt]

I'd recomend staying with a 32" tire for gas mileage and reliability reasons, and to aim for a ~3" lift with fender trimming to keep the COG low. I ran a 96 ZJ w/ 33" tires and a 3" lift for 6 years and was very happy with its performance.

- Matt

[VE2WHZ]

nice setup

look my zj
http://www.hamantenna.com/ve2whz/rb/JEEP.jpg

[JPFreek1]

I agree with everyone. Anything more than 3-3.5" significantly affects the geometry and the expense associated with the gains (cost-benefit) is, in my opinion, not worth it. I just put a 2" budget boost on my WK and fitted it with 265/70R17 tires (approx. 31.5") and despite some light fender rub which I'll correct this week with a grinder, it's perfect for my setup.

Keep in mind that for expedition and overland-type travel, it's not particularly about how high your lift is but rather how you drive the vehicle itself. Choose a lift and tire size that makes the most sense and consider upgrading the under-carriage protection to keep those vitals well protected.

Good luck and welcome!

[WickedZJ]

OK sounds like staying at 3.5" is the best bet. I have thought about trying to make a full belly skid or atleast as full of a belly skid as I can make. I appreciate the feed back. Any other advice to keep in mind for this type of build?

[smbisig]

I will give my thoughts about the D44a, ditch that idea and go with a real D44. the aluminum D44a that came in the later grands are not supported by the aftermarket. not sure if anyone make a true locker for them because of their reliability issues. your D35, in my opinion is stronger (- the clip) that the D44a.

steven b~

[FishPOET]

the aluminum D44a that came in the later grands are not supported by the aftermarket. not sure if anyone make a true locker for them because of their reliability issues.

There is very little aftermarket support for the 44a. It has nothing to do with reliability. For the manufacturers it is a numbers game. There just weren't enough 44a's produced.

If you have a 44a it can be trussed, polished and locked. It has been my experience (and pretty much the consensus on the grand forums) that the 44a is a much more reliable axle than the 35. Having said that if I was going to go through the trouble and expense of swapping in an axle on a grand to handle 33" tires I would swap in an 8.8. The 8.8 is stronger than both the 35 and the 44a and has much better aftermarket support.

[smbisig]

There is very little aftermarket support for the 44a. It has nothing to do with reliability. For the manufacturers it is a numbers game. There just weren't enough 44a's produced.

If you have a 44a it can be trussed, polished and locked. It has been my experience (and pretty much the consensus on the grand forums) that the 44a is a much more reliable axle than the 35. Having said that if I was going to go through the trouble and expense of swapping in an axle on a grand to handle 33" tires I would swap in an 8.8. The 8.8 is stronger than both the 35 and the 44a and has much better aftermarket support.

The D44a's are unreliable. The housing is strong, but the aluminum center section is not. The drawback is that they are a poorly made attempt at a light weight aluminum D44 housing. Their week point is the bearing caps, which I have see fail way too many times. That is why they are not supported by locker companies, just to much liability.

The Ford 8.8 in the later 95+ Explorers are a great axle, if done right. They came stock with 31 spline shafts and disc brakes. But, for overland expedition use, we come back to reliability. Like the D35, the Ford 8.8's have c-clips. This is your weakness, and a scary weakness if you ask me. Have you ever seen a c-clip go on the highway? Scary!

My ideal axle for your application would be a real Dana 44 ordered from Currie or Dynatrac with 35 spline shafts and an ARB. You would have Dana 60 shaft strength, with D44 clearance.

Thats my .02

[Root Moose]

Ford 8.8 C-clips are not an issue.

The axle in general is large enough to support Jeep sized vehicles without worries.

[ExpoMike]

I agree, the Ford 8.8 C-clips are not an issue and if you get one with disc brakes, the rotor/mounting cage will hold the axle in place even if the C-clip failed, unlike a drum brake setup.

