Ho ho ho, Santa came early (AR15 upgrades) [Archive]

Corey

12-04-2010, 07:57 PM

I was doing a Google search last weekend for a gun shop near me, and I found one just a few miles away down by my Toyota dealership.
I drive by this place daily on my way to work, and I never knew they were there.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/index

My AR15 is pretty much stock with the exception of a picatinny rail and a Grip Pod (http://www.grippod.com/) that Jim (the guy I bought my AR from) put on a few years ago.

I have been wanting to have some upgrades to my rifle for awhile now to handle zombies :D
Here is a list of what I had done today:

1. Viking Tactics Light Mount (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=74)
It fits my new Surefire G2X Pro 200 lumen light I got awhile back, and also an older Surefire light I have that is 80 lumens.
The 200 lumen one is my camping/work light, so I will probably pick up a new Surefire 200 lumen light for the AR15 at a later date.

2. ERGO Z Rail 2 Piece Drop In - Carbine (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1410)
The new rail allows the addition of the light mount above, and down the road maybe a combo Surefire laser/light unit (http://www.surefire.com/X400product) I was gawking at today.

3. Magpul CTR - MIL SPEC Stock (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=484)
I do not really care for the stock that comes on the AR15, I like the tactical stocks.
They just look darn sexy :D
It is adjustable too, which is a key feature.

4. Armalite M-15 Carbine Buttstock Kit (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1542)
We did not use the stock that comes with this kit since I am using the Magpul one, but I needed a new buffer tube and the spring to mate the Magpul stock to my AR15.

I also found out that it is perfectly OK to use 223 ammo in a rifle that states on the barrel 5.56 NATO.
I had a feeling I could use the 223, and it is more readily available than the 5.56 ammo I have now.

Also looked at some magnification sights with red dot in them, maybe down the road.
That would be good for target practice.

The upgrades today though really changed the look of my AR15.
I will definitely be shopping there at Rainer Arms in the near future as they specialize in the AR15 and the other clone makes that are on the market.
They have a huge assortment in stock.

First picture is the way the gun looked from a few years back when Jim and I modded it some.
The rest of the pictures are from today.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/4.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/6.jpg

Set the Surefire light to 200 lumens and turned off the desk lamp.
What you can not see is the white hot center circle at the center of the beam, the camera did not pick it up.
The light is very bright though, my coworkers are very impressed with it when I can light up the side of a building or way up into a tree at work when it is pitch dark out early in the morning.
Yes, we are working when most zombies are still napping after a hard nights feeding frenzy.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/7.jpg

Closeup of the new rail and light mount.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/8.jpg

The new Magpul stock.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/9.jpg

Mr. Leary

12-04-2010, 08:38 PM

I had a very similar setup on my AR-15 before I backtracked to reduce weight. Once I set up one of my AK-47s for heavy volume fire then I didn't need to have the bipod forgrip and side stack mags any more.

I think you will be very pleased with your current setup. The added weight up front provides the stability that you will require for putting down large volumes of fire towards approaching zombies.

I have always preferred quad rail setups due to the ease of changing configurations depending on what type of outing you are going on. I prefer EoTech optics for my tactical configurations and find that the modular magnifier works well on a flat top or quad rail setup. Not to mention there's tons of additional crap you can attach right there close to your off hand.

Can't beat a Surefire. Nice peice.

Corey

12-04-2010, 10:19 PM

Thanks.
I am tempted later to pull the light ring that was put on today and get that Surefire laser/LED light combo.

I looked at a few optics today, and the Eotech one had a nice green arrow lit up inside, but no magnification.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop%2Fmanufacturer&manufacturer=11
Not sure which model it was.

The Aimpoint (or was it an Acog) not sure, had a red dot inside with 4x magnification I think.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop%2Fmanufacturer&manufacturer=10

I think that would be better for me where I like to shoot.
We do it up at Greenwater in the backcountry where most of my camping takes place, and the targets we setup are far out.

I think the only advantage to that Surefire laser/LED combo is if it was being used in a home defense scenario, the laser offers some intimidation.

I really need to get a Glock 17 9 mm or similar though for home defense, and it would be great too to have next to me in the roof top tent.

Oh, and someway to electrify the roof top tents ladder when sleeping.
Gotta keep those zombies on their toes.

Gosh I love that new The Walking Dead TV show ;)

Mr. Leary

12-05-2010, 12:39 AM

Eotech makes a 3x magnifier that is separate from the actual scope. It can be configured for mounting as a quick release attachment, so you add it when you need it, and take it off and shove it in your pack when you don't. Sometimes its nice having optics that have no magnification and work with night vision.

The Eotech scopes are also bomb proof, literally. They have a very robust design and will stand up to dropping, banging, submersion, and constant pounding from the elements well. I have a few buddies who used them in the sandbox who swear by them. One of the scopes used took a peice of shrapnel from an RPG and remained useable for the remainder of the battle of Fellujah (sp?). After hearing that story, I was sold.

Mr. Leary

12-05-2010, 12:49 AM

Either you are a Glock person or you aren't. I'm not. The gun that sleeps next to me is either my Taurus Judge or my Baretta 92 FS.

I'm a 9mm fan. I think it is the ideal caliber for a home defense weapon. Some jacketed hollow points and a magazine capacity of 15 plus in full sized models ensures that if you hit, it will put some hurt on them, and if you don't, you've got a quick re-aquisition time and plenty of remaining rounds to make your point. Not to mention its cheap to shoot and there is never an ammo shortage of 9mm.

I had an aimpoint scope... had trouble with it handling the recoil. Several re-adjustments later and I gave up on it for my larger caliber weapons. I never tried it on a .223.

Lasers slow me down, so I don't use them. My eyes can aquire and focus faster if I'm not distracted by that little dot. Some people like them. Not for me, I suppose. They certainly do send a message very quickly that you mean business.

Corey

12-05-2010, 01:29 AM

Thanks, I have seen those Eotechs with the separate piece that mounts in front, I always wondered why they were two separate pieces.

I guess I should go to the range, it is another six miles or so down the same road as the store I was at today.
I can test out a variety of handguns there.

Back in the early 90s I had a 9 mm Taurus that my brother picked up for me with a Miami Vice type holster, I liked it a lot.
Had to sell it during my first Boeing layoff unfortunately though.

I will have to ask my oldest son too what he used over in Iraq for optics.
He saw three tours there before coming home.
He saw the Grip Pods over there too like I have, but I think me mentioned he did not have one.
I like the Grip Pod, push a button and the two legs deploy like a bloody mary knife.

Corey

12-05-2010, 04:28 PM

Question on slings.
My old sling is still on the old stock, and it looks like it will not work with the new setup.

What is a good sling to get?
I see Magpul and many others have them, but not sure how to attach.
I still have the stock sling mount up front, but the light ring that holds the light hits it, but I can move the light to a new position on the rail.

For the rear I am not sure how it attaches with my stock.
http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG310/83

There is a round hole on the stock, but it is near the top, not the bottom, and a square looking hold near the bottom.

http://www.tactical-kit.co.uk/ekmps/shops/tacticalkit/images/milspec-magpul-ctr-carbine-stock-4498-p.jpg

Metcalf

12-09-2010, 02:46 AM

You can loop the sling through the long slots. They are designed to take 1" webbing for the most part. For a dedicated 2-pt 'modern' style sling I like the vertical slot on the butt-stock, however, your generally going to want a side mounted sling loop on the forearm ( 9 o-clock ) in the vertical position. This will help the rifle lay on your chest/back the way you want without it trying to flip itself over or out away from you.

Corey

12-09-2010, 08:04 AM

Thanks.
I ended up getting a quick disconnect that goes into that hold on the stock.
I will experiment with both the QD and using the slot in the rear.
The sling mount up front is a fixed one.

I will have updated pics this weekend of the stock sling with it, and another item I picked up.

thebrassnuckles

12-09-2010, 02:27 PM

http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=86

I have this sling... It is very nice..

jeeper92

12-09-2010, 02:42 PM

Im not trying to start an arguement. Im jsut curious, why do people need this kind of firepower? Again im just curious

blazinid

12-09-2010, 05:58 PM

DUH! ZOMBIES....jeeeez some people:victory:

thebrassnuckles

12-09-2010, 07:03 PM

Im not trying to start an arguement. Im jsut curious, why do people need this kind of firepower? Again im just curious

why dont they need it?

This kind of firepower, is only marginally powerful enough to take a deer at most hunting distances.

I use mine for coyote, squirrel, and rabbit eradication.

ground squirrels and rabbits dig tunnels that livestock, such as cattle, can fall into and break their legs.

I also use mine for paper punching.

I used my AK 47 to kill a rabbit 2 weeks ago..;)

Mr. Leary

12-09-2010, 07:30 PM

Corey, I would recommend that you look into single point tactical slings. I really like mine. It sits close across your body and hangs down from the stock, allowing you to drop it and completely free your hands, all the while the weapon stays in the right position to be easily raised into the firing position. I have even seen retracting anchor points in front of the magazine that pull the weapon in close so it stays out of the way in case the need arises to run or maneuver in close quarters.

Mr. Leary

12-09-2010, 07:32 PM

Im not trying to start an arguement. Im jsut curious, why do people need this kind of firepower? Again im just curious

Its a hobby. Why do you need a 4wd truck?

thebrassnuckles

12-09-2010, 07:49 PM

Corey

12-09-2010, 08:09 PM

Its a hobby. Why do you need a 4wd truck?
Good answer!
It is both a hobby and home defense for me.

Thanks guy's for the tips on the sling.

Currently this is the only gun I own right now, but I have my eye on this more "economical" AR.
You can shoot this one all day long for a lot cheaper than the 5.56 or .223 ammo mine takes.

The S&W M&P 15-22 is suppose to be the best small caliber one out right now.
The charging handle works, it is fake on most other brands.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category4_750001_750051_757786_-1_757784_757784_image

The one I want is the first one listed at the URL above.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_773502_-1_757786_757784_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

It has the MOE stock which is similar to my CTR one but it does not have the friction lock, and the barrel is threaded to accept a flash suppressor or a silencer.
The less expensive ones by S&W do not have a threaded barrel.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson2/upload/images/firearms/zoom_lg/811034_01_lg.jpg

There are some very good videos on this unit on YouTube.

YouTube - S&W 15-22: "Sheep in Wolf's Clothing" by Nutnfancy

Mr. Leary

12-09-2010, 08:50 PM

You should be able to purchase a kit allowing you to shoot .22LR out of your existing firearm.

You will not be able to legally obtain a supressor (silencer) without a class 1FFL and a tax stamp. If you are interested in this avenue, send me a PM and I can get you in contact with a friend of mine who owns a company that manufactures supressors. One can be custom machined for your application.

Corey

12-09-2010, 10:04 PM

Mr. Leary

12-09-2010, 10:12 PM

Thanks.
They showed me the kits to turn mine into a .22 model, but I would rather have a separate gun.
Take them both camping or a day trip to the mountains.

The shop where I got my upgrades said they could sell me a suppressor with some kind of a paper I would have to sign there, but really, I am not to interested in one right now.
They have a bunch of them on display in the cabinet.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/browse&category=soundsuppressors_5.56mm

If they are selling them that way, they are breaking the law unless they are selling to those who are already FFL holders.

BTW, the .223 is a super sonic round, so the "silencer" is more for looks than anything else. I'm sure it makes is quieter, but the sonic "crack" will never go away. Now the supressor could be fun firing subsonic .22LR rounds, but many rifles have trouble cycling when firing a subsonic (underpowdered) round, effectively making the weapon into a bolt action.

You will not be missing much if you skip the supressor completely.

Corey

12-09-2010, 10:38 PM

It is a legit shop there, they have been in business for quite awhile, and LEO's shop there quite often too.

The guy explaining to me about how to purchase a suppressor might have left out a few details...

Tomorrow night I will try to get the other upgrades in this thread if I have time.
It is going to be bad to the bone :D

Then one final item later, maybe a different grip.
I will have to think about that, as the stock one is pretty cool

If I get that 22 later, the only thing I will do to it is put on a Grip Pod like I have now.
I really like those.

Mlachica

12-10-2010, 01:46 PM

Look into the blue force gear vickers tactical padded sling. That's what I just got. It's a two point sling and it's super comfy if you plan on holding it a while. I also prefer the two point over a one point sling. If I had an AR pistol I'd probably use a single point.

