Nutrition 101?

[dieselcruiserhead]

Wondering if there are any people on here who know their nutrition and/or sports nutrition very well. Carrie and I are both fairly healthy but Carrie tore her ACL last night on a mountain bike and the doctor was going over photos of different people's nutrition and how their knees looked on the inside related to diet and health (yikes) and talked a lot about diet in relation to athletics and health both in terms of injury and recovery. The doctor is the guy who did Tiger Woods knee and is local and does a hell of a job luckily... He showed us photos of a 20 year old frat boy's knee (from the inside during surgury) who had a high BMI (body mass index) aka "a little fat" and drank too much and ate pizza and booze and chicken wings.. ...and was genuinely scary.

I do the majority of cooking these days and would like to get good insight on nutrition or where to start.. We are both in our late 20's but between all the weddings and a good portion of our friends who are all great but together we sometimes drink too much and eat poorly, though its a lot of fun, we probably don't have decent health related to diet. Also both of our BMIs are a little high, about 10-15 lbs over. Not fat but a little extra fat.. So I'd like to get a good idea on where to start...

Another thing though is that we are both fairly active, we ski and bike a lot in particular.. So sports nutrition info in particular in terms of joint and muscles and tendon strength, and over all strength and energy. Thanks and any info appreciated..

We also each did a HSCRP blood test which I think will help show our health and healing in relation to diet.. I hope the results aren't so bad that I'm afraid to post them!

[Shovel]

I ran across this link a while back and was entertained...

http://www.healthranger.org/

particularly I've got this graphic on my wall at work, it's helped remind me to make the right lunch decision a few dozen times now :) http://www.honestfoodguide.org/

[Flounder]

I'm an elite level cyclist and have been road racing (with plenty of Mnt and 'cross) for 23 seasons. Geeky as it sounds, sports nutrition was a bit of a hobby of mine for many years. It was my chosen field of study in college for the first 2 years. Since then I've been to various sports nutrition classes and seminars from the US to Europe.

The "knee thing" is new to me, but if you have questions about general sports nutrition, particularly as it relates to endurance sports, give me a buzz.

cnvivefrance@hotmail.com

If I don't have the answer, I can get it for you. One of my best friends is the US Olympic Tri coach and has written a few books on the subject.

[DaveInDenver]

One of my best friends is the US Olympic Tri coach and has written a few books on the subject.
How cool. The guy who helped fixed my Achilles tendinitis last year is a CU Triathlon coach. I knew him from racing CX (he's good, I'm not, so I saw his races). I went because of the CX and that I also went to CU... Anyway, Neal Henderson I think is his name. I know he coached down in the Springs for the USAT collegiate team.

Oh, yeah, nutrition. Never heard that stuff, but there's a lot I don't know. I guess you are what you eat. Be interesting to hear. I'm also going to ask my riding buddy tomorrow about it. He's a kinesiologist, so he won't necessarily know specifically about nutrition but he should know something about joints and soft tissue.

[DesertRose]

First, I hope Carrie is doing better! That sounds painful.

Well, after Flounder's post, I almost didn't respond, but what the heck! I'm not an Olympic class anything (except maybe being a smart-aleck, according to Jonathan), and so my perspective is a bit different.

I did a lot of research last year into diet and exercise for two reasons.

First, I started going to a naturopath doctor instead of a "regular" MD, thinking an NMD would be more in-tune with things like organic foods, exercise, etc. Wrong! I found out most naturopaths and homeopaths actually have very lucrative sidelines selling you supplements - despite the fact that my BMI was fantastic (and way below average for a 43 year old), despite that I weigh 120 after a big meal, and am 5'7" - he tried to sell me $80/month worth of supplements because I was low in iron and magnesium and calcium (what woman isn't?).

Long story short: I argued with him over the fact that I could just improve my diet and get all the nutrients I need from food (and have more fun, too!), and further, that supplements were a waste because much of them your body can't process without other natural food-derived minerals and such . . . you pee away a lot of that $80.

Second thing, I got a wakeup call - literally. Being healthy and eating right all your life won't guarantee you won't wake up to a phone call telling you the lab results show you have cancer.

So I started looking into how to track my diet and exercise. It can't be that tough, I thought.

And it wasn't. I found a fantastic online resource that I used for about 8 months to track my dietary intake and activity levels - and it's been really surprisingly easy to balance out what I need.

