Heavy Duty Bumpers for Expedition/Overland Use: Practical Necessity or Superfluous an

[Cee-Jay]

Heavy Duty Bumpers for Expedition/Overland Use: Practical Necessity or Superfluous and Heavy?

The topic is off-road bumpers, both rear and front. I’m talking about aftermarket or custom made heavy duty bumpers designed to replace the factory bumpers on your average expedition vehicle.

Some possible reasons to purchase a heavy duty bumper:

-Protects vehicle from major damage caused by hazards found on difficult or extreme trails/roads
-Provides a proper mounting point for a winch
-Improves approach and departure angles relative to stock bumper
-Provides quality recovery points
-Looks cool

Some possible reasons NOT to purchase a heavy duty bumper:

-Wastes available payload capacity (esp. in lighter, smaller rigs)
-Changes vehicle handling characteristics for the worse (especially in lighter, smaller rigs)
-Expensive
-Just plain unnecessary for most people most of the time
-Draws attention to vehicle (may attract thieves)
-Looks ugly

I realize the best answer to this question may be “it depends”, but I’m interested in your thoughts. Under what conditions and for which vehicles is heavy duty bumper protection desirable? When is it okay but not necessary? When is it actually harmful?

Thanks,
Cee-Jay

PS: I know I'm being a little simplistic here. For example, not all replacement bumpers are created equal; some are more efficiently designed than others.

[mtnbike28]

My biggest reason for a front was animal strikes, I would hate to be a long way from home and ruin a trip with simple accident. My rear bumper was 1. protection 2. replacing a dented stock one.

[DoWorkSon]

Many newer vehicles lack any real bumper... lots of plastic offering little to no protection of ANY sort.

[911regular]

Speaking from a full size standpoint,,,,none of the current bumper mfg's make practical bumpers for full size trucks. Unless you want to ram cows, have the bumper survive an IED, or just wear your balljoints out early. Seems all of the aftermarket bumpers are just too freakin heavy and bulky or they are just made for pure aesthetics . Wish a practical and functional bumper was on the market. Something like the project Superduty one.

[Mighty Dodge Ram]

My front bumper was bought to house a winch, but the added protection is a bonus. The added weight has been a steering nightmare now just being remedied. I'm looking for a rear mostly to mount swing aways for a spare and fuel. The bumpers seem to be secondary to the accessories. :sombrero:

[1leglance]

For all us Full Size folks make sure to look at Aluminess, they make some amazing light weight but super strong bumpers.
I had one on my Sportmobile front & rear and let me tell you I was able to winch my 11,000lb rig off the front bumper without a worry.
The rear bumper had really cool storage and held a 35in Nitto Trail Grappler without an issue on 1 swingout and a big ol' box full of stuff on the other side.
http://www.aluminess.com

Yeah they are not cheap but that is part of what happens when you think about saving the weight but have it be well engineered.
And they are a great company that uses their product also.

Now if only I could get them to make something for my 70 Burb :)

[blakeape]

I built my front bumper after a rock tumbled off a hillside in a construction zone and took out my bumper, intercooler, radiator, A/C condenser, fan, and fan clutch. That left me dead in the water for 2 days laying in the rain and snow fixing my truck 500 miles from home. My bumper includes tow points, front end protection, a 12k Warn winch (that saved my butt last weekend when both my driveline yokes broke) and a place to mount a fog and driving lights. Plus I think it looks pretty cool. There is a lot of wild life where I live and I feel naked and vulnerable driving a vehicle with a stock bumper.
101048
101049
It is the same truck, just got some love and a paint job.

[GregB_00XJ]

The protection factor and possibly the winch factor alone are good enough for me. I imagine being far away from, well anything and crunching into...say maybe a rock in a construction zone for instance? Stock bumper = smoked rad and likely worse. Aftermarket bumper = far better off.

I have see people hit deer around here, and destroy their whole front end, peel the plastic "bumpers" right off, rad done etc. With a nice solid steel bumper and a grille guard, they would be headed for the car-wash and Bambi on the way to deer heaven. For me it is about protection, useability (winch) and function. If it looks good, great.

The cons are weight, but that should be taken into account before you slap on 250# of steel.

[HumphreyBear]

As you say: "it depends". I currently live in the middle of Sydney and am surrounded by pristine 4WDs with shiny bull bars. The sheer number of urban bull bars recently prompted "them" (the shadow men, the gray people, them that have no names) to try and ban them. Fortunately they failed because for most country folk who do a lots of dirt road (or even highway) driving they are the first thing people put on along with decent lights. I do agree with a part of their campaign though (don't put them on a city-only car).

I have run into a few chaps on a trips around the traps who proudly tell everyone who'll listen to them that bull bars (or roo bars as we often refer to them) are not required, and most people just smile and nod their heads, and then roll their eyes. The people who say it also tend to be either city folk or foreigners. I grew up in the bush and have too many memories of incidents like these (photos sourced from the Internet in a 3min search):

101057101058101059

It one of those things for me - when you actually need it, it is simply too late to put it on... However, from experience I would only consider reputable brand steel bullbars. Alloy ones are basically for low speed dings and mounting stuff to (IMNSHO).

[Will Riggs]

I needed a place to mount a winch and we have various wildlife like deer once you're outside the city, the security when wheeling is a major plus.

[FellowTraveler]

Front bumper; Animal strikes, some impact protection, step for maintenance, winch mounting, approach angle increase, brush guard, platform for additional lighting are my reasons for front WARN bumper.

Knowing well the ill effect of putting something heavy way out in front of the front axle/steering would change the vehicles balance, handling and stopping distance I used GM factory up-fitter manuals to keep CG and axle loads at or very close to factory design. The additional expense of tweaking after install related to the bumpers/winches is always a consideration, can I do it or do I have to have some shop do it?

Rear bumper; Impact resistance, better ground clearance, shackle mount points, and help bring the front bumper/winch install back into harmony with the vehicles original design.

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[keezer37]

I recall someone posting pics of his newer model Tacoma after a dear strike. As I remember it, the ARB bumper looked pretty good still. Problem was, it was about a third of the way in the engine compartment. And I do believe, the truck was still totaled.
I think any critter big enough not to roll under a modestly lifted truck, is gonna be heavy enough to do damage regardless. If not to the bumper, what is directly behind it.
I got mine because my insurer covered the cost after I destroyed the plastic et al. I don't think it will save your truck but may save your wallet from minor damage repairs that the OE bumper would not withstand and be within your insurance deductible.

[BlackClassic]

I got my bumper mainly for the front tow points, but second added approach. Because with only my stock bumper and air dam she sat low. I have had to get pulled out a couple of times and the bumper worked great. Not mentioan it looks cool. May add some sort of pre runner hoop, stinger someday but I'm good with my light bar. Also if I want to add a winch I can pretty easily. I probably do a rear one some day too.

[HumphreyBear]

I think any critter big enough not to roll under a modestly lifted truck, is gonna be heavy enough to do damage regardless. If not to the bumper, what is directly behind it.

I agree, and they don't cover all situations. Many years ago my high school industrial arts teacher ran over a wombat in a road car he had just finished restoring, and it damned near ripped the front axle off (like hitting a slightly malleable rock at 90km/hr) as it went under the vehicle and launched him skyward. His next car restoration was an MG and he took the legs out from under a cow and the cow joined him in the cabin which didn't do him any favours.

In general though, if it stops the engine moving rearwards in a big collision and impinging on the driver (personal experience with a head on vehicle smash that I never want to repeat), or discourages the deer/cow/'roo from rolling over the bonnet then I'd call that a win even if the car doesn't.

[BIGdaddy]

-I've been run into 2 times in parking lots, with zero damage
-I've been rear-ended 3 times in the last year with zero damage
-I've pulled out stumps on our land with the tow points
-Just mounted a winch with very little fuss on it.
-Been recovered in deep sand with recovery points.
-Holds my pair of hella 500 lights
-Great spot for tools on the wings when I'm doing maintenence on the front end of the jeep.
-Perfect spot for children to stand (i have 3), and for beers to wait to be consumed. :)
-Not to mention how well protected my cooling system is from major damage in a moderate impact with a car/rock/tree, etc...

I have no illusions that a 30-40mph crash will overload and crumple the bumper, but I also am a big fan of cannibalizing other vehicles
crumple zones whenever possible, which the added weight helps with, if the worst happens. (Hasn't in 16 years of driving, and I don't plan on losing that record, but you never know...)

