FWC and questions...

[cabochris]

I own a 99 Tacoma X-cab 4X4 and was trying to decide between a FWC and a traditional style smaller hard-side camper. The best FWC for my truck seems to be their Eagle model, and would you believe there is a barely used 2006 Eagle for sale, just 10 minutes from my home. So I just had to take a look.

I did. It was in "Like New" condition, however I decided to pass because it was priced too high. For a couple of thousand more I can order a new Eagle, with the options I wanted. But, what are the odds that a used one would pop up so close to me?

OK perhaps I should have purchased the used Eagle, but I was still not certain a FWC was my best choice. So I drove to my local small town RV dealer, and they had a 2001 Pastime traditional style small truck camper. It looks like new and the price was right! While still small inside, it was easier getting in and out, because of a much larger door than on the Eagle. The Pastime had everything except a bathroom and awning. I thought this is a great little camper for the money. Plus it has more storage than FWC Eagle. It weighs 1,025 lbs.

That night at home I agonized weather to order a new Eagle, or go with the Pastime? My heart was with the FWC. But the Pastime seemed to offer so much for the $4,000 price. I knew I would not be doing much 4-wheeling with the Pastime, and more than likely the Pastime would be keept off the truck. But it only takes about 15 minutes to load... even though I would prefer to keep camper on the truck and ready to go.

Well I just had to see what that Pastime looked like on my truck. So at the dealer we loaded it and discovered that my rear springs were shot! Actually the truck did pretty well with the load, but still the springs need replacing. That can be fixed, but seeing the camper on my truck made me question if this was such a good idea? How would the rig handle on the highway/wind and on logging roads? Even though the Pastime is a very small camper, perhaps it is a bit too much for a Tacoma? I sort of thought I would drive my Tacoma daily. I'm not sure I would be happy doing that with such a camper loaded?

As much as I like the Pastime camper, I am now leaning towards a new FW Eagle. I would keep it on the truck always. My dog could ride in the folded camper and I could go off road, plus still tow a utility trailer or my small boat!

But a FWC is expensive new and I could use some help with correct options decisions. Here is what I have in mind... FW Eagle with awning, standard aluminum luggage/boat rack, rear wall steps and flood lights (for looks). No jacks to save some money and weight- besides I plan to leave camper on truck and do not want hastle of loading. I also want the rig ready to go always, for last minute weekend travel decisions. Is not having mechanical jacks a mistake?

On the interior I want some tunes, the furnace, aux battery system. Again to save some money I am leaning towards an ice box rather than the $700 refer option. Would I regret not having a refrigerator? Also I am wondering about the costly Arctic Pack insulation. It seems like another thing to have to store. But when winter camping might be a needed option? Would the furnace keep that little camper warm enough in the winter without the insulation option?

Without the mechanical jacks, refrigerator and arctic pack, my new Eagle will be around $13,500 delivered and installed. But since I do not have an expensive truck, I can sort of swallow the expensive price for such a small camper. Besides, the camper should serve me for years to come, plus hold resale value. Even down the line I could use/load it in a new truck.

My concerns besides the above mentioned options selections are, a real lack of storage in the camper and that tiny entrance door. OK, I guess a FWC is for an explorer, adventurer and those seeking the path less taken. So duffle bags in the truck cab will have to do. But what about that tiny door? On the Eagle I looked at, the couch is also in the way of getting in and out of the camper. With my size, I found it easier to climb out backwards stepping on to the milk crate, used as a step. While camping, will that tiny door drive me crazy every time I need to enter or exit? Or will I adapt and discover some secret technique. At the very least become more fit and flexible?

I have owned all style RVs. So I'm used to big doors, bathrooms and showers. But my heart longs for backcountry adventure. I actually own a smaller Class C Motorhome now. it is very nice, but runs on a 460 Ford. I am thinking with the price of gas, now is the time to sell it and downsize to the FWC. So should I go with an FWC Eagle and which options? Or the Pastime camper with bigger door and a small coat closet and overhead storage? I greatly appreciate any thoughts, help and advice. Thanks, CC.