More magnesium? I increased dark greens and things like broccoli . . . and dark chocolate :26_34_3: . . . More iron? I increased some stuff like liver (in pate - we tried liver and onions, and it's a bit much!) and more greens . . . after a few months my leg cramps went away and my blood tests proved I had balanced the imbalance.

While I went through 6 weeks of daily radiation, which kills cells and so the body needs to be regenerating cells, I paid special attention (using a number of resources to learn what nutrients the body needs for cell building, etc) to certain foods. The techs at the hospital were impressed by how well my skin did and how little I felt the effects of high-dose radiation. I'm sure it was nutrition, and the fact I didn't stop exercising. And that Jonathan kept me supplied with Godiva chocolate.

Sorry to soapbox! But my feeling personally is that you can't go wrong if you balance your caloric intake with your activity level, you really eat plenty of vegetables and fruit along with your meats and dairies and grains, and then you make sure you're eating whole and organic foods. Forget processed stuff with high fructose corn syrups and sweeteners. Go with real meat. Real veggies grown locally. Whole milk (preferably raw). Eggs, because whole eggs are the perfect food. Don't get sucked into the "low-carb, low-fat" thing, or the vegetarian thing. Forget soy, an evil crop, unless you ferment it first. Balance & knowledge are the key.

The website I used was the good old USDA's - the Healthy Interactive Eating Index. You can enter what foods you eat each day (after you input your physiological info) and it tells you pretty well how you did with eating "right." Having baseline bloodwork helps, so you can see whether you're hitting your marks. They also have an activity tracker for how much energy you burn and what calories you need to intake to maintain or lose weight.

http://www.mypyramidtracker.gov/

This website is good for looking up nutrient-specific foods:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

Okay, that's enough - but this is a subject I feel strongly about, because I think most people don't enjoy real food (and drink!) enough, and miss out because of fad diets . . .

Good luck and keep us posted!

[dieselcruiserhead]

Thanks guys.. Just checked in here quickly to see if there were any responses. Flounder I'll definitely send you an email... The joint thing is pretty basic I think across the board positive sports nutrition. The test though checks for inflammatory tissue count versus anti-inflamatory which is particularly important with recovery stuff. I guess it is an often enough issue (particularly with modern eating habits) that it can literally make or break a surgery. That is what this picture showed, almost a completely degraded knee and the ACL literally nowhere in sight after it had snapped after the guy waited a few months to address it.

Anyway, I have gotten the biking bug badly in the last month-two, been riding probably 50-100 miles a week easily on the MTB since I got it about a month and a half ago. Really sad, Carrie is a good biker and it was really our first big ride together, she fell off in sort of a weird off balance section and her Shimano clipless didn't release (we have been having all sorts of adjustment issues with them - so off they go especially now) and she tweaked her knee. Timing almost couldn't be worse as we leave (hopefully) for a trip in a week and a half...

I have sort of peaked my knowledge on cars and trucks I feel like and been moving to bikes and they are so easy.. So hopefully I can start learning and reading all about diet and sports nutrition and hopefully lose a little weight and get healthier :)

Cheers and thanks guys,
Andre

[Flounder]

Desertrose just offered up a steaming plate of excellent advice! She's right on target with her advice regarding food quality. Food quality is the foundation for good sports nutrition. Whole foods and whole foods that haven't been cooked to a pulpy mush are key. It simply is a matter of balancing your three primary macronutrients: Protein, Carbs, fat(good fat)

Now, depending on your activity level, to master your diet such that you can eliminate all supplimentation....that might be tricky. I couldn't use diet alone to source all of the micro-nutrients I need to recover from hard rides day to day. I suppose I could just plan on riding an extra 4 miles (not a biggie) to offset the calories in 1/2 a cup of blue berries - OR - I can just take a sports based suppliment full of antioxidants needed for sports based recovery. Plus, I don't really want to eat berries or other such anti-oxidant foods daily. I'm using berries and antioxidants as an example. Suppliments do just that...suppliment things you miss from your diet. No one, and I do mean NO ONE PERSON can stick to a perfect diet day in and day out. *Keep in mind, this is assuming you ride at least 4-6 days a week and do so for 60-90 minutes at a moderate clip.

