Waterproofing your vehicle

[pangaea]

Although snorkels look cool, they're far from the only step that you should take when modifying your 4x4 for deep water crossings. Lets start a discussion on things to do to ensure your rig is ready for the deep stuff.

[pangaea]

The first thing to consider is that water is really harsh on the vehicle. If you encounter deep water frequently, expect increased maintenence to keep it up to snuff, including repacking wheel bearings, and changing diff fluids with more frequency, keeping an eye on t-case, and transmission fluids for sign of water intrusion.

The first mods, should be to up the breather tubes on both axles, your transmission and transfer case as high as possible. If your vehicle has a snorkel (second thing to do), it makes sense to run them up to the top of the snorkel.

[Scott Brady]

Good point on the wheel bearings. The only failure I have ever had on the Trooper was due to the wheel bearing failing as a result of water ingress. The Trooper uses huge bearings, and they lasted longer than they should have. Now I check and repack them every other oil change (about 10k miles)

[The BN Guy]

I've done many deep water crossings and haven't had any trouble. Not sure I should jinx myself but thought I'd share.

I do have the rear diff vent extended quite a distance above my waterline. I do not have the front done but have that slated for coming soon.

On both the Frontier and Xterra, there is only one component that will ruin our day. Nissan laid out everything quite nicely except the Alternator. It's located at the bottom of the engine and is fairly succeptable to dirty water. Clean does nothing to it but dirty will kill it quickly. I speak from experience - already killed one and I think my present one might be failing soon.

My door seals are fair. Already had water intrusion once. Two days after I bought the truck and stalled in in four feet of water. What can I say? I was a rookie.

The other item which is probably more universal is the ECU. On Xterra's and Frontiers it's located just forward of the center consol. Flood one of our vehicles and it can be toast really quick. A possible solution has been to custom cut a plastic container (tupperware or other), seal the unit inside and caulk any openings to make it watertight.

Another concern that was mentioned in water hazards, the water itself getting so deep that it makes contact with the engine powered fan. Broken blades are just one problem. An alternate is going electric but there are arguements against them as well.

[Brian McVickers]

Great thread!

What about Dielecric Grease (sp?) and where to put it. I have heard that it can really help to waterproof some electical areas.

Another product that I have used a bunch is Corrosion Block. I have not used it on vehicles yet but I have used it for years on boats in fresh and saltwater environments. It's pretty amazing at protecting electronics from water and corrosion. http://www.nocorrosion.com/corrosion-control.htm

So what would be the best electical parts or area to waterproof?
Fuze Box?
Alternator?
Distributor or Coil Pack?
Battery?
ECU?

[pangaea]

If we get a fair bit of info on this thread, I'll try to consolidate in the first couple of posts.

As to dialectric grease, I put it around the seals of my distributor and both ends of my spark plug wires, although the spark plug end seems to be a tight enough fit that its probably overkill.

A good modification to consider is electric fans. That way, you have the ability to turn the fans off for deep water crossings. That seems to be a big killer with petrol engines, is the fan kicking water up into the rest of the engine compartment shorting out the system.

Of course, never underestimate the power of WD-40 and a couple of paper towels, to dry stuff out after a really deep crossing. I had one crossing a couple of years ago where the water was about 3-4" up the windshield (kind of freaky, because the truck started to float at that point). At the end of the rather long water crossing the truck sputtered a bit and was running rough. A generous amount of WD-40 and a couple of paper towels later, and it was running like new.

[cshontz]

One concern I have with deep water crossings is premature airbag deployment, if the vehicle is so equipped.

I'm not sure what needs to get wet for this to occur, but I've known it to happen to Jeep Cherokees, and it has probably happened to other makes and models as well.

I've been in the drink over door sills but below the headlights and haven't had a problem, so I imagine it takes alot of water - probably prolonged submersion, but I don't know how much and where.

Anyone have any info on this?

EDIT: On 1997 or 1998 Jeep Cherokee, the air bag sensor box was located under the driver side seat. Apparently, water welling up under the seat would cause the air bag to fail or deploy. These models were recalled and the box was relocated to under the center console on top of the tunnel.

In any case, it is clear that this is a factor that should be taken into consideration when waterproofing, depending on the vehicle.

