Re-sealing older Alaskan camper

Hi again.
As I indicated in my Alaskan purchase post, I'd like to re-seal and re-caulk my Alaskan while in the garage this Fall.

Attached is a picture of mine with arrows to show the places I figure should be re-caulked with new sealant, and would appreciate confirmation from you that these are the spots that should be addressed, and whether I am missing some.

I also want to either adjust the top door so it shuts more snugly, or install a thicker sealing strip because there is currently a gap that probably allows rain to get in and accounts for some wood rotting on the bottom of that door.

For sealant, I have been advised by Peter (Basinranger) to use Sikaflex polyurethane sealant (which I can obtain locally). Some of their marine products look particularly well suited:

http://www.sika.ca/ind-mar-mar_prod.htm

Peter also gave insightful advice on areas to deal with:

Looking at the exterior trim it looks like the original sealant - which I wouldn't trust at all - you won't see any evidence of leakage till it's done some damage so to labor the point a bit - I'd re-seal all the exterior trim & penetrations before too long...You've got just a spot of stain on that inner front left top corner which is from the edge trim sealant failing. I'd also pull all the exterior screws, give the holes some sealant if they are sound & a syringe of epoxy if they aren't & re-fasten. That & epoxy seal the exposed bottom ply would give your Alaskan a LONG rot free life. That 40 year old sealant & leaking screw holes are what kill these campers...

Since the aluminum can't leak it's only the screw holes to worry about. After I pull one out if there's no sign of rust & they weren't stripped in the wood stringer that runs under the skin I just put a dab of sikaflex & put it back. If the screw was stripped (well the wood actually) I mark that hole & keep moving doing the sikaflex the holes routine. Later I mix some thickened epoxy, put it into a syringe and pump that into all the bad holes. Next day just sika & replace the screws. Goes pretty fast.

These things live outdoors just fine - as long as all the holes in your skin are sealed. The original sealant was a mastic like you describe - pretty good stuff but asking it to last 4 + decades...? It will still be flexible & look ok and leak like hell - at least that's my experience. Polyurethanes like Sikaflex are vastly superior.

Any other recommendations (places to reseal, and/or products to use)?

Thanks a lot!:ylsmoke:
--Robert

Some input from another forum...

Here's what someone posted on another forum (for those who might be interested):
http://www.wanderthewest.com/forum/index.php?/forum/18/

Caulking with an Alaskan is kind of like placing a bandage over a wound. The screws that penetrate the skin are the culprits and there are a be-gillion of them.

Some of the sealants used in the original construction are linseed oil based...works well with wood and a coat of paint but today there are several others better suited to our needs. Sika is an excellent product, the polyurethane caulk is one of the best, used as a finish caulking over edges with the tip of the tube cut properly.

However, if you're going to attack this problem at the source, there is another layer to consider.

Original installation has a layer of sealant under the flashing, eyebrows and at the doors...(which is a horse of a different color). Under eyebrows, gutter ends, windows and front drip I used a butyl glazing tape, available at your local glass shop. The material does not dry, remains flexible and fills every conceivable deviation in the surface. It's easy to apply and sticks to almost any relatively clean surface...clothing included.

It is applied UNDER the flashing, eyebrow and after the screws are replaced can be carefully trimmed with a sharp razor blade. After that, the fine caulking line of urethane can be applied on the edge of the flashing, providing a flexible edge covering which will weather well and be paintable as well.

Covering the edges, without sealing the surface under it is tantamount to hiding the problem and it WILL bite you....later down the road.

Surfaces move and shift on these campers and the top edge seals will get broken and wear with constant uv damage. The underseal needs to be just as good if not better than the surface coat. when caught by the threads of the screws the butyl will track into the screwholes too.

when you use the polyurethane caulk as a finish to the edge of the flashing, it now is a paintable surface. Linear polyurethane paint bonds well with it and provides yet another layer of protection. While a little difficult to work with linear poly is an aircraft paint and will provide a fine surface for many years. It stands up to the UV better than any latex or oil based paint and is fairly forgiving when it comes to glossing with a gun.

More.....much more

Thanks for the additional tips Peter.
There's a marine store near me that sell Sika and a number of other products, so I'll go shopping there for my supplies.

I presume they'll have some of the "epoxy filler" you mentioned, as well as syringes to push it into screw holes.

I used a picture of my camper to indicate the spots I understand should be given some attention during this re-caulking exercice.



1. the "eyebrows" above all windows and door
2. the two longitudinal moldings that allow hooking on the awning
3. the roof vent
4. the two long curved roof-end moldings at front and back
5. the window frame connections to the sides
6. the multitudinous screws securing the aluminum siding (and other areas)
7. the jack mounting plates at 4 corners
8. all light and reflector connections to the body
9. the upper door weatherstrip
10. the furnace vent cover (and any other such external panels - e.g. fridge vent)
11. the electrical connector seals
12. the screws that vertically hold the metal piece that backs the flexible seal (as you indicated).

