What battery options?
- Thread starter MIGZ
- Start date
http://www.altestore.com/store/Char...5A-Charge-Controller-with-Display-1224V/p788/
This what I use at all of my solar towers. We provide high speed internet wirelessly for Southern Californian Telephone and Energy. These last forever it seems. I have not had one fail, unless it was shorted by technician. You can find better pricing than what is listed on this site.
It tells you the volts, the draw/load and the incoming amps from solar if used. It maintains the battery, had a low volt shutoff, and has a push button turnoff. Everything is digital, and has a light meter for state of battery.
This what I use at all of my solar towers. We provide high speed internet wirelessly for Southern Californian Telephone and Energy. These last forever it seems. I have not had one fail, unless it was shorted by technician. You can find better pricing than what is listed on this site.
It tells you the volts, the draw/load and the incoming amps from solar if used. It maintains the battery, had a low volt shutoff, and has a push button turnoff. Everything is digital, and has a light meter for state of battery.
I've had some good campfire discussions with guys that know a thing or two about battery systems. Here's some of what I currently (punny) understand. Very non technical writing here...
Car batteries are designed to output a large amount of amperage quickly, ie for starting an engine. To achieve this there are many thin lead plates in the battery. This increases the surface area between the plates and the acid in the battery, which allows a rapid output of amps.
When a battery is "cycled deep" the plates get eaten away. When a battery has thicker plates (results in fewer plates) there is more plate to be eaten away. That's why this type of battery can handle a "deep cycle", over a longer period of time. As we see it, in most auto parts stores, the term deep cycle is most always used as a marketing term. When you see a battery labeled as deep cycle, it may be only slightly deeper cycle than what's labeled as a standard battery. The description is relative and when describing an automotive battery is misleading when designing an electrical system for a trailer.
Skersfan has got the right idea here. For powering a trailer, a battery designed to work with solar systems makes good sense. It's designed to run the battery "deep" over and over again. Another type of battery application, that seems to be priced very well, is a wheel chair battery. Think about it, it gets charged over night, then runs all day long. Not good for starting an engine, but it's what we trailer owners need.
I don't know why, but another "trick" for trailers owners is to run two 6 volt batteries in series, to produce a 12 volt output. The guys that I've spoken with about this have told me that this will improve battery life span. Boats and RV's will often do this with house battery systems.
If you have a trusted auto parts salesmen, ask them about Optima batteries. They are terrible with true deep cycling. Run through an optima with your winch and it's toast. I currently run an Odyssey in my Jeep. I think it's the best car battery in it's price range.
AGM is a technology that has definite benefits for an offroad trailer. AGM batteries handle vibration very well.
When trying to determine how many amp hours to have available. I try to start small, then add on if needed.
I currently run a water pump on my trailer and that's about it. I charge my battery with a Toad-Charge so it's charged almost every day. I run a single 12 volt 7 amp hour battery. I've never had to consider upgrading. It cost about $25, weighs about 5 pounds and measures 6" X 2.5" X 4". A WAG is that I can pump over 50 gallons of water easily.
[SIZE=-1]My recommendation to anybody building a trailer, is to start small with twin 6 volt AGM Wheel Chair batteries. Use the system and see how it goes. From there the math is simple. Buy two more of the same. It will double your capacity. Buy four more and it will triple your capacity. And make sure you know how to wire banks of batteries that are a mix of in series and parallel.[/SIZE]
Car batteries are designed to output a large amount of amperage quickly, ie for starting an engine. To achieve this there are many thin lead plates in the battery. This increases the surface area between the plates and the acid in the battery, which allows a rapid output of amps.
When a battery is "cycled deep" the plates get eaten away. When a battery has thicker plates (results in fewer plates) there is more plate to be eaten away. That's why this type of battery can handle a "deep cycle", over a longer period of time. As we see it, in most auto parts stores, the term deep cycle is most always used as a marketing term. When you see a battery labeled as deep cycle, it may be only slightly deeper cycle than what's labeled as a standard battery. The description is relative and when describing an automotive battery is misleading when designing an electrical system for a trailer.