[riverguide]

this is a good thread Pangaea. Keep it comin' ya'll.
I've always worried about my intake..that being said I've always wanted a snorkel (I will and always have worried about enough caulk to make the intake waterproof after adding a snorkel) However I know one day when I'm either careless or the water is deeper than anticipated, I will reach a point of getting electrical things wet. Thats where I lack knowledge. I know I have an electrical box under or near my glove box...this needs to be waterproofed. I think I am confused on exactly how to waterproof the distributor. I can handle the spark plug wires. I need to get an electric fan..I found some from Nullifier.

[pangaea]

I was doing some research on waterproofing a distributor and found an interesting solution from an old UK 4x4 magazine:

Take a rubber glove and cut the tips off all five fingers. Route the coil wire through the middle finger and two wires through each left over finger (assuming a V8). Zip tie the base of the glove to below the bottom of the cap, and use smaller zip ties around the ends of each finger tip. Plug any holes or gaps with silicone, and you've got a pretty decent waterproffing solution for the ignition.

[gjackson]

As far as waterproofing the distributer goes, just use silicone. Silicone the cap to the distrubuter and silicone the plug wires to the cap. Put dielectric grease on the rotor and contacts, coat the whole thing with WD40 and you should be golden. Remember WD stands for water dispersant (or something like that). It is designed for that task. Better yet, convert to diesel and forget about water! (Depending on how deep you get. . .)

cheers

[riverguide]

send me a deisel from Africa and we'll call it done.;)

[gjackson]

Damn, where'd I put that oil tanker? Let me get in a call to off shore Angola and we'll see what we can do! ;)

cheers

[riverguide]

lol sounds good

[MaddBaggins]

I'm a p%$$ about running thru deep water. If it's more than 3' deep I'm looking for a better route. If its more than 4' I would prolly turn around.
3' is a little over my tires and at 4' it's just below the hood. All my breathers and stuff are good for a 3' crossing but more than that...???

[riverguide]

tea toto, thats some deep water, prepared or not. I'm not really afraid of deep water if I'm ready for it but more scared of Moving water.

I love this picture...every since 1994 off road mag featured it:

http://x5e.xanga.com/ec8812eb0066817047521/b12278290.jpg

woohoo!

[riverguide]

Pangaea or others, I've often wondered what I do if I got into deep without a snorkel and i got some water into the engine but didnt hydrolock it. I've heard of ppl in Rovers taking out the switch board or computer and letting it dry out...I've heard others that take out the plugs and whatnot but I'm not sure exactly what I'd do if I went through some deep water, lets say top of my arb...not the tube part but the actual flat part..that is 34 inches...right behind my left headlight is my intake so lets say I get really close to the intake...water gets on the engine and my engine dies(not sure if this is possible without sucking water in). If I couldnt start my truck after going through deep water, what would be the first things to look at and maybe examples of what I would find and do in different situations? I am pretty sure I have no way of getting my truck to start if I got into water deeper than expected. Make sense? Suggestions you wizards! :ylsmoke:

[MaddBaggins]

tea toto, thats some deep water, prepared or not. I'm not really afraid of deep water if I'm ready for it but more scared of Moving water.

I love this picture...every since 1994 off road mag featured it:

http://x5e.xanga.com/ec8812eb0066817047521/b12278290.jpg

woohoo!

Holy Poop!! That is nuts!

[ShottsCruisers]

I'm a p%$$ about running thru deep water. If it's more than 3' deep I'm looking for a better route. If its more than 4' I would prolly turn around.
3' is a little over my tires and at 4' it's just below the hood. All my breathers and stuff are good for a 3' crossing but more than that...???

OK Alvin. Now I KNOW I have to get you to Chiva Falls some weekend after it snows. Our Cruisers (80 and 100) luv being in there. On that last trip with Brian we went back to the Pools. We must have been in DEEP for several minutes. In REAL DEEP for a few minutes.

Come on down. I'll getcha in there and you'll luv it!

[91xlt]

ther is also a boot that covers the distributer, used to be on mustangs, i have one on my distributer, i like this as opposed to silicone. if you watch e bay you can find them once in awhile or any ford dealer can get you one. heat shrink is a MUST! the raised vent lines and repacking of bearings also. there is also a marine grade crc spray it is excellent, a little pricey but excellent. i will try to find the brands name, i can not remember right of hand. and in a pinch along with the WD40 and papertowels, Vaseline helps alot, if you get caught "with your pants down" Vaseline will deter water, its just not a permanent solution.

Pangea you run a great site!!, i often find myself surfing your site, i would really like to see more info for that rock crawler! but i did want to compliment you on a job WELL done!

