At wits end with highway handling issues, I'm out of ideas.

1stDeuce

Explorer
If you have a left or right pull, and went to the same shop 3 times for an alignment, and it STILL has the same pull, you are a VERY good customer! :)

The trouble with alignments is nobody checks the work. We deal with shops all the time that are "toe and go" shops. This means they set toe, but don't touch camber and caster. In your case, you definitely have a camber/caster problem. Hopefully the new alignment shop can fix it by making some adjustments. Be sure to tell them it pulls, and that you'd like it aligned so that it DOESN'T pull. They may have to run it to the negative side of the camber spec to get enough caster change to get it to drive straight, but they can do that.

As for wandering, if your LCA bushings are SHOT, then it could cause some wandering. KJ's steer very quickly in the first place, and are a little "nervous" even when new, so if you've got anything loose, they're all over the road. Have you checked the center balljoint in the rear upper "Y" arm? If that balljoint has a bunch of play in it, the tail will wander around, and that'll cause the jeep to wander too, and the handling to be very twitchy. Excessive toe-in will do the same thing.

Once you have it aligned, post the readings, and let me know how it drives. And make sure they give you BEFORE and AFTER readings. If they're not willing to give you that much, then go somewhere that will. You're paying for it, you should be able to get it!! (Toe and go shops like to change things to read green w/o changing the actual values, so you can check their work against the real specs...)

As for the steering wheel shake, you have tires/wheels either out of round or out of balance. FIRST thing to do is check your front wheels for weights on both sides. If you only have weights on the inside, you're not really balancing them as much as your IFS would like... Take it somewhere and ask them to dynamically balance the front tires at least. Dynamic doesn't just mean spin balance, it means balance using weights on the inside and the outside lips of the wheel! That should get rid of the steering shake, assuming they don't find any excessive out of round or wobble when they're doing the balance. Really good balance machines also do road force variation, which uses a roller against the wheel. That can compensate for a little bit of out-of-round too.

Let us know what plays out.
 
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the_dealer

Observer
Thanks for all the input guys. Insayin, I've done what you mentioned a while back, just to make sure things were square, and even had a body shop put it on the frame machine just to check.

1stduece, the tri link has new moog bushings and ball joint. I'm starting to think the shop I've been using is toe and go, which is why I decided to try my dad's favorite shop out. He has a 99 f150 with a 4" trail master lift(lifted since brand new in 99...with 17 miles on the clock). He swears by the place so I figured I would give them a try. They told me they would do any special instructions I may have, and even let me watch. I went by there today and they weren't able to get to it. Being a shop owner I know the feeling, one job that takes longer than expected may put everything behind. I also didn't want a 4:45 pm rush job. I have an appointment in the morning, so we shall see what happens .
 

the_dealer

Observer
Ok, the results are in:

The original shop I used for alignments weren't worth a crap. The drivers tire was at the max spec for negative camber, and the passenger side at the max spec for positive camber. Cross camber had a huge difference. I can see how this played a big part in the handling. Caster was low, but cross caster was a 1.5* difference. Toe was also off as well. They were able to get the camber at the low end of spec for negative camber(I'd have to look at the sheet to see the cross camber, but it was fairly close), cross caster at .5*, and toe in spec. It looks like I'll need to add some JBA uca's, as the caster is still low (2*), and to get the camber closer to neutral. There's a huge night and day difference after the new alignment, and I'd say it's fixed. I do want to replace the lca bushings, and add the uca's but other than that it's good. It drives 100x better than it ever has. Thanks guys!
 

1stDeuce

Explorer
Might be a cheaper solution than JBA UCA's... I just put some 1 degree camber shims in the fiancee's Liberty. That allowed the cams to be used to dial in more caster. It's only about .75" taller than it should be, but I have PLENTY of caster now, and still only a tiny bit of negative camber. I'll PM you with details...
 

the_dealer

Observer
Stock

After


Took it on a long highway drive to the Truck & Jeepfest today and it was so nice having some highway manners.

Craig333, the liberty guys swear by the moog k3199. The weight difference between the stock TRW and the moog is huge. The liberty has had many recalls for lower bj's, and fail quite quickly even after the recall fix. My stock lower bj, and upper bj's were shot. The lowers were actually almost seized in that position.
Now here's the Moog, which was put on during the lift, but before the steering rack and tre's. I agree, Moog ' s quality has seemed to have gone downhill over what it was back in the day, but for the liberty it's the best option and greasable.
 

redthies

Renaissance Redneck
As others have mentioned, I'd be going back to the first alignment shop and asking for some money back! Glad to here its fixed!
 

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