Another supplimentation example: Three seasons ago I collapsed in a pile during a race and spent four days in the hospital. Just an oversite on my part. My chromium, potasium and magnesium dipped enough to initiate a rather serious issue with my ticker. I had a heart rate of 225 for hours which lead to seizures...not nice. So, I suppliment those minerals as a precaution. Sure, a banana would have been a big help, but like I said...I neglected my diet for a couple days and wham...hospital.

So, don't fear suppliments, just don't expect too much from them. The key is understand nutritional concepts and know how to tweak your needs depending on the season, your activity and your objectives. If you do it well and to some extent for performance everything else just falls into place.

You can also use a strategic diet to help tweak the efficiency of your body, kind of like modifying your truck. Need more endurance? Teach your body to replace glycogens (fuel your bod uses) quicker by removing as many sugars from your diet as possible (during certain phases of a training program) and BAM...your liver becomes one serious glycogen producing machine.

It really is cool stuff. People have a tendancy to go too far to extremes with nutritional theory. My Rover has fancy traction control...over complicated...all it needs are lockers....very simple. Sports nutrition is the same. Learn the basic concepts and keep it simple.

Most importantly - If you knock out a big ride, don't forget to swing into your favorite greasy spoon once in a while and eat some of your favorite crap food. You still have to feed your soul from time to time! Once a month I go completely off the farm and eat junk. It's good for you.

[dieselcruiserhead]

Wow Roseann thanks for such a great post! That is great and congrats I don't think I ever recalled that you battled cancer.. I love it, some mutual information sharing in the near future ;)

I'll post up. Tonight is the first night here.. But flying blind (sort of like obsessively changing lightbulbs trying to reduce energy costs when you could have a simple light bulb). But anyway, my first flying blind meal was (tonight):

Golden Curry (the box they sell at stores -- DElicious, but high sodium...
Sprawn. Also unfortunately prepackaged but at least raw.
Jasmine Rice
Lightly steamed fresh spinach
Mixed greens...

I would love to start posting and reporting on it hopefully as I have time. Wouldn't mind getting into this a lot more including what you guys are eating maybe if you don't mind. It would be neat to turn this into a big thread.. PS -- right on Roseann.. On all of it!!

[DaveInDenver]

Golden Curry (the box they sell at stores -- DElicious, but high sodium...
Sprawn. Also unfortunately prepackaged but at least raw.
Jasmine Rice
Lightly steamed fresh spinach
Mixed greens...
This is the one and only lucky result of having a wife with high blood pressure. We eat very little sodium ever and for the most part not a lot of packaged stuff. Personally hate spinach, though. Yuck. We go thru jasmine rice by the crate it seems, she loves sticky rice. So we just try to eat balanced and beyond we don't over think it. Lots of scratch made stuff, albeit simple, I think is the key. You have some more control over what goes into it at least.

[bigreen505]

Excellent advice, I agree with all of it and have little to add. Chris Carmichael has a podcast you can download off iTunes that is worth a listen. There is a Web site called the Organic Athlete that has some recipes for veggies.

On slightly OT add is that I would recommend a doctor that will do a hamstring tendon graft over a patellar graft to repair the ACL. I have one of each and I definitely prefer the hamstring and recovery was faster and post recovery balance and coordination was better. I recently ran into a grad-student at CU doing some research on which method is better and his rather qualitative research seemed also to point to the hamstring graft as the method of choice. Fewer and smaller scars too, which I'm sure she would appreciate.

[Flounder]

We go thru jasmine rice by the crate it seems, she loves sticky rice. .
One of the best kept secrets in sports nutrition is whole grain BROWN rice. If white rices are gasoline, brown rice is rocket fuel. I find it truly helps in boosting weight loss, plus it has improved fiber, protein and other bennies not found in white rices. Personally, I hate it, but it really is worth it's weight in gold.

My other secret weapon is Acai berry juice. I'm really conflicted on that stuff. I'm not wild about the socio-enviro-political implications of buying Acai berry products but the stuff is UN-REAL. It has more antioxidants than FRS or Athlete Octane sports suppliments plus it has Omega 3 fats and lots of protein. Pretty much a perfect food. Unfortunately it comes from Brazil and has become a hot topic on the political radar. Tastes like poo, but if mixed in a smoothy, it's great.

Brown rice. Acai juice. Wild salmon. Whole grains. Yogurt. Chicken breasts. Veal. Whole grain pasta. Flax seed. Fresh fruits and dark colored veggies. Those are things I invite to every meal or snack.

