Help me choose my first "expedition" vehicle

ert01

Adventurer
I vote 3rd gen 4runner or 80 series landcruiser.

$6k might get him into an 80, but it won't leave a lot of wiggle room for maintenance and goodies.

$6k will do a LOT with a Cherokee.



Even if it is a unibody design, it still has a great engine, transfer case, transmission, and axles. Buy some unibody stiffeners and weld them on if the unibody is really that big of a concern.
 

zelatore

Explorer
$6k might get him into an 80, but it won't leave a lot of wiggle room for maintenance and goodies.

$6k will do a LOT with a Cherokee.



Even if it is a unibody design, it still has a great engine, transfer case, transmission, and axles. Buy some unibody stiffeners and weld them on if the unibody is really that big of a concern.

I second this. I spent a lot of time looking around in the sub $10K bracket last year before blowing the budget and getting an LR3. At least in the west where I am, any 80 at $6K would be rough, though as with most things they do seem cheaper in the east.
 

jeep-N-montero

Expedition Leader
94-99 full size Montero(not the Sport model), I have built a few Cherokees and Grand Cherokees and recently picked up a 98 Montero for many reasons.
 

Martinjmpr

Wiffleball Batter
The tough part is going to be the MPG and the cost.

You basically are faced with this dilemma:

* <$6k price
* 4wd
* 20 MPG
* Reliable & reasonably new (say, <15 years old.)

Now pick any Three of the above and you have lots of options.

A 1st gen 4runner with a 22r and a 5 speed will give you 25mpg on the highway. Certainly you can find them for under $6k. The problem is, you're talking about a vehicle that is at least 25 years old and will most likely have somewhere north of 250,000 miles on it. Towing is also going to be dicey with a 4 cyl.

To be honest, you're going to have to dump one of your requirements, and it will probably have to be your desire for 20mpg. An older Subaru Outback or Forester might be close but IIRC they are not rated to tow very much. The newer ones are better tow vehicles but will bust your budget. For a pre-2002 Subaru you have to consider the high possibility of a head gasket failure, its a notorious weakness of the 2.5l flat four. It had pretty much been fixed by 2002, though.

FJ 80s get horrible gas mileage -just check the threads on people trying to squeeze a few MPG out of their 80's. I think you can get 15mpg out of an 80 if you are going downhill with a tailwind but otherwise, figure on 12-14 and that's before you start modding it with bigger tires, armor, etc. There are lots of folks with 80's who will candidly admit to getting 10mpg and being happy with it.

A 3rd gen 4runner would actually fit most of your requirements including price, the difficulty will be in finding one that isn't beat to hell, especially East of the Mississippi. Furthermore, a lot of 4runners sold South of the Mason Dixon line are 2wd, so you have to watch for that. Also, while 20mpg is possible in a 3rd gen 4runner, it's not something you can count on (I got up to 23 in my 99 with an automatic, but that was under very favorable conditions, i.e. flat roads, highway speeds, and holding the cruise control at about 62mph.) 16-18 MPG is much more common in that class of vehicle.

Since you already have a Ford have you looked at a 2nd gen (1995-2001) Explorer? They can often be found very cheap, used by a suburban soccer mom, and sometimes even with low miles. For your uses, I'd stay away from the V8 model, just because I think it has full time 4wd (not sure) but I know it only has a single speed t-case. Also the V8 isn't going to be great mileage wise. If you look hard, you might even find one with a 5 speed manual tranny, which would give you a 2 speed T-case and would avoid any issues with the transmission (not that I know of Ford automatics being troublesome, just that modern automatic transmissions in general have a lot of electronic parts and other things that can fail, vs. a manaul which is pretty foolproof.)

The Chevy guys can chime in about whether the S10 Blazer or Trailblazer is a decent vehicle. They should fit most of your requirements (except, again, MPG) but I don't know enough about them to recommend one or the other.

The Montero Sport is another possibility, but I can tell you from experience of owning a Montero in NC, there isn't much in the way of aftermarket or dealer support. They were just never very popular in the Eastern US (I had a 1990 Montero when I was stationed at Fort Bragg from 1992-98 and people would actually come up to me at stoplights and say "what is this thing?") A Montero Sport is about the same size as a 3rd gen 4runner or Nissan Pathfinder.

