2014 RAM 1500 5.7 Hemi

[BlueCruiser88]

I hope this is the right forum for this. I am a Land Cruiser guy, but Toyota has not impressed me much lately and I simply want to try something different.

I have been reading through all sorts of forums on chevy vs dodge vs ford etc.... I am noticing there is a large demographic of folks with a very limited level of intelligence. So I want to bring the age old conversation here. Not a "VS" thread, but engineering differences thread. And not a bailout thread or political thread...nuts and bolts man!

Toyota has some great videos regarding the nuts and bolts of their trucks, but I have not found too many for Ram trucks. Ford has a very pretentious campaign and repeat the "most sold ever" over and over. That is fantastic, but quantity sold means nothing about quality in my opinion, I know how Government contracts work, lowest bidder (for fleet purchases etc). Ford also has some great (although snobby) engineering videos putting down all the other trucks.


I have test drove all of the new trucks, twice.

Is it just me or is the new ram trucks pretty amazing? I was blown away. I will be first to admit I wanted to hate them based off past impressions. I have never owned a Dodge. Is this all smoke and mirrors, or are these guys really making an legitimate effort?

My first clue was a Charger rental, I could close my eyes and be drivng a Mercedes, it was that good. Materials, fit and finish all amazing.

How durable are these newer trucks? They seem so soft compared to a few years ago, yet engineered much tighter.

I am looking to purchase next week hopefully and want to make an educated decision.

 

[Buliwyf]

Yes, Dodge has made substantial improvements. Most of my opinion is about the 1 tons. I don't get wrapped up in the half ton stuff anymore. Plenty of ford guys driving Dodge diesels and Powerwagons right now.
Yes, brand loyalty is stupid and the people who get butt hurt over honest criticism are fools. There are tons of "Flatbillers" (truck version of grown up ricer kids) out there now as well.
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Yes, Ford is very proud of their trucks. They have to push their heavy weight engineering improvements hard, otherwise no one would even know about them. It bothers me that Dodge hasn't copied more of Fords greatest improvements. It wouldn't really cost much extra. Why be the cheaper truck builder, be the better truck builder.
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My major beefs with Dodge HD's:
-slip yoke in the transmission instead of on the drive shaft where it belongs
-they used to rust like a 1981 GM truck. I'm watching the used market patiently, to see if newer plow trucks are holding up better. A 2001 dodge truck is as rare as a unicorn in Ohio. Rusted down to scrap mostly.
-Steering wheel has massive spokes at 9&3 making it weird to hold. (Ford is similar, GM's steering wheel is fine, the only proper ergo in a GM interior LOL.)
-front trailing arms on the 2500/3500 aren't as long as Fords.
-not allways significantly cheaper than Ford.
- a bit more complex to lift properly than the Ford.
-I hate auto hubs, central axle disconnects and electric transfer cases. (I think you can still get manual cases on the Dodge 2500's)
-still owned by Chrysler. (QC needs improved with some component vendors. AC compressor, Alternator, Starter, etc. etc.)
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I think Ford has a better olde fashioned HD truck in the Superduty. But my opinions revolve around 1 tons. I have limited experience with half tons.
Things I like about Ford HD's:
-manual hubs and manual transfer cases are still fairly popular on the used market.
-I've seen their factory priming and rustproofing before paint at 3 different factories. It can't be beat.
-massive rear springs and frames and overall a little beefier than most other trucks.
-easy brake jobs
-Simple to lift.
-flexy, easy to mod C frame
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Still, why stop at a half ton Dodge if you're into a fullsize. Don't overlook the advantages of the 2500. Solid axles friendly to lockers. Beefier steering components. Easier to lift. More cargo capacity to grow into. Rougher ride, but who really cares.
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If your set on half tons, I recommend ALSO test driving the Toyota Tundra, Ford F150, and Nissan Titan (a little smaller). The F150 feels like a smaller truck. A copy of the Toyota Tundra. But they have them beat this year. The Dodge and GM half tons feel, completely different. Do they even really compete with eachother any more? Or do they just do, what they do, ignoring the other trucks. The half ton market is weird, I don't give any of them a huge advantage over the others.

 

[DreamingOfExpeditions]

The reason you can close your eyes and think you're driving a Mercedes in a charger is... You are. That's a legacy of the former merger. It was engineered off the previous model E-series.

I was on a business trip with some German colleges and they were making fun of big mushy American cars. We were in a charger, so it was awesome to see them back track once I explained what they were riding in.

 

[Buliwyf]

Still they're right. The Charger is a big mushy American car. Even if they scalped parts off of a Merc, the Merc's make our domestic cars feel like $h(t boxes.
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Go cheap on shocks, suspension bushings, interior quality and ergos, throw in some non-sense to please the uneducated buyer,.....classic American car. The Europeans have us beat in many ways.

 

[O.R.T.]

