Anyone interested in Burning Man 2007?

[asteffes]

So I've been vaguely interested in going to Burning Man for a couple years now, but finding a group to go with has been tricky. Is anyone here interested in going? I know, it's not your typical overland trip, but all the gadgets on our vehicles would be put to good use!
-Adam

[justfred]

I've been going for about 10 years. It's beyond description.

Several times I've taken the Pinzgauer; about a 10 hour trip if all goes well, which it usually has. And I usually stay at least a week; Saturday through to Monday is a good run. I'm also a "Black Rock Ranger" - the local "scouts" that help people out during the event.

There are a bunch of Pinz'ers that go; and a whole camp for VW busses. I usually camp with my local San Diego people.

Even better than the event, tho, has been the local burner community. They do campouts and workshops and parties and all sorts of fun; and they're not your typical special-interest geeks; there are all sorts of different artists involved. I met my wife and most of my current friends through the local group.

Any questions, I would be happy to try to answer.

[offroadchef]

Even better than the event, tho, has been the local burner community. They do campouts and workshops and parties and all sorts of fun; and they're not your typical special-interest geeks; there are all sorts of different artists involved. I met my wife and most of my current friends through the local group.

Any questions, I would be happy to try to answer.

Ok, what is the "local burner community"?

[dieselcruiserhead]

Cool.. I've been 2 years and had a blast.. We are not sure we are going this year but definitely hoping to...

When I get a chance here I'll post some pics..

[dieselcruiserhead]

Sorry here are some photos..
First year...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/478383-R2-09-16A.jpg

http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/478383-R2-13-12A.jpg

http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/478383-R2-23-2A.jpg

Typical night time scene.. Sort of like mardi gras meets halloween for about a week straight.. combined with, uh, maybe Mars, meets self dependent survival for a week, meets a city they draw in the sand.. with some of the sickest and hand made metal and other items both utility and art, all on one spot... http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/546153387205_0_BG.jpg

http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/865153387205_0_BG.jpg


http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/561616287205_0_BG-1.jpg
These statues, completely hand made out of steel scrap from some sort of pipe manufacturer, all made out of different diameter rings that were scrap of about 1/2" wide pipe, 3,4,8" wide pipe...

[dieselcruiserhead]

Last year.. Pretty typical of the hordes and hordes of beautiful beautful women wearing next to nothing there :)
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20037.jpg

Sunset.. We rolled there this year in our Ford van (formerly CruiserOutfit's) that I just sold :(
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20048.jpg


One of the many sweet rigs I have seen there.. Possibly Fred's Pinz? Was in the VW camp he was mentioning, which we were right around the corner from...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20064.jpg

Some of the burning that goes on.. Killer, really the only time there are 'crowds' there, otherwise its sort of like a city where there are lots of people but for the most part pretty spread out...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20112.jpg

Pretty typical of some of the sick creativity that goes on our there.. this thing was complete and moved and everything...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/090705_BM05_psgallery/images/Picture%20125.jpg

http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2005/more_photos/891266187205_0_BG.jpg


The BJ42 we rolled out with last year that belongs to my good friend Damon...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20005.jpg

Our camp last year.. Sort of hard to tell but great camp with full bar, kitchen, etc... Use the truck to slow down the wind...
http://burningman.shoumatoffmedia.com/2006/2006_Gallery/images/Picture%20026.jpg

[dieselcruiserhead]

Pretty much X2 on all of this..

Tonight I scored one of these from a local burner for free via a local burner email list..
Can hopefully use one something...
http://www.rackoutfitters.com/car-racks/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=90&idproduct=630


I've been going for about 10 years. It's beyond description.

Several times I've taken the Pinzgauer; about a 10 hour trip if all goes well, which it usually has. And I usually stay at least a week; Saturday through to Monday is a good run. I'm also a "Black Rock Ranger" - the local "scouts" that help people out during the event.

There are a bunch of Pinz'ers that go; and a whole camp for VW busses. I usually camp with my local San Diego people.

Even better than the event, tho, has been the local burner community. They do campouts and workshops and parties and all sorts of fun; and they're not your typical special-interest geeks; there are all sorts of different artists involved. I met my wife and most of my current friends through the local group.