[98dango]

Well i look at most aftermarket bumpers as a joke. there to heavy and ugly. The last good looking bumper was made by warn. Runell makes a fair bumper but over heavy. You do not need to build a bumper to witstand a train. The last bumper i build is a mix of 1/4 3/16 and even 1/8th. Its on a dura max and has held well for years did finaly get a dent in the 1/8 cover. One man can install it with no help. Living in Wyoming it has hit many a antalope with no issues. The bumper i am building for budget beater will be much like it.

The only reason is a critter getter and they look better but you dont need that giant 200lb ranch hand bumper. I also say the bolt over the stock bumpers ones they sell now are not worth your money.

[toymaster]

The need for a heavy bumper increases as your usage increases. A heavy duty bumper is an extension of your frame for the reasons already stated: recovery point, accessory attachment, protection. If you need these things then you need a heavy duty bumper; if you do not need these things then it is for show.

I have a 'ranch hand' style bumper I made for my F350 back in 2001 which has more than paid for itself. I've hit three mule deer without a scratch on my truck. I'm sure I would have hit more but the last six years the truck as basically been parked. On my JK they serve all the purposes mentioned and could not/would not image keeping the 10lb plastic bumpers on a vic built for the off-road.

[Cee-Jay]

The need for a heavy bumper increases as your usage increases. A heavy duty bumper is an extension of your frame for the reasons already stated: recovery point, accessory attachment, protection. If you need these things then you need a heavy duty bumper; if you do not need these things then it is for show.

Just to take the opposing view (since most people seem to be supportive of heavy duty bumpers), one could argue that there are often lighter ways to create recovery points and winch mounts then installing a full-sized heavy duty steel bumper. Same with swing out tire holders, fuel can racks, etc.

But I agree, as many have pointed out, that some stock bumpers these days may as well be made of cardboard. And I also agree with you, toymaster, and some other posters here that heavy duty, full coverage steel bumpers probably make sense if you often bash big things including animals (assuming that driving at slower speeds is not a viable option).

Here are a few links arguing for moderation for the sake of weight savings:
http://www.overlandexpo.com/overland-tech-travel/2012/1/8/is-gross-vehicle-weight-rating-overrated.html
http://www.jpmagazine.com/featuredvehicles/154_1110_50_ways_to_lighten_your_jeep/viewall.html

My gut instinct is that there's a lot of wisdom in the keep it simple, keep it mostly stock kinda mentality. That being said, sometimes there are d*mn good reasons to make upgrades and that goes for heavy duty bumpers too I suppose.

One problem, as several of you have pointed out, is that sometimes you don't know that you need a heavy duty bumper until after it's already too late... kinda like insurance.

[AFSOC]

Heavy Duty Bumpers for Expedition/Overland Use: Practical Necessity or Superfluous and Heavy?

My heavy duty bumpers are just to look cool and to mount my M8000 and the rear has my tire swing.

[colodak]

I got mine after a rock took out the lower portion of my original setup. Originally I had the stock bumper with a push bar/winch mount to house my lights and winch. Few years back, nailed a rock on a trail, bent the lower bar, tweaked the whole mounting and was actually bending my frame rails from stress. As for weight, well, I saved 20 lbs going from steel cable to synthetic line while with the old setup. Previously, I had a 35 lb bumper, 7lb valance, 100 lb pushbar, and 70 lb winch, and 5 lbs of lights. Now, I have a 70 lb winch, 110 lb bumper, and 5 lbs of lights. The truck still sits the same in the front, but now looks like it will survive an IED attack.

[911regular]

101103

definetly see the benefits to a massive bumper, but something like this seems more practical for a full size seeing off highway use. But,,,,a massive Mad Max front end looks pretty bad ***** too.

[Sergeant_V]

But I agree, as many have pointed out, that some stock bumpers these days may as well be made of cardboard. And I also agree with you, toymaster, and some other posters here that heavy duty, full coverage steel bumpers probably make sense if you often bash big things including animals (assuming that driving at slower speeds is not a viable option).

One problem, as several of you have pointed out, is that sometimes you don't know that you need a heavy duty bumper until after it's already too late... kinda like insurance.

The kind of off-road trails you drive also may determine your need for a heavy duty bumper. There are occasional obstacles that beg (or require) you to rub up against them to get over them or force you to drive the nose of your rig into the dirt or rock at the bottom of them. I've done several trails that included such obstacles and I am always much less concerned about my heavy duty bumper being scratched than my companions running rigs with stock plastic bumpers are.

[98dango]

I agree that stock bumpers suck. But they don't half to be heavy to be useful. Just remember that improper mounting and extra weight can also cause damage all on there own. I will post pictures in the am of good light weight bumpers.

[toymaster]

Just to take the opposing view (since most people seem to be supportive of heavy duty bumpers), one could argue that there are often lighter ways to create recovery points and winch mounts then installing a full-sized heavy duty steel bumper. Same with swing out tire holders, fuel can racks, etc...

Yes, the argument is there and valid. With this scenario you are only giving up protection for the vic's body.

I by no means am advocating going over a reasonable GVWR.


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Nor do I like a person that buys a ton and half truck derates it by putting on lessor tires and only carries around 3-4K in payload. (for reference a 1 1/2 truck i.e. F550 or dodge 5500 have a rear axle rating of 13,500lbs and a GVWR of 19,500). Why would you spend the extra money for a heavy truck then neuter it? Same with the opposite example of someone buying a small SUV or 1/2 ton truck and overloading it.

The overland magazine article you linked is a good example. The other article you linked was geared toward making a specific type of sport jeep that does not really apply to overlanding. On another forum there is a dude giving his jeep anorexia he has even removed his sway bars for the sake of weight savings; this is just as unsafe as driving on public roads overloaded.

I say form should follow function. For your chosen vic you have a limited amount of available payload use it as your activities dictate. Costs and benefits must be weighed. You show awareness of the trade-offs if your activities are set and your vic is overloaded well, it time to upgrade :coffee:.

[XJINTX]

Sorry I did not read all posts :( However, I also run rock sliders on my off road / expodition vehicles. Yes very seldom needed but on a recent trip the leader was in a nice new jeep Grand Cherokee ZJ. We rounded a corner and there was a rock slide and rocks we had o cross. He spent a long time getting spotted over those rocks and still ripped and damaged both rocker panels and his wife was pretty mad. I followed with sliders and drove right over / past the rocks... scratches no damage.

I too have winch bumper for reasons stated and rear bumper for spare tire... NO REGRETS!!!!

[FellowTraveler]

I have a fabricator building up tight fitting rock sliders for my Burb the drivers side will include a skid plate for my aux fuel tank then some drive-shaft hoops will be installed to prevent tank damage if u-joints on drive shaft fails, I think that will just about cover my custom goodies under vehicle.

Next, I plan expanded alloy guards installed over windows outside of vehicle w/interior release on each.

[24HOURSOFNEVADA]

I had my rear bumper designed to eliminate the bulk found on so many bumpers. It's functional, strong and practical.

Here's a side profile picture. The bumper fits much closer and provides more ground clearance than the OEM bumper while also being stronger.
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d127/ruffian05/IMG_4280.jpg

Rear shot.
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d127/ruffian05/IMG_4268.jpg

I would agree with the above statement regarding usage dictating the need... It's like the story about the cowboy that brags about never being bucked off a horse. He hasn't ridden many horses then.

[Detslider]

My truck came with aftermarket front and rear bumpers when I bought it.
I considered ditching them to save weight (which really isn't that much when you subtract the weight of a stock bumper beam and skin) but ended up keeping them because the stock system didn't offer any reasonable recovery points.

I can probably do without the winch that the aftermarket bumper has but if the stock system doesn't even offer a place to hook a snatch strap it's no good to me.

[zidaro]

I had my rear bumper designed to eliminate the bulk found on so many bumpers. It's functional, strong and practical.

Here's a side profile picture. The bumper fits much closer and provides more ground clearance than the OEM bumper while also being stronger.
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d127/ruffian05/IMG_4280.jpg



nice looking bumper

[Terrainist]

After backing into a few campsites at night.... wish I had taken off my previously straight rear bumper and sold it. Now have to scrap it and replace with something worth while. A stock bumper will crumple at 3 mph when hit head on by a 30" diameter tree. Disgraceful really, so much window dressing... something called a "bumper" that you can't bump into things with.

[Martinjmpr]

Like others here, I never sought out a custom bumper, but when I got into a minor accident that was the other driver's fault I was faced with the choice of replacing the bumper with an inadequate stock one, or a custom one.

