VOLVO TGB Expedition Camper

Very cool - if you have photos posted elsewhere, please post the location! If I ever end up with one, it would have to have PS so my wife could drive. Of course then she would prefer an automatic transmission, too ... That brings up if an auto is added, is it better to swap out a whole engine ...

I have, here's the location:
http://forum.terrangbil.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=3556&PN=1&title=terrncamper
It's the swedish forum for Volvo terrängbilar. I have posted the direct link to my thread. Just look for the pics of the servo (I think it's on page 4...)

It would be very hard to fit an auto in these vehicles since the length of the drivetrain is an issue... The length of the original package is around 130 cm or 52"

Christian said:

I have, here's the location:
http://forum.terrangbil.net/forum_posts.asp?TID=3556&PN=1&title=terrncamper
It's the swedish forum for Volvo terrängbilar. I have posted the direct link to my thread. Just look for the pics of the servo (I think it's on page 4...)

It would be very hard to fit an auto in these vehicles since the length of the drivetrain is an issue... The length of the original package is around 130 cm or 52"

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52" as in fan blade to the prop shaft? I have had this crazy notion about seeing how a Mazda Rotary engine/auto trans would fit in the truck :coffeedrink:
Thanks for the link to the pix!

I have had this crazy notion about seeing how a Mazda Rotary engine/auto trans would fit in the truck

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While many would consider this absolutely crazy (especially as far as fuel consumption figures go) I once saw a Mazda 13B turbo in a 2WD Mitsubishi FE delivery truck as a replacement for the original small diesel. The pulling power at highway speeds up long steep hills was nothing short of incredible. If anyone ever says rotarys don't have any torque, I'll shut my ears from now on.

Hope this doesn't go OT.

whatcharterboat said:

While many would consider this absolutely crazy (especially as far as fuel consumption figures go) I once saw a Mazda 13B turbo in a 2WD Mitsubishi FE delivery truck as a replacement for the original small diesel. The pulling power at highway speeds up long steep hills was nothing short of incredible. If anyone ever says rotarys don't have any torque, I'll shut my ears from now on.

Hope this doesn't go OT.

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How much worse could fuel consumption be? How does the economy of the Volvo 164 sedan with a B30 engine (12 - 16 MPG?) compare to a 304 with the B30 (I realize that the specs between the two B30s is not identical.) I have always read the comments about rotary engine fuel consumption. I have read the RX8 NA engine achives between 16 and 22 MPG at 232 HP. I believe the gearing in the AT is not to odd either.

Non of my questions or comments are rhetoric, I have always figured someone else who know more than I has tried a rotary or at least thought about it and concluded that there were too many reasons not to do it. I have not found anything so fare saying try it or don't try it and here is why. Of course since I don't own a 304 at this point the question is somewhat academic ...

I do not have anything against the idea of using a Wnakel engine. I love it when peoble think out of the box, so I say go for it!

I myself prefer Herr Rudolf Christian Karl Diesel contraption over Herr Felix Heinrich Wankels in our application though... I would dread having to rely on exotic Wankel spares in Mongolia!

Christian said:

I do not have anything against the idea of using a Wnakel engine. I love it when peoble think out of the box, so I say go for it!

I myself prefer Herr Rudolf Christian Karl Diesel contraption over Herr Felix Heinrich Wankels in our application though... I would dread having to rely on exotic Wankel spares in Mongolia!

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No question the diesel has some big advantages period. Many of us on the G Wagen forums lament no modern Gs available from MBUSA in diesel. Non the less, I would likely not be in Mongolia, but it is a point well taken. The only thing about that I have considered is the Mazda rotaries way something like 150LB complete. I have no idea how easy and engine is to change, in Mongolia, but having a second complete one seems doable weight wise ... LOL

As I said, before I can go for it, I first need to decide I can aford to aquire the truck itself. My original interest was peaked as a beach/off road camper (we can drive on most of the Gulf Coast beach in Texas.) The order of retrofit would likely be:

1) Improved heat and air conditioning.
2) Insulation, seating and interior mods. Wife and kids say toilet/shower.
3) Power Steering
4) Engine/Transmition

At least planning is cheap ...

Indiana Drew said:

At least planning is cheap ...

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Yeah, looked up some inverter/battery charger systems voor campers/boats.
A nice inverter/charger combination and all the bits and pieces costs about the same as a new set of wheels :Wow1:
And then I'm talking a set of XZL 9.00 tires...

M.Bas said:

Yeah, looked up some inverter/battery charger systems voor campers/boats.
A nice inverter/charger combination and all the bits and pieces costs about the same as a new set of wheels :Wow1:
And then I'm talking a set of XZL 9.00 tires...

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XLZs are virtually priceless in the US as they are not imported. I read on the G forums that they are even somewhat hard to get in the EU regardless of cost.

I figure - though I have not done the math, that making 12VDC out of 24VDC will cost and that installing a generator, it would either have to run inconjunction with the engine to run air conditioning or that dual AC would have to be used to cover both front and mid cabin seats ... I gather that an air conditioning compressor and bracket could be used from a 164?

Take a look at http://www.trog.us/ for inspiration. That is a beautiful and mammoth build.
I have just completed a servo mod on ours and have just made a linkage system to operate the Toyota (Aisin really) R150F gearbox from the cab. Next big thing will be installing the Toyota 1KZ-T engine.

Indiana Drew said:

XLZs are virtually priceless in the US as they are not imported. I read on the G forums that they are even somewhat hard to get in the EU regardless of cost.