(Have I missed any obvious places?)

Whew, that makes for a lot of caulking/weatherstripping, and is more work than I had originally anticipated... But once it's all done, I will be more confident leaving the camper on the truck for extended periods, and storing it outside for the winter, under a tarp.

It's convenient for me that I have it in my garage, and I have a window of opportunity to deal with this re-caulking business this Fall (before the weather gets too cool) and finish in the Spring if I have to.

Another question: would it be a good idea to paint the exterior side of the bottom plywood, as a preservative measure? If so, what kind of paint or finish would be recommended?

Thanks a lot.

Hey Peter, you the man!
Well, your wife had me worried there so I went out to the garage and it's definitely a 10 footer!

I'm thankful for the information on West and System Three, which I'll familiarize myself with before I buy any of their products (available locally at this marine shop, who also sell the sika stuff).

Very helpful to have an idea of priorities from you, and also those useful insights and tips on all the spots I marked in the picture.

Hopefully, this thread, the picture, and your excellent explanations, will also be useful to others stumbling upon it in the future with similar Alaskan questions/Issues.

Anyway, next step is to educate myself on the products, then go out and buy some and have a go at it; as you indicated, start with the easier things to get me used to working with this stuff.

You mentioned silicone, which I have read on RV sites as not recommended for sealing and caulking, but as you suggested, might be ok if it's something one envisions having to remove at some point. Otherwise I'll go with Sika or the epoxy, which I gather is more of a permanent thing (well, on there and doing the job for a couple of decades anyway!)

Well, this should be a fun little project, unless I get the darn epoxy all over the place! Masking with the blue tape is an excellent idea! I'll see how much I can get done before the garage gets too cold to work with this stuff. Then the rest will get done in the Spring.

Again, much obliged, great to be able to benefit from your helpful advice on this!

Cheers,
--Robert

Started re-sealing the camper

Started taking off the mouldings on the camper. Butyl everywhere. Some of it evidently replaced not too many years ago. Especially under the eyebrow pieces, where I could see that the original mounting screw holes had been plugged and new holes for the new eyebrows drilled, along with butyl that was still quite soft. Could have left them in there and saved my self some work, but I figured I'd take things off just to see if there was any damage underneath.

There are 2 roof seams off-center, which can be seen once the edge trim and butyl is removed at each end. Aluminum is folded upon itself so doubt it would leak, but will run a bead down the thin longitudinal line on the roof for good measure.

Removed one side window, which looked like original butyl seal, but still good probably. No sign of rot on the frame anywhere, which is a good sign! Will replace with the sikaflex caulking, as I will do with most other places where I've removed butyl.

I noticed that the canoe racks front and back are mounted in the same holes as the hydraulic system top brackets, so surmise they must be factory-issue.

So far, haven't seen an obvious caulking issue, but there was some cracking of the original butyl here and there, which I feel warrants the re-sealing job. Hopefully, I should never have to worry about it again, if I do a good job of it.

I attach a few pics for your interest.

--Robert

Applying sealant - technique?

Basinranger said:

If you plan on removing the thing you're sealing - use silicone sealant - it's much easier to remove but it doesn't paint well.

Click to expand...

I picked up a tube of GE Silicone II for that purpose (rear outside light fixture, roof vent).
http://www.caulkyourhome.com/ge-silicone-II-window-and-door-supreme.php

Basinranger said:

The trick with sika is to do it neatly...once it's hardens it's just tough to deal with...So start small. I keep a bucket of wood dust (corn starch or similar fine powder works too) and rub my (gloved!) hand in it when I get sika on them - other wise you'll spread the damn stuff EVERYWHERE. Peter

Click to expand...

I couldn't find the Sika locally, but bought a couple of tubes of DAP Polyurethane adhesive-sealant, which I gather will do as good a job.

http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?BrandID=28&SubcatID=6

Basinranger said:

#4 front - that already has a visible leak

#4 back

Click to expand...

Question: what is the best way to put the polyurethane sealant on here and not do a complete mess of it?? THe moulding piece is long, curved, and unwieldy. I figure I may need another pair of hands to help me guide it on and allow me to secure some screws in to stabilize it. I plan on:

1. masking the area above and below the area to caulk,
2. making some pencil lines to line up the moulding and the roof edge
3. applying sealant to the roof edge (unless it's better to add it to the moulding?),
4. carefully position the moulding by lining it up with some pencil marks, and securing a couple of screws to hold it in place
5. screw in the remaining screws (adding sealant to the threads for good measure)
6. once good and tight and the extra caulking has oozed out the top and bottom (how thick of a bead should one put on there in the first place?), scrape out the excess and try to form the sealant using wet finger?
7. remove masking tape as the sealant starts to set
8. clean up as necessary

Am I forgetting anything? I figure I'll have one crack at doing this right, or else I'll be elbow deep in a sticky sealant mess!