I too am torn between the aimpoint micro t-1 and the eotech xps3-0. The battery life on the aimpoint will put the eotech to shame, it's compact and durable. The eotech has a nice viewing window but I'm not sure I like the 65moa circle.

I just finished building my first AR. I assembled the lower receiver and used all the parts I wanted then bought a complete upper. We should start a "Show us your AR's" thread :sombrero:

Corey

12-10-2010, 02:07 PM

Thanks, I will have to look into that sling as well.

I am confused about optics.
Is there a combo all in one unit that has the holographic arrow (red, green, or amber) inside as well as magnification?

If I am going to put one on so I can see targets further away, I want some magnification too.
I have seen where some use two separate units on the rifle, but one device that can do both would weight less and take up less space.

Zatara

12-10-2010, 03:54 PM

Im not trying to start an arguement. Im jsut curious, why do people need this kind of firepower? Again im just curious

Why do you need ______ ???
Insert anything in the space above.

Why do you need a big screen tv, big gas guzzling truck, 2200SQ FT house, sports car, steak dinner, etc....etc....

It's not a matter of "need".... and whats wrong with having massive firepower, the criminals sure do.

Mlachica

12-10-2010, 04:56 PM

Most of what I've seen people will run an aimpoint or an eotech both of which are great for close range and if you really want to reach out then they put the magnifier in conjunction with the sight. I'm pretty sure there's a mount that allows you to have your magnifier pivot out of the way when not in use while maintaining attached to the weapon. I have not seen a sight that does both. If you want to reach out to greater distances check out trijicon sights. Trijicons are super nice. However I don't think they do both?

Metcalf

12-10-2010, 05:28 PM

Being that it is a non-flat top upper I would just stick with the factory irons. Most mounts for that style mount the optic way to high to get a decent repeatable check weld. With the drop in style forearm rail it's not really best practice to mount the optic forward. The drop-in rails tend to move a bit much for a forward mounted optic.

For Zombies :), my suggestion would be to replace the front sight post with one that has a tritium dot. This gives you some added night time capability if you don't want to use the light or it doesn't have the range. You do loose some fine adjustment of the front sight since the dot has to be facing you.

cnynrat

12-10-2010, 05:39 PM

Are you really looking for a holographic sight, or simply an illuminated reticle?

There are lots of optics with magnification and illuminated reticles, but I'm not sure about a true holographic sight with magnification. As I understand it the key characteristic of a holographic sight such as the EoTech is that they are "parallax free" which means the reticle will always appear to be on the point of aim regardless of the alignment of the shooter's eye with the optic. Here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telescopic_sight) is a good explanation of parallax as it relates to optics (scroll down a ways).

As noted above the common solution to magnification with the EoTech is to use a separate magnifier, and they certainly do have flip out mounts that allow you to quickly get the magnifier out of the way if you want to use the sight without magnification.

The Trijicon ACOGs are very nice (but expensive) optics for the AR platform that offer various levels of magnification with an illuminated reticle, but I'm not sure they are a true holographic sight. Maybe someone can chime in and, ahem, illuminate us on that question. The ACOG's I see used on AR15s most often typically have magnification in the 3x - 4x range.

elder_michael

12-10-2010, 05:52 PM

Im not trying to start an arguement. Im jsut curious, why do people need this kind of firepower? Again im just curious

For the zombie apocolypse, what else?

Mr. Leary

12-10-2010, 05:55 PM

elder_michael

12-10-2010, 05:56 PM

cnynrat

12-10-2010, 07:10 PM

The ACOG's are not holographic.

Thanks for the clarification ....

Corey

12-10-2010, 09:52 PM

Thanks guy's for all the advice here.
I said I was a newb at the optics thing :D
I thought the Red Dot Aimpoints were the same as holographic sights.

I am not really sure if I need one, as my new addition (which I have not installed quite yet) may allow me to make mincemeat out of paper targets just as well as using a Red Dot Aimpoint unit.

Zatara

12-10-2010, 09:52 PM

I have an Eotech on one of my ARs now and it's ok, nothing to get excited about.
Optics are as personal a choice as the rifles they go on. Everyones eyes are different and what works for one guy may not for another.
I am selling my Eotech and when funds allow I am getting an TA31F ACOG because I like the red chevron reticle and 4x magnification the best.
Other than that, I prefer iron sights. :sombrero:

Corey

12-11-2010, 01:52 AM

Well, Santa paid me another visit http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.yotatech.com/get/images/smilies/xmas1.gif

When I left the store last weekend, my sling was not put on, and I thought the way to attach it was in the sack with all the other stuff, but not so.
What I needed was a quick disconnect (QD) made for the Magpul stock I have, you insert the QD into a hold in the stock.
I can still use the stock sling mount up front.
VLTOR Quick Detachable Sling Swivel (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=225)

When I was at the shop drooling over that Surefire X400 last weekend, Monday I gave it more thought as I have wanted a laser for my AR15 for a long time, and you can transfer them to a hand gun too.

If I kept the light ring that was just put on the AR15 I would have to spend another $65 for a nice Surefire light and buy a separate laser for around $200 or more, thus having two items now on the front.

The Surefire X400 is half the size of my Surefire G2X Pro flashlight as the batteries go side by side, plus it has a laser underneath the light.
With the Surefire X400 being an all in one unit, it saves weight up front and is darn cool, and it was marked down on sale from what it shows on their website.
Surefire LED Handgun / Long Gun WeaponLight with Laser - X400 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1966)

The light is 170 lumens which is blinding, just a little less than my G2x Pro light at 200 lumens.
The laser is very bright too at 5 milliwatt, in fact Surefire claims it is one of the brightest ones out there right now.

I just got done putting on the sling and X400 a few minutes ago.

Below is a picture of how the sling now mounts to the new stock.
I am not sure if I even have the sling on properly.
To be honest with you, when I have shot it before, I feel more comfortable not using one.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/12.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/13.jpg

Here is a comparison size picture of the light I had on the AR15 for a bit compared to the new X400 light/laser combo.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/10.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/11.jpg

I wanted to mount the new light/laser setup below the rail, but the stock sling mount up front is in the way, and it looks like it is held in with a pop rivet.
Even if I was able to remove, where would you mount a new one?

Closeup of the X400.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/14.jpg

Flash on camera on, light on only.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/15.jpg

Flash on camera off, light on only.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/16.jpg

I took a picture with the light and laser both on, but it did not turn out even though I could see the red dot near the center of the lights beam with my eye.

Laser on only.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/17.jpg

Camera flash on and laser only.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/18.jpg

I took the X400 to work Wednesday as a coworker is wanting to get one, and he wanted to check it out.
I notice when you aim the laser on a nearby wall the dot is kind of small.
Outside at work later that day in the daylight I tested it out by aiming it at the side of an adjacent building about 150' or so from me, and the red dot was no longer a small dot as it appeared to me to be about the size of a softball or bigger.
Weird huh?
I thought it was going to be hard to see it from so far away in the direct light, but I was wrong.
The dot was HUGE, and very easy to see.

This has me thinking if I set out some targets up where I go shooting and stand back at a good distance, I will be able to line the laser up on the target, and maybe get a good shot in.
Will have to experiment with the setup next spring/summer after the snow melts.
Right now where I go shooting there is several feet of snow, it is pretty high up.

If I pick up the S&W before to long, I will try out the X400 on it at the indoor range which is not to far from me.
That is if they allow you to use one in there.
I am very impressed with the X400 though for its light and laser output.

They have three nice YouTube videos on this Surefire X400.
The second and third video are linked from within the first video.

SureFire X400 live fire video (part 1 of 3)

YouTube - SureFire X400 live fire video (part 1 of 3)

robert

12-11-2010, 05:31 AM

Your light is generally better protected on the side but mounting it underneath is easy enough. The front sling swivel is help on by the rivet as you noticed- a small gauge punch will knock it out as will using a file/Dremel/hacksaw to take the head off and knock it out the other way. Be careful that you don't knock the ears off when you start working on it (unless you just want to grind them off). It's easily replaced if you change your mind down the road but I can't imagine you would.

Several companies make sling mounts that go on the rail or the front sight.

I'm assuming you're left handed judging by you're sling being on the right side? If not put it on the left side and it will lay flatter against your body.

As for the optics, you can get a step down mount that puts them in front of your carry handle yet off the rail. Mounting a scope on the rail generally necessitates a cheek riser on the stock. Weaver makes a couple of scopes with a red dot and magnification also.

Corey

12-11-2010, 01:04 PM

Thanks Robert.
I am left handed, but I shoot right handed since the ejector port is on the right side.

My friend I bought this from a few years back is into slings big time, and the first time we went out shooting I found it more comfortable not even using it since these rifles are so light weight.
But I do want to have it setup the proper way and get use to doing it right.

It looks like I would have room for a lower rail mount to mount a sling between the Grip Pod and the Surefire.
Would that be the best way, or hand it off the front sight?

I may go down to the shop today with it too to see what they have.
Only thing is everytime I walk in there I spend a wad of cash.
I have been meaning to pick up a few polymer mags though.

Corey

12-11-2010, 07:20 PM

You knew there was going to be one right :D
I swear, that jolly St. Nick will not leave me alone, I must have been very good this year.

I mentioned earlier I do not have much experience with slings, and I found the stock one somewhat cumbersome.
I just got back from the shop as I wanted the front stock sling mount removed (they punched out the pin setup), and a rail setup with a QD on it for the sling.
They mounted a rail mount one that comes with a QD of its own, but I am not using the QD.
I also wanted the stock sling mount moved so I could put the Surefire X400 light/laser underneath the rifle instead of off to the side like I had it yesterday.
Daniel Defense Rail Mount QD Swivel Attachment (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=412)

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/19.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/20.jpg

I was going to go with the stock sling when the guy who has been working with me the last two weekends showed me a very cool sling that has its own QDs built into it.
SKT Industries Adjustable QD Sling - 2 Point (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2228)
I am now a fan of this setup.
Not only is it easily removable from the rifle via the QDs, but it is a sling I will use everytime from now on.
You put the sling over your shoulder and your arm through it and pull a black strap to lower the rifles tip down towards your feet and snug the rifle up against you.

When you want to loosen the sling to allow you to bring up the rifle, you pull a green strap.
Very simple set and well thought out.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/21.jpg

I also wanted some new mags, so I picked up a few of the Magpul 30 round PMag ones.
Magpul 30 Round PMag (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=682)
These are not suppose to jam like some other ones out there.
My other ones are some old Colt mags that I bought online a few years back.

While I was there he showed me his custom 308 setup that is a piston setup instead of the normal gas setup like mine.
He had an AAC flash suppressor on the end of it that also allows an AAC silencer/suppressor to mount over it.

I found out if is legal to own and mount a silencer in the state of WA., but you can not shoot with it.
I would have to go to Oregon or Idaho to do that.
You also have to apply for the tax stamp which is around $200 to have to say you have the right to own one.
This is probably something I will not do, as right now I feel I would not get my monies worth out of it since I have not traveled to either of those two states in quite awhile.
But it was informative to know that you can legally buy and own one in my state.

Will there be a part four?
Probably down the road some, as I looked at an Aimpoint and an Eotech optic today.
I looked at both battery ones, and the kind that use radioactive materiel in them to power the dot you see inside.
I will have to look more into that later.
Also with my fixed carry handle on top, that would make an optic sit up rather high.
One will mount to my rail/hand guard system, but he mentioned it could get some vibration there.
Has anyone mounted theirs there on an actual hand guard, or is that asking for problems?

robert

12-11-2010, 11:48 PM

Cool sling.

re the optics on the handguard, most two piece non-free floating handguards that I've seen have at least some movement in them. If you want to mount optics on the handguard I'd switch to a free float style. Personally I like the new Spike's Tactical (light, well finished including smooth edges, inexpensive, etc). Mounting them is going to require taking off your flash suppressor and front sight but that's easy too (three pins and a mallet- two pins in the sight base and one through the gas tube). I believe Daniel Defense makes a free float series that you don't have to remove the sight for; just cut the delta ring and it clamps on to the barrel nut.

You might try moving the light to the side again then moving that grip forward- a lot of people find it preferable to being up close to the mag well as it doesn't allow as much motion of the gun. I prefer Magpul or Tangodown pistol grips over the stock A2 style; they fit my hand better.