[smbisig]

I'm just speaking from experience. C-clips will go, and the shafts will come out even with the disc brakes.

[BigDaveZJ]

Huh, I wheel with a LOT of ZJ's and WJ's with the 44A (wife has one too) and have never seen one fail due to an issue with a bearing cap. I've only seen a very small handful of occasions I would even consider a failure. I think I can count 2 snapped shafts, and a couple other bent ones. Would I run one hard on 37's? No way, but for 32's and 33's I would be perfectly happy with the 44A in there.

Never had an issue with the c-clips in my 8.8 after 5 years of beating on it with a V8 and 33's and then 35's. Are they ideal? No, but with the ease of an 8.8 swap into a ZJ it doesn't bother me at all, nor do I worry about the c-clips out on the trail.

An axle from Currie may be ideal as you say, assuming budget is not a concern at all.


My ZJ:
http://www.jeepsite.net/HellsRevengeFall2008/P1010087small.jpg

[WickedZJ]

I am on a tight budget. I am trying to do the best upgrades for the least amount of money I ca. I know the D44A was a direct swap and with a truss and skid I heard its was a tough axle. I have thought about an 8.8 swap but with no welder or experience welding and not sure my brother inlaw could get an axle setup correctly. I am not sure what to do know. I know with the 8.8 swap I have to add coil spring buckets and all the brackets for the trackbar and CA's.Other than the D44A is there any thing that would be a direct swap or am I better off paying a shop to setup a D44 or an 8.8? Trying to decide now so I know how much I need for each part of the build. I don't mean to be a pain or keep and deate going but since I am on a budget I gotta explore every choice fully.

[BigDaveZJ]

For 32's and the kind of wheeling you should be doing with 32's, the 44A will be just fine. My wife runs 32's on her ZJ with the aforementioned 44A as well as an Aussie Locker. She bent a shaft trying to keep up with me on 35's, but other than that it's been a great axle for her.

[WickedZJ]

Yea from what I have seen on the other forums I am on, the D44a with an aussie, truss and skid is pretty tough with 32 and 33's. I talked to my mechanic friend who has a 98 said he went to the junk yard to replace his rear D44A and got one for like $50 . Hard to beat on a budget. I think I am probably going that root. Direct swap with disks is pretty nice.

[slomatt]

I ran a D44A w/ 33" tires for 6 years on all kinds of trails and never had a single problem with the differential other than peeling the cover on rocks. If you can find one for a reasonable price I think it would be a very nice upgrade over the D35. If you were going to run 35" or taller tires and drive aggressively then I would consider upgrading to an 8.8 or a "real" D44.

- Matt

[WickedZJ]

So heres my plan. I am going to swap my NP249 for a NP242. Get Skid Row engine, TC and gas tank skids. I am not sure if the lower control arm skids are worth it or not. I am going to swap the rear axle for a D44A with an Aussie locker, truss and Skid. Swap the front LP D30 for a HP D30 with a air locker. Then get some Cragar soft 8's and 32" Maxxis Bighorns. With in the next two months I am getting a full set of RE adjustable control arms and I have front and rear JKS track bars. I am wanting to get a rear bumper and tire carrier that can carry some gas cans and an ARB bull bar up front. Please tell me what you think and offer any suggestions that could help.

[BigDaveZJ]

Sounds like a good plan to me. The LCA skids to me were more about strengthening the mount there than actually acting as a skid plate. I had one of the OEM control brackets taco on my stock LP30 a few years back, not fun.

[WickedZJ]

Does anyone know if there is a place that you can get doors for a ZJ? All four of my doors are rusting bad at the pinch seams and need replaced. Plan on checking the JY but if I could get new for not much more may be a better idea. I also need a new hatch. Same problem as doors. Also I am trying to decide which way to go with an OBA system. I am wanting to use a york 210 but am not sure if I have the space under the hood. Would I be better off to make it work or look into 12VDC Compressors?