Basinranger said:

#5 The windows would take me most of a day, pretty straight forward - remove, clean sealing surfaces, mask, sika, clean up. If you run into some soft wood there are several fixes that don't require surgery. This is where I'd use penetrating epoxy sealer even if it looked fine - sika after the sealing dries.

Click to expand...

Again, any tips on sealing the windows? I'll use the same technique as above, with the difference that there will be 4 sealing surfaces as opposed to one... Does the sealant go on the outside edge of the camper opening, or on the inner windowframe, or both?

Thanks again for the help, and hope this thread helps others tackling a similar project!

--Robert

Peter, thanks for all the additional tips!! I feel more confident tackling the end trims with that detailed set of instructions/tips. Yeah, those tubes feel stiff to the fingers, so you may be right about warming them up a bit. Anyway, I'll try to proceed this weekend, and let you know how I fare. Some before and after pictures (not sure I can manage the during, but I'll see what I can do - in case that kind of pictorial thing can be useful to others reading this thread).
All the best, and thanks again!!
--Robert

p.s. have seen pictures of Unimogs with those Alaskan NCO's on them and they look so good, the camper looks like a large truck cap on them, such a nice fit! Not that I'm about to chase down a Mog, my mind is set on a good old Dodge Cummins... Want to get 20mpg for those long-distance road trips!

Roof ends resealed

Well, got both roof ends resealed, and was able to get it done with just 2 hands! Trick is in having good preparation ahead of time: areas well masked off (with blue tape), disposable latex gloves on hands, pre-cut paper towels placed here and there ready to use, screws readily available. I used a screwdriver with small socket at the end as the fastest way to get the many screws in.

As Peter suggested, I let one of the DAP tubes warm up inside beforehand (about 10 deg C in the garage), cut a small hole and plugged up the screw holes and small gaps initially. Then cut a bigger opening and put on a good-sized bead all around, which I then spread out with a plastic spreader I made with teeth in it to leave grooves. Marked the position of the middle screw holes at top on the masking tape beforehand, to make it easier to line up the moulding. Grabbed the long moulding and holding the two long ends away from the camper, got the middle top screw started. Then started 4-5 other screws to get it in place, and quickly added all other screws, loosely. Then snugged them all up, allowing the sealant to ooze out both sides of the moulding (preferably on the top/outside, which is the main sealing area).

Once that was done, quickly proceeded to the other end of the camper, where I had already plugged up the screw holes. I realized on the first side that I may not have put as much sealant as I should, as there seemed to be a few gaps on top where not as much sealant was oozing out. So on the other side, I put a thicker bead on. Problem was: I ran out of the first tube, and had to switch to the un-warmed second tube, and indeed it WAS tough to push out of the tube with the gun, I had to use both hands on the trigger. Managed to get it out, put the moulding back on, secured, then all screws in and good quantity oozing out everywhere.

Went back to other side and, having pushed sealant onto a short piece of flat wood, used a small scraper to fill in the gaps on the outside edge, where I felt that insufficient sealant had oozed out.

Then on both ends, I used the edge of the plastic speader (didn't have popsicle sticks!) to flatten out the oozed portion onto the masking tape (I used wider masking tape for the outside than the inside, and was glad I did!). Then I used my gloved finger to "tool" the sealant a little smoother. There was a bit of back and forth here, and some of it was a little messy, but generally it turned out ok. After 30 minutes or so, I carefully pulled back the masking tape above and under the moulding, revealing a strip of sealant about 1/8 or 1/4 inch beyond the moulding. There's a bit of a raised edge to the sealant, from the tape coming up, that I'm not sure I'll be able to flatten, so perhaps I should have waited for the sealant to cure more before yanking the tape, but I didn't want to take a chance of waiting overnight. Some of the paint peeled off with the blue masking tape, so I'll need to touch that up in the Spring, if I can get a paint to match the custom colour that the original owner used to paint the top portion.

Well, I figure that was probably the toughest re-sealing job on the camper, working with this sticky and potentially messy stuff, and I am glad I managed to do it reasonably well (and hopefully, will never need to do it again - the DAP product apparently has a 50 year warranty!

Next will be putting the side window back in, the eyebrows, the canoe racks. I'll see if I'll be able to tackle the window on the other side this fall, the window at the front, and other odds and ends.

