Can someone explain to me the hoopla over disc brakes on low end bikes??

MarcFJ60

Adventurer
My mtn bike is over 10 years old, but was pretty high end at the time (XTR drive train, hardtail with Manitou shock). It still serves my 40+ year old, slightly pudgy, *** fine. Probably the last thing I would change about it are the brakes. With a finger or two, I can modulate the V-brakes just fine and lock them up if needed. Even in the wet and mud, which I do try to avoid, they work fine. Most of my friends with newer bikes have disc brakes. While I won't say those brakes seem problematic, they do seem to have more issues than my brakes (essentially zero).

Maybe there's some advantage to disc brakes (certainly if your wheel gets out of true), but WHY do manufacturers go to disc brakes so quickly in the lower end of the model line? I was bike shopping with a buddy for lower end mtn bikes. It seemed silly to me that as you go up the model line, they jump to disc brakes before they upgrade the drivetrain or put on an improved shock. Personally upgrading to disc brakes, especially low end ones, would be the last upgrade I'd pick.

I'm sure in the case of low end bikes it is more about marketing than performance. But what a waste! I'll admit I've always been a late adopter with new bike technology, mostly because new technology was highly priced and not yet perfected (i.e. early rear suspensions: heavy, expensive, performed poorly). Rant over.
 

Christophe Noel

Expedition Leader
Disc brakes are just superior for one thing. A low end disc will almost always out perform a higher end rim brake. However, more importantly this is about frames and forks. Manufacturers of frames and forks would be remiss to build those components with rim brake mounts. Anyone who would ever have an inclination to improve their brakes would never look to upgrade a rim brake. They'd most likely go to discs.

We could resurrect the long dead debate of rim brakes vs. discs, but it's really not worth the bandwidth. Any peccadilloes, or complaints anyone has had about discs have long since been dispelled. Discs are simply better. So much better, they've now been applied to touring bikes, legalized for cyclocross racing by the UCI, and believe it or not, in 2014 will begin showing up on tons of road bikes.
 

mtnbike28

Expedition Leader
Funny this comes up... I have a Salsa disc cyclocross bike and was never happy with the discs, in fact I was looking at mini-Vs. I had Paul Retro's on my old CX bike and wasn't happy with them in wet races either. After my first race this year, I decided to try a flat bar. Wow.... same wheels, brakes, etc and I can stand the bike on it's nose. It was all lever/leverage..... Disc's are better!
 

MarcFJ60

Adventurer
Even conceding discs are better, I just question how much better they can be. I don't have an issue with them on high end bikes, but if I was spending $500-600 on a bike I would prefer upgrades in other areas before moving to disc brakes. On an entry level bike, I would think upgrades to the shock, wheels, or drivetrain would be a much better bang for your buck. But it seems once you hit about $450 all the bikes have disc brakes.
 

mtnbike28

Expedition Leader
I know what you are saying.... I ran really chap V brakes for years and they stopped the bike fine. I guess it's like chrome plastic.
 

Christophe Noel

Expedition Leader
Even conceding discs are better, I just question how much better they can be. .
MUCH. But, consider this. Adding discs to a bike over rim brakes is probably a $40 upgrade at retail. You can't increase the overall ride experience with $40 added to the quality of the drivetrain or the fork.
 

thedjjack

Dream it build it
sucks when your rims wears out riding across a country from the rim brakes...wish I had disks back then....did manage to limp into a town where I could by a new rim and swap it over....
 

goodtimes

Expedition Poseur
Even conceding discs are better, I just question how much better they can be. I don't have an issue with them on high end bikes, but if I was spending $500-600 on a bike I would prefer upgrades in other areas before moving to disc brakes. On an entry level bike, I would think upgrades to the shock, wheels, or drivetrain would be a much better bang for your buck. But it seems once you hit about $450 all the bikes have disc brakes.

While those other upgrades may give you a better bang for your buck - they don't "sell" as well as disc brakes do. The average buyer of a $450 bike probably doesn't know that much about bikes (what works - what doesn't, what is important - what isn't, etc) - so they go for what they can see.
 

Christophe Noel

Expedition Leader
Having worked in the bike industry for a couple decades, one thing I can tell you is this: Any entry level bike is comprehensively kind of crappy. It's not just the brakes. I've watched the price of "entry level" bikes go from $275 in the late 80's to $450 now. Not much has changed. It really doesn't matter if that $450 bike has a $25 rear derailleur on it or a $45 rear derailleur. You can't just upgrade one component, be it brakes, a derailleur, or anything else and have it change the ride experience. This is why bike intervals within a given line usually jump by increments of at least $150 or more on the lower aspect.

At the upper reaches of bike buying, and extra $100-200 doesn't effectively change anything, or result in an improvement in the bike or ride experience. That same $100-200 at the lower end represents a MASSIVE change in quality and ride experience.

A $450 bike these days is pretty darn cheap and it shows. A $650 bike is miles better for what is really not a huge volume of money more.
 
When I rode my first 29er (Dos Niner) at Interbike Outdoor Demo, what I noticed the most was the difference between V-brakes and disc brakes, not the difference between 26" and 29" tires.
 

Christophe Noel

Expedition Leader
There's even a tremendous difference to the ride experience between average disc brakes and really good discs. By really good, that doesn't have to mean super expensive. Here in Prescott our trails are very fast, very smooth, but often loose and slick due to the decomposed granite surface. A good brake provides excellent range of modulation allowing the rider to push faster into turns because there's less risk of locking up the brakes. A lesser brake requires the rider pull back a tad and not approach the point of traction loss. V-brakes around here are super sketch as that "lockup point" is much harder to feel through the lever. It's not about power, it's about modulation and lever feedback.
 

spikolli

New member
On the box store bikes it's lowest common denominator marketing. I wish Walmart would leave rim brakes on the bike. I can usually get those to work. On the disk bikes bending the frame tabs to properly align a brake is commonplace and god help you if you need replacment pads....

Craig
 

Ray Hyland

Expedition Leader
Quote Originally Posted by Christophe Noel:
....A $450 bike these days is pretty darn cheap and it shows. A $650 bike is miles better for what is really not a huge volume of money more.

I don't disagree, but it is 44% more of the cost of the more moderately priced bike.


I gotta say, $200 is still a lot of money, and when you have a family of 4 or 5 that suddenly want to get into biking, that adds up pretty quick.
 

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