Skersfan has got the right idea here. For powering a trailer, a battery designed to work with solar systems makes good sense. It's designed to run the battery "deep" over and over again. Another type of battery application, that seems to be priced very well, is a wheel chair battery. Think about it, it gets charged over night, then runs all day long. Not good for starting an engine, but it's what we trailer owners need.
I don't know why, but another "trick" for trailers owners is to run two 6 volt batteries in series, to produce a 12 volt output. The guys that I've spoken with about this have told me that this will improve battery life span. Boats and RV's will often do this with house battery systems.
If you have a trusted auto parts salesmen, ask them about Optima batteries. They are terrible with true deep cycling. Run through an optima with your winch and it's toast. I currently run an Odyssey in my Jeep. I think it's the best car battery in it's price range.
AGM is a technology that has definite benefits for an offroad trailer. AGM batteries handle vibration very well.
When trying to determine how many amp hours to have available. I try to start small, then add on if needed.
I currently run a water pump on my trailer and that's about it. I charge my battery with a Toad-Charge so it's charged almost every day. I run a single 12 volt 7 amp hour battery. I've never had to consider upgrading. It cost about $25, weighs about 5 pounds and measures 6" X 2.5" X 4". A WAG is that I can pump over 50 gallons of water easily.
[SIZE=-1]My recommendation to anybody building a trailer, is to start small with twin 6 volt AGM Wheel Chair batteries. Use the system and see how it goes. From there the math is simple. Buy two more of the same. It will double your capacity. Buy four more and it will triple your capacity. And make sure you know how to wire banks of batteries that are a mix of in series and parallel.[/SIZE]
No trick really, but their use is popular because the 6V golf cart batteries are true deep-cycle and are relatively inexpensive.
I did a little reading on the internet and WOW there is a lot of bad info. out there. This topic gets beat to death all over the place and by guys who don't know what they are talking about.
I found a pretty good article HERE, that I believe provides accurate information.
Summary of info. as it applies to trailer batteries, as I understand it:
There are four standards by which batteries are rated by manufactures;
- CCA Cold Cranking Amps - Number of amps delivered at zero degrees F for 30 seconds (not very important for most of our trailer needs)
- CA Cranking Amps - Same measurement but at 32 degrees (not used very often now days)
- AH Amp Hours - An amp rating taken for 20 hours. How many amps a battery will provide over a 20 hour period. This is something to consider when selecting trailer batteries.
- RC Reserve Capacity - the number of minutes a fully charged battery at 80 Degrees F will discharge 25 amps until the battery drops below 10.5 volts. This is very important when selecting trailer batteries.
One plate in a battery produces approx. 2.1 volts. A 12 volt battery has 6 plates. A 6 volt battery has 3 plates. 2 6 volt batteries that occupy only slightly more space than one 12 volt battery will provide similar daily performance in amp hours and reserve capacity. The 12 volt battery will provide much more cold cranking amps (we don't care about CCA's for use in trailers). The thicker plates of the 6 volt battery will increase longevity. Two six volt batteries should have a longer life span than one 12 volt battery of the same capacity and that is the major benefit of 6 volts over a 12 volt.
Select a Gel Cell or an Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) rather than a Wet Cell if the application is in a harsher environment or the battery is not going to receive regular maintenance and charging.
Another consideration when choosing batteries is form factor. Sometimes you can get greater capacity out of one 12 volt battery, rather than two 6 volt batteries and vice versa. From what I read, some 6 volt batteries are available in a "taller" form factor.