An Isuzu Trooper will also meet all your requirements except MPG. As with the Monty, you have to content yourself to owning a vehicle that has very little US-based aftermarket, so you'll have to get "creative."

Another sort of oddball might be the Isuzu Rodeo. They are often available very cheap, but sometimes that means it's a trouble-prone vehicle. I've heard both good and bad about the Rodeo, but no personal experience.

A Tahoe or an Expedition will fit your budget and your towing requirements but not your MPG requirement (but again, IMO nothing that is <15 years old will.)

Seriously, if you are willing to give up 20mpg there are a whole bunch of possibilities.
 
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Martinjmpr

Wiffleball Batter
Land Rovers...

As far as Land Rovers go, you can often find a Disco very inexpensive. I'll let you ponder as to why a high priced luxury vehicle like that depreciates so fast. ;)

From what I've seen on the various message boards, a Land Rover is like a boat: The two happiest days with your Land Rover are:

1. The day you bought it, and
2. The day you sold it. :p
 

zelatore

Explorer
As far as Land Rovers go, you can often find a Disco very inexpensive. I'll let you ponder as to why a high priced luxury vehicle like that depreciates so fast. ;)

From what I've seen on the various message boards, a Land Rover is like a boat: The two happiest days with your Land Rover are:

1. The day you bought it, and
2. The day you sold it. :p


Hmmmm....this might explain something about why I bought the LR3. I not only own two boats plus two dinghies, I also work on them for a living!

Seriously though, while I love the look, style, history, off-road performance, etc of the Discos I'd have a hard time recommending one to somebody I don't know. It's certainly never going to be as easy to own as a Toy or Jeep.
 

BIGdaddy

Expedition Leader

I agree with Clutch. Previa vans are pretty cool.

Our trooper has treated us well for almost a year, with 150k miles. Just enough of an aftermarket to be fun, but not so much that you're overwhelmed. Very, very comfy rig. We bought it for $4500.00 +/- and probably overpaid a bit, but this rig had tons of maintenence done to it,was a 2 owner car, and is very, very clean/well taken care of for a 13 year old truck. I normally carry 5 people in mine. It has a TON of rear seat space and cargo space. I always used to compare it to cherokee's and discovery's, but it's dimensions are actually more along the lines of a newer explorer. VERY cavernous inside without seeming or being too big outside for parking in normal spaces, etc.

I put $1500.00 into the motor right off the bat, putting in a new timing belt, pulley bearings, tensioner and water pump. I've also added an ARB bull bar, m8000 winch, Hella 500's, General grabber tires, and a rear cargo drawer build thats still in progress. I'll likely be replacing the suspension bits soon as they're a bit worn, and adding a roof rack or load bars to carry a thule box or RTT.

Here's my trooper thread: http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...dness-quot-Cabbie-quot-the-2001-Isuzu-Trooper

My Jeep cherokee was a great car for 4 years. Bought for $2000.00 sold for $2000.00, put about $1500 into it. 1997-1999 are the sweet spot as far as most desireable drivetrain and bodystyle. I can talk for hours about jeeps, so PM with specific questions.

My first gen 4runner was a great trip car, and has a very effective drivetrain and layout for 4 people, or 2 people and lots of gear. They're a bit spartan/loud/flimsy when it comes to fit and finish, but that's their 80's technology roots. Both of my trucks were 100% reliable and very easy/cheap to work on. Good daily driver, too even with some offroad mods.
 
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Martinjmpr

Wiffleball Batter
Doing a quick CL search I came across several Troopers. Here's a nice one near Knoxville:

http://knoxville.craigslist.org/cto/4332575414.html Has 200k on it but asking price is under $3,000. If you spent even $2k "refreshing" this vehicle it would be under your $6k price and probably be good for at least another 100,000 miles.

Nice thing about Troopers, AFAIK they were never sold in 2wd version in the US (at least, I've never heard of one.) So if you find a Trooper, it's going to be a 4wd, which is not true of a 4runner, Explorer, etc.
 

Clutch

<---Pass
I agree with Clutch. Previa vans are pretty cool.

I know a lot of people laugh, very practical though...stick to graded dirt roads, and you'll be fine.

Used to make fun of mini vans, until we rented one for a mountain bike vacation, tons of room for gear...and decent mileage...good enough to
get us to trail heads.

Can make decent little campers.

