Ford F550 vs. Ram 5500

[plainjaneFJC]

I have a cummins, but I agree with your assessment.

 

[Buliwyf]

At least you got one thing right here. The Cummins is a MEDIUM duty engine. Most folks do not realize this. Being classified as a MEDIUM duty engine is a fairly big deal to guys who actually DO WORK. The Ford and Chevy diesels are rated as light duty engines.

Yes a boat load of emissions equipment. Everyone has it. Don't knock the manufacturer, its our gov pushing these restrictions on them. Increasing cost and complexity its not by choice so take it easy huh. Rams are designed with the upfitters in mind. DEF tanks don't hang below the frame rails like on other trucks. The filler is next to the diesel filler for easy access. Fill a chevy with DEF? Its up against the fire wall under hood, good luck. Whats DPF only good for 100k?

Too much miss information, one sided opinions and general lack of open-mindedness in this entire thread.

I'll leave you with this... One of these diesel pistons is out of a medium duty Cummins 6.7L straight out of a Ram truck. One is a Ford Powerstroke and the other is out of a Chevy Duramax Isuzu sourced diesel. (both light duty engines)

Which one do you want under your hood?

LOLz. Cause we have tons of rod and piston failures on modern diesels.

Picture is meaningless anyways. Look into the metalurgy of the Rams rods. It ain't a Cummins QSX, and it ain't a Ducati Superquadro, that's for sure. All of the big threes new diesel engines are filled with sickenly soft parts. But better engineering and ECM's that limit the load, make this possible, and reliable. Don't worry though, other tractor engines are just as soft. JD, Kubota, Yanmar. Yummy powdered rods. LOLz. Every piston failure I've seen was the victim of another component failure nuking it. No matter which brand. The larger wrist pin is just because it's a heavier piston. A slightly larger piston has a huge effect on the added strength needed from the wrist pin. Most likely, the smaller pistons are stronger. It's easy to make strong little pistons. It's hard to make big one. Many of the best built diesel engines I've worked on had only 1150rpm redlines.

My biggest concern from my experience is the Cummins nanny hidden in the ECM. When she's cranky, you're going nowhere. Cummins doesn't give us much room for error. Trip a bad sensor and it's shutdown city. Carry over fail safes, left over from the trucking industry.

 

[Buliwyf]

I would like to see an apples to apples 10k cheaper dodge. I price trucks all the time, and usually the Ram is 1k cheaper not 10, from my experience.

We call Dodges the poor mans Ford around here for a reason.

Any Dodge ram that's been sitting on a lot for a 13 months around here can go for dirt cheap. You might think of me as a Dodge hater, and that's not it at all. I'd love to buy a new Dodge as they are available WAAAY cheap around here quite often. It's just that they have a few weird features that I don't like, and I haven't seen enough well beat examples in good shape.

It might be some of the trim packages, or maybe they sell better in your area. They sell quick around here, but the lots always seem to have excess when next years models come out. Cheap as a gas Ford or GMC. Hopefully they get it together for me.

 

[plainjaneFJC]

I don't think your a Dodge hater, I actually like the Fords, and have been tempted to get one, but I hear a lot of warranty denials for hpfp's when they find water or corrosion in the system. I think you can find water in any fuel system if you look hard enough. My 2011 duramax grenade the hpfp last year with approx. 80k miles on it. Dealer replaced entire fuel system under warranty, no questions asked. From what I have heard it would have been a fight with Ford.

 

[Buliwyf]

My opinion is that Ford, Dodge, BMW, BMW bikes, Merc (cars not trucks), and Mitsubishi (especially their heavy engines) have NO warranties. None of those companies stand behind their product anymore.

Ford only warranties things that never really break. And dodge warranty claims that none of their techs know how to fix. BMW and Merc only warranty easy to fix items. Germans stick to "it was fine when it left the factory, sorry for your luck" warranties. They'll deny things quicker than anyone I've ever seen. The Mitsubishi reps are the worst though. They have to meet a quota of denied claims. They'll actually make up fraud to deny claims. Didn't believe it until I saw it with my own eyes.

Even if Dodge honors the warranty, who's going to fix the darn truck? The desk girl? They chased off all of their techs years ago. Ford is facing the same exodus. The best Ford and Dodge techs work for Land Rover and Hyundai now.

 

[TwinStick]

Do the 4500 & 5500 series really have C-channel frames ? If so, i hope they are much thicker & stronger than mine, seeing as how they are rated for so much more weight (mine don't flex at all, even w/1200 lbs in the bed at max articulation). My 2008 Power Wagon frame is fully boxed from front to rear. That is a fact.