I'll be honest though- with an A2 style upper (carrying handle) and what looks to be a lightweight barrel I'd just add a sling, a light and a different pistol grip and call it good. You can only take the design so far before you might as well switch to a flat top and they start getting heavy. That said, it's easy to swap uppers if you wanted to have several different styles or calibers. Have a handy carbine for fun, a long range gun for target shooting, a 6.5, 6.8 or other for hunting, a .22 conversion for plinking, etc. If you're willing to build it yourself lowers can be had for under $100 then just buy a parts kit and a stock. You see where this is going........

Obviously you can spend a ton of money on these toys- I heard one fellow describe them as "Barbie for men" and thought that was a pretty good description.

Check out ar15.com for all the info, and then some, that you could ever want on the ar15 platform. The technical forums are still good although the general discussion gets childish at times. I'm curious about the shooting with a suppressor thing though- are you sure they meant you can't shoot it or you can't hunt with it? Some states don't allow hunting with them for some reason but transferring an NFA item over state lines requires that you notify the BATF. AR15.com has a section on class III toys under the "Armory" tab and there is a Washington home town forum where you should be able to get specific answers relative to your state too.

Corey

12-12-2010, 12:47 AM

Thanks Robert, I believe I signed up over at ar15 a few years back.

Seems that sight is down too.
http://www.spikestactical.com/

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* Using Plesk, you can create domains with web hosting on a single physical server.
Yeah, having the fixed carry handle is the only drawback I see right now with a good optics setup.
I might save that for that S&W M&P 15 22 I am going to pick up later.

Good thing about this new sling I got is you can move it to all of your rifles in a few seconds as long as they are setup with a QD rail.

When you say move the Grip Pod forward, you think all the way to where the light is sitting now?
I will have to experiment with it.

I do know I like having the new stock collapsed all the way so I can snug up to it more.

On the suppressor thing, what he told me is I can own one and mount it on the gun, but it is strictly forbidden to discharge the gun in any part of my state with it.
I will have to read up on the sub forum over there.
But I doubt I would get one, the price would be equal to about two of those S&Ws I want.

He also mentioned with the tip he has (wants to sell me ones as well) that when you rapid fire the rifle you do not get as much kick around with his type of tip as I do the stock flash suppressor I have.

I sure wish we had some good weather right now, I could use some shooting time with this new setup.

The local indoor firing range which is on the same road as the shop I have been dealing with, but about six or so miles further, said the only way I could shoot my AR there now would be to use 223 frangible bullets I get from them or elsewhere.
I just Googled it, and they seem to pretty expensive.
http://frangiblebullets.com/xcart/223-REM-by-ICC-45gr.-RP/NT-Box-of-20.html

He told me they do not allow regular 223 or 5.56 there as it would do to much damage.

It might be worth checking out what that range charges though so I can use it down there, as I am pretty excited with this new setup, plus they sell that S&W 22 I want, maybe I can demo one there.

And yes, this is as addictive as modding our vehicles and getting new camping gear :D

PS, I called the local indoor range, and he said come on down :D
$39.95 for a box of 50 frang rounds.
Expensive, yes, I could burn through that in a very short time.
I would sure feel better though afterwards since the Colt is begging to try out its new makeover.

LMarshall73

12-12-2010, 02:39 AM

M4Carbine.net (http://www.m4carbine.net/) is a good place to find info on the AR platform as well. Lots of industry professionals there (manufacturers, active/former mlitary/contractors, etc) so you get a lot of no-BS reviews on what works and what doesn't on a combat rifle.

For me, I like to tinker with ARs, but AKs are my 'working' guns.

ETA - I've gone down the NFA/Title II/Class 3 road before, so I may be able to give some insight if requested.

robert

12-12-2010, 04:26 AM

That's weird about the Spike's website- it was working when I posted it but it sure isn't now. They just reworked it so maybe they're having problems with it.

Experiment with your vertical grip- some like them all the way out, some like them up close to the mag well. I tend to run mine about halfway if I run one but I've been experimenting with one of the new Magpul AFG grips. I've got it out near the end of the handguards and so far I like it. I'm using a light setup similar to your first one but mounted on the side where I can hit it with my thumb; my plan is to switch to a Streamlight TLR1 with a wired switch but I haven't gotten around to it.

Your friend is probably running a muzzle brake on the end of his barrel instead of just a flash suppressor. Personally I don't like them as they tend to increase noise to the shooter. I had one of the Bushamster's with the AK style brake for a while and even with earplugs and muffs it was painful to shoot under a covered range for more than a magazine or so. I removed it and pinned a Phantom on it to make it a legal 16" (I prefer the Vortex over the Phantom though). I've tried a couple of other style brakes and I just don't find the 223 to have enough recoil to put up with the extra racket- JMHO.

Spike's also makes a drop in .22 conversion as do a couple of others (they're all basically the same design). While dirtier than .223 it allows you to use the same gun for practice. The .22 conversion kits tend to shoot a hair lower than the 223. Can't go wrong with one of the S&W's though- everyone I know with one likes it.

The big thing is to shoot it- have fun trying out different parts until you get the set up you want. You mentioned shooting with the stock collapsed- make sure you have on safety glasses as the direct impingement system can blow crud back in your face around the charging handle. You can also buy a gasbuster charging handle which will help eliminate that (expensive though).

Corey

12-12-2010, 11:20 PM

M4Carbine.net (http://www.m4carbine.net/) is a good place to find info on the AR platform as well.
Thanks, have that one bookmarked as well.

That's weird about the Spike's website- it was working when I posted it but it sure isn't now. They just reworked it so maybe they're having problems with it.

Experiment with your vertical grip- some like them all the way out, some like them up close to the mag well. I tend to run mine about halfway if I run one but I've been experimenting with one of the new Magpul AFG grips. I've got it out near the end of the handguards and so far I like it. I'm using a light setup similar to your first one but mounted on the side where I can hit it with my thumb; my plan is to switch to a Streamlight TLR1 with a wired switch but I haven't gotten around to it.

The big thing is to shoot it- have fun trying out different parts until you get the set up you want. You mentioned shooting with the stock collapsed- make sure you have on safety glasses as the direct impingement system can blow crud back in your face around the charging handle. You can also buy a gasbuster charging handle which will help eliminate that (expensive though).
Hopefully it will be up later.

I will experiment with the front grip this week.

Thanks for the advice about the blowback.
I do not have any safety glasses as of yet.
Do they have them that fit over prescription glasses?
Mine are the plastic Transitions.

I checked out that handle, around $90, but the reviews say it is worth it.
Might be going on my list.

PS, it is up.
http://www.spikestactical.com/new/z/index.php

robert

12-13-2010, 12:57 AM

I just wear my regular glasses but they're polycarbonate impact resistant. You can get safety glasses that fit over prescription glasses or just get prescription shooting glasses. You're eyes aren't replaceable and if something lets loose you want to be prepared; while unlikely it does happens occasionally just as with anything mechanical.

That gasbuster charging handle sounds very expensive; there are other option out there. I just use the factory handle and don't get my face too close. So far no issues although suppressors tend to run the gun dirtier.

I still think you're best bet is to run it for a while and get a feel for it to see what you like. I'm partial to light weight and simple (and I'm cheap).
:sombrero:

jesusgatos

12-13-2010, 02:29 AM

Something about pictures of guns taken next to computer keyboards makes me chuckle.

Corey

12-13-2010, 08:24 AM

I just wear my regular glasses but they're polycarbonate impact resistant. You can get safety glasses that fit over prescription glasses or just get prescription shooting glasses. You're eyes aren't replaceable and if something lets loose you want to be prepared; while unlikely it does happens occasionally just as with anything mechanical.

I am going to call up my eye doctor and see if mine are impact resistant or not.

I have two weeks off for Christmas coming up soon, so I will get down to the range and try this new setup out amongst some other guns they carry there.

PS, I bet my prescription Oakleys I picked up last spring are impact resistant, but they would only be good for shooing outdoors on a sunny day.

Something about pictures of guns taken next to computer keyboards makes me chuckle.
Better than taking it outside and sticking it on my hood like in some pics I have seen.
Neighbors might think I am getting ready for a postal run.

Corey

12-19-2010, 10:18 AM

Stopped off at Rainier Arms on the way home Friday from work and picked up three of these in black.
Magpul 30 Round PMag - Windowed (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=865)

I got two of the non windowed ones last week, I thought I might try these too.

The guy who rang me up noticed my FJ out front and we got to talking for a bit, and he said he had drove one at Cruise Moab in Utah.

He had an older Toyota truck out front, and is a member over on NW Toys, a local Toyota forum.

He asked me if I knew a moderator at YotaTech named Chris that went by the membername Tofer (friend of his), and I told him yes and that I was the admin there.
Small world.

I forgot to pick up one item I have been wanting for awhile when I stopped by the other day to get the new Pmags with the windows in them.
This is a speed loader.
Butler Creek LULA Speed Loader for AR15 / M16 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=908)

No more having to push in the ammo against the spring and tear up your fingers, my fingertips are already split from the cold weather, happens everytime this year with it and working out in the rain at work.

This thing is so cool, just drop in the ammo one at a time and push the lever one way, drop in another bullet, and push the lever back again the other way.
You can load a magazine very quickly this way.

I got to talking to the guy about optics again, and I am kind of limited with the carry handle on my rifle.
He said just replace the upper, and I would have a nice flat surface with a rail built in, then I can mount any optic I want without having it stick up way high on top of the carry handle.

I did not know it was as simple as that, and next time I go there I will be getting it done.
You lose the rear sight though, so I will be getting a Magpul flip up sight that will mount right behind whatever optic I go with in the future.
Remove the optic, and you can then flip up the rear sight.
It will work with the stock front sight, so no need to remove it as this time.

I am not sure if this is the same upper he showed me, they have many on their site, and I did not write down the name of the one he showed me.
They vary in price quite a bit.

Rainier Arms Forged A4 Upper Assembly - GEN2 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2197)

Also there are many rear sites they offer too that will fit the new upper with the rail built onto it, this is just the one he showed to me yesterday.

Magpul MBUS - Rear (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1441)

After I get a new upper installed, it will open up to me many choices for an optic.
One I looked at was a 4x Acog which I liked.

PS, found a video (there are more) of how that speed loader works.
Guy is using it on a Magpul Pmag.

YouTube - LULA Magazine Loader works with PMags

Strizzo

12-20-2010, 05:22 PM

like that speedloader, i saw one in use at the range a while back but didn't realize that it also unloads as well as loads mags.

i looked at that magpul mbus sight at a gun show and didn't like the feel. it felt kinda flimsy and cheap to me. i ended up getting a regular A2 style detachable rear sight that mimicks the A2 detachable carry handle. its really sturdy and has windage and elevation adjustment.

Here's mine just after i put it together:

http://www.aww-kittah-aww.com/up/files/402/rifle%20assembled.JPG

Corey

12-20-2010, 07:58 PM

Yes, the speed loader is pretty cool, it will stay in my rifle bag.

Nice rifle you have there too.

Thanks for the info on the mbus, I may also look and see what the store has there.

LACamper

12-21-2010, 01:56 AM

Metcalf

12-21-2010, 02:10 AM

Swapping the upper isn't super hard but takes a few tools. I assemble mine on the bed of a knee mill. This lets me keep the forearm rail in perfect alignment with the receiver rail while I torque the barrel nut.

You should wait on the rear MBUS, gen 2 should be out soon :)

Hill, Bill E.

12-21-2010, 02:17 AM

Corey

12-21-2010, 08:39 AM

The gas buster handle is expensive. Its really meant for silenced guns though. Go poke around on www.silencertalk.com and you'll find a poor man's alternative. IIRC they fill the groove at the back of a standard charging handle with silicone.
I've never had an issue w/ mine (and I'm not running a silencer) so I've never tried...

I asked about the glasses a few pairs ago. They said most lenses now are polycarbonate and are fairly impact resistant. Side shields are available if you're worried about it...
Thanks, just need to find some glasses that are comfortable that will fit over mine that give me some side coverage too.

Swapping the upper isn't super hard but takes a few tools. I assemble mine on the bed of a knee mill. This lets me keep the forearm rail in perfect alignment with the receiver rail while I torque the barrel nut.

You should wait on the rear MBUS, gen 2 should be out soon :)
Thanks for the info on the gen 2, I will ask about that there.

Very nice set up!

Just some FYI (didn't see it posted yet)

If your reciever is marked "5.56" or "5.56/.223" you can shoot either round in it.

If it's only stamped ".223", you do not want to shoot 5.56 ammo.