[Seeker]

I keep seeing WD40 and Paper Towels mentioned, but what all are you guys hitting with this? I'm a bit ignorant in this area so I'm very curious.

[91xlt]

I keep seeing WD40 and Paper Towels mentioned, but what all are you guys hitting with this? I'm a bit ignorant in this area so I'm very curious.


distributer , cap , rotor, and wires...wd40 was orig mfg for gov. it stands for Water Displacement and 40 was a ref or chem # but wd40 removes moisture and wettness VERY WELL. hope this may help you.

[elcoyote]

It's possible to waterproof ignition systems and keep the engine breathing and running but if you get stuck in water (it can happen!), it's almost impossible to keep water from getting in somewhere. After getting high centered on a submerged log in a swamp in Ocala, FL, I learned that having a good drain plug at the lowest part of the cab is a really good idea. Once I got my soggy bottom out of there, the MJ was filled to the arm rests, opening the door was rather comical but a puddle of water remained just below the door jamb until I discovered the factory drain plug that is used when they dip gavanized the body. I banged it out with a hammer, let it drain, put on some dry socks and kept on wheeling!

[locrwln]

Also just another side note, toilet paper is super absorbant. Sometimes works a little better than paper towels. Works great on distributor caps.

[BajaRunneRs]

So... If a have some 1st. Gen. 4 runners i want to waterproof, anybody have knowledge of whats what i have to do first??? Already got the snorkels.....

[Ruined Adventures]

So... If a have some 1st. Gen. 4 runners i want to waterproof, anybody have knowledge of whats what i have to do first??? Already got the snorkels.....
wow this is an old thread, BajaRunner you should start by checking out 4Crawler's website (http://4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/WaterProofing.shtml)...you'll find tons of other info you realize you needed.

As an alternative to relocating the ECU to the glovebox, you may be able to mount the ECU under your dash pad (http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/27110-1st-Generation-Toyota-4Runner-s.....?p=833614#post833614)

[ReconH3]

Waterproofing with a rubber glove or bag is not a good idea because it depletes the air and ionizes. You'll get misfires for a different reason. I used to waterproof my distributor and other components by pressurizing them. We used a small 100% duty cycle compressor. The compressor had it's own snorkel so it could run underwater. We ran a hose to the top of the distributor. At the bottom some have a small drain hole. If it doesn't, make sure you make a very small one. Once you turn on the compressor, the pressure inside the distributor is greater than the water outside, so water will never get in. You also have a good source of air to guarantee a good spark. We did the same with the winch motor, which at the same time cools it.


"Ex Umbris Venimus"

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[overlander]

Other things that must be considered but not yet mentioned that I've done on mine (or planned to do).


have good axle seals to keep water UNDER PRESSURE from slipping into your drive train
transfer cases have breathers sometimes too
have a good sealing gas cap to prevent water ingress
some fuel tanks have vent lines. if your gas cap is a rigid and not venting, you likely have a vent lines somewhere so that fuel tank doesn't vaccum lock when fuel is drawn out.
Timing cases tend to have vent holes. On the land rover diesels, there is a wading hole that must be plugged with a threaded plug.
For TDI's, your boost diaphragm has a vent. you'll get water in there if you go deep enough.
diesel or petrol coolant heaters have an exhaust, and intakes that need to be sealed prior to wading.
how about your onboard air compressor? bet that doesn't have a wading tube for the intake. are the electronic sealed for short submersions? most aren't
bell housings have a drain hole to allow water/oil to drain out, but that's an entry point for mud into your clutch
you want to make sure that the air intake routes you have are all sealed and in good condition. for example, does the air filter box you use have good sealing? are all the clamps holding it together in good shape or is it being held on by less than all. would you trust that water UNDER PRESSURE would not come into your intake path anywhere other than the end of your intake?
For those of you who decided to not replace that fan clutch and bolted your fan straight to crankshaft, when that fan hits the water there's no give. That means when you enter revving for that cool picture, you are likely to bend your fan blade. Even with a fan clutch, a floating object like a stick can enter into your engine compartment while wading and when your fan hits it, blades will likely bend out of balance or worse. I had a fan blad bend on my old CJ forward and shred the radiator back in AZ during a wading. I keep the CORRECT long wrenches on board my 110, and it takes about 2 minutes to remove my fan for a wade. this is one of the things you can do prior to a deep fording while you are ALLOWING YOUR BLOCK TO COOL so it doesn't thermal crack when it hits the water after running hot. You also have time while someone is doing a recce of the crossing point. you're going to do that right? never drive through blind unless someone else has done it.
Last but not least, underbody armor. particularly the armor for diffs and steering drag links. Can't see much under water, and doesn't take much to do damage by anything in the water that doesn't move under water.