I went with the tube style, even though I'll be the first to say it's not the prettiest thing. Like grapefruit juice, it's an acquired taste, I've come to like the Mad Max look but it took a while.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z256/ZappBranigan/4RUNNER/2011_0827_172808AA.jpg

Besides the other benefits mentioned (place to mount a winch, recovery points, more rugged than stock, etc) I'm a little surprised that nobody yet has mentioned the improvement in the approach angle. Modern vehicles all seem to have these low-hanging air dams, probably to improve airflow and to eke out that last little bit of fuel economy (so as to get closer to CAFE standards.) But that low approach angle can hurt you when you're approaching a steep rocky road.

My Addicted Off Road bumper only weighs 18lbs more than the stock parts it replaced, which is a negligible weight difference. The ability to add a winch and the increase in approach angle is worth the "unconventional" look.

Another plus for tube bumpers is that they are generally less costly than plate (ARB or Shrockworks-style) bumpers. In my case, the cost of the AOR bumper was about $20 more than the cost of the stock parts that would have been purchased to replace what needed replacing anyway.

[rxinhed]

A Ramsey front bumper with REP8000 winch came with my new Ramcharger; however, I finally have a chassis for my Iron Horse with folding crane. I have a set of sliders from my Montero parts bin that are the perfect length, too. I am going to convert the 1/2-ton suspension and axles to Dana 60s and 3/4-t front springs and 1-t rear. My goal is to haul our horse trailer and similar loads for our ranch.

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[JeremyT101]

Martinjmpr, i know this is slightly off topic for this thread, but what are your thoughts on your current tire selection? I was thinking of putting those Hankooks on my truck, how have they fared for you?

[Borrego60]

Bumper replacement was the first thing I did to the 03 tundra, I have been in head to head crashe not my fault. I switched out the factory bumper 20 pounds of plastic for a ARB Sahara bumper 170 lbs hit me now. I do feel alot safer with that bumper up front.

[Martinjmpr]

Martinjmpr, i know this is slightly off topic for this thread, but what are your thoughts on your current tire selection? I was thinking of putting those Hankooks on my truck, how have they fared for you?

Love 'em. They do great in the snow and they have been great in the desert (Moab) as well. They also did very well on some rocky trails in CO last year (Schofield Pass.) No complaints at all.

[98dango]

hear is my finished bumper it came out at 61lbs a little heavier than i hoped.

101792

[01tundra]

I personally prefer the more simple, lighter approach now a days.......


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v419/01tundra/FrontBumper.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v419/01tundra/RearBumper-2.jpg

[craig333]

I"m just waiting for the cash to do an aluminum bumper. I'd love to do a Reunel, they're only an hour away, but with the dodge every pound counts. Will I hit anything? Its pretty much inevitable unless I want to stay home.

I was rear ended coming home from work. I had visions of massive damage to my camper. Luckily she hit my trailer hitch. Punched a nice hole in her car. Didn't even remove the rust from the ball. I'd rather know I have some protection than have to wait for an insurance check.

Oh, I don't think they're ugly. No rear bumper, now thats ugly.

[REDrum]

Like the photos from down under show, a full "bull bar" does offer more than just a place to mount winch, land limb risers, and add machismo--they could mean getting back to civilization, or not, after an abrupt encounter with a large animal. And, yes, they do help keep to "keep it real" in the Whole Foods parking lot too...

[bob91yj]

I hate the way most of the bumpers stick out so far. I think the extra length of some of them makes the approach angle a wash. Anyone know of a bumper that doesn't have the parcel shelf as part of the design?

[McZippie]

Would a DIY and/or aftermarket Expo type front bumper change how an airbag would 'trigger-off' in an accident?

[Regcabguy]

I live 20 minutes from Aluminess and have toured their factory a few times. Their product is the only way to go for strength without too much weight. When you figure in the standard powdercoating,and outrageous $85 installation,they are very competitive.
I love that place.

[E.J.]

Besides the other benefits mentioned (place to mount a winch, recovery points, more rugged than stock, etc) I'm a little surprised that nobody yet has mentioned the improvement in the approach angle. Modern vehicles all seem to have these low-hanging air dams, probably to improve airflow and to eke out that last little bit of fuel economy (so as to get closer to CAFE standards.) But that low approach angle can hurt you when you're approaching a steep rocky road.
101935
Maximizing approach angle was the number one design consideration behind mine. Every little bit counts with a rig like this.

[TheAlmightySam]

^ That Forester is totally rad. Have you got a build thread anywhere for it?

[E.J.]

Thanks Sam, I've got a journal (http://offroadsubarus.com/showthread.php?t=1370) over at offroadsubarus.com documenting most of the mods.

[brushogger]

For all us Full Size folks make sure to look at Aluminess, they make some amazing light weight but super strong bumpers.
I had one on my Sportmobile front & rear and let me tell you I was able to winch my 11,000lb rig off the front bumper without a worry.
The rear bumper had really cool storage and held a 35in Nitto Trail Grappler without an issue on 1 swingout and a big ol' box full of stuff on the other side.
http://www.aluminess.com

Yeah they are not cheap but that is part of what happens when you think about saving the weight but have it be well engineered.
And they are a great company that uses their product also.

Now if only I could get them to make something for my 70 Burb :)

I live 20 minutes from Aluminess and have toured their factory a few times. Their product is the only way to go for strength without too much weight. When you figure in the standard powdercoating,and outrageous $85 installation,they are very competitive.
I love that place.



X2 . My Aluminess FJ cruiser bumpers are due to ship the 1st or 2nd week of June. The winch bumper 43lb.s. The rear with dual swingaways for spare and 3 fuel cans 75lbs. I cant' wait! They are great guys to deal with too. I wish I only lived 20 min from them. The price on the bumpers is reasonable for what it is. The shipping to Oklahoma is a #$%^&!

[crazyeyez]

Would a DIY and/or aftermarket Expo type front bumper change how an airbag would 'trigger-off' in an accident?

this is something i have always thought about concerning a big heavy steal bumper.

i would have loved get a big bumper, but the price and weight is a downside. and not many ppl sell em for my truck and making one myself wasnt an option. luckly i did find one. its not a full bumper, but more of an extra heavy duty bull bar. seems like most bull bars out there are just for looks and mounting lights. but ever look at the mounting bracket for those bars? thin, i wouldnt trust standing on them, let alone recovery points.
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/crazyeyez1502/IMAG0364.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h291/crazyeyez1502/IMAG0366.jpg

[crazyeyez]

like the basket/bumper!! is that a one off home made or pre-made?

[crazyeyez]

lol, cool. you did a really good job on it

[Stumpalump]

I use stiff bumpers because they are a major part of the frame or unibody rails. With stock flexible bumpers the frames and body will twist way more than you would expect when on uneven surfaces. I recently I removed the stock bumper on an E350 4x4 van and noticed between the bumper and frame horns was a thick plastic spacer. It was not what I would call a solid attachment and the stock steel front bumper could be twisted or flexed by hand. If you follow the frame back past the flexible rubber motor mounts the first solid crossmember is behind the transmission. So basically you have the front frame horns swinging in the breeze. Consider this is the point where the front of the springs mount and you can imagine how much it moves. A solid bumper boxes this in and really tightens up the handling on a loaded rig. It stops creaking and twisting of the whole frame and body.
Unibody vehicles like a Jeep Cherokee are even worse. They flex so much the whole body cracks around the doors,tailgate and floor from all the twisting. Stiff bumpers box all vehicles together and make them better handling, more crash worthy and longer lasting. You can really feel it on and off road.

[redthies]

I use stiff bumpers because they are a major part of the frame or unibody rails. With stock flexible bumpers the frames and body will twist way more than you would expect when on uneven surfaces. I recently I removed the stock bumper on an E350 4x4 van and noticed between the bumper and frame horns was a thick plastic spacer. It was not what I would call a solid attachment and the stock steel front bumper could be twisted or flexed by hand. If you follow the frame back past the flexible rubber motor mounts the first solid crossmember is behind the transmission. So basically you have the front frame horns swinging in the breeze. Consider this is the point where the front of the springs mount and you can imagine how much it moves. A solid bumper boxes this in and really tightens up the handling on a loaded rig. It stops creaking and twisting of the whole frame and body.

I know someone with a few 4x4 E350 conversions. One of them has cracks right through the body at the A pilar, and also between the passenger door and the double doors on the p-side. It is freakin scary! You can lift the roof up and push the windshield out!! Probably due to the flex you describe (and the fact that it spends 80% of its life off pavement).

[TurboChris]

I was grateful I had my custom bumper after this

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/71372-Don-t-over-drive-the-conditions!