I'm looking at getting a collapsible stock for my XM15 'Varminter'. While mainly a 'bench gun' (it has the 26" barrel) the adjustable stock is nice in the winter, when wearing bulkier jackets.:coffeedrink:
Thanks, pretty excited getting this built up.
It states NATO on the barrel and also on the mag well it states 5.56/.223

LACamper

12-22-2010, 01:58 AM

Corey

12-23-2010, 08:02 PM

Huge variety out there with slings.

I will have updated pics tomorrow morning around noon or so my time.
The shop is closing down today for a party, so I will not be able to pick it up today.

thebrassnuckles

12-24-2010, 02:30 PM

Very nice set up!

Just some FYI (didn't see it posted yet)

If your reciever is marked "5.56" or "5.56/.223" you can shoot either round in it.

If it's only stamped ".223", you do not want to shoot 5.56 ammo.

I'm looking at getting a collapsible stock for my XM15 'Varminter'. While mainly a 'bench gun' (it has the 26" barrel) the adjustable stock is nice in the winter, when wearing bulkier jackets.:coffeedrink:

the place you want to look is on the barrel. the reciever can be marked as anything... I have 2 lowers marked "multi"

one has my 450 bushmaster upper oi it and the other my 5.56 LaRue Steath upper.

you can put any caliber upper you want on any lower you wat. the roll mark on the barrel is where you should check to see what chamber is cut into the barrel.

if I put a 556 cartridge into my 450 the whole cartridge falls out the end of the barrel :smileeek:

thebrassnuckles

12-24-2010, 02:34 PM

Actually, I want one of the resin/plastic lowers. I'm trying to get the weight of my AR down.
I have a Clark carbon fiber FF tube and a pencil barrel. The lower w/ the collapsible stock is pretty heavy.
A Phantom flash hider and a ergo hand grip are also on the wish list.

As far as slings go I usually stop at the nearest Ace hardware and pick up some webbing and fastex buckles. Works fine.
If you're not getting better groups and more control using a sling then you're not using it right.

YouTube - Improving your shooting #7. Using a leather rifle sling. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaRCFpH27-w)

I don't use leather (too much work and I don't shoot competition), but I do put some tension on the sling looped around my elbow.

if your sling is attached to the sling loop on your barrel it will affect your point of impact. I didnt watch the video, but the best place to put a sling is on the free floated handguard. it allows the barrel to follow through each shot with its own unique whip, which will repeat itself everytime. if you are putting tension on the sling loop, your pull on the sling will inhibit the barrel whip each shot, and if you dont put the exact tension in the exact same spot in the exact same direction each time, it will change POI. maybe not that much at close ranges, but out further it will definitely have an adverse affect.

Corey

12-24-2010, 07:04 PM

Santa said more upgrades, and just in time for Christmas.
All these upgrades have not cost me a thing, it has come via the company bonus, I love this time of year.
I dropped the rifle off Wednesday, and picked it up today when they opened.

To mount a good optic later with magnification I did not like the carry handle, as that would make one sit to high, and as mentioned earlier, the store advised me I could go with a new upper.
The Colts are not a dark black like some ARs out there, it is more grayish, so this matches the new quad rail I got a few weeks back better than it does the rest of the rifle, but it still looks very nice.

Rainier Arms Forged A4 Upper Assembly - GEN1 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1434)

Since I lost the rear sight as that is part of the carry handle, I went with the a polymer Magpul one.
They are coming out early next year some time with a gen two of this model, but I needed one now, so I went with the gen one model.
Depending on if the gen two is that much better, I may swap this one out for the other.
Most of my shooting though for target practice is going to be through an magnification optic, so this gen one model may be good enough.

Magpul MBUS - Rear Gen One (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1441)

Since the gun needed to be torn down (gunsmithing charges apply) I asked about triggers, and I really liked one that felt much better than the stock one.

Mega Tactical Trigger (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1852)

I had already paid for it, but I got a call from the shop letting me know if would not fit my Colt after it was torn down.
I had looked at a few other triggers there too that were a two stage one.
You could pull it back a short ways, until it stopped, then pull it all the way to fire.
Since this is all new to me I am not sure what is the best to use mainly for plinking/target practice.

So the plan was to take a look at either sticking with the stock trigger for now, or try another option which would be a two stage one.
I ended up staying with the stock trigger for now, but they let me try out one of the ARs on the wall (remember, this shop has ARs all over the wall, very cool) that had one of these two stage Timney triggers on it.

Timney Single Stage Match Trigger (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=580)

The ones they have in stock use the small pins, so they would have to custom order one with the bigger Colt type of pins for me.
Also I dig the looks of the skeletonized triggers more, and that tacks on quite a bit more $$$.
The trigger will come later, my next mod is going to be an optic.

I looked at a few.
IOR Valdada 1.1-4X26 CRT Illuminated Tactical Scope (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=638)
Very nice, but takes up a lot of room.
It is adjustable from 1.1x to 4x.

ACOG TA31DOC (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=650)
This one was cool, it has a separate "red dot" type option on top, but overkill for me since I have the laser up front.

ACOG TA31H-G (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1661)
This is the one I am going to get, and the price will be less too.
This one has a green horseshoe shape instead of the chevron like some of the other have, I like it better.
I also like the green better than the red..
He showed me when I was looking through it how it gets much brighter when he shined a flashlight near the top to simulate a bright day, the green horseshoe inside got very bright, making it easier to see.
This is a 4x optic, which they said would be fine if I am standing/sitting in one spot and aiming out at targets at different yardages.

http://www.gunshopfinder.com/trijicon/acog_ta31f-g.jpg http://www.gunshopfinder.com/trijicon/ta31hg_reticle_diagram.jpg

The very first optic above in this post being adjustable would be better if I was moving all around, but since most of my shooting will be targets and plinking the 4x is a good choice.

I really liked the look of it on top of the new upper too.
I will pick this up early in 2011, and that will leave me with just adding a new trigger at a later date too.

The new Magpul foldable rear sight is very nice too, I like it.

I am very pleased at how this is all coming along, and here are some pictures from today.

View showing the new upper with built in rail and the Magpul site in the down position.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/22.jpg

View with the sight up.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/23.jpg

Top view showing how the rail hand guard blends in with the new upper.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/24.jpg

Side view of the new upper branded with their name on it.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/25.jpg

Side view of the whole rifle as it sits now with all of the new mods.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/26.jpg

Strizzo

12-25-2010, 05:09 AM

Peck

12-25-2010, 07:33 AM

Carry some black electrical tape when going to the range with that ACOG. Just cover up as much, or as little, of the tritium as needed. I say this because on a bright day, the bright reticule can really fatigue your eyes fast. Covering up the tritium will reduce the brightness.

ACOGs are nice, but they sure are spendy! I love my EOTech XPS2-0 with Primary Arms 3x magnifier. It's good to about 300yds which is about all my eyes and skill will let me right now. Plus I love shooting with both eyes open and the really fast target acquisition. Soon as I can get my stick up, I'm on target. My next build will have a magnified optic though, but it'll probably be a .308. :)

I also suggest getting a free float railed hand guard. Some people will argue if they actually make a difference in accuracy or not, but after spending so much coin on the stick as is -- why not? Daniel Defense makes a drop in rail that requires no disassembley of your gun. The Daniel Defense Omega 7.0 will fit your carbine nicely. I run the 9.0 on my mid-length and have nothing bad to say about it. Real solid.

BTW, I want you to know you are on really slippery slope, but it appears you're already bitten by the bug. It's all down hill from here! Have fun and put plenty rounds down range.

Corey

12-25-2010, 05:05 PM

rifle is looking really good now! for triggers, i really like the 2-stage that came in my RRA lower. i tried it and one with the standard trigger out when i was shopping, and the difference was very noticeable. also not too heavy of a pull and very smooth movement. the stock trigger i could feel the trigger creep a few mils before dropping.
Thanks, I will try out a few before deciding what to go with after I get the optics taken care of.

Carry some black electrical tape when going to the range with that ACOG. Just cover up as much, or as little, of the tritium as needed.

ACOGs are nice, but they sure are spendy!

I also suggest getting a free float railed hand guard.

BTW, I want you to know you are on really slippery slope, but it appears you're already bitten by the bug. It's all down hill from here! Have fun and put plenty rounds down range.
Good idea on the tape.
Yes, that Acog is a lot of $$$.
I asked my oldest son a year or so back what they liked over in Iraq.
He did three tours there, and he said they liked the Acogs very much.

I just went with the new quad handrail a few weeks back, I gotta break it in first before deciding if it is worth dropping it or not in favor of a free floater.

Slippery slope indeed, I have as much now into mods as I paid for the rifle, and I still have that optic to get.

Mlachica

12-29-2010, 02:00 PM

Corey

12-29-2010, 04:59 PM

Just bought a laser bore sighter via Amazon.
SightMark Laser Bore Sights Cartridge Sizes: SightMark AccuDot Laser Bore Sight - 223 Model SM39001

There are some junk ones out there, but I have read the reviews of this one at Amazon and other sites, and it seems to be a good brand.

I intend on using it to fine tune in my Surefire X400 (http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main.pl?pgm=co_disp&func=displ&strfnbr=6&prrfnbr=24585&sesent=0,0&search_id=2456040) laser and light combo, and also the Acog TA31H-G I plan on getting before to long.

Anyone used a in chamber laser bore sighter before?
If so, did you have good luck with it?

thebrassnuckles

12-29-2010, 09:04 PM

Just bought a laser bore sighter via Amazon.
SightMark Laser Bore Sights Cartridge Sizes: SightMark AccuDot Laser Bore Sight - 223 Model SM39001 (http://www.amazon.com/SightMark-Laser-Sights-Cartridge-Sizes/dp/B001BVI982/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=sporting-goods&qid=1293645235&sr=1-1)

There are some junk ones out there, but I have read the reviews of this one at Amazon and other sites, and it seems to be a good brand.

I intend on using it to fine tune in my Surefire X400 (http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main.pl?pgm=co_disp&func=displ&strfnbr=6&prrfnbr=24585&sesent=0,0&search_id=2456040) laser and light combo, and also the Acog TA31H-G I plan on getting before to long.

Anyone used a in chamber laser bore sighter before?
If so, did you have good luck with it?

the bore sighters are good for getting on paper, but they do not follow the flight patch of the bullet. I would definitely get out to a range and shoot a few rounds at each distance you plan on shooting at.

plus, it ever hurts to run a few rounds down the pipe to familiarize yourself with the rifle more.

your acog should come with paperwork telling you what range to sight it in at, once sighted in the scope has additional dots for ballistic drop compensation, (most acogs have them.. not sure on your exact model)
so if you are zeroed at 100, and you want to shoot at 200, you put the next dot down on the 200 yd target and you should be able to poke a hole in it.

Corey

12-30-2010, 05:22 PM

Thanks, I can not wait to get to a range at a later date.

Found some more info from the makers site on the bore laser.
http://sightmark.com/images/manuals/SM39001-008.pdf

http://sightmark.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=20

I have never been to an indoor range before, so I am not sure what kind of paper targets they supply.
I will be looking into a few different ones I have seen online that leave a green goo when you hit it, and some zombie ones :D

Shoot NC (http://sport.birchwoodcasey.com/Targets/TargetList.aspx?CategoryID=3b4e8543-d1ac-4fff-b7eb-80c81868e1b6)

http://sport.birchwoodcasey.com/files/Targets/Shoot%27N%27C/Small/sm_shootnc_coyote_silhouette_kit.jpg http://sport.birchwoodcasey.com/files/Targets/Shoot%27N%27C/Small/sm_shootnc_targets_prairie_chuck_target.jpg

I am not sure what size to get if shooting indoors between 25 and 50 yards.

And for the zombie ones... (http://www.zombietargets.net/)

http://zombietargets.net/store/media/z1_store_view.jpg http://zombietargets.net/store/media/z4-store-view.jpg http://zombietargets.net/store/media/z2_store_view.jpg

For outdoors in the mountains when I go, I have looked at some expensive metal targets that reset when you hit the reset paddle.

Theirs are pretty high priced at $369 for the high velocity one.

Metal Spinning Targets (http://metaltargets.com/)

The reset one (http://metaltargets.com/ResetTargets.htm)

http://metaltargets.com/Images/ResetTargets/ResetAnimation.gif

A cheaper one is at the site that has the green goo NC targets.
World of Targets® Metal Targets (http://sport.birchwoodcasey.com/Targets/TargetDetails.aspx?ProductID=5590b85c-3bf9-40bd-8dbe-8e93d7f0090f)

It states that it is for .38 to .44 magnum caliber pistols, I wonder if a 5.56 round will be OK, or will that ruin the metal?
That is a lot better priced at $72.

http://sport.birchwoodcasey.com/files/Targets/World%20of%20Targets/Small/sm_44_gallery_resetting_target.jpg

LACamper

12-31-2010, 02:30 PM

You do NOT want to shoot the pistol targets with .223. If you insist on doing that switch to frangible ammo to prevent ricochets...