The following is pretty good info. on battery life and performance. It's a direct quote form the article linked above:
"8. Battery life and performance - Average battery life has become shorter as energy requirements have increased. Two phrases I hear most often are"my battery won't take a charge, and my battery won't hold a charge". Only 30% of batteries sold today reach the 48-month mark. In fact 80% of all battery failure is related to sulfation build-up. This build up occurs when the sulfur molecules in the electrolyte (battery acid) become so deeply discharged that they begin to coat the battery's lead plates. Before long the plates become so coated that the battery dies. The causes of sulfation are numerous. Let me list some for you.
I found a pretty good article HERE, that I believe provides accurate information.
Summary of info. as it applies to trailer batteries, as I understand it:
There are four standards by which batteries are rated by manufactures;
- CCA Cold Cranking Amps - Number of amps delivered at zero degrees F for 30 seconds (not very important for most of our trailer needs)
- CA Cranking Amps - Same measurement but at 32 degrees (not used very often now days)
- AH Amp Hours - An amp rating taken for 20 hours. How many amps a battery will provide over a 20 hour period. This is something to consider when selecting trailer batteries.
- RC Reserve Capacity - the number of minutes a fully charged battery at 80 Degrees F will discharge 25 amps until the battery drops below 10.5 volts. This is very important when selecting trailer batteries.
One plate in a battery produces approx. 2.1 volts. A 12 volt battery has 6 plates. A 6 volt battery has 3 plates. 2 6 volt batteries that occupy only slightly more space than one 12 volt battery will provide similar daily performance in amp hours and reserve capacity. The 12 volt battery will provide much more cold cranking amps (we don't care about CCA's for use in trailers). The thicker plates of the 6 volt battery will increase longevity. Two six volt batteries should have a longer life span than one 12 volt battery of the same capacity and that is the major benefit of 6 volts over a 12 volt.
Select a Gel Cell or an Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) rather than a Wet Cell if the application is in a harsher environment or the battery is not going to receive regular maintenance and charging.
Another consideration when choosing batteries is form factor. Sometimes you can get greater capacity out of one 12 volt battery, rather than two 6 volt batteries and vice versa. From what I read, some 6 volt batteries are available in a "taller" form factor.
The following is pretty good info. on battery life and performance. It's a direct quote form the article linked above:
"8. Battery life and performance - Average battery life has become shorter as energy requirements have increased. Two phrases I hear most often are"my battery won't take a charge, and my battery won't hold a charge". Only 30% of batteries sold today reach the 48-month mark. In fact 80% of all battery failure is related to sulfation build-up. This build up occurs when the sulfur molecules in the electrolyte (battery acid) become so deeply discharged that they begin to coat the battery's lead plates. Before long the plates become so coated that the battery dies. The causes of sulfation are numerous. Let me list some for you.
- Batteries sit too long between charges. As little as 24 hours in hot weather and several days in cooler weather.
- Battery is stored without some type of energy input.
- "Deep cycling" an engine starting battery. Remember these batteries can't stand deep discharge.
- Undercharging of a battery to only 90% of capacity will allow sulfation of the battery using the 10% of battery chemistry not reactivated by the incompleted charging cycle.
- Heat of 100 plus F., increases internal discharge. As temperatures increase so does internal discharge. A new fully charged battery left sitting 24 hours a day at 110 degrees F for 30 days would most likely not start an engine.
- Low electrolyte level - battery plates exposed to air will immediately sulfate.
- Incorrect charging levels and settings. Most cheap battery chargers can do more harm than good. See the section on battery charging.
- Cold weather is also hard on the battery. The chemistry does not make the same amount of energy as a warm battery. A deeply discharged battery can freeze solid in sub zero weather.
- Parasitic drain is a load put on a battery with the key off. More info on parasitic drain will follow in this document."
Hilldweller
SE Expedition Society
This is a good list.
I used to test and inspect batteries for a living and can vouch for all of this.
Pretty spot on. But the one thing you have to remember, no matter what anyone tells you. You will use more than you think, especially if you have little kids. Figure it out, and then double it to protect yourself. Having too much battery power is not a problem, not enough is close to Hedoublelo of not having enough.