[IdaSHO]

I use stiff bumpers because they are a major part of the frame or unibody rails. With stock flexible bumpers the frames and body will twist way more than you would expect when on uneven surfaces. I recently I removed the stock bumper on an E350 4x4 van and noticed between the bumper and frame horns was a thick plastic spacer. It was not what I would call a solid attachment and the stock steel front bumper could be twisted or flexed by hand. If you follow the frame back past the flexible rubber motor mounts the first solid crossmember is behind the transmission. So basically you have the front frame horns swinging in the breeze. Consider this is the point where the front of the springs mount and you can imagine how much it moves. A solid bumper boxes this in and really tightens up the handling on a loaded rig. It stops creaking and twisting of the whole frame and body.
Unibody vehicles like a Jeep Cherokee are even worse. They flex so much the whole body cracks around the doors,tailgate and floor from all the twisting. Stiff bumpers box all vehicles together and make them better handling, more crash worthy and longer lasting. You can really feel it on and off road.

Most truck chassis are designed to flex. Rubber body mounts are intended to isolate the body from the chassis under normal and intended driving conditions. If you are getting cracks in the body, then you are pushing the vehicle beyond its limits, and are asking for trouble. And IMO adding bumpers in order to minimize flex will only complicated things. You are adding rigidity to a chassis in places it wasnt designed/engineered to have them. Could be good, could be bad, but it was never intended.

As for me, I like bumper for two things:

*tow points.
*critical area protection.

Beyond those two, it is simply dressage, IMO. And only adds weight in the wrong place.

[Prybry]

It would be a shame to ruin the clean look of my Power Wagon with a huge hunk of steel or aluminum...
http://i535.photobucket.com/albums/ee357/prybry/PWFW6.jpg
It does just fine, has the winch hidden until needed, it has the tow points to do the job... all while looking clean.
Also has great clearance for entry and departure angles to boot.

It's the finest example of a well built bumper... "function and form" in one design.

Factory is just fine for me...

[mkitchen]

I replaced my stock bumper on the 06 Tacoma because the original was too low and really cut down on entry and exit angles. I also have a 71 F 250 that sees quite a bit of use and it has the original bumper and does fine. It really depends on the vehicle and what you use it for. I do have a heavier steel "Barden" type bumper on the rear of the 71 but it came that way from the dealer and has been there ever since. It is a bit low but well mounted and I have graded a few trails when exiting a wash.
Mikey

[Gary Wescott]

Since our Land Rover days 40 years ago, our expedition trucks have always used heavy duty bumpers. Yes, they hold a winch and driving lights. Yes, they keep cows and horses out of your radiator. And yes, they will also ward off brush, limbs and shopping carts. Similar to the old Rickard Compartment Bumpers used on The Turtle II, Turtle III and Turtle IV, (see the Vehicle page on www.turtleexpedition.com) our new custom Buckstop bumper (www.buckstop.biz) has sealed locking compartments and a covered 15,000 lb Warn winch. It also has dual trailer hitch receivers and two points where a Hi-LIft Jack can lift the corner of the vehicle off the ground. The front axle weight is still less that the rear, and we have had no steering problems even before we installed a ram assist by Lee Power Steering (www.lee-powersteering.com). The heavy duty Rickard Compartment Bumper on The Turtle II probably saved the lives of two people when it was involved in a serious head-on collision in Pennsylvania by its current owner.

Gary Wescott
The Turtle Expedition, Unltd.

105101

[the Rewster]

Well said Gary. With your experience that should be the last word!
Fortunately we can all make our rigs to our own wants and needs.

[88Xj]

Personally for me, I hate most of the aftermarket bumpers for my Cherokee (XJ)..I honestly only like the look of maybe 2...

I do however love this...
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/tucked-trimmed-winch-build-1157408/

Hidden away and if you look, he completely boxed in the front Uni-rails of our Xj's....which will make things quite sturdy up front. I would extend the winch plate on the passenger side a little to act as a splash shield for the alternator, since its located right there. And those 3/16" D-ring mounts look like they will bend sideways if pulled from that angle, so I'd probably go 1/4 on those at least. I'd also extend the mounts back a little further to pick up the HUGE anchor bolt for the factory tow hooks...which would give like 7-9 bolts per side...
Our Xj's are have a incredibly weak steering box spacer, and our driver side Uni-rail takes alot of stress..so with him boxing it in, he replaced the steering box spacer with 3/16" plate....just like the aftermarket "steering box inner brace", but he also spread all that load across both sides of the rail which is awsome.

Add in those few changes above and I'd be happy...I just can't think of a way to add in a thick piece boxed steel (2x2) or something, that will still fit behind the stock bumper. Make it removeable or something, and have it in front of the winch somehow..I'd add that in to help take up some of the force of a impact..kind of help spread the load. Otherwise I love that guys idea!!!

[crazyeyez]

he did a nice job on that XJ. but something i thought of.... dont these winchs have a clutch lever? to disengage the clutch to free spool out the cable? some of these hidden winches, how would you get to the lever?

[redthies]

He said in the last post that he was going to drill a hole in the factory bumper so he could access the clutch.

[crazyeyez]

ah, must have missed that

[IrishXJ]

I had my first run-in with a deer a few months back. It is precisely what spurred me towards the ARB bullbar.

[doug720]

I had my first run-in with a deer a few months back. It is precisely what spurred me towards the ARB bullbar.

Two deer for me over the years...one with stock FJ60 bumper - lite damage as we going under 30 mph and the deer was small, but I was very lucky, second time with ARB and no issues at all, except for the deer who the bears took care of!

If you spend much time in areas with game, good bumpers are important.

Doug

[Demon4x4]

Here's mine, high and tight, pretty lightweight, yet strong, improved approach angle over stock, integrated dual tow points.

http://demon4x4.com/Rigs/Randall/images/slide02.jpg

http://demon4x4.com/Rigs/Randall/images/slide03.jpg

[haven]

Demon4x4, a deer would pass right underneath your vehicle without touching! Cool to see an Explorer on ExPo.

[88Xj]

Well guys I may be starting to change my opinion...I do love the hidden winch & I have a factory tire swing..but no hitch. And my tire swing is wearing out, not wanting to swing as freely anymore..but it is 24 years old! Also on my 2 recent trips, I've found myself digging in front or bagging my rear bumper..and something stronger would be nicer!

So I'm starting to look for some ideas on low profile bumpers. Tire swing, hitch, Drings & 1, maybe 2 jerry cans in the rear. And up front a sturdy brush guard, but still keeping the winch as far back as possible to keep my approach angle. I'm thinking of using 2x3..2x4 at the biggest and building off of it..It will deffinetly be custom, but light and simple with a slight miltary look is what I'm after!
I don't really do any fast offroad wheeling, and don't really have big wild life out here in Socal. But traveling will put me at risk. I was thinking of adding a small brush guard to keep brush away since I only wheel slowly but something bigger will be needed for anything besides bushes!

[88Xj]

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f177/xj-rear-bumper-build-1-a-775547/

Thinking something like this maybe but use 3x3 and welding a spindle through the 3x3 vs welding it to the 3x3...and then building a tire swing & jerry can holder with a intergrated hitch, and yes it will remain cut & fold! It will alos be mounted with 3x3 through the frame rails to really stiffen things up and make them strong back there! The 3x3 through the rails will help keep the back end from twisting while flexing it out!

And in the front I'll do 3x2 and place my winch where the front crossmeber is..and also do d-rings thorugh the bumper with a custom brush guard!

[doug720]

Both times we hit dear were not off-road, but on pavement! Way more dangerous in my opinion as you are moving faster. One of the deer was hit on Smokey Bear Road near Gorman right at Dusk and the other was outside of Bridgeport CA early in ther morning going fishing. Deer are not just in far away locals, but near by SoCal too.

Another thing to consider are cows. If you travel up and down 395 look at how many cows are next to the freeway you can and imagine how many you can't see. Four of our friends hit a cow on 395 about 10 years, killed 3 of them when the cow came through the windshield. Yes in a car, but... A bumper can help, not always, but many times.

Yes they can look a bit poser at times, but if the winch mounted to it gets you unstuck, or the bad driver makes the left in front of you or the one trying to parallel park saves you're front end, why not?

Doug

[Buliwyf]

Just curious, are these bumpers stronger than the frame?

I mean what's the point if they can survive a hit, but just transfer that energy straight to the frame and damage it? Are there considerations about the trucks strength when these are designed? I can torch off a bent bumper on the trail.....

Every time I've seen/driven/ridden in, a truck with a heavy bumper with a few dings, it was on a truck that had no chance of going straight on the freeway.

Not to mention that $3000+ buys alot of spare parts, tires, and stock bumpers. And that's the bottom line for me. I'd love to have an Alumness bumper on the front and rear of my F250, but I'm not too keen on the idea of two bumpers costing more than a complete 100% new/rebuilt engine installed. I'm ok with these folks being proud of thier products, but $3000 for simple bumpers is just plain too much.

