UHF / GMRS monitoring with a dual band rig

[BogusBlake]

So I'm thinking about picking up a dual band mobile rig. A few I've looked at have a frequency range that goes up to 520MHz. GMRS and FRS frequencies (~462 and 467 MHz) are in this band. If I dial in the frequency of a GMRS or FRS channel, can I monitor and transmit to folks with FRS/GMRS walkie-talkies?


Second question: I'm considering the Yaesu FT7800 and 8800. I don't really care about cross band repeat capability, but simultaneous monitoring of two bands seems like it would be useful. Do you guys find that to be something you use often?

[1leglance]

I have the yaesu VX6R and with a little soldering it can be euro spec'd which will allow you transmit on those FMS freq..it will monitor from the factory.
I am also looking at a new radio for the FJC and the 8800 is my choice right now...I will use the crossband repeat when hiking if needed but I really like the dual radios in 1 setup to I can listen in on repeaters while on simplex on a run.
Let us know what you go with and post pics on the install with a useage report.
enjoy
1leglance

[HenryJ]

I scan with my 8800 all the time. I work for a quasi-government entity and also emergency services.
The radio works well with all that I need. Having dual band dual receive is a must.
The controls are tiny on the 8800, but it you have a place to steady your hand it works great. They are not lit, so memorizing them for night time becomes needed. Not a bad idea to be able to operate blind folded anyway. Not while driving , of course ;)
I also pack a VX7R. I do monitor FRS/GMRS with both. The VX7R is can be opened with software. The 8800 with a soldering iron and 10 second removal of one piece.
Neither radio is legal for TX in FRS/GMRS. Neither would do a good job in those either.
I pack a small FRS/GMRS radio when I need that capability. They don't take up much room and a redundant communication source is not a bad idea.
Personally once you have used 2m there is really no need for shorter range communications. 2m can do it all and better. I have friends who do not have 2m. I will use the small FRS/GMRS when they are along. I have one of the RadioShack mobile units in the truck all the time for monitoring.

[gary in ohio]

.........GMRS and FRS frequencies (~462 and 467 MHz) are in this band. If I dial in the frequency of a GMRS or FRS channel, can I monitor and transmit to folks with FRS/GMRS walkie-talkies?
Yes you can monitor but it would not be legal to transmit



Second question: I'm considering the Yaesu FT7800 and 8800. I don't really care about cross band repeat capability, but simultaneous monitoring of two bands seems like it would be useful. Do you guys find that to be something you use often?
I monitor multi bands with multi radio in my primary vehicle, but having the two independent receviers the 8800 have could be nice. Put one on your local repeater and scan other freq with the other.

[BogusBlake]

I have a VX7R and a FT-7800R and both will receive GMRS and FRS frequencies, but neither will transmit on those frequencies from the factory. No ham radio sold legally in the USA will transmit on FRS/GMRS out of the box.

That's what I wanted to know. Thanks!




There are threads about cross band repeating and wide band TX mods here. You might search and see if you can find them.

Did that. That's why I pretty much decided I don't need cross band repeat.




I think of the 3 the 7800 is the most obviously designed for moving vehicle use (particularly at night, it's the only one with lighted buttons).

That's a big deal. I think lighted buttons clinches it.



I pack a small FRS/GMRS radio when I need that capability. They don't take up much room and a redundant communication source is not a bad idea.
I have friends who do not have 2m. I will use the small FRS/GMRS when they are along.

My thoughts exactly.


OK, on the dual receive- can I set up a scan mode to only switch between two frequencies? For example, my group's simplex frequency and a local repeater. It seems like the scan would alternate between the two pretty fast and act like dual receive. (I'm a total noob at this stuff and I don't have a radio yet, so that's probably a dumba$$ question.)

[BogusBlake]

You can also watch two memories with this thing called Dual Watch. I do that often to monitor 146.520 and whatever simplex we're using or a repeater. This ping-pongs between the two memories until one gets a transmission, then it'll stop. I guess what I'm saying is even though the 7800 doesn't have two independent receivers, it has quite a bit of flexibility on it's one.

Perfect. Thanks for all the help! One more question- can I set up that dual watch for two frequencies that aren't in the same band (2m simplex and 70cm repeater)? When using that feature, do you designate which frequency will be active if you transmit? (Sounds like I need to just sack up, buy the radio, and read the manual!)