[bigreen505]

My other secret weapon is Acai berry juice. I'm really conflicted on that stuff. I'm not wild about the socio-enviro-political implications of buying Acai berry products but the stuff is UN-REAL.

I was unaware of the socio-enviro-political implications and I will definitely have to look into it. The stuff is rocket fuel, but is also an acquired taste.

Wild salmon with a nice teriyaki or misoyaki sauce (PM if you need a recipe) over brown rice with lightly steamed asparagus and an Acai smoothie is about as good as it gets.

What has been touched on, but maybe not pounded in hard enough is quality food is important -- wild salmon not farm raised, brown rice and whole grains over processed, organic vegetables (preferably from a local farmers market). You are what you eat, but that goes for what you are eating. "Organic" and free range* animals (beef, buffalo) is better than hormone enhanced. Stay away from processed foods. Stay away from nitrates.

*If you live and or travel in an area with a lot of free range farming, buy an ARB bumper. Cows may be tasty, but they are not smart.

[xcmountain80]

So in a sudden realization, the organic, free range, and fresh foods are like way back when. When food was un fooled around with?

Aaron

[DaveInDenver]

Acai juice. Veal.
My man, you are a political nightmare waiting to happen!

[bigreen505]

Flounder, what is your take on whole eggs vs. just egg whites.

[pskhaat]

...going over photos of different people's nutrition and how their knees looked on the inside related to diet and health (yikes)...
In your example--despite the booze and wings--would not one assume that fats on the body would not be a detriment to joints? Was it just simply the extra weight, or the effect on the joints by the fats themselves in the diet? And...what were those effects? You said `scary' but can you elobrate? I'm curious :O

My fully-deep-midwestern wife cooks all the wrong things I've been told. She's an organic meats with real gravy from cooking remains, non-nitrate and non-cured bacon, whole milk, eggs, extra-heavy on the raw farm cheese please kind of girl. I'm definetely heavier now than ever (which is due I believe in my own caloric quantity intake) but my heart rate and blood pressure is way down (vs. when I was effectively a partying vegetarian) and I feel really good. (Crossing fingers and praying it lasts).

[Otto Von Squiggy]

And it wasn't. I found a fantastic online resource that I used for about 8 months to track my dietary intake and activity levels - and it's been really surprisingly easy to balance out what I need.


The website I used was the good old USDA's - the Healthy Interactive Eating Index. You can enter what foods you eat each day (after you input your physiological info) and it tells you pretty well how you did with eating "right." Having baseline bloodwork helps, so you can see whether you're hitting your marks. They also have an activity tracker for how much energy you burn and what calories you need to intake to maintain or lose weight.

http://www.mypyramidtracker.gov/

This website is good for looking up nutrient-specific foods:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

Okay, that's enough - but this is a subject I feel strongly about, because I think most people don't enjoy real food (and drink!) enough, and miss out because of fad diets . . .

Good luck and keep us posted!

just signed up, hopefully within a few months I wont need those extra shocks for all the extra weight.

[Big Daddy Chia]

WHats this nutrition u talk about.

[DaveInDenver]

Was it just simply the extra weight, or the affect on the joints by the fats themselves in the diet? And...what were those effects?
Good questions. I figure the fat your body stores isn't necessarily all done just in the mid section. So fatty deposits will probably develop in all sorts of places. That will probably be bad for joints that have lots of range of motions that would be limited. Just thinking. That is exacerbated by the extra weight and probably pretty lousy routine of stretching and exercise that a partying student would follow.

[Flounder]

I was unaware of the socio-enviro-political implications and I will definitely have to look into it. The stuff is rocket fuel, but is also an acquired taste.

Honestly, I'm not entirely educated on the ins and outs of Acai production, but from the sounds of it, the locals living in Brazil that once centered their diets around Acai are now unable to afford it and the fall out has been ugly.

As for farmed salmon, that is beyond gross. I'd eat a case of slimey hot dogs before I ate an ounce of farmed salmon. Foul. Just foul.

As for organic beef, I'm not so sure organic is always best. I grew up in beef country and still have friends raising beef. Sometimes the most unhealthy beasts I've ever seen have been "organic" cattle. I've seen some with terrible bouts of pink eye and other such ailments. I've seen them with nasty infections which have to remain untreated to fall within the rules of "organic." Real cattle ranchers can't afford to drop a ton of dough on roids and hormones but they do treat for illness which can produce better beef.