[6x6pinz]

big fan of a heavy duty bumper. I made my own and it is stout enough to handle the trail obstacles. I have been on a trail where a boulder had fallen and blocked the way. It was a shelf road and we had been traveling down it for some time. Going around was not an option, neither was backing up. I just pushed it out of the way with the bumper. I could have stopped and setup a winch line but if the boulder went over the edge and tangled the line I am sure it would have taken the truck with it. there have been numerous instances where trees have fallen across the roads and it was very easy to just push them till they moved out of the way or broke allowing me to pass. not too concerned about highway or in town uses as I don't see much of that anyway.

[CodyY]

Not to mention that $3000+ buys alot of spare parts, tires, and stock bumpers. And that's the bottom line for me. I'd love to have an Alumness bumper on the front and rear of my F250, but I'm not too keen on the idea of two bumpers costing more than a complete 100% new/rebuilt engine installed. I'm ok with these folks being proud of thier products, but $3000 for simple bumpers is just plain too much.

Design
prototype
prototype
prototype
materials
Labor
Insurance
rent
Electricity
Bender
Brake
Shear
Waterjet (purchase or subcontract)
Welders
Consumables
Jigs
Storage space
Powder Coating

And tack on enough profit so that as the owner of a small business you get to make enough to pay yourself a wage for your 60-80hr work weeks, paying your accountant, the $3000 license for SolidWorks/AutoCAD, phone bill, internet, web development, and and and and.

Yes, they're expensive, no I can't afford one either. I'm too busy trying to make a living doing everything on the list above.

[hikingff77]

Very Nice. Do you have details of your winch install?

I love the bumpers and all the addons and I agree with reasons on both sides. I'm torn. I'll never have a front bumper, can't afford it. Although I'd like a rear one with tow points, a swing away tire carrier and other possible mounting options.


I personally prefer the more simple, lighter approach now a days.......


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v419/01tundra/FrontBumper.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v419/01tundra/RearBumper-2.jpg

[HARDTRAILZ]

I have my stock plastic junk replaced with custom steel. I would not go back and definitely feel the extra weight is worthwhile.

[Buliwyf]

Design
.

Yes, they're expensive, no I can't afford one either. I'm too busy trying to make a living doing everything on the list above.

I hear ya. I need to try to find a company that deos custom fabbing and makes thier income on other projects and can try a bumper on the side. I can see how a bumper only company is stuck with huge overhead, but there's got to be a company out there that can make quality bumpers for a more reasonable cost than Warn, ARB, Alum, Road Armor etc.

Supply and demand. I think I'd be better off investing in some steel and a welder and fab my own stuff. It ain't rocket science.

I could settle for $1.5k for the front with a simple light bar, and $1k for a rear....

[CodyY]

I hear ya. I need to try to find a company that deos custom fabbing and makes thier income on other projects and can try a bumper on the side. I can see how a bumper only company is stuck with huge overhead, but there's got to be a company out there that can make quality bumpers for a more reasonable cost than Warn, ARB, Alum, Road Armor etc.

Supply and demand. I think I'd be better off investing in some steel and a welder and fab my own stuff. It ain't rocket science.

I could settle for $1.5k for the front with a simple light bar, and $1k for a rear....

What you're looking for is a guy like me that does fab work at home/small shop.

Problem is, guys like me need your truck for a week to build a pair of bumpers. And lots of example photos to base design

[Buliwyf]

The down time isn't a problem. I drive a company van so I can ditch my truck.

I'd just want a simple angled style road armor bumper with ARB style bull bars welded on for grill protection and Lightforce Blitz 240 mounts.

The rear is a bit more complex. Most rears are simple offroad flat clearance bumpers. But I want one that sticks out still like a step bumper, pretty much exactly like the stock F350 bumper, but with stronger steel.

Still, It would be a fun project to do myself.

[DR1665]

Still very new to all this, but I'll offer my interest is also mainly for protection. The animal I seem to encounter most in my travels is the inattentive vehicle operator. Not to be confused with drivers, as there is a distinct difference. For a number of years now, I've decided the majority of my play money will go into the race car, as race tracks and closed roads are the only places left where drivers outnumber operators. My daily driver - my truck - is an easily-replaced, low-buck machine.

That said, I don't want to just leave my guard down. I still (sadly) spend most of my time in the urban jungle. I suspect a set of burly bumpers do a good job of making clueless operators think twice before getting too close to a truck. I'd like that for my little Pajero. "Rock" sliders would have come in handy in the first three weeks I owned it. Still fighting with the Honda driver's insurance to get this resolved.

http://www.tarmac-and-gravel.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/20120408_115734-495x371.jpg

I love, love, love the top shelf builds I see on this site, but I figure if the Top Gear guys can get decrepit, bone stock, beater 4X4s through the Amazon and across the Atacama to the ocean (with help from their service crew friends), my little Mitsu has most of what it needs to survive in the wild. To me, the additional tow points and idiot deterrent properties are the biggest sellers.

Thanks for all the good ideas in this thread, by the way!

[crazyeyez]

as anyone had issues with airbags and these big bumpers?

[Eaglefreek]

I hear ya. I need to try to find a company that deos custom fabbing and makes thier income on other projects and can try a bumper on the side. I can see how a bumper only company is stuck with huge overhead, but there's got to be a company out there that can make quality bumpers for a more reasonable cost than Warn, ARB, Alum, Road Armor etc.

Supply and demand. I think I'd be better off investing in some steel and a welder and fab my own stuff. It ain't rocket science.

I could settle for $1.5k for the front with a simple light bar, and $1k for a rear....

I didn't have the dough to pay someone to build some for me, so I bought a welder and figured it out. I had the critical welding done by a local welding shop. I tacked it and brought it to them. I'm happy with the results and now understand the costs associated with fabbing a bumper. LOTS of time involved. The spare tire has been lowered about 4" since these pics were taken.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/svoman2300/photobucket-1357-1326157429580.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/svoman2300/photobucket-1471-1326156912060.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/svoman2300/AMCEaglerearbumper1.gif
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/svoman2300/AMCEaglerearbumper5.jpg

[crazyeyez]

looks good, Eagle!

[thegreatdivorce]

as anyone had issues with airbags and these big bumpers?

This is the real question, and the one I've never seen adequately answered. Not an issue, perhaps, with older vehicles, but on something newer with sophisticated SRS systems, how do these bumpers effect that? I know ARB touts theirs as airbag compliant, which I've read means that it simply doesn't interfere with deployment.

I think a lot of us can safely say our rigs do a lot of double-duty as family-hauling daily-drivers. On dirt, a bumper makes a lot of sense. But what about when someone makes a left in front of you while you're doing 50+mph? What about at 20mph? Do the airbags deploy too late? Too soon? Do they deploy when they shouldn't, or fail to deploy when they should? I'm not a worrier, but if I'm putting my loved ones in a vehicle, I'd be keen to have at least some sort of answer about this, beyond, "Well it looks strong, and it would probably be fine."

Ya know?

[Bergum]

To answer quick and dirty.
Most likely it will deploy correctly. The sensor triggers on inpact, and that impact (G force) will be the same. Secondly you have a bigger crimp zone, since you are using the other car for your benefit...

B4x4.no

[CodyY]

You would be amazed how often airbags deploy incorrectly as is.

I cornholed a left turner a couple of years ago in my 08 Silverado. Totaling the Chrysler sebring, i got a bumper headlight and fender on my chevy. Bumper wouldn't have made a difference

[biere]

Go hit how it works or something similar to read up on the air bag sensors and what makes them deploy an airbag.

My opinion, the air bags will deploy when the sensor tells it to deploy as normal but these bumper replacements are changing crumple zones and a crumple zone spreads the acceleration time frame out so perhaps an air bag would not need to deploy if you crumpled your hood and fenders and frame up instead of hammering something with a big chunk of steel.

Plus you should read up on crumple zones in vehicles these days because the frames are made to give way these days compared to older vehicles.

I got a rear bumper replacement for a tj the other day. As much as I wanted a tire mount and what not I will go with the stock tailgate setup for now, I don't plan to change from the stock tire size on the next tire purchase so the tailgate will work for a bit.

I wanted a full width metal bumper with recovery points and a rated hitch. I got it. The bumper is not all that heavy and I will reinforce a few things from the looks of it but overall I am dang happy with it and I just think it needs a bit more frame engagement and not anything added to the bumper. The stock one is a joke, 2006 tj so plenty of plastic on it.

For the front I want to mount a winch and lights but I have hit a deer coming home from work in a different vehicle and after seeing the busted headlight, bent up hood, partially crumpled fender, and all the plastic bits busted up I decided from there on I want something sturdy enough to handle a deer.