Any questions, I would be happy to try to answer.

[Grim Reaper]

Something i have always whated to do.

Who is in the SE up for a 4800 mile round trip run? Hit Moab while out that way.

[asteffes]

Thank you for the feedback, everyone. For those considering to go this year, do you already have groups you're going with? Would any of you like to go as an ExPo group?

[slooowr6]

Very interesting, a ExPo group will be fun!

[asteffes]

Very interesting, a ExPo group will be fun!

Ok, you are officially listed as a "yes." :D

Who else is in? :littlefriend:

For the record, I don't have any plans to create an art car or whatever. I would, however, like to attend and just absorb the experience. I'd love to get a few more folks together to form a small camp.

[slooowr6]

Ok, you are officially listed as a "yes." :D

Who else is in? :littlefriend:

For the record, I don't have any plans to create an art car or whatever. I would, however, like to attend and just absorb the experience. I'd love to get a few more folks together to form a small camp.

Just went to burning man website it's going to cost $500 for the tickets for me and my wife. :bigbossHL: And they don't sell day ticket, ouch. :mad: Count me out, $500 is a lot of $$..........

[justfred]

"Ok, what is the "local burner community"?"

In most major cities there are "burner" groups - "regionals" that host events.

http://regionals.burningman.com/

There are mailing lists and yahoo groups and such with all the local info. San Francisco is burner central with several events per week; San Diego, LA, Portland, Seattle, Austin, New York have large regionals with at least monthly and often weekly events.

Two weeks from now is a group campout to Ocotillo Wells, we're expecting about 400 people, and a bunch of live bands and performers and costumes.

At some point soon I'm going to be giving a "camping workshop" - a lot of these people are artists and don't really know that much about camping. Don't even get me started on what these people do with re-bar.

And lately the focus has been on making these events benefit the community. There's a group called "Burners without borders" that among other things sent a group to New Orleans for months to help with cleanup and rebuilding; we're being encouraged to become more local community-centric.

And to clear up some common misunderstandings:

"For the record, I don't have any plans to create an art car or whatever. I would, however, like to attend and just absorb the experience. I'd love to get a few more folks together to form a small camp."

Read the website. http://www.burningman.com/

Burning Man is first and foremost a participatory event. You don't go to attend and absorb, you go to participate.

And though much is made of "art cars" they're really not that important. Costumes are important. Meeting people is important. "Leave No Trace" is important. If you're really ambitious you can join in on an art project - there are plenty of people in your area (wherever that is) that need help. Meet them, get to know them, help out beforehand, it will make the event a lot more rewarding.

In any case, you don't have plans? Make some! Going to Burning Man without planning to make an artistic contribution is like leaving for an expedition without shelter, fuel and food.

"Just went to burning man website it's going to cost $500 for the tickets for me and my wife. And they don't sell day ticket, ouch. Count me out, $500 is a lot of $$.........."

Nope, no day tickets. That's because you're meant to attend the event and PARTICIPATE for around a week. You can even skip "Burn night" and I often choose to - but you have to stay out there for a while to acclimate and see the sights and meet the people and become part of it all.

People who show up for the final Saturday and Sunday, they're the ones who really really don't fit in, and don't get it, and shouldn't have wasted their money.

I work for at least three days, as a Ranger. Mostly that involves wandering around meeting people, interrupted by the occasional crisis. No big whoop, but it makes sure I participate on top of whatever artistic things I'm doing. One year I created 100 decks of tarot cards with images of our local group. One year I hand-built two disc golf nets, and gave away 100 discs.

Hardcode participants go beforehand to set up and stay after to clean up. Really, really hardcore people become "DPW" and set up the city for weeks beforehand and make sure it's completely gone, vanished, without a trace for weeks afterhand.

The largest portion of the expenses goes to permits (lots of them) porta-potties and medical and other services for each participant for an estimated seven days. With 35000 participants, that's a lot of infrastructure. They also give out art grants, which I think is absurd but they're the ones doing it. Hardly anyone makes a salary and no one makes any profit (or at least that's what they keep telling us, and the books are pretty open).

