Mercedes 914 LK LN2

Dream

Observer
Hello Guys,

We bought a Mercedes 914 4x2 with Diff. Lock (ex Firefighter) which we want to convert into a Camper. The hole Idea is to build a camper which will be able to go on easier Offroad Tracks. It should be more suitable than classic road Campers, but not as much as Expedition Vehicels. Something between, able to make trips all around the Globe, exept Deserts, Mud, etc.
I thought about the normal Truck Body should evtl. get higher placed to get more space under it (this feature if necessary). What I am sure about is to change the wheel with a Profile more convenient to Offroad Track (something like a building site Profile) and bigger sized (the oringinal size is 9,5x17,5 and I imagined something like 12x19,5" or 12x20" if possible). And thats the point where I stucked. I cant get nowhere Informations about what size is allowed/possible and under which conditions to put them on the 914. I will be obliged to change the rims to realize this.

All that is to boost the Offroad Capabilities of the vehicule, and the final look of the finished Project, sure, is also important which should approach to an Expedition Vehicel.

Does somebody have an Idea what I can do?

Reguards,
Benjamin


PS: Here`s a picture of our one

IMG_4127.JPG

And this is what we want to do out of him

MAN.JPG
 

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ianc

Adventurer Wannabe
Benjamin welcome to the forum.
The fact that you truck already has a diff lock will make it very capable on all but the worst roads.
A few thoughts from my experience (moving from 9.5, R17.5 to 285/70 R19.5 and back):
1) Stick with the twin rear wheel set-up if you're not going to be doing lots of sand/mud. This keeps the rear more stable on the highway
2) If you do end up going for larger wheels - Try to maintain the centre to centre distance between the 2 front wheels. I extended mine and I think this contributed to the bump steer. There are at lreast 2 companies making 19.5" custom rims - Aspect Wheels in in the UK and also a Belgian or Dutch company.
3) Keep in mind that putting aggressive thread (like the building site profile) on the font will make the steering more vague
4) Going for bigger wheels/tyres will change both the drive gearing and the effectiveness of the brakes. I could notice the reduction in breaking and 285/70 R19.5s took the edges off the already "relaxed" acceleration of my Vario.

Best of Luck and keep the updates and questions coming.




 

Dream

Observer
Hi Ianc,

thanks a lot for the welcome and also for your advices and sharing experiences!
I just didn`t understand what this will mean: "Try to maintain the centre to centre distance between the 2 front wheels."

I think you`re right about the consequences by mounting bigger wheels. Maybe this will require also a alteration of the break system. I hope hardly not.
Anyway, the first important thing is to make the vehicel ready to use, means that the all about the vehicels back (the box) is in priority. After I will see how the music is playing and take further decisions.

Also the "retired" accelaration is a uncomon consequence of bigger wheels, that`s true. It already is a slow motion Truck now.
I had both of them in front of me to choose when buying, the T2 (old Vario) and this one. Both with same 136HP. The only difference was the motor type. The T2 with his OM354LA (?(3,9l turbo intercooler)) and the LK with his OM366 (5,9l no turbo).
I hardly throw out of choise the T2, because I wouldn`t have a lot of possibilities to tune him up and the GVW 7,5t would come up to its limits with our needs. Otherwise I really love those Trucks.
In opposite the OM366 offers the possibility to give up to 240HP with original MB pieces. All those motors are based on the same block. Up to 170HP (all the X17 or XX17 models) it`s in a range of let`s say "low cost" motor tuning- about 1kEuro. I think once I`m going to load that donkey I`ll soon have the need (or wish) to realise this modification.
Anyway I`ll try to build it as light as somehow plain possible.

I hope also that our "ready to go" weight will be around 7,5t. This means that the body and the breaks will have 1,7t reserve (at 9,2t GVW), what again means that there is a big possibility that the breakes can do their job even with bigger tyres. I hope...
Maybe someone of you made similar experiences?

Finally what a motor tuning could bring, except better acceleration, is a raised fuel consumption. But with bigger wheels I could balance the consumption, or? And at the end I`ll drive 90km/h at let`s say 2000rpm instead of 2500rpm, possible?