I admit to liking how a good bumper looks as well. And once I have recovery points or a hitch or a winch I find them to be very useful.

I try to stick to stuff that is well built but not super duper heavy these days.

[CodyY]

Spent a few years in body shops and dealerships, I'm familiar.

I concur on the "not super heavy" too much weight does funky things to the shock valving and spring rates too.

Either way, I've got insurance. :thumbup:

[roving]

i just modified my stock bumper to work with my winch. It only added about 60 lbs total to the front end.

113145

113146

[biere]

I did not mean you specifically needed to go read up on them, I feel it is good for everyone to go read up on them and have an idea on what could make them deploy.

Same with abs and traction control and other stuff new vehicles might come with.

I will be putting a bumper up front first and then probably add in heavier rated springs and the winch at a later date. Will have to pull the bumper to put the winch in most likely since those are the theft deterrants I am looking for with a winch on the jeep.

I don't want to wait until I can afford to do everything at once and I feel having the protection is worth the money and effort I will spend in later taking off the bumper to put a winch in it.

And after thinking about it for a bit I don't know if I would put the bumpers on just because of what I want to do off road. Protection in a slow speed accident on pavement is my main consideration, or a deer for the front bumper part that will protect the headlights and grill.

If going to remote areas I would do the bumpers but if I felt more confident about the deer missing my jeep or the stupid people managing to miss my vehicle I would not worry about the bumpers as much.

[crazyeyez]

thanx for the input guys. something i've been wondering about. theres a bunch of guys on 355Nation with the bar type bullbars like mine, but havent heard of anythem getting into head on wrecks with em.

[BCHauler]

Apparently, I need a heavy duty bumper to protect my truck from my wife attempting difficult maneuvers like exiting our driveway. That rampaging hedge was unavoidable. Smashed headlight, bent hood, dented fender.

[redthies]

Apparently, I need a heavy duty bumper to protect my truck from my wife attempting difficult maneuvers like exiting our driveway. That rampaging hedge was unavoidable. Smashed headlight, bent hood, dented fender.

Damn those rampaging hedges! I have one that tries to attack me when I load my camper... My wife hates the look of the old school warn bumper, but the big flat spot was a great place to park the lunch stuff on our road trip last week.

I'm going to assume your wife doesn't read ExPo often? Or do you sleep with one eye open?:sombrero:

[BCHauler]

No, I sleep okay. I would hear her coming, anyway (see above).

[Keith_Indy]

The bumper is there to protect the vehicle, mount a winch, recovery points, and other necessities (like a hi-lift or lights.) Now, that said, there are some that are way larger then they need to be. I think the Broncoairs bumper I've got on my Bronco is a good starting point. Not to large, good design, good approach angle.

114664

[HARDTRAILZ]

My bumpers were a necessity to me.

I had no tow points, light mounts, or place for a winch up front. I had a giant piece of plastic that offer none of these and had an abysmal approach angle. Also it provided no protection to vital components. I will admit the tube work may be considered excess, but served for light mount and protection from the multitude of suicidal deer in my area.

The bumper was also plastic and hung down low. While I did have a hitch, I did not have any other recovery points if I was towing or needed to rig a winchline. I did not have a place to mount a spare tire or other accessories. The built one is now stronger, has recovery points, has a spare tire mount, has jerry can mount, and has better departure angle.

Both are custom made by MDB Fab with me assisting. Lots of time and thought and labor. Couple pics, but I think they are functional and have truly improved the vehicle without being really superfluous, some may feel different, but to each their own.

http://i1194.photobucket.com/albums/aa370/hardtrailz/2012-07-22_16-03-57_650.jpg

http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr131/hardtrailz400/zzzz.jpg

http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr131/hardtrailz400/z.jpg

http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr131/hardtrailz400/Harrys%20Farm/b2-1.jpg

http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr131/hardtrailz400/Harrys%20Farm/2012-07-15_21-07-45_821.jpg

http://i477.photobucket.com/albums/rr131/hardtrailz400/Harrys%20Farm/2012-07-15_21-05-53_144.jpg

[CodyY]

Nice work. I like em

[HARDTRAILZ]

Thanks

[blue dog]

my Home built job with receiver.

[Jcrayton99]

Same boat as Hardtrails. The stock bumpers on Trailblazers are a joke given the fully boxed frame. The Waag guard welded to mine is a bit much, and I often think of removing it, but I know as soon as I do a deer or something will want to hit me. Rear has yet to be done on mine, and plan on a lot of the same features as his, just a lot smaller and lighter.

[BCHauler]

114664

I like this bumper a lot. This is exactly what I would put on my truck.

[Keith_Indy]

I like this bumper a lot. This is exactly what I would put on my truck.

Here's where I bought it... http://broncoair.com/frontBumper.php

I love it, but it wasn't cheap.

[jronwood]

I perfer non stock bumpers (or a guard out front), just too many animals out there to hit and damage things, that said I HATE most flimsy aftermarket ons, they simply "hold the dent/damage in" after any REAL contact. I have built several, and this was my latest "quick" effort for a trip north for a 2000 mile vacation after putting a $600 tranny cooler on my rig. I got to thinking with the tranny cooler, turbo inercooler and then radiator, if I hit a deer or moose (whatever) it could be 2-3K plus down time. I braced it back to the core support at a key (heavy) junction and it will soon have a "flip down" option as well as a reeese style reciever for a removable winch. Note the heavy solid rod (1 1/2" bacing back) it is ALL solid rod and alot of High carbon I could not use for much else. I did ALOT of preheat before welding to get good welds on the carbon. Lets just say it is SOLID. Dont rely on the cantilevered ones form down low, you gotta use REAL steel and brace it back, yes it is HEAVY, but to me it is worth it.

117265117266

[Mrk1]

I had an ARB on my land cruiser and I thought it was much much to heavy. Personally I dont rock crawl so it dont need a bumper to bounce off rocks, but I agree the factory bumper especially now in the days of plastic everything there is much to be desired.

Im going to fabricate a bumper for my land rover now and am aiming to provide protection from obstacles and animals but keep an eye on weight for performance and mileage. At the end of the day when building a rig you need to consider what your actually going to do with the thing

[Jitterbug]

Modern bumpers are a designed weak spot, by fitting a really strong front bumper you are moving the weak spot elswhere. Granted most of the time that 'elswhere' is the animal/tree/other vehicle, but not always.

A good friend of mine was recently in an accident in his 79 series Land Cruiser Ute, with ARB winch bumper. If he had the standard bumper he would have been left with a destroyed bumper, smashed up cooling system and a heap of front end panel damage, because of the HD steel winch bumper he has minimal bumper damage, no cooling system damage and minimal body damage BUT ended up with a twisted chassis...

I guess it is a fine line between making the bumper strong enough to withstand impacts but still being weaker than the chassis it is mounted too so it twists/deforms before your chassis does!

[Jcrayton99]

I believe our bumpers made for the TBs are made out of 3/16 steel because of this. Our frame is stronger than the bumper so it still takes the force, but it can handle it better than the stock.

[HARDTRAILZ]

Modern bumpers are a designed weak spot, by fitting a really strong front bumper you are moving the weak spot elswhere. Granted most of the time that 'elswhere' is the animal/tree/other vehicle, but not always.

A good friend of mine was recently in an accident in his 79 series Land Cruiser Ute, with ARB winch bumper. If he had the standard bumper he would have been left with a destroyed bumper, smashed up cooling system and a heap of front end panel damage, because of the HD steel winch bumper he has minimal bumper damage, no cooling system damage and minimal body damage BUT ended up with a twisted chassis...

I guess it is a fine line between making the bumper strong enough to withstand impacts but still being weaker than the chassis it is mounted too so it twists/deforms before your chassis does!
The twisted frame doesnt leave you stuck in the boonies but the other damage would have. I would rather be home w a bent chassis than starving 100 miles from nowhere.

[bfdiesel]

Modern bumpers are a designed weak spot, by fitting a really strong front bumper you are moving the weak spot elswhere. Granted most of the time that 'elswhere' is the animal/tree/other vehicle, but not always.

A good friend of mine was recently in an accident in his 79 series Land Cruiser Ute, with ARB winch bumper. If he had the standard bumper he would have been left with a destroyed bumper, smashed up cooling system and a heap of front end panel damage, because of the HD steel winch bumper he has minimal bumper damage, no cooling system damage and minimal body damage BUT ended up with a twisted chassis...

I guess it is a fine line between making the bumper strong enough to withstand impacts but still being weaker than the chassis it is mounted too so it twists/deforms before your chassis does!
So he was still able to drive home? Sounds like a win.