Anyway, I tend to be the "Huck Finn" of advocates. Don't go. You won't like it. It's not for people like you. You wouldn't be able to appreciate it anyway. It used to be much better. This year is going to suck. (etc).

[Christian P.]

Hi!

I have been to Burning Man twice...and might be going back this year. I think it is something to experience at least once in your life...

That's actually another reason why I bought the Sportsmobile...

:hehe:

Christian

[slooowr6]

justfred, thanks for the information! :ylsmoke:

[FJ Cruiser]

why do you have to pay to enter, isn't it just a huge camp out in the Nevada desert?

[dieselcruiserhead]

not at all, justfred said it really well.. just check out burningman.com it is all spell out there pretty well.. Here is the first timer's guide, it is very informative... http://www.burningman.com/first_timers/ I think they call it 'an experiment in a temporary urban living in an extreme environment' or something like that..

I also find that pretty much everyone's experiences are a little different, there is definitely no 'one' way to be part of burningman... It is all spelled out pretty well on the burningman site.. My own analogy which may or may not be entirely correct is "they sort of draw a city in the ground, complete with streets and neighborhoods and everything..." ...By sunday there are already a couple thousand people who are waiting to get in (mostly these guys are the people with really elaborate camps), and then is slowly fills in.. Sort of like a good city, IMO, there is pretty much no way to experience more than 5-10% of it at most, and that would be really bustling and actually *missing* most of what you checked out...

Again, the creativity is just insane, from metal work to the art cars, to you name it.. You will walk into buildings and have no idea, what so ever, that they are a temporary structure, and see and be part of things that have so much effort and labor and time put into them.. It is pretty amazing... But also it is, IMO, really sort of beyond words (I know that sounds really cheesy, not meant that way at all) but there is really no way to describe the week or time you spend there other than going...

That said you have to be of a certain mindset and openness.. There is a lot of nakedness and all sorts of craziness.. IMO if San Fransisco makes you 'sick' or something like that you probably won't dig it, it has a lot of San Fransisco's funkiness in it... If you believe the earth was created 6,000 years ago you probably wouldn't fit in... Basically if you were fairly conservative and have little respect for the 'alternative,' I don't think you would fit in..

Before I attended, one night I was at a party at a friends house and we started talking about BM and a good friend has been 9 years in a row, was a ranger also.. You would never know it but she is a total trustfunder, her step dad is CFO of Oracle or something like that.. Anyway, I was fascinated by the idea but by the time you spend all the time and $$ for infrastructure, you could probably go to Mexico or something like that.. So I wasn't willing to spend the money versus going to Mexico... So, in the mail arrives something that says 'you won a contest, congrats here is a ticket!' (I couldn't believe it).. To this day she doesn't know that I know she bought the ticket, which is sort of exactly how she wants it.. Which is awesome... Someone else in our camp also did the same thing for another of one of our good friends, so we rallied a whole bunch of us to go for the first time.. A pretty good range of all pretty normal people..

Anyway, for me one of the most fascinating parts and experiences of it was honestly just enjoying the confusion of it all when I first arrived... It builds itself into honestly a pretty bizarre place, bizarre experience, really where you can have no real expectations of what to find.. What would never, ever, ever, fit in anywhere else is basically the 'norm' there... No one else could make it super early and I am self employed so I could split early, and I got so excited that the first year I went I spent a couple days there by myself, having never been.. That was awesome, and pretty bizarre, but killer... It was real neat to see the city sort of build itself up as more stuff goes up and more people arrive... And again it was just so odd to me.. I remember thinking at some point 'dear lord, I had no idea humans were capable of such a thing,' about the event... My friends showed up and it sort of became a little more normal.. Both years we've had killer camps that are about perfectly elaborate (ie quick and easy to setup / take down, but fully functional) with about 10 people...

It is all about participation.. The people who rent campers IMO don't really participate or understand too much, unless they have been before and use the camper for ease of use.. Also, for the most part is pretty much the most organized event I have been a part of.. Again if you enjoy the confusion of mardi gras or can still get down with halloween or something like that, and have an appreciation for the generally bizarre (or it doesn't bother you too much)... I never knew I was that way personally (I live in Utah, led a pretty normal life growing up other than my old man is a well-traveled journalist)... But I pretty much totally dig it.. I could see myself becoming a lifer, LOL...