[Flounder]

Flounder, what is your take on whole eggs vs. just egg whites.
There are some valid arguments for the old egg white routine, but I don't eat enough eggs to worry about yokes. I eat yokes. In the sports nutrition world, particularly the endurance sports world, cholesterol usually isn't a big concern and that was what really drove people from the yoke.

Variety is extremely healthy so I mix my protein intake between eggs, chicken, soy, whey, lean beef and sometimes a little turkey or pork. I also fold in a lot of salmon and other salmoniods like trout.

[desertgirl66]

I believe that the body recognizes food in their whole state. Eggs for instance, should really be eaten with the yolks so the body recognizes that it is an egg with all the nutrients associated with egg. You can eat egg whites for the perfect protein that they are, but please throw in at least one whole yolk also. The same for juice. The body recognizes carrots for the nutrients and also the fiber. If you just drink a glass of carrot juice (which is alot of carrots) then the body will be looking for the fiber. Then you might start to crave say, crackers or pretzels, because the body is looking for fiber.

Whole grains provide lots of goodies for the body. Brown rice is good, but rather high on the glycemic index. Quinoa is one of the best whole grains you could eat. An ancient grain from South America, it has been called the perfect food. It has a pure protein profile. Cooks fast and is really tasty. Also, yams are a great food.

As Desertrose pointed out, keep your food whole, unprocessed and organic if possible. Processed foods and refined carbohydrates are probably the worst for you. You can't eat too many vegetables!

[DaveInDenver]

Real cattle ranchers can't afford to drop a ton of dough on roids and hormones but they do treat for illness which can produce better beef.
This is a good point. There's an appropriate level of use and an abuse. Routinely pumping them full of rBGH and HGPs is bad, treating illnesses is fine. There are side effects of medical treatments on cattle, like the reduction of effectivity of antibiotics, but the upside is healthy cattle. It's a balance of course. But the notion that 'organic' is not automatically better is something that makes me wonder. Like milk that is rBGH free seems good, but treating the cows to keep them healthy doesn't strike me as a bad idea.

[pnwadventurer]

For my family, due to the fact that my daughter has food allergies to a lot of processed food and dyes, have came up with a simple method of eating healthier.

We have tried to eliminate as much food as possible that:

1. have ingredients we have no clue what they are
2. have food dyes
3. have high fructose corn syrup
4. high in saturated fat

We feel that the more basic the food is, the better.

We also try to eat our share of foods from different food groups along with portion control.

Do we stick to it 100% of the time, no, but that is our goal.

Steve

[Lost Canadian]

Great points everyone, Roseann you nailed it.

Let me just say one thing though. I'm not a fan of hormone-laced cattle but I'm also not sold on going 100% organic either. One reason is many of the foods we eat have higher levels of natural toxins then most pesticides used to protect our food sources. Oranges and coffee for instance contain fairly high amounts of naturally occurring toxins, toxins that of course are processed by our bodies when we ingest them. Don't be fooled by all the organic hype, some of the talk surrounding organic is valid but much of it is not. Just remember that our bodies deal with all toxins in the same way regardless of origin. Go to the rainforest and munch on all the organically grown greens there, do so and I bet you'd be dead within a week if not sooner.

As has been repeated a number of times already proper nutrition is really very simple, eat a balanced diet consisting of lots of fresh locally grown and/or frozen produce, eat whole foods, avoid processed crap, drink plenty of water to flush the toxins we ingest, inhale, and the ones our bodies produce naturally, and our bodies (for the most part) will take care of themselves. Of course exercise and stretch daily, but that's a no brainer.

[Flounder]

We're sort of getting "off the farm" with the original topic. Sports nutrition or nutrition for very active individuals is quite different from eating for the average healthy Joe. Sure, brown rice has a high glycemic index, but big whoop. For someone like the original poster who is riding as much as 100 miles a week (probably 8-12 hours) that's actually a benefit.

There is a massive difference between eating healthy and eating for health and performance. MASSIVE difference.

[desertgirl66]

Flounder, you may be right in your opinion ---but as one who has a degree in Sports Nutrition--well-just trying to help out with some important information.

In Sports Nutrition--low glycemic and high pure protein is really important.

Keeping the carb count low is important, keeping the protein up is important. Keep the balance, at the right time. You have windows of muscle and ligament repair that are vital---

Good luck!