[Bergum]

Actualy, a bumper has two jobs.
Offroad, it has to take down trees, push rocks and keep the engine safe.

Onroad it has to dampen the impact in a smash. This will reduse the strain on your body, and keep you alive.....

So, basicly a bumper has to be designed to whitstand low speed impacts, but deform at impact at high speed.
Can you make that??? :-)

So, Heavy bumper? yes please, that is, Offroad.
Stock bumper? No, I will take a well enginered ARB any day. That is, since i trust them with my life....

Now i drive a Suzuki Samurai, and I know that in a collision over 70Km/h, I will be dead. That's it...

[craig333]

Yeah, in my Jeep I don't stand much chance in a high speed collision. Hopefully the truck does better.
http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk132/craig195/bumpic_zps0cdefe23.jpg

[eggman918]

3 or 4 years I was on a forest service road in the sierras and was not paying attention let the truck get the bit in it's teeth and went off the side of the mountain!
400' later I came to a stop against another road thankfully I did not get sideways and was able to drive it home there was no damage to my truck
I knocked 6 or 8 small pine trees over on the trip down.I credit my "over kill" bumper with the positive outcome of that little "side trip".
In a collision I will put my faith in physics...mass X velocity squared the truck weighs 7500lbs so I should out weigh most of the vehicles I might bump in to.

[The Fleckster]

I thought you may like to see a few of the bumpers i have build over the years. They may not be all out Expedition bumpers, but i guess that depends on your definition. These happen to be on Scouts but seem to fit almost perfect on older Toyotas too.
I custom made these. One went to Alaska to the Town Sheriff. It was the one that encased the winch. He specked security, so i made it so you bolt the winch in, then bolt the bumper in and tack weld the nuts. Then you can not steal the winch without having to cut the bolts off and remove the bumper. :victory:

[The Fleckster]

Here is another cool one i did and incorporated the tow bar into the pull points. The clevis mounts go all the way through the bumper and are lined up with the frame rails for strength and so you do not deform the front face of the bumper in a hard pull or impact. # Winning

[The Fleckster]

Here is one i did on an expedition style scout. It has 60 Pin led turn signals, then the 100 Watt flood lights are angled out since it has H-4 Hella headlights. This gives a broad range of light up front. Then below it has Piaa driving fog light combo lights. The winch is inside centered for weight per the customer's request. It has pull points and headlight surround bars. Most of this bumper is 3/16" with angles for better approach angle.

The rear hold a swing out tire carrier, and holds two jerry cans, a Highlift, and has room to mount a shovel and ax behind the tire. Then i powder coated both bumpers.

[The Fleckster]

Here is a Jeep Cherokee i did for a expedition Jeep Cherokee. The guy was also a volunteer fire fighter. It had to have everything.

[Containerized]

Given that my girlfriend and I could have died last year with some SLIGHTLY different circumstances (Toyota Hiace against a medium-sized cow... impact was substantial, but we were fine...), I'm an even bigger believer now in steel bumpers.

[eurosonic]

Here is a truck that I bought for parts.

Might not be exactly overland-use related, but here is an example of ARB bumper under "heavy stress".

Although it does look nasty, but if it wasn't for the bumper, it could've been far worse.

http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx73/eurosonik/12510492_2X.jpg

http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx73/eurosonik/12510492_7X.jpg

[Scott C]

That thing just needs a good alignment and it could be back on the road!

[88Xj]

^^ Haha, makes me very happy I held out for my ARB..only complaints are that I'll need full length mounting brackets made up & beef up the recovery area. The small little 1/8" plate that holds the Drings will rip quite easily..gonna weld in a 1/2" think plate on either side or something to make it much strong for side - side pulls, as well as straight on pulls.

[The Fleckster]

wow, thats some accident. What did that "parts rig" cost you. Looks like the winch will be usable. I assume you needed some interior parts?

[eurosonic]

wow, thats some accident. What did that "parts rig" cost you. Looks like the winch will be usable. I assume you needed some interior parts?

Well, lets just say that I would've payed more for a winch and snorkel by themselves.

[Black Dog]

Well I'm a big bumper devotee now. Two nights ago I hit a really big buck in full rut at about 55mph. Without the bumper I would have had some serious damage, but with it it isn't so bad. It kind of looks like the bumper twisted and wrapped under a little bit upon impact which made the edge of the bumper come into contact with the front edge of the wheel well. So its a dent about 3-4 inches long after hitting a 200 pound deer instead of a costly fixit job.

[jronwood]

Here is a picture of the style of the two back bumpers I built, one for my F350 CC/CC, the other for my F550 log hauler. They act as steps to access the beds and have 8x8 box tubes not yet capped and "doored" for tire chain storage. I suppose while not "off road" they provide another set of ideas for functionality.....I have lots of Reese style recievers for mounting multiple level hitches AND for salt spreader (plow truck also) and potentially for a backhoe (truck has wet lines to the rear).

134794134795134796134797

[Box Rocket]

Stonger aftermarket bumpers have always been worth it to me. A lot is based on how I typically use my vehicles which is some mild overland/camping with a mixture of moderate-difficult rockcrawling. If it was purely overland travel then my approach might be different but since i play in the rocks too it means it's worth it to have a little extra beef to keep things protected.

For me the necessary elements of good bumpers are:

1) Protection from rocks and other trail obstacles, but still maintain excellent approach and departure angles as much as possible.
2) some improved protection from animal strikes (but that's lower on list since most of the places I wheel rarely encounter animals)
3) winch mounting for the front bumper, as well as recovey points at the front and the rear.
4) location for things like spare tire, hilift, fuel. (I don't like any of those things taking up space inside the truck and rarely can a fit a big enough spare tire in a factory location)
5) Aesthetics. Maybe because I'm an artist for my day job I can't go purely for function when I consider bumpers or anything else on my trucks for that matter. It still needs to meet my functional requirements but I like it to look well designed. Sometimes that's a difficult balance and in the end function will always win out but as much as possible I try to make it look good too.

So from my experience that includes LOTS of rock bashing, a couple different deer that have moved on to a better place, and just the things you figure out over time that make life on trails more convenient I've settled with my current setup on my Tacoma (which happens to be a very similar setup to what I've had on my FJ40 and my FZJ80.

For the front I chose a TrailGear low profile bumper with light bar. This is the first tube style bumper Ive had. Aesthetically tube is not for everyone. But for me this bumper has been great and has met all my requirements. I particularly like the high clearance it offers and it has given excellent protection so far.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7836.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7837.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7834.jpg

For the rear bumper there wasn't anything on the market that met all of what I wanted without a ridiculous pricetag. So I built my own. It happened in phases but I finally completed it over the weekend and gotta say I'm happy with the results.

Started out as a stronger than stock simple bumper that improved clearance, included a reciever hitch so I could tow my trailer and some lower bedside protection.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0154.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0152.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0159.jpg

it still needed a tire carrier so I could carry a fullsize spare that didn't take up bed space. So I built that and added a place for my hilift jack.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_5883.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_5900.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7805.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7897.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7811.jpg

Then I still needed a place for extra fuel/water, and some rear aux lighting. I finally finished that part of it this past weekend with a second swingout. It now has what I need.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0249.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0258.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0262.jpg

Both of these bumpers have taken some solid abuse. Without question the factory bumpers would have been destroyed by now and I'm sure there would be other damage to the truck as a result. So from my perspective in answer to the original question of the thread, heavy duty bumpers are a practical necessity with nothing superfluous about it.

[eurosonic]

^ wow, well done!

http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx73/eurosonik/GIFs/0.gif

[User113]

Custom bumpers don't have to be expensive, why not try a little bit of electrical conduit from your local home improvement center?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpxGDHvm1n0

Makes me laugh every time I see it! Especially the part where he says "Nothing wrong with it!"

[Holland]

Stonger aftermarket bumpers have always been worth it to me. A lot is based on how I typically use my vehicles which is some mild overland/camping with a mixture of moderate-difficult rockcrawling. If it was purely overland travel then my approach might be different but since i play in the rocks too it means it's worth it to have a little extra beef to keep things protected.

For me the necessary elements of good bumpers are:

1) Protection from rocks and other trail obstacles, but still maintain excellent approach and departure angles as much as possible.
2) some improved protection from animal strikes (but that's lower on list since most of the places I wheel rarely encounter animals)
3) winch mounting for the front bumper, as well as recovey points at the front and the rear.
4) location for things like spare tire, hilift, fuel. (I don't like any of those things taking up space inside the truck and rarely can a fit a big enough spare tire in a factory location)
5) Aesthetics. Maybe because I'm an artist for my day job I can't go purely for function when I consider bumpers or anything else on my trucks for that matter. It still needs to meet my functional requirements but I like it to look well designed. Sometimes that's a difficult balance and in the end function will always win out but as much as possible I try to make it look good too.