The only real poor organized part of it is leaving.. It is about 40K people all leaving on one day (for the most part) on a two lane road... Last year, we actually left the night before the exit day, after the 'temple burn' at about midnight, which was a great way to do it... Other than that, once you get there you understand exactly where all that $$ goes and the organization of it all, it is literally a killer event..

Also, about the median age I would guess is about 40-45? There are all sorts of old hippies and Google high-ups, then 20 year olds and even some kids (I would never bring my kids personally)... In our camps it has been mostly late 20's, early 30's, and a couple of 40-somethings.. Married & divorced, couples and singles, etc etc.. Pretty neat..

If anyone has any questions post up!

:beer:

[dieselcruiserhead]

Top, I hope I didn't scare anyone off with my comments here.. I just edited them for typos, didn't realize there were so many..

:beer:

[laurie-the-lorry]

Yes sir,

Count us two newbies to the site very much in. As a Newbie to the Expo forum, and also to the United States it would be cool to hook up with other like minded individuals at the event. Although that said we could probably make our own way.
But having heard tales of the festival, and after reading this link. We are committed. So if an expo camp is in the making we will be an active ish member.

Cheers and see ya there:campfire: :campfire:

[DenCo40]

and I'm going again. I have been to the burn many years. I wouldn't really call it an expo unless you are going the back way thru Winnemuca (sp) I did that route in 2000. ho hum. Not real exciting but it is the hardcore way to go. I would be game if someone wanted to go that way. It is better because if something happens to your Truck you can still get to the burn!
Truly burning!

[dieselcruiserhead]

unfortunately can go this year.. I couldn't go to the regional burn this year either that was also supposedly killer. Weddings knocking out both.. This is a good year as this the eco-year, "greening the man." That are doing carbon footprinting for the whole thing. Unfortunately a ****-load of consumption goes into the whole event. It is literally its own economy, possibly even a half-billion dollar economy, going into just this event.

Anyway you guys all have fun... There is a database/computer director thing right near center camp at the "information" booth... If it were me I owuld put in "Expo" or some sort of catch word so you guys could all meet up. We have always enjoyed bringing our rigs out there and they always fit in great... I met a lot of neat people. I also wish I had a photo. Literally the sickest FJ45 LWB I've seen. It 38's (huge - but oddly done really tastefully) was there too.. The 55 was a real hit there... There was also a sick, built FJ60 near us last year too..

Anywhoo...

[24HOURSOFNEVADA]

I've got a pic of that 45...somewhere. let me see.

[24HOURSOFNEVADA]

Is this the one? I liked it so much the picture is on my cell phone.





http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d127/ruffian05/burningmanfj45.jpg

[dieselcruiserhead]

yes that's it.. Sick.. Check out the rear coil springs.. Awesome Jereme, replied to your PM about it :)

[DenCo40]

That is the coolest cruiser......

[DenCo40]

BTW--I am still looking for someone interested going into the burn from the north....:)

[dieselcruiserhead]

been getting into building burning man bikes the last two years and been having a blast with it.. Thought it might be fun to build a few more even though I can't make it this year.. A friend is going to deliver them. . So if anyone wants a custom BM bike, let me know! A

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290146060798

[dieselcruiserhead]

PS t minus a few weeks for you guys! A

[dieck]

So are you guys going as a group? Id consider going tho it would be a long drive for me.

[DenCo40]

i haven't heard anything from anyone. If not, I will drive from Denver to Reno and then go into the burn from the south with everyone else...I will be arriving to the burn Monday afternoon. and setting up on the west side, second to the outer ring about 8:30. It 's our usual spot.

[Shovel]

Ugh...

It's been a rough summer... I just sold my BM tix... for the second year in a row!