Corey

12-31-2010, 03:38 PM

Thanks, will have to stick with paper targets then.

Already priced frang ammo at an indoor range down the road from me, and they get $39.95 per 50 rounds.
Total ripoff, but if I want to shoot my AR there, I must use their ammo they say, as they do not allow regular .223 or 5.56 ammo in there.
He said it would tear up the place :D

Heck, I could burn through 50 rounds in a few minutes or so just taking it easy there.
I am looking at other ranges too (outdoor) but they are not close to me.

Up where I like to shoot where I camp, it is buried under right now with several feet of snow, it will not be clear until around late May or early June.

Strizzo

12-31-2010, 09:50 PM

lose tension how? i have noticed that mine isn't quite as heavy as when it was new, but that doesn't bother me too much since i like a lighter trigger anyways.

robert

01-03-2011, 04:32 AM

You can buy all sorts of metal targets designed for rifle calibers but they are expensive. Rifles rounds are higher velocity and will tear up pistol/.22 targets and could be dangerous.

As brassnuckles said, the boresighter will allow you to get a scope on paper but you still need to put rounds down range. You need to match your ammo to your barrel too- do you know what twist rate you got? 1:9 is about the most common (it's usually stamped on the barrel somewhere) and you should be good with 55gr to 64 gr. Heavier or lighter and you'll need a different twist for good accuracy.

Corey

01-06-2011, 11:17 PM

Robert, it says 1.7 on the barrel.

LACamper

01-07-2011, 02:56 AM

Corey

01-15-2011, 10:16 PM

The AR15 is still getting the Acog TA31H-G optic before to long, and I am picking up a Glock 21SF very soon for home defense and to have in the tent while camping.
The Glock will be in a new thread.

But I have had my eye on the S&W M&P AR15-22 for awhile since it will be very cheap to shoot, and I can shoot it at the local indoor range.
They make several models of this one, and some have had a few problems with it, but not with the MOE version I plan on getting, it has an upgraded "blue" spring in it which seems to have resolved some issues with earlier models.

Here is a snippet on it, and some reviews from owners.
http://www.tactical-life.com/online/products/smith-wessons-mp15-22-rifle/

Here is the site from S&W with links to them, and the MOE model I will get.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category4_750001_750051_757786_-1_757784_757784_image

MOE model (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_773502_-1_757786_757784_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y)
MSRP is $609, my local shops have it for $525.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson2/upload/images/firearms/zoom_lg/811034_01_lg.jpg

Corey

11-25-2011, 06:20 PM

Dropped the AR15 off at the shop a bit ago to take advantage of some Black Friday specials going on.

Magpul PMags are on sale for $13 each, normally $17.05 for the 30 round windowed ones, and I got three more to add to my collection.
MAG210-BLK (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=865)

Main reason I went though is to have the stock gas block taken off so I can have a flip up sight up front to replace the fixed stock one.
I could have gone with a polymer Magpul sight like I have in the rear if I kept it on the handguard rail, but the further up front it is, the better, plus the gas block I am having installed has a picatinny rail on it for one.
Had to go with an aluminum one though, as with it being directly on the barrel a polymer one like the Magpul would melt.

Here are the two parts:
PRI Gas Block w/Picatinny Rail (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1937)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/326eb4dbc54c8d2bbfbc75664d9c68dc.jpg

Diamondhead Premium Classic Front Sight (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2516)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/636339905f3e58c9411ec452d59ca661.jpg

It will not be ready to pick up until midweek next week sometime, and I will update this thread with pictures.

Since I am a good customer there, I got some free stickers thrown in.
Here they are, pretty cool.
Some will go on my safe, I may put the zombie permit on the FJ :D

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/stickers.jpg

robert

11-25-2011, 10:38 PM

Just some random thoughts…

Have you thought about getting a CMMG or Spike's .22 upper instead? The Smith would give you a second gun, but I didn't care for them when I looked at them (can't remember the reasons at the moment) and they had some negative reviews. You can also buy conversion kits that replace the bolt/bolt carrier but the rifling in a 5.56 barrel isn't ideal for the .22 and they tend to shoot low in my experience. I've got a CMMG upper and a Spike's conversion and they both work well. I run Black Dog magazines with both; buy a loader as it’s a pain loading the small .22s in the mags since you’ll burn through them quickly- they’re a ton of fun. For the life of me I can’t figure out why they don’t have a button on the side to compress the spring like Ruger MK series magazines. If you get a conversion, run a round or two of .223 through the gun after shooting and it’ll make sure the gas tube is clear (the conversions are blowback, but they still get some junk in the tube supposedly).

The G21 is a monster. The SF frame tends to fit more folks but it’s still huge and heavy when loaded. If you’re buying new, great, if not make sure it’s not the ambidextrous frame as they had issues with them. Mine never worked quite right then it broke so I sent it back and they replaced it with a regular frame. For even more fun, go to KKM’s website and get yourself a conversion barrel- .45 to 10mm. Pick up a couple of G20 mags and you’re ready to shoot 10mm. The polymer frame of the Glock tames heavy 10mm loads well and they’re not as hard recoiling as say the Colt Delta Elites for example. The gun is very accurate and a lot of fun to shoot but due to the size it’s pretty much a range gun; if I were to do it over I’d have gotten the G30 instead (KKM makes a 10mm barrel for it as well).

Personally I prefer a low profile gas block with an extended free float handguard; just a cleaner profile, lighter weight and the front sight doesn't get hot. Make sure they lock-tite/stake/somehow secure the screws on the gasblock.

Corey

11-26-2011, 01:02 AM

Thanks Robert, I do not want to mess with the hassle of changing out uppers to choose between .22 and 5.56.
A separate rifle would be the best choice for me.

Most of the reviews I read on that particular S&W .22 were pretty good.

They suggested the picatinny gas block over a smaller one which would leave "scars" showing from the stock sight when it comes off.
I take if a free float handguard/rail such as this from them (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2215) slips over a gas block so it kind of hides it?

I will have to keep an eye on the heat of the site on the new gas block I am getting.
If it does indeed get to hot, I can always move it to the end of my current handguard/rail setup.
It would only move it about one inch or so closer to the rear site, not to bad.
Main reason they suggested putting the site out on the gas block was to make more distance between front/rear sites.

I am sure this place will use Lock Tite, they are a pretty professional crew there.
They cater to a lot of enthusiasts and law enforcement officers.

One guy came in today to pick up his new silencer.
He had applied for his stamp last spring, and it took this long to get it.
But silencers have only been legal to shoot (always been legal to own for quite a while) since August of this year.
The state is getting around 10,000 requests per month to file for the stamp to buy a silencer in my state, and they are overwhelmed.

I may have to look into one of those down the road.
Sure would be nice when camped in the mountains where I like to go to not make a bunch of noise that would attract others in the area to see what the noise from a 5.56 is all about.

I really like my G21 SF, and yes, no ambidextrous mag release.
My friend who turned me onto Glocks said to avoid them at all cost, and I read online reports from LEO's having their mags released when they got out of their vehicles from the gun contacting the steering wheels.

I wanted the G30 due to its ability to use my G21 mags, but the shop was out, and the guy talked me into the slimmer single stack G36.
I still like the G36 even though it only holds six shots.
It shoots very nice though, but the 21SF is my favorite.
It is the one I keep close at night if there was a breakin, plus it has my Surefire on it.
No Picatinny/Glock rail on the G36.

I have seen some of the conversion barrels for the Glocks.
So it is as simple as just taking out the current barrel once you release the slide, then getting the G20 mags?
Is the 10 mm recoil a lot less than the 45 ACP?
How about cost difference in ammo?

I guy my 45 ACP in bulk at 500 rounds, so I get a fairly good deal on it.
Now the hollow points are different, as I only keep a hundred rounds or so of it for home defense.
The bulk white box ammo I have is for targets only.

robert

11-28-2011, 10:01 AM

Two pins and you're done, but yes, I bought another lower for my CMMG. Yes, most low profile gas blocks will fit under most free float handguards- not all will though so it's best to check. As long as the front sight you get is metal you should be fine though. I'm sure those guys will steer you right.

The KKM conversion barrel is a drop in item. All you need is the barrel and some G20 mags although they recommend upgrading the recoil spring to a heavier weight. The 10mm is harder recoiling in the heavier loads (180gr, 200gr and 220gr) than a .45+P; when loaded to proper 10mm specs it's close to a .41mag. Personally I don't think the recoil is bad at all- certainly nothing like 10mm in a Colt Delta Elite; I suppose the polymer frame helps absorb some of the recoil. Almost everything I've read about the KKM barrels has been positive with a couple saying that they used the heavier spring and a new extractor (sharper) to solve an occasional FTE. The big downside to 10mm is it's expensive and can be hard to find. It's an easy cartridge to reload but I don't currently reload. I bought a couple of boxes of Buffalo Bore and Double Tap, shot a couple of each to see how they did then put them aside for a rainy day. There's some imported 100 that's the same price as other ammo, but it's not loaded hot, it's basically the same as 40S&W.

Corey

11-28-2011, 10:19 AM

Double post there :D
I am still not getting the proper box to reply in, it brings up the Quick Reply box for me.

I will probably just stick with the 45 ACP I am using since it has less kick than 10 mm.

When I am at the shop to pick up the AR, I will inquire about a free float handguard/picatinny rail.
More than likely I will stick with what I have, that new handguard has only been on since last December.

robert

11-28-2011, 10:32 AM

AR-15s: Like Barbie for men. :))

Yeah, I deleted the other; the site is hanging up for me too.

Scott C

11-30-2011, 08:24 PM

I was building an AR like you in stages, but it gets to a point where you have too much invested and its still not quite what you want or could buy all at once cheaper. Ditched the whole thing and bougth an enhanced acr with eotech sight and flip up magnifier.

Corey

11-30-2011, 09:56 PM

Well, I just received bad news.
The shop called me and said the gas block will not work because my Colt has the "pencil" barrel.
He could put a low profile one on there without a Picatinny rail, but then I could not use the new flip up sight.
And moving the flip up sight to my current rail would not be good he said.

So I will have to take my lower back to them this week and have them reassemble it for me.
The guy who was selling me the stuff should have caught that mine was a pencil barrel.
I knew it was, but I assumed he knew it too.

Corey

11-30-2011, 11:09 PM

Hey, we are back on again.
I am going there after work tomorrow and look at a new front quad free floater handguard, low profile gas block to fit underneath of it, and the Diamond front sight I bought from them will work on it.

I will also get a matching Diamondhead rear sight to replace the Magpul polymer one.

Its only money :D
Then this rifle is done except for maybe the Acog down the road.
I want to get another rifle still, or the KSG if it is out yet.

danish

11-30-2011, 11:22 PM

No need to buy a lo-pro gas block when you can use your current sight post. All you need to do is grind of the post without getting into channel that the gas tube sits, hit with some high temp paint, and the free-float rail will fit right over it. This is a preferred method since you are using the stock taper pins which will not move instead of set screws that may move if not staked. You can then use a MBUS front sight with no worries of melting.

Corey

11-30-2011, 11:51 PM

Thanks, I will print out your info and see if they want to do it that way.
Here is the rail I will probably end up with.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2481

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/3979a973a828e69b6d2081a6f4a036ac.jpg

danish

12-01-2011, 12:29 AM

Nice!! Centurion's are the best being lightweight, strong, and have an excellent mounting system. You can ditch the Daniel Defense QD mount now that you've got the integrated mounts right in it. I've been running Troy fore ends lately on my builds and have been extremely happy with them. Good luck!!

Corey

12-01-2011, 10:52 AM

Yeah, I read that it has QDs built in, pretty cool.
I am going to see if they want to give me anything for my current quad rail.
I found the package it came in plus the snap on covers.

Thanks, will let you know how it goes.

Corey

12-02-2011, 11:48 PM

ust got back from the shop ago, and the rifle is to sexy to put back in its case :D

Before with the quad picatinny rail they put on and the new upper with the picatinny rail the Delta ring between the two broke up the flow on top.
Here is an older pic with the Delta ring (http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/24.jpg) in the middle directly above the GripPod.