[1leglance]

wow excellent discussion!
I was really set on the 8800 but now I am really leaning toward the 7800:
cheaper..
backlit buttons...
easier to read/use buttons..
will do everything I thought I needed in the 8800..I didn't really need 2 tx/rx radios just the ability to monitor 2 freq and switch between...
Thanks for saving me some serious cash...
now before I buy tomorrow or Tues anyone had the 7800 and switched to the 8800 for reasons we should know about?
thanks again
1leglance

[edgear]

wow excellent discussion!
I was really set on the 8800 but now I am really leaning toward the 7800:
cheaper..
backlit buttons...
easier to read/use buttons..
will do everything I thought I needed in the 8800..
I was kinda thinking the same thing before reading this thread. From reading the Yaesu website, it looked like only the 8800 had the remote-head mounting capability, along with much more features. But with the backlit buttons, I think the 7800 seems like a better option (and it's more affordable!). I haven't found a place in Flagstaff that sells these radios, and I'm not sure if I want to drive all the way to Phoenix to look at one. I might just be brave & order it online.

[1leglance]

I was just on yaesu's website and confirmed that the 7800R has remote mountable head unit...that is why I was still considering it and I am 99% sure that will be my purchase...
I wish they threw in the kit for free like on the 8800 but even with the extra $60 the price is still less than the 8800.
enjoy
1leglance

[gary in ohio]

I
I wish they threw in the kit for free like on the 8800 but even with the extra $60 the price is still less than the 8800.
enjoy
1leglance
The free kits is only good till the end of the month.

[cruiser guy]

Sounds like I need to just sack up, buy the radio, and read the manual!

That, and get licenced.

[gary in ohio]

I probably wouldn't pay for the kit. You can achieve the same thing with a 6-wire phone cord, a couple of connectors and a crimp tool.

While you may have a working head, you may also find your may also have a big problem with RF in the control module. The factory kit is more than a 6 wire phone cable and plug. You have a ground and shield. If your only going a couple of feet your most likley ok, but after that RF into the cable is only a matter of time.

[gary in ohio]

As noted you cant use your UHF ham radio on GMRS but you can use your UHF GMRS radio on the ham bands. A commerical UHF radio can be used on GMRS (if type accepted for GMRS) and on the ham bands. Kenwood as a number of commerial radio that will do double duty, as do vertex (yaesu) and icom.
NO real dual band commercials but you can go to dual RF decks and get a dual band like system.

[BogusBlake]

That, and get licenced.


I don't need a license to buy and read! :ylsmoke:




(but I am taking the test on 8/2)

[craig]

I have a dual band radio and I find myself using the sub-band all the time.

Main band: Set to whatever frequency I'm talking on (repeater, simplex, etc)
Sub-band: One of...
APRS or other packet radio activity
NOAH weather radio
FRS monitor - Better speaker than handheld FRS
Local repeater - Have radio set to a local repeater to communicate with trucks out of our groups immediate range
Second frequency: Switch to sub-band for communications off the primary group frequency. E.g a winch operator (on a handheld), or a smaller group of vehicles scouting apart from the main group.

Once you have the sub-band you'll wonder how you ever got along without it, and it is much less ham-sexy than sticking 2 radios and 2 antennas in your truck.

[cyclic]

I have a Kenwood TH-D7 handheld. I use it for portable and as a base station using an external outside antenna. I am constantly using the dual RX. I normally run the local repeater on main and the local simplex on secondary. Switching between the two is a one button operation. I also monitor the GMRS freq's when the 2m band is quiet.

Biggest suggestion I have is to make sure you get a computer cable and software to go with your radio. Hand programming these new radios is a pain. I can set up my complete preprogramed channel selection on the comp then simply transfer it.

Another radio that might meet your needs is the new Yaesu FTM-10R.
Wicked little rig, multi use, decent power. Check it out.

[cyclic]

There are a lot of mic options for that radio, including BlueTooth!!!!

[BogusBlake]

Yeah, I like the 7800 because the lighting matches the rest of my interior lighting in the Taco.

[frgtwn]

From the Yaesu website:



AF Dual Monitor Function: Listen to your favorite AM or FM stereo broadcast station, and monitor an amateur band at the same time. Note: AF Dual Monitor Function does NOT permit monitoring two different amateur bands at the same time. **External audio input is also available to connect your iPod!**

(End of Quote)

This radio is packed with features, but it does take some time to sort it all out. Before purchase. Then, of course, the real fun begins.

Me? Just looking. Looks like a great option for a motorcycle or open top as the removable part is waterproof.

[Accrete]

I have two ADI handhelds that are dual band. Out of the box they are great scanners all the way up through police, air traffic etc. With a simple software (key pad sequence) they will open up the bands to also transmit on the GMRS/FRS bands. A friend of mind did this with his ADI and i can state that at least for that particular radio, the FRS was fine in receive mode, but he was unable to transmit more than about a quarter mile or so. I'm no radio expert but it seemed to me that the rig was just not sensitive enough to be used as a transceiver in the GMRS/FRS bands.