 

[Buliwyf]

I hope so. Bolting accessories like an air compressor, water tank, or utility body works a whole lot better to a chassis that's pretty much a plate of steel, instead of a thin box. You'll find that almost all heavier trucks are C channels. I would avoid boxed frames in 3500's and up.

The boxed frames are marketing. Hydroforming is cheap to do. GM and Dodge didn't switch to boxed frames for any kind of performance advantage. It was cost and ease of production. Everything else is just hype.

We had a bent GMC frame from delivery. Was strapped down on a trailer too tight. Early hydroformed models were actually quite weak.

 

[toylandcruiser]

I hope so. Bolting accessories like an air compressor, water tank, or utility body works a whole lot better to a chassis that's pretty much a plate of steel, instead of a thin box. You'll find that almost all heavier trucks are C channels. I would avoid boxed frames in 3500's and up.

The boxed frames are marketing. Hydroforming is cheap to do. GM and Dodge didn't switch to boxed frames for any kind of performance advantage. It was cost and ease of production. Everything else is just hype.

We had a bent GMC frame from delivery. Was strapped down on a trailer too tight. Early hydroformed models were actually quite weak.

Words of wisdom right there


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Buliwyf]

Also keep in mind that you can box a C channel frame anywhere you want to. Often where the engine and transmission sit. Heavy trucks can be braced, and I've even seen heavy trucks with double C channel frames. A C slid right inside a C.

The key to the C is it is often thicker so it survives hard impacts on the suspension mounts and such better. See Dodges track bar mount issues. For example the upper A arm mounts on the new Chevy. They're properly welded on. But could you bolt them on? Heck no, they'd tear off. On a C frame? Maybe.

The next step for hydroformed frames will be unequal thickness frames. To get the thick walls of the C channel frame for areas that get hammered hard. But without the entire frame being thickened.

 

[FordGuy1]

We call Dodges the poor mans Ford around here for a reason.

Any Dodge ram that's been sitting on a lot for a 13 months around here can go for dirt cheap. You might think of me as a Dodge hater, and that's not it at all. I'd love to buy a new Dodge as they are available WAAAY cheap around here quite often. It's just that they have a few weird features that I don't like, and I haven't seen enough well beat examples in good shape.

It might be some of the trim packages, or maybe they sell better in your area. They sell quick around here, but the lots always seem to have excess when next years models come out. Cheap as a gas Ford or GMC. Hopefully they get it together for me.

Here is where I do have the real world experience, Warranty! We process over 1800 warranty claims per month. Ford warranty is very easy and we warranty everything Ford should be covering and we will not warranty what is not Ford's responsibility. Ford will not deny a repair unless they are being provided with proof the customer or a modification has been the culprit. Maintain your vehicle, don't throw a crazy tuner in it, don't put gas in your diesel, or pour DEF fluid in the fuel tank and life is good! We will know. Most dealers want to make warranty repairs, and we want our customers happy. Most unhappy customers are people who know they ******up and won't admit they blew it.

 

[Buliwyf]

Glad someones making money on W work.

 

[FordGuy1]

Glad someones making money on W work.

It's not like we kill it on warranty work, but it is all part of the equation.

 

[plainjaneFJC]

I thought Ford screwed techs on warranty work? I think it was the Powerstroke forums that the techs were complaining about it?

 

[FordGuy1]

I thought Ford screwed techs on warranty work? I think it was the Powerstroke forums that the techs were complaining about it?

Warranty repair times are made to pay the tech the amount of time it takes to actually do the work, so in theory, if you are good, and did warranty work all day, you could flag 8.0 hours of time. In the old days, a really fast tech could perform warranty repairs to the tune of about 140%. Well, we got used to hitting those hours and when the auto manufactures started to reduce times to cut there expense, it really took a bite out of the tech's pay. Ford used to build into there time, time for tool cleaning, test drives, time to fetch the vehicle etc.. called it contingency time, they have taken it all away. What really sucks is they will set a time for a repair, for example take a ignition switch, say it pays .7hr, then ford recalls this part, they will cut the time to .3hr just because they need to save money claiming the tech will do so many he will get really good at it so its justified. It's tough for the tech's mental outlook when they do this. The good news is if you are a good, smart tech, invest 50k plus in tools, get certified and work hard, you can make 60-90k a year plus 401k etc..

 

[153624]

I'm not sure if it was noted or not. But the 550&5500 do NOT share the same diffs. Fords use Dana/Spicer front and rear. Dodges use a Magna Steyr front.