With the new free floating quad rail, there is no need for the Delta ring, it has its own setup.
It looks much more even flowing.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/27.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/28.jpg

The 10" quad rail worked out perfectly.
They had it in a shorter/longer version, but the 10" goes out one inch out past the gas block which is about directly below the front flip up sight.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/29.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/30.jpg

I like how the new quad rail has built in integrated quick disconnect attachment sockets for the sling.

Parts used:

Magpul MBUS Gen2 - Front (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2675)
The Gen 1 like my rear sight are being phased out, the Gen 2 are out now.

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/5ab5d47cce4743a9912f04e0b516fa5d.jpg

Gas Block: Daniel Defense Low Profile Clamp Style - .625 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2768)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/c05272a8e6476045e05f14588ca159d0.jpg

Centurion Arms C4 Rail System - 10.0 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2481)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/3979a973a828e69b6d2081a6f4a036ac.jpg

This completes the build on this rifle.
Well, maybe that Acog down the road still.
I really want to get the S&W AR15-22 MOE next.
Can shoot it at any indoor range, and for pennies since it is a 22 caliber.
I think the jolly fatman in the red suit will be bringing me one for Christmas this year.

Model M&P15-22 MOE Rifle - Magpul® Sights, Stock and Grip (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_773502_-1_757786_757784_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y)

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson2/upload/images/firearms/zoom_lg/811034_01_lg.jpg

danish

12-03-2011, 12:50 AM

Looks great!! Be sure to stake your castle nut..:ylsmoke:

robert

12-03-2011, 04:14 AM

I'm a bad influence. :costumed-smiley-007 Had some goodies waiting on me when I finally got back tonight including two Primary Arms red dots to try out/use on my .22s and some more P-mags (CDNN had the black windowed versions on sale).

hochung

12-03-2011, 04:23 AM

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/29.jpg

30 round magazine? :drool:

Corey

12-03-2011, 12:14 PM

Looks great!! Be sure to stake your castle nut..:ylsmoke:
Is that the new thing that replaced the Delta ring?

I'm a bad influence. :costumed-smiley-007 Had some goodies waiting on me when I finally got back tonight including two Primary Arms red dots to try out/use on my .22s and some more P-mags (CDNN had the black windowed versions on sale).
Yes you are :D
What do you think about this?
Overkill for someone who just takes the AR out once in awhile to the mountains to shoot it?
This is from the local shop I deal with.
Man, its like being a kid in a candy store all over again.
You walk in there and a whole wall is covered with AR15s you can buy right there, or have them custom built for you.
Silencer/suppressors are even legal now to shoot here in WA. state.
They have an AR on the wall with the grenade launcher on it too :D
HSG - Talon Field Kit (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2900)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=q6I4dq3l1HQ

There is a local outdoor police range I am going to be joining before to long.
I can shoot the AR there plus my Glocks too if I want to.
But all the local indoor ranges do not allow an AR15 inside unless you use fragmented ammo which is expensive, hence why I am looking into the S&W 22 version.

30 round magazine? :drool:
Yes, I have around nine of them now, plus a ton of the Colt steel ones in 30 round, but I like the polymer ones better.
The first few were without the window, but most of them I have now are the windowed ones.
They had them on sale for Black Friday for around $13, so I picked up three more.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=865

They even carry the new Surefire 60 and 100 round mags.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2851

They also carry the high capacity drums which are legal here in WA. state.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=91

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/f5b673c375bb55f041ace7225de7b15d.jpg

danish

12-03-2011, 12:47 PM

http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o159/danish1911/DIYstaking-1.jpg

This locks the castle nut in place and keeps it from moving. Proper torque in not enough which I found out during a five day pistol/carbine course and loc-tite is the lazy man's method. The PMAGs are great and Magpul is supposedly going to be releasing a 40 round version soon but they have been saying that since last year. I run a Nordic Components 18 round extension on a PMAG for three gun matches and it has been flawless. The Surefire's are nice but from what I've seen they make a prone position damn near impossible due to length. How are you on ammo??

Corey

12-03-2011, 01:04 PM

Thanks for the explanation on the castle nut.

I do not think I would want anything bigger than the 30 round ones I have now, pretty haqppy with them.
I have around 900 rounds of of the XM193 on hand (http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/2.jpg).
Paid around $400 for 1000 rounds back when I bought the AR from my friend, and I had some from him that I bought off of him too.
Thinking of getting some more soon to have on hand, but not sure wheter to get the same, or try some cheaper .223.

I have a few online sources to get the 5.56 stuff, and there are several local places to buy .223 including the AR shop I deal with.
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop%2Fbrowse&category=ammo
Out of the stuff my local shop carries, what would you recommend?
So many different .223 they carry.

danish

12-03-2011, 04:39 PM

I feed my carbines a steady diet of steel cased Wolf or Tula ammunition since you can get a thousand rounds for under $200. Some people don't like to shoot steel cased (since it does have a copper washed steel jacket) but as long as you have chrome-lined bore and barrel you will have no issues. One issue that may arise are failure to feeds or failure to extract due to the ammunition being weaker than a 5.56 round. I have not had any issues in the thousands of rounds I have shot but suggest you pick-up a couple boxes and give them a try. Just do a Google search and you find all the info you want.
Besides a properly staked castle nut, also check the buffer in the receiver extension. Most people run a H or H2 buffer to help slow down the whole function of the bolt carrier group which leads to a more reliable weapon. Carbines usually have a carbine wight buffer which can be identified easily since there will be no markings on it. An H or H2 are just as easy to identify by a H or H2 stamping on the end facing the carrier.
I don't mean to overload you with info and please let me know if I ramble too much but I have been sick with BRD (black rifle disease) the last couple years and have learned a lot through trial and error and the internet. I only hope to share my info and help out in anyway possible!!

Corey

12-04-2011, 11:04 AM

Thanks Danish for the info.
I can see you have a lot of knowledge on the black rifle.

I am hunting around now for that S&W AR, but they are hard to find.
One local shop/range can order it for me, I am going to read up on it some more.
From what I have read so far in reviews and comments, the S&W AR15-22 is one of the best 22 AR styles out there right now.
I do not have any desire to buy a new upper/conversion kit for my present AR, I want a totally separate rifle.

Ray_G

12-04-2011, 06:29 PM

While I didn't see it in your local ammo link depending on your application Black Hills makes some phenomenal 5.56 ammo. During tours to Iraq and Afghanistan we used the 77gr BHP for our M4s to offset the muzzle velocity compared to the M16A4's. Much better knock down. If you do end up with an ACOG and start shooting at range it could become a factor when you go from ammo to ammo, but on open sights or even something like a Eotech (unaided) I don't think you'd notice.

Bear in mind that's not a $$$ friendly choice for shooting for proficiency; it's what I have in the SHTF rig. The 55gr you have now is good for that, and like you I'm actually looking to build a clone rig in .22 for the majority of the handling and basic marksmanship stuff.

Nice looking rifle.
r-
Ray

Corey

12-04-2011, 07:10 PM

Thanks Ray.
I am still undecided on the Acog.
Even with my discount at the shop, it will be over a grand.
Green horseshoe, and it can be used both in daylight and nighttime.
I may just use the sights, and then spend some money on a good scope to put on that 22 I want.

I may stop at another shop that carries S&W stuff, and have them special order that 22 for me.
Been reading lots of reviews, and many have put thousands of rounds through it with Blazer ammo I think was the brand, and no misfires or jams.
Here is one site with some reviews, but it is not the MOE model, but basically the same.
Some had jammed up, but I read a year back that the MOE model has the better "blue" spring in it which prevents that.
http://www.tactical-life.com/online/products/smith-wessons-mp15-22-rifle/

Phreak480

12-05-2011, 01:13 AM

I'm a fan of the ammo from PMC. I've shot quite a bit of this stuff http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx?item=APMC223FMJ55&name=PMC+.223+55grn+FMJ+20rd+box&groupid=21

and here it is in 62 grain which is the same as the military uses. http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.aspx?item=APMC223SS109&name=PMC+X-TAC+5.56x45+%28.223%29+62grn+SS109+20rd+Box&groupid=21

i've been through nearly a thousand rounds and a buddy has been through just over 500 and we have had 100% success (zero failures) in 5 different AR's and in a mini14.

Ray_G

12-05-2011, 01:15 AM

You can't go wrong with an ACOG; and it basically fulfills the optical rule that one should be willing to spend as much on the optic as the rest of the weapon. I've used ACOGs with a couple different reticle patters-the donut and chevron models and love them. Simply superb. I also liked the reflex and aimpoint style sights as well; but for most shots the Eotech is a fantastic compromise.

The angle I take now is I can build a .22 clone of my RRA M4 and move the existing Eotech over to that, and upgrade to the XPS for the 5.56mm gun. Desire on this end is to have nearly identical functionality between weapons.

thebrassnuckles

12-05-2011, 03:29 AM

Personally i'm not a fan of the ACOG...

well i mean i'd love to have one, by BIL has one, its a great optic, but I very much prefer a no magnification optic, such as a red dot. Parallax free is definitely the way for me.

I have a primary arms red dot on my AK, I have taken it through a tactical carbine course, and put gobs of ammo through it, it still holds its zero. still looks just as good as it did when i bought it.

I just purchased a 1-4x magnification millet DMS scope for my AR, but it is being built as more of a designated marksman type rifle.

the acog does great, but I hate using it in a close quarters type scenario.

robert

12-06-2011, 01:32 AM

Those tools are pretty cool but one thing he forgot to mention is that when you pull your bolt out of your bolt carrier you need to make sure your gas rings are a) still in good shape and b) the gaps aren't lined up (think of them like piston rings). Cleaning the carbon out of the bolt carrier periodically will help your rings last longer but you should still have spares on hand.

Add some twenty round mags to your bag for easier prone shooting. They're also good if you want to keep small lots of specialty type ammo loaded; for example, I keep one twenty rnd loaded with some varmint loads for coyotes. Too expensive for killing cans and paper, but if I'm going to shoot a critter I want a clean kill if possible.

I like ACOGs but they are pricey. For quick shooting I like the Aimpoint Microdots; they're lightweight and very fast to use. You can get scopes now with 0 or 1.5x-4x which work pretty fast too. they give you the benefit of a red dot but can be zoomed in as needed. They aren't as fast as the Aimpoints and EOTechs but they are pretty quick and have the advantage of magnification.

Scott C

12-07-2011, 04:28 PM

Although you could shoot from time to time, I wouldn't personally shoot a lot of 5.56 thru most .223 rifles. Some will be ok but it is not good on some models.

thebrassnuckles

12-07-2011, 05:05 PM

Although you could shoot from time to time, I wouldn't personally shoot a lot of 5.56 thru most .223 rifles. Some will be ok but it is not good on some models.

what I have seen and read, is that the majority of top tier mfg's ar switching to the "wylde chamber" it allows for worry free switching of 223 and 556. personally, i have only fired 223 through my larue stealth upper, but it has a wylde chamber. if i ever saw any in a store i might buy a box, but i justgot setup to load for it, so i'll stick to my 77gr noslers ;)

Corey

12-07-2011, 05:47 PM

Thanks for the info on the optics and the ammo.

Called the shop where I bought my two Glocks and asked when are they going to get in the S&W AR15-22 MOE black edition that I have been wanting, and he said they had them on the wall.
I ask how many do you have, and he asks me how many I want :D
Had to explain that I did not want them to sell out before I got there, and he said to just call the day before to hold one for me.

So it looks like I may be picking it up Friday.
I will want to get some kind of optic for it later for range shooting.
This one will be used primarily for indoor range and up in the mountains to shoot targets.

Watched a vid on how to clean it, and although it has a charging handle and bolt like my Colt AR15, it is way easier to clean, and the bolt is not as hard to take apart like my Colt.

He used a boresnake too, and said it was better than using a rod, patch holder, and a brush like I use on my Colt.
Never used a boresnake before.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVYi12yWd_s

Ray_G

12-09-2011, 01:39 AM

When you go to use the boresnake pull it arms length to stretch it a bit right before you drop it in the chamber; if you don't it will be too wide to have the end come out the barrel.

ALWAYS go the direction of the round.
r-
Ray

Corey

12-09-2011, 08:06 PM

Thanks Ray for the tip.
The boresnake showed up today.