[Flounder]

Flounder, you may be right in your opinion ---but as one who has a degree in Sports Nutrition--well-just trying to help out with some important information.

Keeping the carb count low is important, keeping the protein up is important.

Good luck!
I'm not sure I follow. Can you expand on "keeping the carb count low?" I was assuming the discussion here was focused around the original poster's riding regime which could probably equate to 6-12 hours per week of work load at mid-aerobic, sub-lactate and super-lactate threashold zones. I'm somewhat assuming a larger portion allocated to mid aerobic zones. That's usually the effort level that loves to suck glycogen stores right out of your muscles, no? I'm making huge assumptions based on a late 20's rider with "the bug" for mountain biking. Doesn't sound like sidewalk riding, I guess is my point.

Don't keep us in the dark!! This is just the geeky sorta stuff I love!!

[bigreen505]

Sort of brings up an interesting point. I think sports nutrition (no degree here) is somewhat event dependent. I know I personally eat very different in the summer when I am spending a lot of time on the bike (exactly as Flounder described), vs. summer spending a lot of time on the boat (mid-length high intensity efforts) vs. skiing in the winter (very high intensity 2 min. efforts).

[Flounder]

Sort of brings up an interesting point. I think sports nutrition (no degree here) is somewhat event dependent. I know I personally eat very different in the summer when I am spending a lot of time on the bike (exactly as Flounder described), vs. summer spending a lot of time on the boat (mid-length high intensity efforts) vs. skiing in the winter (very high intensity 2 min. efforts).
Exactly. During my base building weeks, I log as many as 350 miles per week (winter). My coach I've had for 15 years would kill me if I ate a sugar cube as those are the months that we hope to train my bod to produce/convert glycogens more effectively. Key for upping endurance levels and elevating lactate threshold levels through increased aerobic strength. Those days, my carb intake is massive. On the flip side, when I'm racing back to back days for 2 weeks at Super Week, I have to pound the proteins and suck down my carbs within 45 minutes of getting off my bike. Even in the same sport, consumption changes big time from day to day or week to week.

[DaveInDenver]

On the flip side, when I'm racing back to back days for 2 weeks at Super Week, I have to pound the proteins and suck down my carbs within 45 minutes of getting off my bike.
Never had a coach, so I'm in the dark. I trend towards endurance races, since I'm not super fast but stubborn. How do you eat for those? I eat equal carb and protein thinking that I need to refuel and rebuild.

[desertgirl66]

There is certainly a difference in average eating and perfomance eating. And many, many different views and opinions on performance eating. Basically, low glycemic carbs equal sustained energy and protein rebuilds. And of course there are times when you need a quick hit of glucose to finish----

[Flounder]

Never had a coach, so I'm in the dark. I trend towards endurance races, since I'm not super fast but stubborn. How do you eat for those? I eat equal carb and protein thinking that I need to refuel and rebuild.
Maybe it's because I've been doing it so long, but I think cycling nutrition is easy. You have to understand just a couple basic concepts and eating for the bike is pretty strait forward. Your three key macronutrients are pretty obvious; carbs, protein and fat. You really have to have all three. The balance depends on the time of year, and/or the objective of your fueling by week or by day.

For longer events like road races or endurance mnt events, carbs are key. Especially during those days of long training miles. When you log big miles you have to help your body replace glycogen stores and carbs do just that. When you do short, intense miles like those cyclocross races, you do a great deal of fiber damage to muscles and protein helps rebuild or repair that damage.

As it relates to replacing glycogen stores, there is a very brief window of opportunity. If you introduce glycogens (carbs) into your system within 45 minutes after a hard workout, you stand an excellent chance of having the glycogen stores in your muscles up to snuff by the next day. Outside of that window your body struggles to replace those stores and it can be a few days before you catch up.

This is all nothing new. This was true when I was a kid living at the Olympic Training Center in the Springs during the late 80s. We'd finish a ride and suck down carb rich drinks...yuk. Things have evolved. Now it is encouraged to consume proteins as well to help repair tissue damage quickly. The use of things like Muscle Milk fit that bill. Keeping a steady base line of incoming antioxidants also helps. FRS is my favorite for that need. Before we leave the subject of carbs - The notion of "carbo loading" pretty much died in the mid 90s. However, when I race with my buddies in Italy, they still swear it works. Of course they do...they're Italian!! There is also a new use of "quick carbs" in the form of GU, Power Gel, etc. Even if you're on the edge of a nasty bonk, you can usually suck down a 100 calorie GU pack every 20 minutes and survive even 100 mile road races...I have. Those GU packs are glycogen rocket fuel....quick burn.