See ya in 08? :P

03 was still my favorite burn, for some reason... maybe it was the busted Man, or maybe the dust was just right. :)

[dieselcruiserhead]

Cheers guys, t minus a few days. Both Carrie and I are reeling that we cannot go.. Anyway, you all have fun. I heard an excellent NPR program about it today. As it is posted I'll forward the link. Here is also one of the funniest and accurate from both sides stories I've read about it from Car & Driver of all places. Cheers, Andre

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/12374/the-cosmic-campers.html
Also make sure you check out the gallery....

[DenCo40]

T minus 48 hrs..... The truck is almost ready, got to finish the wiring on the solar panels, load up the pelican boxes and the playa bikes and away we go. I'll post a pic before I head out. It's always interesting to see how people pack thier vehicles for the burn.....:wings:

[Shovel]

Ha!

Someone prematurely burned the Man!

The law's calling it Arson...


I call it either Impatience... or Done in the Spirit of the Burn....


I mean... safety considerations aside... he created change, he affected EVERYONE at the festival.... kinda cool really :arabia:


(the risking of peoples' lives.... not so cool)

[dieselcruiserhead]

Yes, crazy.. If I were there I'd probably be pissed. But reading it from here looks like Hunter S. Thompson did it and that is sort of funny. Luckily not a hugely elaborate man this year, I hope the replacement they are building does it justice..
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070829/ap_on_re_us/burning_man_burned

[cruiseroutfit]

Saw loads of burners heading east on I80 today betwen Elko and SLC... lots of neat cars (paint jobs), bikes, etc. One of these years...

[DenCo40]

Made it back! ugh! I am tired. This year was hot and tons of people. The premature burning happened early tuesday morning. We rode out after we heard what happend to check it out. Sure enough some reject climbed it and tried to burn it. They took it down and had another man by thursday. They also extended the city by adding three extra streets and it was still hard for the late arrivals to find a spot to camp because there were so many people. When I get to the house later i will post some pics...

[dieselcruiserhead]

Made it back! ugh! I am tired. This year was hot and tons of people. The premature burning happened early tuesday morning. We rode out after we heard what happend to check it out. Sure enough some reject climbed it and tried to burn it. They took it down and had another man by thursday. They also extended the city by adding three extra streets and it was still hard for the late arrivals to find a spot to camp because there were so many people. When I get to the house later i will post some pics...

Thats awesome. I too saw all sorts of great cars rolling through, was actually thinking of you Dave :) Been following the stories and even saw the burn love on Current TV. Sort of almost like watching new years :) For a temporary man that was one of the sickest burns I've seen, a good 1:45 long :) Cheers, Andre

[DenCo40]

Okay. Finally had some time to post a couple of pics..please be patient with me -some may not turn out....We have lots more but for some reason this year there wasn't much in the way of art but I have a cool one to show you..BTW the burn would have lasted longer they wound up pulling one of the guy wires so the man would finally collapse.....and yes i did use my Hi lift to support the hammock

[24HOURSOFNEVADA]

I thought the pre-burn was great...It was the true spirit of counter-culture. B-man representatives were not as open to the idea as I was however. One quote from an upper employee of b-man (Not one of the top LLC) "He looks amazingly good, for burning the man and being caught." B-man pressed the arson charge by the way...

There was a different attitude on the playa this year. I do not ever remember people getting into fistfights on the playa before. There were a few this year. I don't know...maybe due to alot more observers than participants. Just my thoughts...

[Dave]

High resolution aerial photo I saw on digg this afternoon...

http://www.boingboing.net/2007/09/14/burning-man-2007-see.html

Direct download link: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=92F91CCC7AB24911

Very impressive.

[DenCo40]

Thats way cool thanks!!!!

[97kurt]

I had a great time, finally got to use my roof top tent.

http://www.kurtandnichole.com/gallery2/d/7883-1/bm2007_overnah.jpg

[SinCity4r]

Hey, I was right near that spot too! :D

[DenCo40]

I saw those. they were right down the street from me..2 people Magiolinas right? I have an RTT too. Everytime I was at camp people ask me about my set up . I went down to say hi one day- but no one was home. It looked like the camp had a couple of four runners with RTT's and somebody with a brand spankin new Taco with an ARB freshly bolted on.

