Excursion 12v build, help and opinions needed.

[cattivo]

Excursion build plan.

Allow me to introduce my 2000 Ford Excursion, happily known as “Beach Truck” or “BT”.
I have had the truck since new in January 2000. The BT came with the 5.4 and is 2WD. It has been a lot of fun over the years, rode around on big shinny rims for 6-7 years with a big stereo and tvs everywhere, but soon function became important so a Fabtech 6” lift was installed and 35’s. This made the truck a lot more fun to drive, i no longer had to worry about friends driving it and curb checking expensive chrome wheels. My old friend BT is now very tired, has a ton of miles (way more than I thought I would get out of the 5.4L) For the last few years the truck was only being used basically to drive to the beach and tow the boat to the lake for some wake boarding. Any kind of distance traveled or road trips, camping and the like were done in my 2008 RR. As life changes we recently bought a house and I just sold the RR. Time to build the BT to handle all the Rovers duties AND THEN SOME. Things I enjoyed about the RR was I could get in and take a road trip any time, I love taking routes less travelled and dirt road or driving through national parks, my kids are totally into the nature drives (7year old daughter, 1 year old dogo argentino) I want to be able to drive to the Grand Canyon taking as manny off highway routes as possible while keeping my family safe and comfortable in a big truck. Ok now here is my plan, or the start of it at least. Please keep in mind I BASICALLY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT. The ideas I have come up with are based on things I have read on forums and talked to some people about, but I have no actual experience in doing a build for a truck I want to be able to drive across the country off the beaten path, so please send helpful useful opinions my way.

Keeping in mind money is a factor (just bought a house) I was trying to find a way to build the truck in stages, however I feel like gearing is the fist place to start and that does dictate the tire size so if anyone wants to chime in on that feel free.

I want to go with a Cummins 12v and a P pump, I like the idea of it being simple to work on and my buddy gets 20 mpg in his old dodge with a 12v. MPG are important! Even if I never get 20MPG but get better than 14-15 that the RR got I will be happy. I have seen some reasonable priced 12v online and before installation I would plan on fixing the possible dowel pin issue. If there are any other things important to do prior to installing the 12v please chime in.

OH AND I LIVE IN MIAMI FLORIDA, IF ANYONE CAN SUGGEST A GREAT DIESEL SHOP PLEASE DO!

I would like to, in theory have an Allison 6 speed, not sure what kind of module or programing that would involve but I think Destroked has a kit for it. Again i have not actually bought any of these things I have simply heard great things about this trans and I feel the 6sp will help in MPG.

I don’t plan to do hardcore trails, but I do plan on taking trips away from civilization and need it to be build to last, so I think having the possibility of LOW LOW gearing would help crawl over stuff rather than bounce/smash down the trail. For this i was looking at a NP205 and a NWF Black Box for the TC.

Since the truck is now 2WD and I have to buy or build a solid front axle I was thinking of getting a Dana60, but do I buy a used one assembled (found a few in local junk yards for less than 1k) or do I buy the housing (cheap on ebay) and buy the shafts I want and gears and so forth? I also would love to do a Dynatrack free-spin hub kit. The used is probably way less money but I want to hear some opinions on it…Maybe my ideas are overkill so let me know if any of this is ridiculous. I plan on doing ARB front and rear and I will obviously re-gear the rear to match the front. I am under the impression the rear is strong and with some gears and a locker we would be good, but if I am wrong please let me know.

The brakes on my truck are terrible, I have SS lines but need new pads and rotors and a fluid flush, I was thinking of trying Stoptech rotors, I have used them on car applications and I am assuming they are also great for a truck, this is way less money than going with a big brake kit.

Now for the suspension I was looking at Carli Suspension, for the truck, I want it to handle well on and off road. My plan (which has one huge flaw) would be to keep my 35’s (90% tread left) and when I can afford it move up to 38’s keeping the same suspension height and just cutting to make it fit so to keep the center of gravity low. Problem is changing the tire size affects the gear ratios, and I don’t want to buy gears twice or buy bigger tires now…dilemma…

The trucks body is in great shape, just has a small bit of rust bubbles on the roof that I am seeing the body shop about today. I plan on having it fixed and then having the roof, grill and bumpers Linex’d. I will be using the factory front bumper with the winch adaptor, I know it makes the bumper stick out a bit but it will do for a while.

So this is the start of my ideas…Please let me know if I am headed in the right direction.

 

[BCHauler]

http://www.fordcummins.com/

Not close to you but these guys are well-known and very experienced. They can also source the engine for you.