As for the balance of the three macro-fuels, fat usually gets allocated 10% of daily intake by most riders. Avocado, olive oil, fat in the proper fish, peanut butter, etc. For me, like most riders, sometimes my carb intake can reach 65% or more as those back to back big miles really suck the glycogen stores bone dry. That's assuming there hasn't been much in the way of super-lactate intensity. The more super-lactate intensity you endure, the more likely you'll need to up the protein levels. So, on back to back days of killer intensity, like during stage races or big ugly training weeks, I up my protein level to maybe 50%. Okay....when off season rolls around, that's the time to really up the protein as a measure of not blowing up like a swollen tick. I can gain pounds quick so moving to 60% protein, 30% carbs and 10% fat helps.

The key is somewhat knowing when you're in aerobic zones and when you've crossed over your lactate threshold and are now doing serious tissue damage. Cyclocross races are 100% super lactate. Base miles are boring and 100% aerobic...carb eaters.

For cycling, this is all pretty much universal. This is the absolute core of cycing nutrition whether you're a Cat 5 beginner or Jan Ullrich, minus the dope. Honestly, I've never heard of cyclist doing much different. One of the coolest things about this...Fausto Coppi was eating this way IN THE 1950s!!!!! Smart dude.

[dieselcruiserhead]

Great guys good to see all of this great info.. As usual the weekend came and ate at a friends house (both very fit and healthy people) but big meal and lots of sugar.. So tough. Anyway, I ahve been biking like crazy including my biggest/hardest ride ever this weekend that kicked my *** and probably burned 4-5K calories I figure.. As I have time I'll "digest" all this great info and will keep you guys posted.. Thanks again, Cheers, Andre

[bigreen505]

If you are working pretty hard (not coasting, but not puking either), 500 cal/hr is a reasonable guess for a burn rate. As always, YMMV.

[dieselcruiserhead]

I have not had a chance to follow the great suggestions and information from this thread... But wanted to give a little update...

I have been exercising as much as possible (2-3 nights a week of serious MTB riding, in a good week) and we have been healthy and well. Carrie would be excerising a lot too I speculate except for her torn ACL so pretty immobilized for now... My beer consumption has also gone way down.. With some increase in wine consumption but this is very limited..

And low and behold in a month or so I've lost 5 lbs easily, closer to 10.. . It is a noticable visual difference... Weighed myself and I was down to 228 last night (which for 6'5 and my body type is not too bad). My worse was probablty about 238-243. I'm back to about where my body was when I was in college... Body fat is at just under 26% and water weight is about 55% according to my fancy schmancy new scale... Not sure if this helps at all.. I was not over weight particularly but had/have about 15-20lbs or extra weight and light gut action which I feel like really affected me as far as overall feeling of health in general... My goal is 220...

Poor Carrie just had her knee surgury and is hurting and unfortunately gets a little depressed if she's sitting around too long. She's been working from home and is doing well but she reacts poorly to strong pain killers (nausea, etc) but is doing well. The knee surgury ended up being done by (not sure if I mentioned it) probably the best knee doctor in possibly the west and from the photos and discussion looks like everything is going well. She required the least surgury possible for the torn ACL. There was some concern there was cartiledge and/or meniscus damage and luckily there was none of that.

As far as health, her test (see first post for more info) came out at 9 and I was way worse, a 16 surprizingly... But I have basically been eating whatever I want for the most part, my entire life, until this year. Her dad, who also took the test and is 63 and just won a huge local mountain bike race and was also the only guy on a single speed (extra hard work), and is in more than perfect shape, got a 3... Which is supposed to be pretty good but a pro athelete in fully recovered mode (little regular impact) should be a 2 or 1.

Anyway, still working on it. I learned to really cut out sugar and think about what I eat. I hope I don't forget that, for the first time in my life I really have started thinking about what I eat every time I eat which I think is kind of cool...

As I get more time and settle down on my latest obsession (mtb bicycle building/parts) I want to focus on learning about nutrition and overall physical health as mentioned before. I also really want to learn how to cook beyond my currently very limited repertoire to produce delicious yet healthy food.

Cheers,
Andre