I won't bore you with any specs, data, etc because honestly by this point you already know them. I am critical of what I buy and build so in the Spirit of this thread I will simply answer the O/P this way,


"I'll just leave this here."? My "New Project" that I picked up last week. You won't be disappointed in the purchase of a Dodge, trust me. If you come down to do Pismo this year hit me up and I'll let you have a shotgun ride. I don't miss my Toyota(s) at all now. I'm glad I waited and put the money I was gonna use for an engine swap etc into just getting this.

I'm already going over Nathan Hayashi's bed cage design for inspiration. My only "concern" is minor, electrically motivated steering racks on the 1500's.

 

[BlueCruiser88]

Love it when you type out a long reply and it gets lost.

I appreciate the info guys.

BULIWYF, thanks for the detailed reply, those are exactly the type of things I was curious about. It seems as if everything is shrouded in marketing BS and not actual methods and numbers.

I did test drive the 2014 Tundra and it still drives like a 3/4 ton (drives BIG). This will be a daily driver and for my uses a 1/2 ton is idea as I have had 3/4 and 1 tons in the past and they are a bit taxing as daily drivers ( I am living in Bend, OR and it is not the most full size friendly city). 3/4 ton trucks make a lot of sense due to the fact that every component has been beefed up and can easily outlast the 1/2 ton counterparts. Search "camper special" on craigs list and you will see that all of the 60-70's trucks from Ford And Chevy were the beefed up 3/4 ton trucks.

I have no doubt in my mind about the reliability and longevity of the Toyota, I have owned them since I started driving. But they are quite honestly like driving an appliance and are boring. This is subjective, but my observation. Biggest pile of junk I ever owned was a Jeep, but it was also the most fun. Go figure.



O.R.T

I appreciate the offer on sitting shot gun! ANd I know how the engine swap thing goes. I could have paid cash for a RAM after all the money I dumped into my project...but no regrets at all building it.


Now I will say this about the Charger driving like a mercedes. I am aware of the partnership and parts bin sharing or major structural components between the makes. What I find interesting is that a Mercedes is just as prone to falling apart from neglect as a Dodge is. I am a HUGE luxury car geek and have owned a few in the past. The MErcedes requires the owner to actually maintain the vehicle, the Lexus side of the house simply does not. You can run them like a Honda Civic, but the there is NOTHING that compares to driving a BMW or Mercedes.

At the risk of sounding corny, I would like to give the Ram a chance. Chrysler is a company that has actually been listening to its customers. People wanted lockers factory in a jeep...granted. People wished for a full size 3/4 ton that can off road...granted with the return of the Power Wagon with lockers, sway bar disco, winch etc... People wanted a diesel half ton, you got it.

Reading various articles seems to tell a story of a very interesting, yet dysfunctional company. Constant leadership and ownership changes, identity crisis and initial quality issues (as of a few years ago). But you have to give them credit for building vehicles the people want, in the recent past they simply were not building them very well. Heck, the CEO even made all of their top level execs drive three year old used Chrysler products in an effort to make a point about their quality issues. Probably also a marketing ploy, but I found it interesting anyway.

Met a Dodge dealer tech last night. He has worked Toyota and Acura. He said he would absolutely LOVE to own a RAM if he could afford one. He said the company has made some great strides, the only issue is that some of the technology is surpassing the knowledge of the boots on the ground technician.

 

[rkj__]

I test drove a Ram and a Sierra. Both were very good. The new Sierra was quieter, but both trucks rode well.

I am curious to see if the latest generation of Ram trucks will resist rust any better than their predecessors.

 

[ttravis5446]

I have a lot of experience with newer American trucks in the last few years. I am a maintenance director for an oil field service company and we beat the crap out of our trucks. At my current job, the fleet is almost exclusively 2007-2012 Ram 2500 4x4 diesels. These trucks have surprised me greatly with their durability and reliability. We've got several with over 200k hard miles on them, they are still going strong but the suspensions are worn, interiors don't hold up and the bodies are hashed. My biggest complaint on the '12 and '13 Rams is that the seats and ergonomics are horrible on long trips. One nonstop drive from Denver to North Dakota was enough to convince me not to buy one. My last job was all ford until getting burned by the 6.0's, then switched to GMC 2500's. these trucks were good all around, but not great at anything. Allison trannies were great when they came out, but are behind the dodge and ford now. We had a lot of problems on the gmc's with the after treatment systems. When it came time to buy my own truck to use for work, I bought a leftover new '12 F350 SRW. The Super Duty is by far the most comfortable for long road trips and has the best power in my opinion. I have about 25k miles on it since I bought it in June and its been great so far. That being said, I sometimes wish I would have bought another F150, the 2010 I traded in on my F350 was the greatest vehicle I've ever owned. I put 45k miles on it in less than a year with nothing but a set of tires and oil changes. Got 20 mpg on the highway and fit 34's with no suspension mods. I would have kept it but I couldn't make due with the small extended cab anymore. My ex bought a new '12 ram 1500 last year and it was a fun truck. She had about a 100 mile each way commute for most of the time she had it. She didn't have good luck with it and traded it in on a new GMC 1500 in less than a year.

 

[BlueCruiser88]

That is pretty interesting. I know oilfield work can be very hard on any piece of equipment.