 

[MT6bt]

I may sound biased because I have a 12 valve, but yes, you are definitely choosing the most efficient and reliable diesel of all time. Cheap to fix, and pretty predictable.
Now when you say you're on a budget...then mention an Allison transmission, carli suspension, 38" tires, free spin kit, brake kits....I can't help but giggle!
Anyways, issues with the 12 valve: KDP is first priority. The return/supply fuel lines are notorious for leaking. Replace them with a marine grade diesel/multifuel hose asap. All of it. Get rid of that silly hardline/softline system they have on there.
The 12 valve was detuned quite a bit from the factory. Bump the timing up, fuel plate, tune the AFC, cold air intake, different turbo or find a larger compressor for the one that's currently on there. That will get you a modest power increase (180 is stock auto trans hp, 210 is manual I believe. That's primarily because of injector size) of up to 100 hp(keeping stock turbo on there, that is) without having to start digging into the engine. Keep in mind you shouldn't boost more than 40 psi(?) because the stock head studs can fail after that. At least that's what I thought I read. I'm no mechanic, so you may want to do your own research!
The lift pump can be an issue, but isn't as big of a deal as with the 98.5-2002 ISB cummins, since the VP-44 injection pump is lubed by diesel. Failure of the lift pump on this setup will cause injection pump failure and, well...that'll be a pretty penny.
personally if I were to do a Solid axel swap I would start from scratch and build it the way you want. if you buy a D60 from the junk yard, who knows how it was treated and if its got auto locking hubs, you're looking at at least $1500 for a decent manual locking hub kit.
I don't know what size your rear dif is, but keep in mind that even the 12 valve has a lot of torque stock. My 1998 12 valve has a D70 LSD in the rear and that is not enough with a mild tune. The ring and pinion gears are failing, which is a common occurrence on these dodges. And that's with a very moderate tune(see sig) that brings me to only about 230-270 hp...and who knows how much torque. So just keep that in mind.
So, if your rear end is a Dana 80 or equivalent, you're probably okay.
But, like BChauler says, check out the ford cummins website. They will have much more accurate intel than what I have just given you.
Best of luck! it sounds like you're building the best rig possible: cummins diesel, ford chassis, Allison transmission.

 

[east_tn_81]

I am sure this will stir up a storm but why not a 7.3 or even a bullet proof 6.0

Just a thought. I think you are limiting yourself if you are on a budget.

 

[Kottonwood]

I'll be the first to say it... you are gonna save yourself a ton of time money and hassle if you just buy a 4x4 7.3 excursion. The 7.3 are powerfull, bulletproof, long lasting engines and they get decent mileage in that truck. I currently own 2 7.3s and cummins for my tree service fleet, I have owned a few more 7.3s in the past. They are a 300k mile motor usually, even in abused work trucks. I mean, hell by the time you do the diesel conversion and the 4x4 add on you are well over 20k in the hole. Sell your rig for what its worth then buy a 4x4 with low miles and no mods, then go from there. Or buy it first, swap your goodies over, then sell the 2wd gasser.... JMO

 

[MT6bt]

x2 but a 12v is a 500k+ motor and is called the "million mile motor" for a good reason. Other than that, I agree. 7.3s are good engines.

I'll be the first to say it... you are gonna save yourself a ton of time money and hassle if you just buy a 4x4 7.3 excursion. The 7.3 are powerfull, bulletproof, long lasting engines and they get decent mileage in that truck. I currently own 2 7.3s and cummins for my tree service fleet, I have owned a few more 7.3s in the past. They are a 300k mile motor usually, even in abused work trucks. I mean, hell by the time you do the diesel conversion and the 4x4 add on you are well over 20k in the hole. Sell your rig for what its worth then buy a 4x4 with low miles and no mods, then go from there. Or buy it first, swap your goodies over, then sell the 2wd gasser.... JMO

 

[MT6bt]

Ahh...If you're referring to the 6.0 diesel, that has got to be one of the worst diesels to ever be put into a production truck. Lots of power? yes, but you need to dump some serious money into that engine in order for it to be bullet resistant. I personally had one blow up on me towing a light trailer doing 55 down a flat highway. Now that nice looking ford has a 12 valve cummins in it and is more fuel efficient than it ever has been.

I am sure this will stir up a storm but why not a 7.3 or even a bullet proof 6.0

Just a thought. I think you are limiting yourself if you are on a budget.