: ) Thom

[HenryJ]

... (Sounds like I need to just sack up, buy the radio, and read the manual!)
How about downloading the manual and doing some reading? - http://www.yaesu.com/

Go to the owners corner link at the top and register. Once registered you can add equipment to your "add products" that will give you access to the brochures and owners manuals. A handy reference to have in .PDF
I probably wouldn't pay for the kit. ... I think it's also possible to use a stock 6-wire phone cord and a butt-connector to the short little piece that comes with the radio.It is possible and works great.

While you may have a working head, you may also find your may also have a big problem with RF in the control module. The factory kit is more than a 6 wire phone cable and plug. You have a ground and shield. If your only going a couple of feet your most likley ok, but after that RF into the cable is only a matter of time.Mine has been working just fine. I installed it Feb, of 2005. I think if any problems were to arise I would have seen them by now. Mine is plenty long mounted in a crew cab. I think I used a 12' long cable.
The short crossover cable that comes with the radio for connection to the head unit, does not appear to be shielded in any way. I have not personally seen the extension that is sold so I can not attest to differences.
I do know more than one that has used six conductor cable and crimped an end. More than that have done as I have and used a phone cable with a line connector to the short factory crossover cable. I would not worry about RF interference in the connection from the head to the transceiver.

http://www.s-10crewcab.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10006/radio.jpg

Here is the thread on my install: S-10CREWCAB.COM Forum- Ham Radio Install (http://www.s-10crewcab.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2695)

Having the head mounted on the console has been great.

http://www.s-10crewcab.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10006/console3.jpg

I don't miss the buttons lack of back lighting at all. I rest my arm on the armrest and can operate the buttons by feel.

[BogusBlake]

How about downloading the manual and doing some reading? - http://www.yaesu.com/



Or, I could buy the radio and read the manual that came with it:sombrero:
(which I did)

The dual watch feature will give me the function I need.

Here's my install (a few posts down): http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3489&page=5

[HenryJ]

Here's my install (a few posts down): http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3489&page=5Looks nice :)

[FJ-Ollie]

Sorry I got to this so late... this is a great discusiion. I'm going to chime in. I currently own three radios.

1. Yaesu VX-7R HT Tri-Bander (my first purchase)

2. Yaesu VX-170 HT 2M Only

3. Yaesu FT-8800R Mobile (my latest purchase)

The 7800R is an awsome radio. I had it until about two weeks ago. I sold it to my friend and bought the 8800R to replace it. With the 8800 ou can use one frequency and monitor another frequency at the same time and it has volume and squelch control for each individual band. This gives you the ability to monitor two frequencies simultaneously. Priority scan on the 7800 allowed you to do this but not nearly at the same level. Priority scan will scan the priority frequecy every 5 seconds. Not continuously. If someone is heiling you it generally takes less than 5 seconds so they could be missing you on the scan.

SCENARIO:
-During a fest event.
-Four trail runs/groups on one day in different places.
-Each different run/group has their one dedicated simplex frequency their communicating on within the group.
-Before we start the day we plan on one repeater to monitor for group to group communication.

Now, since you have the ability to transmit on one freq and monitor on another, you can be talking simplex within your group and still hear me heil you on the repeater in case of an assistance call or emergency without worrying about me missing or not hearing your heil. GOOD STUFF!!!

As far as the lit buttons go, 90% of what you do on the face plate can be done on the handset on which the lighting can be turned off and on with the flick of your finger. The things that REQUIRE you to use the faceplate buttons shouldn't be done while you're driving anyway. Indiviual volume and squelch nobs for each frequency is handy for quick reach and adjust situations.

As far as mocking up your faceplate relocation cable goes, it is possible to make the wire but the kit comes with the faceplate mounting bracket and hardware. Additionally, it comes with a heavy duty external speaker extention cord about the same length as the faceplate cord.

No matter which radio you go with of these two, you won't be disappointed.:)

[FJ-Ollie]

Seems most hails I hear are done phonetically, never really thought about it until now. But "kilo-delta-zero-alpha-alpha-alpha calling kilo-charlie-zero-bravo-bravo-bravo" said twice is about 4 or 5 seconds if I say it rapidly but what I think is distinctly. Just an observation.

Not a bad observation either... and that is the correct way to hail but 95% of the conversations/hails I hear when I'm monitoring are not done that way anymore. Most of the time people just say the letters and numbers and only voice it "phonetically" when asked to repeat the callsign because it didn't come across clearly.