[SinCity4r]

I saw those. they were right down the street from me..2 people Magiolinas right? I have an RTT too. Everytime I was at camp people ask me about my set up . I went down to say hi one day- but no one was home. It looked like the camp had a couple of four runners with RTT's and somebody with a brand spankin new Taco with an ARB freshly bolted on.

Yep, that was us! The black taco has a Shrockworks bumper though.

[Cabrito]

I miss it already..

[maxama10]

Actually, I live right near where this all goes down, we get some very odd folk come through. Nice folks like you here too though I'm sure.

We're all a bit sore because Pershing county doesn't really get any money from it. Even though we have to police it etc...

Edit: I guess BLM takes the money? I do suppose though that the hosts of this event have donated several nice things to our town now :) Thanks!

[spincycle]

High resolution aerial photo I saw on digg this afternoon...

http://www.boingboing.net/2007/09/14/burning-man-2007-see.html

Direct download link: http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=92F91CCC7AB24911

Very impressive.

I'm not going this year for personal reasons, but I'm one founder of a Burning Man camp that's existed since 1997; feel free to ask any questions you might have. If I don't know the answer, I'll know who does.

[spincycle]

Actually, I live right near where this all goes down, we get some very odd folk come through.

We're all a bit sore because Washoe county takes all the money and Pershing gets screwed. Even though we have to police it etc...


Just thought you might wanna know.

Sounds like and issue that could use a solution, rather than a complaint.

Not trying to be confrontational or rude: just a quiet observation, as a long-time and grateful visitor to your part of the world.

[24HOURSOFNEVADA]

Actually, I live right near where this all goes down, we get some very odd folk come through.

We're all a bit sore because Washoe county takes all the money and Pershing gets screwed. Even though we have to police it etc...


Just thought you might wanna know.

That's a funny outlook. I thought BLM got all the money.

[CoastalDefender]

That's a funny outlook. I thought BLM got all the money.
C&D article I'm reading (posted above) says BLM Fish-Cops and Pershing Co were patrolling. (Pg 3, Pgh 11)

[dlbrunner]

The event draws near again.

I know of a couple "Alternate" ways in and out that would avoid the traffic. they would require considerable dirt road driving though.

Smoke creek desert is the first one that comes to mind. also there is a way into lovelock over the 7 troughs, rabbithole springs or not.

The third and best route....well I won't tell, but I would guide it, in person.

My feelings on burning man are all over the map. I have been several times, between 1996 and 2000. I will say it was an incredible event to attend; however, with growth and development the associated issues and challenges arise (similar to any metropolis).

What I do know is, some of the locals (Northern Nevadans) are very passionate about Land issues, they live, work and hunt there. Some like the event, some loathe it. I can sympathize will all parties for their respective reasons.

Have fun, be safe, and for goodness sake, if you are traveling with a group, make sure EVERYONE is prepared. This includes bringing warm clothing. Bring plenty of food and water, there are lots of underprepared people out there.

[Cabrito]

The event draws near again.

I know of a couple "Alternate" ways in and out that would avoid the traffic. they would require considerable dirt road driving though.

Smoke creek desert is the first one that comes to mind. also there is a way into lovelock over the 7 troughs, rabbithole springs or not.

The third and best route....well I won't tell, but I would guide it, in person.

My feelings on burning man are all over the map. I have been several times, between 1996 and 2000. I will say it was an incredible event to attend; however, with growth and development the associated issues and challenges arise (similar to any metropolis).

What I do know is, some of the locals (Northern Nevadans) are very passionate about Land issues, they live, work and hunt there. Some like the event, some loathe it. I can sympathize will all parties for their respective reasons.

Have fun, be safe, and for goodness sake, if you are traveling with a group, make sure EVERYONE is prepared. This includes bringing warm clothing. Bring plenty of food and water, there are lots of underprepared people out there.


Nice stuff there dlbrunner - However should some of these posts be in this other thread? - http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9101 - this link is to the 2k8 event. I think I will link to this post in the planned events thread.

I might be interested in some of the alternate routes for going home, but once one the main road it seems to go pretty steady unless there is an accident. It's getting to the road from camp that takes up so much time getting out of there.

-m