Thanks again to Peter for the advice and tips, which were extremely useful. Anyway, hope this writeup and a few pictures attached helps others tackling something similar at some point. Some of you will likely do a better job than I did, but hopefully this might help others from doing a worse job

--Robert :ylsmoke:

I'm in the process of resealing a Callen. It's steel framed so I don't have the same issues as you with wood. But the sheathing and trim are exactly the same. I am redoing it with new butyl tape.

Another thing I am doing different is using new and different hardware, thought I would mention it to you. The screws I am using for the exterior are new galvanized 1" HWH w/sealing washer. For the interior around the window retaining ring it will be stainless w/ stainless flat washers (think condensation). The screws with the rubber washers are off the shelf at Lowe's or Home Depot and come in 1 lb boxes. The stainless are from True Value (not cheap, $15 per 100 I believe).

You might consider using an exterior screw with a rubber washer for another barrier to keep water from entering at the screws.

Good tips about the hardware, thanks! Those galvanized screws with rubber washers sound like the cat's meow for the outside trim, for sure. And I like your idea about condensation inside, and using stainless hardware. That kind of attention to detail is noteworthy, and there are so many great products to choose from on the marketplace now, and adapt to our situations.
You should find it easier working with the butyl than with the polyurethane sealant in a tube, I suppose both can do a great job if applied well, and keep external water from entering the structure for a few decades!
Cheers.

Yes, I don't know about your old hardware, but mine was ready for a replacement. However, for a zink coat screw, they held up okay for twenty some odd years. Zink coat is the lower end of the spectrum for corrosive resistance, galvanized is two or three times better. Stainless is king, but it seizes easily, so needs to be used accordingly.

I can tell it is an involved process using the Sika. I hope it works the way you hope. I'm confident in using butyl after using it for weather proofing in the communications industry. It's a standard weather proofer for antennas, cables, etc., things that absolutely cannot have any water get in. As well as the camper and RV industry. But typically will only last for 6-20 years in direct sun and weather.

Hopefully your application of the Sika, combined with some indoor storage, will keep the camper preserved for another generation. Those older Alaskans are something more than just a camper. The innovation and the care taken in manufacturing - individually handmade essentially - are a testament to the older ones still being around and used. Each one is a piece of history besides being beautiful and very functional. It's good to see one being preserved and used. Have fun working on it as well as using it!!

Thanks again Terrainist.

Interesting hearing about your experience with butyl. A fine product, but as you say, may not have the useful lifespan of polyurethane window caulking products. The DAP product I used flaunts a "50 year warranty" on the package. Well, maybe my descendants can challenge them on that with regards to the Alaskan, if it's still around at that time! :ylsmoke: Assuming the butyl that was used on mine was original, it lasted a good 35 years in some places, though was starting to crack in others and probably resulted in some water ingress.

I didn't find the poly that difficult to work with, just takes careful planning, and like anything, practice makes perfect (I didn't reach perfection on my camper, but at least it's functional and will keep the water out!!)

You might consider using an exterior screw with a rubber washer for another barrier to keep water from entering at the screws.

I picked up a box of 1" siding/roofing screws on the weekend (#8) with the rubber gasket and washer built in, picked the ones that were painted white which I felt was an even better guard against eventual rust. Used them to replace original screws that were somewhat stripped. Rolled the threads of the new screw in some poly caulking, then screwed into the holes. THe poly helped to fill the hole, and the excess also created an additional water-proof seal under the rubber washer. Plus the slightly larger size/thread of the siding/roofing screws self-tapped itself snugly in the original hole.

THanks for the suggestion, I'll use these screws in other locations on the camper also, along with poly on the threads for good measure.

Cheers.
--Robert

Hi sorry to hijack but since its alaskan related hope ya dont mind...got a chance to pick up this one localy for $400 ,owner says inside is nice one hydrolic jack blown....Wondering if it will be to heavy for my 90 GMC 1500 4x4 6 ft box it fits an 8 ft box so would be sticking out on my tailgate.... they weigh about 1500 lbs...any htoughts....Den

I wouldn't presume to tell you what you can or cant (should or shouldn't) haul around with your 1500 (GMC?), but I have a non-cab-over 8ft 1973 Alaskan on a 96' Toyota T-100, and I got it home (about 200 miles) with the stock suspension, I wouldn't have felt comfortable going very much further, so after some research, I have since added ride rite airbags and for around 200 bucks, it made a world of difference, I wish I would have added the airbags years ago when I bought the truck I cant say enough about what an improvement they are. The alaskan rides smooth as butter on that little toyota now. So I would suggest a set of ride rite airbags...

Now lets get back to tearing these things apart just to epoxy/caulk/screw them back together! I sure wish my alaskan had a wood frame that was solid enough to justify all this "re" weather proofing...

RGS