[ReconH3]

I think Overlander pretty much covers it. :) Nice writeup.


"Ex Umbris Venimus"

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[titleguy]

The point about using a compressor to pressurize the distributor was well made. I think several military vehicles over the years have had fording kits that, once turned on, provided a slight positive pressure to the diffs, transfer case, transmission, and crankcase. Obviously, if not well designed this could be hell on seals, but the concept has great potential to successfully prevent water intrusion.

[ReconH3]

The point about using a compressor to pressurize the distributor was well made. I think several military vehicles over the years have had fording kits that, once turned on, provided a slight positive pressure to the diffs, transfer case, transmission, and crankcase. Obviously, if not well designed this could be hell on seals, but the concept has great potential to successfully prevent water intrusion.

Where do you think I got my idea from? ;)


"Ex Umbris Venimus"

Sent from my iPhone

[bobDog]

As far as waterproofing the distributer goes, just use silicone. Silicone the cap to the distrubuter and silicone the plug wires to the cap. Put dielectric grease on the rotor and contacts, coat the whole thing with WD40 and you should be golden. Remember WD stands for water dispersant (or something like that). It is designed for that task. Better yet, convert to diesel and forget about water! (Depending on how deep you get. . .)

cheers water dispersant...attempt #40.......cute huh?:)

[overlander]

I also forgot to mention previously that some components in vehicles may have either drain holes or rubber drain nipples. Those needs to be cleared of debris and preferably lubricated with something like Armor All or the like, to ensure they will drain water easily. This should be part of pre-operation maintenance when wading may be required.

Items that come to mine or floor drain plugs, and on a Land Rover Defender for example, the heater intake plenum has a rubber nipple for draining water out that often can become plugged. All A/C systems also have a condensation drain, that would also be the drain route for any water that collected in your HVAC during a deep ford. don't want that plugged!

[Schattenjager]

Chance favors the prepared mind! eh?

There are a few factors that I keep in mind for water crossing - depth of water, time (how big is the crossing and how long will my rig by in the water) and is there a current that would make wading difficult. Each has a solution.

The previously mentioned extended breather lines are notable. The addition of one way air valves to them is something to consider as well. Wrapping the dizzy helps. I use a plastic grocery bag wrapped loosely around it and duct tape the end. If you submerge the dizzy to the point this won't help, you likely have bigger problems at hand. Keeping fan spray off is the main goal.

Snorkels are often debated as bling or extreme. I'm a believer - just check this pic out. I was the third vehicle to cross and was lucky enough to hit a sink hole that did not exist for the other two rigs. I took a deep, prolonged dip that easily filled the location of the factory intake. Snorkel saved my bacon, no doubt about it. As I first enter the hole:
http://i398.photobucket.com/albums/pp64/schattenjager27/878f2efa.jpg
You only need it once to pay for itself.

Another good tool for water crossings is a tarp. If the crossing is going to be long / deep, then I will drape the front of the ARB with a tarp. I have one ready to go with holes making attachment easy. Additionally, If you get into trouble, as my friend Adam did below, in water with any current (this one was pretty strong) placing a single large tarp upstream against the side of the vehicle, along the bottom door seams, will go a long way toward keeping water out of your rig especially if there is a lengthy recovery.
http://i398.photobucket.com/albums/pp64/schattenjager27/ac548fb4.jpg

An exhaust extension up toward the roof is a smart idea. This Disco stalled due to the exhaust being under water. Once we got it out, a huge amount of water drained from the front end (hi lifted the front bumper to drain) and then it started right up.

Most importantly is technique. Driving the proper speed with a nice bow wave will prevent engine saturation, save your fan, help assure traction better than spinning wildly, and look like you know what your doing!
:ylsmoke:

[matt s]

Breathable chest waders (shorts in warm weather) and some teva sandals. I can be in them in about 2 minutes. If I can't/don't want to wade it I don't drive it. That takes care of most of the problems right there.

My intake is right up against the top of my hood nearly 4.5 ft from the ground and at the rear of the engine compartment. Not a snorkel but if I am that deep I made a mistake. Splashing could be an issue but hasn't been so far. I also have a grill bra that I made that bungies on really easily. It's for winter but I carry it to use if needed for water crossings.