So from my experience that includes LOTS of rock bashing, a couple different deer that have moved on to a better place, and just the things you figure out over time that make life on trails more convenient I've settled with my current setup on my Tacoma (which happens to be a very similar setup to what I've had on my FJ40 and my FZJ80.

For the front I chose a TrailGear low profile bumper with light bar. This is the first tube style bumper Ive had. Aesthetically tube is not for everyone. But for me this bumper has been great and has met all my requirements. I particularly like the high clearance it offers and it has given excellent protection so far.

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7836.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7837.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7834.jpg

For the rear bumper there wasn't anything on the market that met all of what I wanted without a ridiculous pricetag. So I built my own. It happened in phases but I finally completed it over the weekend and gotta say I'm happy with the results.

Started out as a stronger than stock simple bumper that improved clearance, included a reciever hitch so I could tow my trailer and some lower bedside protection.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0154.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0152.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0159.jpg

it still needed a tire carrier so I could carry a fullsize spare that didn't take up bed space. So I built that and added a place for my hilift jack.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_5883.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_5900.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7805.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7897.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/Aug_2012_photoshoot/_MG_7811.jpg

Then I still needed a place for extra fuel/water, and some rear aux lighting. I finally finished that part of it this past weekend with a second swingout. It now has what I need.
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0249.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0258.jpg

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/boxrocket/Gold%20Truck/_MG_0262.jpg

Both of these bumpers have taken some solid abuse. Without question the factory bumpers would have been destroyed by now and I'm sure there would be other damage to the truck as a result. So from my perspective in answer to the original question of the thread, heavy duty bumpers are a practical necessity with nothing superfluous about it.

I have to say that I have never liked that style of bumper ever until now. Super phenomenal.

[The Fleckster]

Custom bumpers don't have to be expensive, why not try a little bit of electrical conduit from your local home improvement center?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpxGDHvm1n0

Makes me laugh every time I see it! Especially the part where he says "Nothing wrong with it!"

WOW are you kidding me? Dude i laughed pretty hard, but also sad to see people that are so clueless in our society. Some poor shopping cart is missing its tubework at the Safeway. Its waxed daily cause the wax from yesterday faded overnight and dripped off its so slippery..... The shovels so you can get other people unstuck..... The trail rated badge....... Its got the owners manual at 100,000 miles cause most just rot by that mileage...... Its got the mercedes key...WTF...... They must smoke some wacky tabackee up there in Staton Island, thoes tires go anyway....sentance was truncated. should have left the rest thoes tires go anywhere at the local mall, but the painted stock wheels to give it that look..... Oh i cant go on anymore my eyes, my eyes. I gotta go get a plane ticket to fly in and buy this if someone else still has not beat me to it.

I think a good prank call is in order to "Buy" this with a recorded conversation. I can see that being a viral hit on Youtube etc :luxhello:

..... Hello such and such auto sales, ...Yes i am calling about one of your Black Ops edition badass Jeeps i saw online. Dude i sooo want it. Is it still for sale? ..... Well that one sold to the cast member the "Situation" from Jersey shore, but we would be happy to make you one custom. ..... Oh right on, what is the wait time, Its gotta be a pretty long line....like a year. . Oh no sir we have production of that special package edition down to say a week turnaround.....On mine can i pay extra to have the back KC lights hooked up so the wires just don't hang? ..... 8).... Yes sir you could, that would be an upcharge of $200..... Good good i am on-board with that. Can you spec mine out with extra thick plastic floor mats for really heavy situations i might encounter on a mission?........Yes sir we can do that for an additional $89.95 each floor mat. ....Sweet you guys are the best, finally someone who will build me my dream offroad badass expedition Jeep. Can you chrome the shocks though? I want the bad guys to see the bling when i jump the rig as i am speeding away from danger or bugging out from the zombies..... That will run...let me see where my figure is at, we just did that on Wesley Snipes personal edition....$289 each shock. ... Awesome....Winning......Oh Oh how about that owners manual, can you make a diamond plate hard bound edition of that so when i bust it out to read up on changing a flat tire my posse see's that i am so dope that i gots bling even in my glove box.....You got it Boss, add $499....ok ok cool, and how about a few years of the special "Daily" brand name wax you use on it..... Yours for the bargain add on of only $78.95 a can...... Dude this is the best day ever.....so we are up to like $50 ta 60 G's right cause I got 75 Grand to spend. What else can you suggest to put this thing over the top and make me the baddest baller hardcore player mother out there on the club scene? .... Well I am glad you asked cause we have been holding off on this one mod for someone very special to come along like you. Do you like gold plating and your name on the dash?...... Dude you read my mind....oh my god this is so destiny that i called you today.....



OK i could go on and on, but i will have to pick this up later if anyone is interested in my comedic genius drival....hahahahahha :Wow1: :safari-rig: :jumping::jumping::jumping: :hehe:

[Box Rocket]

I have to say that I have never liked that style of bumper ever until now. Super phenomenal.

Thanks. Which bumper style were you talking about? Front or rear?

[brushogger]

My Aluminess bumpers have already paid for themselves. On a recent Kiamichi trail trip we were caught in a rain storm which upped the trail rating considerably. Sliding into
ruts put each corner into the wall several times. Zero damage. If I would have still been running the stock plastic FJ bumpers, they would have been completely destroyed along with significant body damage.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Cee-Jay]

Here is a perspective shared by Scott Brady in the article The Modern Explorer in the Spring 2013 issue of Overland Journal:


It is important for me to note that a heavy bumper, winch, etc. is absolutely not required for long-distance adventure travel. However, if it is your desire to incorporate remote dirt tracks, mud, and snow, then it is worth evaluating. As with any modification, accessory, or piece of equipment, it all comes at a a cost to available payload.

Cee-Jay

[SoCalMonty]

I'll beat the dead horse!!! :)

Specifically for overlanding? Superfluous.

But can it come in handy in a variety of situations, not specific to overlanding? Of course. You can justify the aftermarket bumper in 101 ways. But, you can sill go on the same trips with your stock bumper and be just fine. Know what I mean?

For me, it's about cost vs function. I picked up a pair of Smittybuilt bumpers for $135. One was for a Mighty Max, one was for a TJ. I'll be modding them and putting them on in the next couple weeks. For me, part of the reason was that I installed a small (1") body lift. Since the bumpers bolt to the frame, they stayed an inch lower than the body and the gap looks goofy. I figure if I'm going to take the time to modify bumpers to get them back up to the body, I may as well modify beefier ones that offer better clearance for rock crawling and some brush protection up front, as well as less plastic to tear off the truck as an added bonus (no more bumper end caps).

Often, they are overkill...I don't want to add 100 lbs of anchor out past my axles. Terrible for handling, and that's 100 lbs less gear I can carry inside. I was careful to get bumpers that weren't boat anchors, but were still more robust than the stock units.

[scottman]

For all us Full Size folks make sure to look at Aluminess, they make some amazing light weight but super strong bumpers.
I had one on my Sportmobile front & rear and let me tell you I was able to winch my 11,000lb rig off the front bumper without a worry.
The rear bumper had really cool storage and held a 35in Nitto Trail Grappler without an issue on 1 swingout and a big ol' box full of stuff on the other side.
http://www.aluminess.com

Yeah they are not cheap but that is part of what happens when you think about saving the weight but have it be well engineered.
And they are a great company that uses their product also.

Now if only I could get them to make something for my 70 Burb :)

Second this, Aluminess.com makes some amazing bumpers and racks. Super sturdy and both front and back bumpers include additional storage options, all without the weight of steel.

[daddyusmaximus]

Heavy duty bumpers, for me, are necessary. Not for overlanding... for every day!


Country road, late night, go around corner, hit deer... With a stock bumper, you're dead in the road. with something more substantial, you're just moving the carcass off the road to be nice to other drivers. (and there are larger animals than deer) I've killer deer with my Ranch Hand, and survived a tractor trailer pushing me back 3 feet.


Still need to improve as I want to add a winch on front, and spare tire swing out on the rear, only but heavy duty will do.


http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc306/daddyusmaximus/004-1.jpg

[mowerman]

MIne are on to reduce approach and departure angles, support my winch, provide secure jacking and recovery points and provide protection to the truck should I slide into a hill or tree that happened to jump out in front of me! :)
It is worth remembering that stock bumpers are also there to try to avoid damage to pedestrians as awell as provide a crumply bit when you hit someone else