[theMec]

You're going to hate me because I'm going to confuse you with more options. If you're thinking about a heavy hard side like the Pastime, I have found some lighter and cheaper hardside options.

Panther -> http://www.nwsportsrv.com/index.ydev
Capri -> http://capricamper.com/index.html
M & M Custom Campers -> http://www.mmcustomcampers.com/Index.htm

[kcowyo]

Welcome to Expo -

Lemme try to answer a few of your comments and questions.

First the weight issue. If your springs sagged under the weight of the Pastime than in all likelihood they will sag under a FWC. New spring packs and/or airbags will alleviate the problem with either model.

If a hard side slide-in works for you, have you considered a Six Pac? They are the sister company of FWC and they make a great hard side slide in for your Tacoma. Just another option to confuse you some more.

Price vs. price... the FWC's hold their value incredibly well and used ones are in constant demand. More to consider, so if you bought new or used one and were unhappy, you could get your money out of it pretty easily. I can't say the same for sure about the Pastime, as they're an unknown entity in the slide-in market.

I don't have mechanical jacks, I have the manual jacks. For the cost and the number of times a year I remove my FWC, mechanical jacks are not necessary. I have an icebox and I would gladly and happily pay $700 for the fridge. I don't recommend the icebox at all for extended trips of more than 2 days.

Regarding the Arctic pack, do you camp out when it's freezing or below outside very often? If not, skip it and bring an extra sleeping bag. I don't have it and I don't miss it and I don't need it as far as I can tell. But if you're doing a lot of winter camping, I have heard good reviews about the Arctic Pack. The heater works great at heating up the small space. Mine has run me out of the camper more than once.

The rest of your options look great. Go for the 12v ceiling fan. I wish I had one. I don't have a couch, it was removed by the original owner. I've gone back and forth on installing one. After spending some time in a FWC display model at a recent trade show, I really wish I had the couch. But ingress and egress would be a bit of a PITA.

Re, the Alice in Wonderland door... When I first intro'd my girlfriend to my FWC, I made a joke that she has taken to heart and it's good advice as you move into the smaller slide-in world. "Think small and move gently."

Every movement as you acclimate should be at half speed and ducking and sucking it in as often as possible. The bed doesn't have a lot of overhead room. Prepare to bonk your head a few times getting up and down. You'll only crack your head once or twice on the top of the door frame getting in and out before your head naturally tucks and ducks. Stan with FWC, showed me a neat trick to keep that metal frame from creasing your skull. He uses some car door trim, the type that prevents parking lot dingers, on the top of the door frame. It cushions the impact a little.

I won't try to sell you on one camper vs. another, I'm just trying to offer some input and info as an FWC owner. It works great for me but it was a little bit of a learning process. Now my reflexes know when to duck, when to move slowly and gently, how much force to use to open and close the icebox, how to pack my cab to easily pull my duffle bags through the pass through windows, etc.

Best of luck, hope this helps a little.

- KC .....

[Rockcrawler]

I just had the same debate. I was able to find a used Hawk pretty close to me and ended up picking it up. I figure that if it doesn't work out for us that we can sell it in a year or so and get most of our money back out of it. A new one you will still be able to as well, but you will still take an initial depreciation hit. The FWC is roomier than I thought it would be, but certainly is not overly luxurious. We are coming at it from 2 different directions though... upgrading from a rooftop tent and downgrading from a class C motorhome. For mileage, durability and resale, I don't think the FWCs can be beat. Good luck!