I figure - though I have not done the math, that making 12VDC out of 24VDC will cost and that installing a generator, it would either have to run inconjunction with the engine to run air conditioning or that dual AC would have to be used to cover both front and mid cabin seats ... I gather that an air conditioning compressor and bracket could be used from a 164?

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For that amount of money you only get a 24V inverter/charger (one like in the OKA camper elsewhere in this subforum), 12V is a bit cheaper, but in my case a bit more complex with everything being 24V. With 24V you can also reduce the thickness of the wires. Some equipment can be a challenge tho...

Making 12VDC out of 24VDC is relatively simple and cheap, step-down converters in all sizes/prices available. I'm not planning on using a generator/aircon maybe some solar power in the future.
Haven't worked out the electrical system yet. But the big lines are visible inside my mind.

When the TGB is back from the garage I'm first going to make a 3D model to check how/where I want to fit everything.

And being an Electrical Engineer I'm surely going to make some nice schedules of the electrical part

Christian said:

Take a look at http://www.trog.us/ for inspiration. That is a beautiful and mammoth build.
I have just completed a servo mod on ours and have just made a linkage system to operate the Toyota (Aisin really) R150F gearbox from the cab. Next big thing will be installing the Toyota 1KZ-T engine.

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Seems like I have seen the drawing for the "Trog" on some post, but I don't recall the whole blog - that is a real undertaking! I wonder if it is only to be a ride for two people or if people will be able to sit in the back with the top down? I'll have to read that when I have more time ... Is that 306 longer than the 304/GTB13? As far as I can tell, the cheapest way to get one over here in the US is to buy and import it. As long as vehicles are at least 25yrs old, no problem as I'm sure you know. I really want to find one near me to be able to have a look. I know there are Pinz and Mogs, but gather Volvos are even more rare ... Thanks for the link!

Oh and any idea about how long an engine transmision can be to fit in and still get a shaft to the TC?

M.Bas said:

For that amount of money you only get a 24V inverter/charger (one like in the OKA camper elsewhere in this subforum), 12V is a bit cheaper, but in my case a bit more complex with everything being 24V. With 24V you can also reduce the thickness of the wires. Some equipment can be a challenge tho...

Making 12VDC out of 24VDC is relatively simple and cheap, step-down converters in all sizes/prices available. I'm not planning on using a generator/aircon maybe some solar power in the future.
Haven't worked out the electrical system yet. But the big lines are visible inside my mind.

When the TGB is back from the garage I'm first going to make a 3D model to check how/where I want to fit everything.

And being an Electrical Engineer I'm surely going to make some nice schedules of the electrical part

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Pretty sure living in your area air conditioning is not as needed as where I live ... :sombrero:

I have always read the comments about rotary engine fuel consumption. I have read the RX8 NA engine achives between 16 and 22 MPG at 232 HP.

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Indiana Drew, Fuel consumption has always been a drawback with rotaries in the past and I believe Mazda went all out to address this with the new generation engine in the RX8. Obviously they had a win. Previous engines that I’ve had experience with returned similar consumption figures to a small block V8 (and with the same sort of power too).

BTW I do a lot of electrical work on 24volt trucks for use as expedition vehicles so the question of 12v VS 24v is always on my mind. If you can get everything in 24v , then stay with it . Definitely. If you want solar down the track, then don’t use 24 /12V converters if you can help it. We use some neat little Switch Mode units that are fairly efficient but as a rule > if it’s got a big heat sink with aluminium fins hanging off it don’t use it where efficiency is an issue. And with solar, it is an issue. I can usually find most gear in 24volt, especially the bigger DC loads like refrigeration and pumps. Lighting is OK too but when you start looking for options in electronics / audio / Navigation if you can get them they are usually expensive and you are more limited to what you can get.

Having the camper running at the same voltage as the truck also simplifies your charging system and gives you the security of being able to “emergency parallel” quickly and easily. Plus (as was also mentioned earlier) your cable sizes can be halved and voltage drop is less of a problem effectively giving you a more reliable system. This is the reason new trucks are going to much higher voltages in the future. 48V and I even heard of up to 72V is being considered.

However if you think you really need to have a 12v system give a lot of thought to how you intend to charge it. A separate 12 volt generator with a smart reg. Some type of 24/12 battery charger or even 24V house battery bank and mainly 24v gear with a reducer only for the 12v appliances that can’t be bought as 24v.

There is actually plenty more different combinations you could go here. My only advice is to not make it too complicated. Electronics can fail. If you have a look at what’s available in the marine industry, you’ll be surprised what you get in 24V. Most RV suppliers won’t bother stocking it

whatcharterboat said:

However if you think you really need to have a 12v system give a lot of thought to how you intend to charge it. A separate 12 volt generator with a smart reg. Some type of 24/12 battery charger or even 24V house battery bank and mainly 24v gear with a reducer only for the 12v appliances that can’t be bought as 24v.

There is actually plenty more different combinations you could go here. My only advice is to not make it too complicated. Electronics can fail. If you have a look at what’s available in the marine industry, you’ll be surprised what you get in 24V. Most RV suppliers won’t bother stocking it

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I think I'll end up with 24VDC, an 230VAC inverter and perhaps a small 12VDC converter. But probably don't need the converter since all my (battery) chargers are 230VAC. The fridge is 12/24/230 so that no problem either.

And currently I don't have any other electronics.

Those marine guys centainly have very nice stuff :drool:
Found a Dutch manufacturer last week that makes all sorts of chargers/inverters. Their equipment is even used in ambulances, huge yachts and by the military. If it is good enough for them, it will probably be good enough for me But again, those things cost big money...