I work over seas in the middle East and we beat the crap out of anything they give us. We try not to abuse anything on purpose, as we rely on the trucks heavily to transport missiles and such, it is simply a very harsh environment. What I noticed was the Dodge was the diehard as you mentioned, but it was an older truck with the fisher price dash and poor ergos, I cannot speak for the new ones. The Ford trucks were reliable, but they were Gassers and had many issues with the poor quality of fuel we use over there, not fords fault, but still a major issue that had to be addressed constantly. We had one engine failure with a 5.4 triton at 25,000 miles, Although a "mechanic" and I use the term loosely, ran diesel through it.

The number one most reliable, cant kill it vehicle we had? The toyota Hilux. Not the Tacoma, Tacomas are not cut from the same cloth. The Hilux is the only vehicle that most contractors who go outside the wire rely on to bring you back. Even the motor pool guys could not recall the last time they had to do any major work on them. When the Bosnians give something credibility you better listen, those guys know hardship on vehicles.

I do need to give the new Chevy a test drive. I am not entirely impressed with the power numbers of the 5.3, but I have to also be realistic with how I will be using the truck and my own driving habits (I take it easy on vehicles) .

I would LOVE to try out the new 6.2, but I have no idea when that will be released, probably the GMC first.

 

[ttravis5446]

My last company truck at my old job was a new '12 gmc 1500 4door short bed with the 5.3l. That motor was pretty nice, had plenty of get up to it. At one point last summer I had my '10 5.4 F150, my now-ex gf's new 5.7 ram 1500, and my work GMC 1500 all in my driveway. My favorite was the F150, it was the quietest and seemed to be the best built. It also got the best fuel mileage of the three. The Ram was the fastest, but the least comfortable. The thing that I liked the least about the GMC was that the damn thing was lower than the 2wd Ram, I scraped the underside good on some lease roads outs in California. I never had any other problem with the GMC other than a flat tire halfway between LA and Pheonix on I-10 around noon in the middle of August. I put around 40k miles on that truck in the 3or so months I had it.

 

[rkj__]

The thing that I liked the least about the GMC was that the damn thing was lower than the 2wd Ram, I scraped the underside good on some lease roads outs in California. I never had any other problem with the GMC

When I was driving the '14 GMC, I felt like the king of the road. I was all like, "look at me, I'm driving a big new fancy truck, I'm the best." Then an F-150 pulled up, and I noticed how much higher it was....

 

[Wh1t3nukle]

How does one get their hands on a retired Dodge from your fleet?

I have a lot of experience with newer American trucks in the last few years. I am a maintenance director for an oil field service company and we beat the crap out of our trucks. At my current job, the fleet is almost exclusively 2007-2012 Ram 2500 4x4 diesels. These trucks have surprised me greatly with their durability and reliability. We've got several with over 200k hard miles on them, they are still going strong but the suspensions are worn, interiors don't hold up and the bodies are hashed. My biggest complaint on the '12 and '13 Rams is that the seats and ergonomics are horrible on long trips. One nonstop drive from Denver to North Dakota was enough to convince me not to buy one. My last job was all ford until getting burned by the 6.0's, then switched to GMC 2500's. these trucks were good all around, but not great at anything. Allison trannies were great when they came out, but are behind the dodge and ford now. We had a lot of problems on the gmc's with the after treatment systems. When it came time to buy my own truck to use for work, I bought a leftover new '12 F350 SRW. The Super Duty is by far the most comfortable for long road trips and has the best power in my opinion. I have about 25k miles on it since I bought it in June and its been great so far. That being said, I sometimes wish I would have bought another F150, the 2010 I traded in on my F350 was the greatest vehicle I've ever owned. I put 45k miles on it in less than a year with nothing but a set of tires and oil changes. Got 20 mpg on the highway and fit 34's with no suspension mods. I would have kept it but I couldn't make due with the small extended cab anymore. My ex bought a new '12 ram 1500 last year and it was a fun truck. She had about a 100 mile each way commute for most of the time she had it. She didn't have good luck with it and traded it in on a new GMC 1500 in less than a year.

 

[ripperj]

I drove Toyota trucks for 25 years, but made the jump to a 2010 Ram 1500 bighorn 4.7. I drove it for a couple years then traded for a 2012 Ram 2500 hemi. I love both the Rams and don't regret for a minute leaving Toyota. Zero issues with either Ram( same for the Toyotas, a couple had 150k plus with zero issues)
Ram makes a pretty nice daily driver.
Keith

 

[ttravis5446]

How does one get their hands on a retired Dodge from your fleet?

As fast as we are expanding, they just keep fixing them. We have bought a million and half dollars worth of pickups in the year I have been there and the only ones to leave the fleet are the ones that got totaled out..

 

[Larry]

When I was driving the '14 GMC, I felt like the king of the road. I was all like, "look at me, I'm driving a big new fancy truck, I'm the best." Then an F-150 pulled up, and I noticed how much higher it was....

Let’s see which truck is still on the road in 20 years

To help with shorty complex you can get it up for only $64.95. That is the nice thing about the late model coil spring front ends is how expensive they are to do a level or modest lift.