Kyle

[VikingVince]

I'll add my 2 cents to your deliberations:
***Strongly encourage you to spend the extra bucks on the fridge. (as KC mentioned) It's so nice to not have to hassle with getting ice, running out of ice on a longer trip, etc. I would never be without one again, after camping for years with a cooler and block ice. On the other hand, however, if you almost never do more than 4 day trips a big block of ice will work. But still, it's a hassle IMO.
***you say you long for backcountry adventure...my immediate reaction is go with the FWC because of the lower COG; the truck camper is so much more limiting...you can do so many more types of trails/roads with the FWC
***You're right about limited storage in the FWC, but it's just one of those inevitable trade-offs (common to all types of rigs) that you deal with for the backcountry adventures.
***I really like the FWC and would definitely consider getting one in the future. I would for sure get the couch for relaxing, reading, eating inside, etc.
***I'll throw in one more option, which I'm obviously partial to - the Flippac
www.flippac.com New ones are ~$3300. If you're handy, you can custom build the truck bed similar to the FWC and have a LOT more storage, depending on your design. The Flippac for your truck (like mine) only weighs about 250 pounds. In terms of weight/offroad performance there's very little difference from a shell. Having said this, and even though I really like mine, if I were starting over I'd probably get the FWC over the Flippac just because I wouldn't have to do the build.
***One final thing to consider is how you want to experience whatever outdoor environment you're in when you're inside whatever rig you choose. For me, one of the things I love about my flippac is I'm constantly enjoying the sounds, smells, breeze , of the outdoors when I'm it. You don't get nearly as much of that inside a hard sided camper. I think you'd get more of that with the FWC due to the partial canvas sides.

Good luck and have fun!

[theMec]

.... my immediate reaction is go with the FWC because of the lower COG; the truck camper is so much more limiting...you can do so many more types of trails/roads with the FWC
***You're right about limited storage in the FWC, but it's just one of those inevitable trade-offs (common to all types of rigs) that you deal with for the backcountry adventures.

The storage and COG are two reasons that I think a lightweight hardside might be a better option for some. (See my links above.) The larger panthers might not beat the FWD COG but the others might. I'm not sure how they'd do offroad though.

The Flippac is a pretty cool setup. Not good for cold or windy conditions though.

[kcowyo]

The Flippac is a pretty cool setup. Not good for cold or windy conditions though.

Are you speaking from experience or making assumptions?

I've camped with Vince in well below freezing conditions and his Flip-Pac worked quite well for him. A small space heater does wonders.

I know he's dealt with high winds too. Perhaps not enjoyable from the standpoint of trying to get a peaceful night's rest, but it hasn't limited him in any way.

[DaveInDenver]

Can't speak to a Flip Pac, but cold is not any more of an issue in a my WilderNest than any other soft sided camper. There is a 3+" thick piece of closed cell foam under you and that makes it at least the equal of any tent. I'm quite comfortable in sub zero temps in my camper with the addition of a layer under the mattress and a decent sleeping bag. In normal use, we use the same bed linens as you'd use at home, flat sheet, blanket and a comforter and we're fine for the three main camping seasons.

I've had to close up my WilderNest a couple of times in very high winds, but these were winds you'd have trouble standing up normally in anyway. Typical storms aren't a big deal and there are guy lines rings on the tent that you can batten down the camper with if you want. I have to start thinking about closing up above 50MPH gusts, but if I can find a very secure anchor, the guy lines would minimize the buffeting. The problem is the sides of the WilderNest are flat and act like sails, so very high winds require good anchors.

[theMec]

Are you speaking from experience or making assumptions?

I've camped with Vince in well below freezing conditions and his Flip-Pac worked quite well for him. A small space heater does wonders.

I'm making assumptions based on my experiences sleeping in tent - which a flippac is. I'm sure the heater helps.

[lqhikers]

I agree with most of opinions above (i drive tacoma /eagle fwc) for my 2 cents worth i would pass on frig opt on new eagle and spend the money (about the same) on a engle 12v this way if you end up not keeping camper or go a different route you still have the best frig/freezer !
I also do not think you can compare fwc/atc campers with any other type on the market at this time.
Drive slow and enjoy "its the journey"
Les Lqhikers