Early Christmas gift http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.yotatech.com/get/images/smilies/xmas1.gif
Picked up the S&W M&P 15-22 today, along with a few accessorizes for it.
The ammo I bought for it was on the recommended list in the manual for the gun which I had printed out that page the other day at work to show the store for an ammo purchase.

This new rifle is cool!
They have had good sales of this unit there, and I talked to a customer in the store who had shot his dad's, and he really likes it too.

This rifle will be used at the local indoor range that is on my way to work, and also to take camping fro plinking.
Now you see why I wanted this for target practice and general plinking.
$500 rounds of 5.56 ammo for my Colt AR15 is around $200 or so.
I paid $400 for 1,000 rounds a few years back when I bought the Colt.

While I was there I asked about optics for it. and recommended the Leupold 63300 Tactical Prismatic 1x14 Riflescope. (http://www.botachtactical.com/leupold1.html)
It does have a red recticle in it, but unlike the Red Dot brand, the recticle is still there but in black if you turn the battery off.

The one the sales guy showed me had the flip up dust covers on it too, I do not know if it comes with them or not.
They wanted around $475 for it, I am going to shop around online for the best price.
Anyone familiar with this Leupold, and do you recommend it for general target practice?

I have twelve days off during the Christmas Boeing break, so I will get a chance to run some rounds through this cool new addition to my armory :D

Here are a few pics:

Unboxing :D
With everything but the boresnake out.
Forgot to open up the box from UPS.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/1.jpg

Side shot
I had my Grip-Pod on the Colt AR15 all the way forward, but it was kind of tippy with a 30 round magazine, and the AR22 is the same way with its 25 round magazine.
So I moved both the Grip-Pods back some so they will not tip over, and I think I like the grip closer to me.
The adjustable stocks though, I find it is more comfortable having them in their farthest out position.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/2.jpg

A pair of ARs
Hard to tell them apart almost.
The 5.56 one is the one with the sling on it.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/3.jpg

Side view of both ARs

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/4.jpg

Links:
The store I buy from does not have a website, so here are some online links to the gear.

Model M&P15-22 MOE Rifle
Magpul® Sights, Stock and Grip (The store I went to have 'em for $499.99) (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_773502_-1_757786_757784_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y)

Smith & Wesson Magazine S&W M&P 15-22 22 Long Rifle
25-Round Polymer Black (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/593377/smith-and-wesson-magazine-s-and-w-m-and-p-15-22-22-long-rifle-25-round-polymer-black)

US Peacekeeper Assault Case
Model P20040 (40") (http://uspeacekeeper.com/Products/Cases-Rugs/Assault_Cases/assault_cases.html)

500rds - 22LR Federal American Eagle 40gr. HV Solid Point Ammo
[AE5022] (I paid $19.99 for 500, just a tad more than this online place.) (http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/product_info.php/pName/500rds-22lr-federal-american-eagle-40gr-hv-solid-point-ammo/cName/22-long-rifle-ammo-solid-point)
Still, 500 rounds less than what I paid for each of the extra magazines.
I did not realize .22 ammo was so cheap.

Grip-Pod
GPSLE Law Enforcement Model (http://www.grippod.com/gpsle.html)

Hoppe's Boresnake Viper Rifle Bore Cleaner .22 & 5.56 (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003ITBKRC/ref=pe_175190_21431760_cs_sce_dp_1)

Daniel Defense Rail Mount QD Swivel Attachment (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=412)
Already had this left over from my non floating quad Picatinny rail on the AR15, as it is not needed on my new free floating rail on the Colt I had installed last week.
The Magpul MOE stock on the S&W does not have a built in QD like my CRT stock does on the Colt, but there is a QD sling mount on the S&W just below the charging handle.

robert

12-09-2011, 10:29 PM

FWIW, I'm running a Primary Arms red dot on my .22 upper.

https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Micro_Dot_With_Removable_Base_AD_p/md06adt1-10bundle.htm

I've got one of their M3 style red dots on a 5.56. upper.
https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_s/586.htm

Both have been getting very good reviews for what they are with folks actually running them for classes and in competition (not sure I'd go that far myself but I just got mine). They aren't Aimpoints and no one would claim they are built as well as an Aimpoint, but they are a reasonably priced optic for general plinking. I just couldn't see putting high dollar optics on a non target/hunting .22; even my heavy barreled target 10/22 is only wearing a Mueller (highly recommended on various 10/22 and .22 forums and I've been very happy with it so far).

Incidentally, I picked up some of the Magpul Ranger P-mag floor plates today to try out. I've got some of the older band style on some GI mags and they work well so I'll probably like these too.

danish

12-10-2011, 01:33 AM

Stay away from the prismatic and just get either an Aimpoint Micro or EoTech XPS. I run Micro's on my two carbines and three-gun rifle for short distance stages (less than 75 yards). I used to have an EoTech 512 (AA batteries) and liked the reticle but you had to be careful that lithium batteries were all you used since there had been some battery leakage from alkalines if left stored for a long duration. The XPS's are a lot better design and using the CR123 battery with a different mounting position have alleviated a lot of issues. The Micro is simple, robust, and 50,000 hour battery life making it the hands down sexiest optic out there. If after shooting a 1x optic for a while and you think you need some magnification you can get a magnifier from Vortex or Primary Arms. If I had a 22 AR the Primary Arms red dot would be what I would put on mine, very good reviews and excellent price point. Now go get a second job to start paying for more rifles and ammo!!

Corey

12-10-2011, 11:14 PM

No need for a second job, mine pays very well ;)
Speaking of Vortex...

Gosh, this is an expensive hobby :D
I just got back from the custom AR15 shop by me that has customized my Colt AR15.

I now have around $1.1K invested in this new 22 version I picked up yesterday.
Bought four more of the S&W 25 round magazines online today, and I just picked up the exact same sling that I have on the bigger AR.

Asked about optics while I was there, and the owner showed me one that is out of China, but it is not cheaply made like some of the Ebay ones from China.
The Tacoma Police Department and other have been testing this unit and have put it through a lot of abuse and they have found no faults with it.

It has both red and green dots, pretty cool, and adjustable brightness.
The dot disappears though when the unit is turned off, but I really did not want to spend the $500 for the Leupold one I looked at yesterday that works both with power on and off.

Might hit the indoor range tomorrow, or next weekend to try out this new 22.

Just got the optic mounted and I like it!
The green and red dot are very easy to see, and I will most likely run them at full brightness.
Also with the included ring mount that is meant for flat top ARs like both of mine are with the Picatinny rails, you can flip up the Magpul sights and use them along with this scope, it was designed to be at the correct height, as this is an AR15 scope.

I also think I really do not need the ACOG for the AR15, as I can use this optic on it too.
It also came with a 2X magnifier that screws onto the rear of the scope, but have not tired out out yet.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/5.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/6.jpg

Green dot

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/7.jpg

Red dot

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/8.jpg

Links:
SKT Industries Adjustable QD Sling - 2 Point (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2228)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/f548a9e97ba662a67dadc0f72ae1b025.jpg

Vortex StrikeFire Red/Green Dot Scope (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2142)

http://www.rainierarms.com/img/shop/product/3a45bc265da54fa025e2053668cb3974.jpg

Corey

12-13-2011, 10:18 AM

On that Strikefire optic I bought for $150, if anyone is interested in learning more about it, the Tube is full of videos on it (http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=vortex+strikefire+red+green+d ot&oq=Vortex+StrikeFire&aq=4&aqi=g10&aql=&gs_sm=c&gs_upl=21410l21410l0l30322l1l1l0l0l0l0l207l207l2-1l1l0),
Here is one where the guy goes in depth on it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxX1_CuFJgM

Video from Vortex on their scope.

http://www.vortexoptics.com/content/strikefire_red_dot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxG5QezB1R4

Corey

12-16-2011, 10:51 AM

If anyone is thinking about getting one of these M&P 15-22 rifles, here is a 40 minute review.
This guy goes in depth on it.
Lots of comments and feedback on the page there too.

S&W 15-22: "Sheep in Wolf's Clothing" by Nutnfancy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiPgTlKYikM)

Corey

12-23-2011, 06:26 PM

After reading over on S&W's 15-22 sub forum, I decided to order up two of the Hogue rubber grips with internal storage from Amazon.
The stock grip on both my Colt AR15 and the new S&W are not the most comfortable, and the Hogue has finger grooves in it, and makes a big difference in comfort quality.

Still need to install the one on my AR15, but I am in no hurry since I will be spending time shooting the 22 much more.

Also picked up 5000rds - 22LR Federal American Eagle 40gr. from Ammunition To Go.com, but it seems they are out of stock on it now.
Got it for $144.95, pretty good deal online.

Here is a picture of the new grip with the stock one off to the side.
You can see how much nicer the new one is.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/9.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/hogue_federal.jpg

Links:
Hogue Rubber Grip Ar-15/M-16 Rubber Grip Black with Storage Kit (http://www.amazon.com/Hogue-Rubber-Ar-15-Black-Storage/dp/B002IY24GY/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1324667283&sr=8-2)

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31snkVv4BtL._SS500_.jpg

thebrassnuckles

12-23-2011, 08:50 PM

you got rid of your magpul grips?

I love mine. I want one to put on my AK

also, I have one of the primary arms micro red dots, I run it on my AK. I have used it in a couple of classes and general shooting. it has held up wonderfully. zero is still dead on (yes on an AK, mine is extremely accurate, just lucky I guess) Its mounted on an Ultimak rail where the gas tube is, no problems with over heating either.

Corey

12-24-2011, 01:18 PM

I never had Magpul grips on either rifle.
The new 22 AR had a cheap feeling hard plastic one, and the big AR has the original one from when the rifle was new.

These new Rogue grips feel much better.

Some of the guy's over at the S&W forum are running the Primary Arms red dot on their 22s and like them.

thebrassnuckles

12-25-2011, 04:16 PM

The grip you replaced on the .22 is the magpul MOE grip. I love those grips, but I hate frills with finger grooves. They are never in the right place.

I never had Magpul grips on either rifle.
The new 22 AR had a cheap feeling hard plastic one, and the big AR has the original one from when the rifle was new.

These new Rogue grips feel much better.

Some of the guy's over at the S&W forum are running the Primary Arms red dot on their 22s and like them.

Corey

12-26-2011, 01:58 PM

I guess it does say here for my model it was a Magpul.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_773502_-1_757786_757784_757784_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

I like Magpul products, but I did not care for that grip at all.
The Hogue feels so much nicer, and the grooves are aligned perfectly for my hands/fingers.

Corey

01-06-2012, 08:14 PM

I just saw this item posted on the 15-22 sub forum over at S&W.
It will slap onto my 15-22 with a trigger change.
Watch the stock in slow motion, never seen anything like this before.

I bet the ATF will be all over it, as it almost makes a rifle like mine and other makes appear to be fully automatic.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F8Z5ooMZpY&feature=player_embedded

5.56 or .223 here, and much louder than the 22 above.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0B7tzaYgp5g&NR=1

Captain K-man

01-06-2012, 11:30 PM

From what I understand that's legal in BATF's eyes. That's been on the market for a while now.

Corey

01-21-2012, 06:43 PM

Been hanging out on the S&W M&P 15-22 sub forum as of late since I picked up the new 22.
A lot over there customize their rifles with a barrel shroud which takes the place of the flash hider.

A barrel shroud is not to be confused with a fake silencer.
Fake cans are for adult entertainment stars.

One guy who makes these barrel shrouds is a member over at that forum by the name of Tacticool22.
He makes a short and long version, and I opted for the longer one as it looks less like a silencer that way with it going part way into the quad rail opening.
These are also made in the state of Oregon.
I like to support fairly local companies here in the Pacific Northwest as much as I can too.
Also the new case and my SKT slings are local too.

I also want to state that in no way does a barrel shroud make the gun less noisy.
If it did, the ATF would be all over barrel shrouds as in trying to compete with a silencer.
It is legal now to shoot with a real silencer in my state, and I may pick one up in the future for my 5.56 AR15.
I would draw a lot less attention when I am shooting it in the mountains.

I went down today to my shop where I had my Colt AR15 transformed extensively for them to take off my stock flash hider.
You take it off with a 3/4 open end wrench which I have at home, but I could not get enough torque, and I did not want to wreck the barrel.
It is best to use a vice and a set of barrel jaws which Tacticool22 also sells on his site.

While I was down there I told one of the guy's that the new case I bought at another store did not fit my new 22 very well once I had the optic on top of it.
Also my Blackhawk Homeland Security Discreet case I had bought back in 2007 for my AR15 has a hard time too with the optic on the 22.