 

[Kottonwood]

http://www.leftlanenews.com/2002-f-350-powerstroke-passes-1-million-miles-still-counting.html

We could argue ford cummins all day, personally I think they are both great motors. I only buy ford chassis for my work truck fleet so that is why we have more 7.3s than 5.9s. However even though the cummins may be slightly more efficient, weigh a bit less, and be more modifiable, I think the reliability is about equal when properly maintained. That being said, I would never go through the hassle and expense of a cummins swap when the same vehicle is available from the factory with a 7.3..... 6.0/6.8 that is a whole 'nother story. I was talking to a power company lineman in Denver one day and he was telling me xcel energy was paying to swap all their 6.0s to 5.9s... that is a huge undertaking.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

I'll be the first to say it... you are gonna save yourself a ton of time money and hassle if you just buy a 4x4 7.3 excursion. The 7.3 are powerfull, bulletproof, long lasting engines and they get decent mileage in that truck. I currently own 2 7.3s and cummins for my tree service fleet, I have owned a few more 7.3s in the past. They are a 300k mile motor usually, even in abused work trucks. I mean, hell by the time you do the diesel conversion and the 4x4 add on you are well over 20k in the hole. Sell your rig for what its worth then buy a 4x4 with low miles and no mods, then go from there. Or buy it first, swap your goodies over, then sell the 2wd gasser.... JMO

Listen to this wise man.. he will save you tens of thousands of dollars!

 

[cattivo]

BChauler.
I have checked that site out before, but its way way far away from here.

MT6bt.
Only reason I mentioned the Allison is because I have been advised against rebuilding the stock trans and I was also advised against using the dodge trans that would come out of the doner truck, however I am all ears if you can suggest a good strong alternative. And thank you for the fuel line info, that is something I would not want to learn the hard way.
I plan on keeping the boost under 40psi. I don't need it to be fast just reliable and efficient.

east_tn_81.
I have heard horror stories about the 6.0, I know the 7.3 is a good motor, but if I am going to do the swap why not just put in the 12v.

Kottonwood.
It might be way smarter to buy a 7.3 Excursion. But I have had mine since new, I plan on having it another 20 years, its like a family member.

 

[MT6bt]

Unless you wanted to go manual, I couldn't really tell ya. I am currently researching the hassle of swapping my POS 47RE auto to an NV5600 6 speed manual. Personally I enjoy manuals more. They seem cheaper and more efficient to me personally. I can always dictate what gears I want to be in according to the terrain.
Regardless of your decision, I wish you the best of luck!

BChauler.
I have checked that site out before, but its way way far away from here.

MT6bt.
Only reason I mentioned the Allison is because I have been advised against rebuilding the stock trans and I was also advised against using the dodge trans that would come out of the doner truck, however I am all ears if you can suggest a good strong alternative. And thank you for the fuel line info, that is something I would not want to learn the hard way.
I plan on keeping the boost under 40psi. I don't need it to be fast just reliable and efficient.

east_tn_81.
I have heard horror stories about the 6.0, I know the 7.3 is a good motor, but if I am going to do the swap why not just put in the 12v.

Kottonwood.
It might be way smarter to buy a 7.3 Excursion. But I have had mine since new, I plan on having it another 20 years, its like a family member.

 

[thedjjack]

buy an old first gen dodge with the cummins and a dana60 up front with locking hubs and king pins and a dana70

swap the drivetrain over.... use the 4 speed auto with a decent rebuild (do not buy all the crap stuff for the auto just a good rebuilder)... Gear the axles put on the 35 and be happy.

You can buy the stock dodge with low mileage regular cab $4-5K. rebuild auto, clean up motor, others $5-10K due to inability to turn wrenches... maybe make a few dollars back on leftovers

DONE

If you need the 6 speed and 38s buy a school bus and swap the 8.3L over and see about surgery for other possible issues...

 

[dave1014]

12v swap is a great idea. But to do it right youre gonna have 12k plus into it. I second finding a 7.3 or 6.0 EX.

You can have a rock solid 6.0 for 3k

Sent from my SCH-I925 using Tapatalk

 

[The Grinch]

Don't take this the wrong way but your gonna spend alot more then this should cost you.
I know you have owned the rig since new but finacially this makes no sence.

You can pick up a clean deisel X with 4x4 for about what the cummins/allison swap is going to cost you.
From the sounds of it you don't need custom axles or lockers. Basically with your current truck you have a good body and interior that is all your going to use. That would be a great start if you wanted to run custom axles and suspention but for exploration and backroad travel a stock 4x4 diesel X with lift and tires will get the job done.

Its your rig man build it how you want I just think you would be money and time ahead to start with a clean diesel 4x4 X.

 

[BCHauler]

I plan on having it another 20 years, its like a family member.

If this is the case and you are committed to doing the 12v swap, then it probably makes sense to pay the experts to do it. They will do it once and do it right, and have done many of the exact truck you have. Also, they may be a long way away, but in the bigger picture of how much you are spending to do the swap, shipping the truck there, or driving it and flying home would likely be worth the expense.