1993%20Toyota%20Previa%20WHL15%202.jpg



Tell ya, the new mini-vans aren't too bad looking.

535CBB13-81C1-489C-8615-E0324D3EF50B-3144-0000017FEC794206_zps5dc01447.jpg
 

Clutch

<---Pass
Doing a quick CL search I came across several Troopers. Here's a nice one near Knoxville:

http://knoxville.craigslist.org/cto/4332575414.html Has 200k on it but asking price is under $3,000. If you spent even $2k "refreshing" this vehicle it would be under your $6k price and probably be good for at least another 100,000 miles.

Nice thing about Troopers, AFAIK they were never sold in 2wd version in the US (at least, I've never heard of one.) So if you find a Trooper, it's going to be a 4wd, which is not true of a 4runner, Explorer, etc.


We own a 2WD, I got it for waaay cheap...so can't be too picky. :D

397883_10150594686809630_819463804_n.jpg
 

4x4junkie

Explorer
I'll throw in another vote in for the earlier Ford Explorers ('91-'01). Find one that has the bulletproof OHV 4.0L V6 (not the SOHC V6 seen in some '97-'01s) w/5-speed stickshift. Low and even mid-20s MPG should be attainable in these rigs on the highway. The automatic trans tends to ding your MPG by about 2-3 from what I've seen, and isn't particularly reliable unless you also add a good aux trans cooler to it.

'91-'94 Explorers are the most durable and have the best aftermarket support. The '95-'01s can still be very sound choices though if you aren't planning to mod the rig out too heavily (not lifting it, huge tires, etc.), as they are much the same aside from the A-arm front suspension. Both 2-door "Sport" and 4-door models are available. All have full frames, and lots of interior space for their modest exterior dimensions.
 

hulk81

New member
First off let me say thanks to all of you guys for all the info, you guys have really got me thinking. I think martinjmpr hit the nail on the head, the 20mpg is the killer. At the currant fuel prices and the amount I drive dropping to a 15mpg vehicle will cost me a extra $75.00 a month in fuel cost, not that I can't swing that, but everything I put in the fuel tank is money I can't put into a trip. So finding a happy medium in fuel mileage and space is going to be the best of all worlds. I have a disco1 5speed here at my shop now, cool vehicle and all but to how you say quirky.......or unreliable for daily use, a weekend off roader yes, everyday no. After I get don't working on everyone else's stuff I really hate working on my own :smilies27. I've thought about the Cherokee, very reliable for the most part, parts ever where and probably the most bang for the buck, but small inside witch I can deal with, but I think I can buy a larger vehicle for the same fuel mileage. I hadn't thought about a Subaru forester probably the only vehicle mentioned that could hit the 20mpg in a expedition setup. The head gaskets don't scare me ,I done 2 last week, but still small on the inside and limited capabilities would probably work fine for now, but not much room to grow. A land cruiser 80 is out on price and mileage, for the mileage they get I could drive my big block dually. In this neck of the woods they are as rare as hens teeth and the only one for sale in my area has 322k on it and there still asking 6 grand for it. Hell for 6k I would have a hard time finding a old 60 for that in my area. Toyota 4 runner just don't do it for me. they are reliable but in my area overpriced for what you get. Martinjmpr is also right on the Montero, its a rare vehicle over here with very limited parts support and I've not had good experience with Mitsubishi products. I like the 2000 and up Tahoe's but to find one in a good price range most of the time there rough. Even though I have a ranger truck and like it, I'm not much of a Ford man. A ohv 4.0 explorer 5 speed and a 2 speed transfer case I might consider, but in the size and price I might take a Cherokee over it for the better aftermarket. I had thought about selling both truck and rolling into a ccsb diesel, but when I do the math on the fuel mileage vs my big block gas truck and add the extra .70 to .80 cents per gallon fuel cost, add the extra maintenance it almost a wash. add in one part failure (injectors, turbo, oil pumps, etc) and the big block is cheaper to operate, at least for me. I hadn't thought about the Isuzu trooper at all, sound like the most space to mileage to money, but parts may be a problem. So I've guess I've got in narrowed down to 4 . Subaru Forester, Jeep Cherokee, Ford Explorer Or a Isuzu trooper, decisions decisions.

Ps shocker I will post up some 240 pics when I get the car back together, uphill esses at vir + to much speed :smiley_drive:- talent = tore up race car :Wow1:
 

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