It was time to step up to something a little more modern, and they had a case that is made local that was up to the task.
It also can carry both of my ARs, and it is made so you can leave the optics and the Grip Pods on, and still have plenty of room.

Lots of pockets for mags, but I prefer to carry my mags in a range case along with additional ammo, hearing protection, ect...

The new case is very nice, and also has lots of Velcro straps and elastic to go over the barrel end.
Also the new case is a little shorter than the Blackhawk, you just collapse the Magpul stocks to fit the rifles in.
I like the shorter profile better.

On with a few pics.

New case, and it also has an ID window on it

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/10.jpg

15-22 on top, the big boy on the bottom

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/11.jpg

Closeup comparison with 15-22 on top, big boy on the bottom showing the difference between a barrel shroud, and a flash hider

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/12.jpg

The business end of the barrel shroud, and it is threaded

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/13.jpg

The whole collection for now

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar15/all_guns.jpg

Links:

Tacticool22's site (http://www.tacticool22.com/shop/index.php)

Smith & Wesson MP15-22 Long Barrel Shroud (http://www.tacticool22.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=8)

Tactical Tailor - Covert Carry Case - 36 (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2549)

cnynrat

01-21-2012, 06:55 PM

Here is THE classic definition of a barrel shroud:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rGpykAX1fo

Rep. Carolyn McCarthy of NY BTW.

Corey

01-21-2012, 07:05 PM

She also calls magazines clips :D

cnynrat

01-21-2012, 07:10 PM

Yup. She is a running joke on Calguns, particularly the "shoulder thing that goes up" line.

Corey

01-29-2012, 02:45 PM

FWIW, I'm running a Primary Arms red dot on my .22 upper.

I took the plunge and went for a PA microdot, I got this one with co witness mounts.
MD-07 Primary Arms Micro Dot With Fixed Base
[AR15 Mount Options:Leapers UTG Medium Profile 3-Slot-Abs CoWitness Picatinny Style Riser]
(https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Micro_Dot_With_Fixed_Base_p/md-07.htm)

They have diffeent configurations for their micro dot, but the guy I spoke with said the one I gor for my 15-22 along with the UTG mount would be the correct one.
My Vortex is pretty nice, but I wanted to try something on the smaller side too.
Also the green dot that it is capable of doing along with the red dot (Vortex unit) I can not see the green dot at the indoor range I use.
The red dot is far superior in low light conditions.
I also picked up a cheap green laser that has fairly good reviews, as I saw it on another 15-22 over at the S&W site I am on.
Instapark® GLS-3 Pistol / Rifle Compact Mounted Green Laser Sight (http://www.amazon.com/Instapark%C2%AE-GLS-3-Compact-Mounted-Picatinny/dp/B005LYUQ5E)

Both are still one order, and they will arrive this week.

[QUOTE=danish;1003582]Stay away from the prismatic and just get either an Aimpoint Micro or EoTech XPS./QUOTE]
I could not justify spending $500 to $600 for an optic for my 22.
Now my main AR 15, yes.
I may put the Aimpoint on it later.

Ray_G

01-30-2012, 09:00 PM

I'm pretty happy with my PA micro dot that I have on my AK. I bought it with the base that mounts in place of the rear sights but decided to go with an ultimak/scout setup. Def a decent optic for the price.

In the midst of swapping things around akin to you, I ended up with a Chippa .22 upper that I'm going to semi-clone to my RRA; the rationalization for this included purchasing an XPS-2 & Larue QD riser for the 5.56mm gun and then old 551 that I'd had on there for awhile will go on a fleabay QD riser on the .22. Further rationalization allowed me to get a MI gen2 rail to replace the YHM rail that will slide over to the .22 upper...now all I gotta do is rationalize a clone M900A on the .22 to match my surefire on the 5.56 gun. Pics to follow as all this stuff shows up from the men in brown suits with brown trucks.

Gotta love tax returns when you spent 1/2 of 2011 not in the US.

Metcalf

01-30-2012, 09:56 PM

I've been running the Primary Arms red dot on my primary AR for just over a year now. I have had to change the battery once....

Overall, for the money, I could not be happier! I got the removable base version with the PA house brand mount with the quick detach lever. Overall it works GREAT! I run Magpul Gen 2 back up sights and have no issues with the combo. The sights folded down are not in the optic at all, and with the sights up I get a lower 1/3 co-witness.

The 3 moa dot works well for me. I have a very slight astigmatism so the dot flares slightly with my eyes. The smaller 3 moa dot keeps the overall dot size manageable....

I keep two spare batteries for the red dot in the grip compartment along with some other things....

Corey

02-04-2012, 01:10 AM

Glad you guy's dig the PA Micro Dot.
Which number do you usually use for the brightness setting?

Mine came today from the man in brown, and I mounted it up today.
The mount they sent me is pretty nice, but it does not have a quick release lever, just one spring tensioned knob to turn to tighten the base to the rifles Picatinny rail which works out great.

The laser I ordered is pretty nice for $50.
I would say the dot is on par with my $460 Surefire X400 which also has a 170 lumen flashlight.
The green laser is HUGE though.
I did take off the Picatinny rail that was on the bottom of the laser, as I do not plan on mounting anything to the bottom of the laser.
That lightened it up a tad.
I am also not using the optional tape switch with it that replaces the tail cap, I am just using the switch on the side.
I really do not need a cord hanging off the side of the rifle.

Compare my Vortex Strikefire to the Primary Arms Micro Dot, it is honkin' big.
I really like the smaller size of the PA one.

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/14.jpg

http://www.pnw4runners.com/ar22/15.jpg

Also got four more of the S&W 15-22 25 round magazines, as they were on sale at Midway for around $15.
I now have a total of twelve of them.

Going shooting tomorrow when the indoor range opens up.
Will also be taking my Glock 36 (45 ACP) along to shoot.

Primary Arms Micro Dot with fixed base (https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Micro_Dot_With_Fixed_Base_p/md-07.htm)

Leapers UTG Medium Profile 3-Slot Compact Picatinny-Style Riser Mount AR-15 Flattop (https://www.primaryarms.com/Leapers_UTG_Mediu_Profile_3_Slot_Compact_Picatinny _p/mnt-rs08s3.htm)

Instapark® GLS-3 Pistol / Rifle Compact Mounted Green Laser Sight with Picatinny Rail (http://www.amazon.com/Instapark%C2%AE-GLS-3-Compact-Mounted-Picatinny/dp/B005LYUQ5E?tag=5336653594-20)

Ray_G

02-04-2012, 03:01 PM

Very nice!
I usually find my PA dot to be in the middle range of settings most of the time, haven't shot it enough to really find the sweet spot for indoors/outdoors.

Finally got most of the components of my RRA settled-waiting on the magnifier and the determination whether to go with a short base that mounts on the Larue Riser or their flip to the side that mounts just behind it. The .22 clone components are starting to trickle in but she's not ready for prime time yet.
Here's my 5.56 setup:
84813

timmy!!!!!!!

02-15-2012, 02:53 PM

Ray how do you like your LMT stock? I am building up my spikes lower pretty similar to yours except I am thinking of putting a rifle length upper on it.

Ray_G

02-16-2012, 01:02 AM

Timmy-
Your build thread on Dweb seems like you're heading in a good direction (I'm 1920SF over there...currently enraging Newsome and such). The stock is actually
Choate copy of the LMT SOPMOD. I've been very happy with it. (http://www.riflestock.com/catalog_page_detail.cfm?recordno=2&Product_CatalogID=2937&ProductNumber=16-01-06&ProductCode=1&ProductSubCodeID=265&NewProduct=0)

When I got it I didn't want to drop the coin on an LMT...saw one at the gunshow last weekend that was $150 and am considering getting one to put on the 5.56 build, and move the choate over to the .22 clone. I'm also considering the new Magpul STR (http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG470/171) to perhaps cut some weight off it. Not that I know why I'm doing so...it's heavy as sin with the M900 on the front end.

You doing full length upper or the 18"?
r-
Ray

timmy!!!!!!!

02-16-2012, 01:38 PM

If I can find an 18inch upper w/ rifle length gas system then that route but if not I will get a 20in. upper.

Corey

02-16-2012, 02:14 PM

I am a gonna go shooting this Saturday with a Boeing police officer so he can try out my 15-22, as he is thinking of getting something you can shoot all day for low cost.
Then the following Saturday a woman from work is going to go shooting with me.
She has never shot a gun before, so I am going to have to go over some safety stuff with her first.

stolenheron

02-16-2012, 04:56 PM

Corey, how did you like the vortex? what batteries did it take?

My buddy has the bushnell compact red dot which is VERY similar in size and price to the Primary arms. He has had it on his AR and AKs and loves it.
The vortex that you have was recommended to me by a former special forces buddy and fellow rover owner with regards to being good bang for your buck.

I have a front sight post on my flat top setup. I need to choose my optics/mounts accordingly to the cowitness. I'd like to have it absolute cowitness.

Corey

02-16-2012, 05:47 PM

I thought the Vortex was to big for the 22, even though it is the same size as a real AR15.
I forget the battery, but it looks like a CR123, but it is something different.

I was going to get the smaller Vortex Sparc, but the PA Micro was half the price, and it is a clone of the Aimpoint Micro T1, and it gets high praises.
I will see how I like the PA this weekend, and if I like it, I may get one for my main AR15.

I was all gungho on getting a nice ACOG for it, but heck, I am not going into battle with it :D , so I can not justify the high price of it for either rifle, when all I am doing with both is plinking.

stolenheron

02-16-2012, 05:56 PM

I just looked it up, it is a C5 or soemthing like that. very similar in size to the 123 and will fit in my ACS stock.

I've read great reviews on the Vortex strike-fire. from what i've read they hold zero well, can take a beating, and are fairly accurate at various distances. Now the only issues i've heard are that the dot can get washed out in bright conditions and as you've mentioned, the size. I don't mind the size issue, I am curious to take a look at one with the 2x screw on magnifier installed. It seems like the sight would fit my purposes more than the little micro dots like PA or Sparc.

on another note, I just ditched a Konus reflex red dot sight on a trade last week for a little .410/22 combo gun. The guy i sold it to absolutely loves it, took very little adjustment, etc etc. It seemed to be well made, the company was awesome to work with when I had warranty issues, but the damn thing just wasnt what I wanted for my AR at all.

I'm new to the whole "red dot" scope field. All of my optics in the past have been hunting style optics of various makes, models, and powers on typical hunting guns, not red dots with no magnification on CQB weapons.

so the more reviews I read from the web, from this site, and test runs I can make in person on other people's guns the better off I will be when I make the decision to go from irons to optics.

Ray_G

02-16-2012, 09:39 PM

so the more reviews I read from the web, from this site, and test runs I can make in person on other people's guns the better off I will be when I make the decision to go from irons to optics.

Def the way to go; I've been 'fortunate' I guess to have used a variety of things at work-reflex, aimpoint, ACOG(s) and EoTech. For the home/personal application that's why I went with the EoTech...for normal 'work' (i.e. Afghanistan, Iraq, or some other sandbox to be named later) I do love the ACOG RCO...robust, reliable, decent magnification. I just can't stomach spending that much $$$ on a personal gun that does most of its engagements at 25m and in.

Loving the PA Micro though, prob going to order another one for my new MP5 .22.
r-
Ray

Corey

02-17-2012, 08:23 PM

I was just over on the S&W 15-22 site, and I saw a good video of the Primary Arms Micro Dot like I have.
His is a gen 3, mine is a gen 7 if the part number jives.
https://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_Micro_Dot_With_Fixed_Base_p/md-07.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMosefuud0I

Cannot wait to test mine out tomorrow.
Also the indoor range I am going to now opens up at 9 am instead of 10 am.
I am digging that, as I am an early bird/morning person.

Showed a picture of my 22 to that woman at work along with some safety tips yesterday, she is all excited about shooting it.
May have to rent a small pistol for her too, as I am not sure if she should shoot my Glock 36 or not since she has never shot anything before.

Speaking of pistols, I sure wish S&W still made the M&P 15-22P which is the pistol version of my rifle.
Magazines are interchangeable, and it too would be cheaper to shoot than my two Glocks.
I may look into a Glock 22 LR if they make one, unless I can score one of these 15-22 pistols.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_766315_-1_757996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore/SmWesson2/upload/images/firearms/zoom_lg/813000_01_lg.jpg