Benjamin
 
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canals1164

Observer
Hi
We went up from 19.5 to 22.5 super singles and no problems with brakes on our 917. I wouldn't panic about engine just yet as our truck seems to have plenty of kW.
 

ianc

Adventurer Wannabe
Hi Ianc,
I just didn`t understand what this will mean: "Try to maintain the centre to centre distance between the 2 front wheels."
Benjamin

Try to keep the centre line through the thread pattern (as you look at the truck from the front) in the same place.

Does that make more sense?

I'm assuming your 914 already has enough clearance for the larger wheels because it can also come with them as an option - is that correct?
If that is the case - You might be able to get a second-hand rear axle with lower gearing to suit the larger wheels.

Merry Christmas

Ian
 

Dream

Observer
Could you post a photo, please?

Well, I`ve found some picts by searching in your profile. But what was the original size of the Firetruck? 19,5 or 22,5 already? Maybe this could be quit important cause of the difference in height of the bodies between the normal 4x2 and the 4x4. Otherwise I would be happy to have at least the final look as it was originally on your truck.
I think I´ll be obliged to take the 19,5 Vario or Unimog rims with 6 holes. Because from the 11t LK 4x2 bodies upwards are all the rims with 8 holes...

Merry Christmas to you also!

Benjamin
 
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Neil

Observer
kd75.jpg
Hi Dream

Welcome to the forum, I am not a regular poster but I am a regular reader.

I have recently converted 1017A and also went down the larger tyres , I opted for 385 / 65 x 22.5. They made a big difference. You can change the ratio on the diff , although its not cheap. I added nearly 25% extra in mine and it changed everything. Although in 1st its not as low, its top end is now fantastic. 50mph is 2000rpm.
The reduction in the noise is incredible.

Where are you based.

Neil

Essex UK


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Dream

Observer
Hi Neil,

thank you for the welcome!

If I understood "Where are you based." well as a question where I am from... I`m from Slovenia. Uh, yes, right, I didn`t even introdused myself/ourselfs. So...
My girlfriend (36) and me (33) live since 2005 mobile in a camper, means in this year we gave up our normal lives, sold everything possible of our stuff, quited the appartment,...
Half a year before we bought our first camper, a VW T2 1975, also known as the Bully, meant to pass a trip for about two or three months down to Turkey.
Because of low budget we wished all the time to find a possibilty how to join travelling and work together. A week before depart we went to a festival where we met a guy who gives an advice how to do that. Until here we didn`t know yet that our lifestyle is going change radically.
So we just threw all the Turkey-Plans and stuff in the corner and left in another direction. We went to France, had a nice new experience and found a temporary job in grape harvesting... ...and fall into this new dimension of live thanks to all those persons we`ve met there. We realised that our idea of travelling and work is nothing new like we thought before. And we just let us pushing further by the advices we got (sure, with a huge amount of naivity). Passed the first winter in Spain cause we have been sure that the winters there we could spend in shorts. Well, we where wrong. And a stove in our camper van would be welcome also... But we survived anyway, even at 0-1° without any regular heating options. And it was a damn good time! We felt like living a fairy tale!
Back home after approximatly 1,5 years we carried out what we decided already in Spain: to sell the Bully and get a bigger one more suitable for Round 2.... ....3.... ...4... a.s.o. a.s.o.
This is how our lives changed. This is how we started to live in a camper and feel to be at home where we are just in that moment.

Meanwhile I dedicated a lot of time to learn all about campers- materials, constructions, components, types, and learned to work different materials (all orientated and connected for camper build). It went out my hobby.

After all this years living with that object we know what our travelling habituds are. At least for the moment.
This coming rolling home is meant to give us the possibility to go anywhere on the globe (we forecast all oriental countries)- low cost, maximum self sufficient, robustness, easy to maintain and repair, easy accessible spare parts anywhere, low falling out rates, and big enough to provide agreable uncomplicated living comfort on tour and stock all we have, all we need and what we want to have more.

I know this will be a big investigation and a lot of work which will take its time to be (if ever really really) finished. But step by step we`ll arrive on top.
We are not in a big hurry to succeed as soon as possible, but anyway hope to start end of summer/beginning of autumn and do the most work until Winter is coming in (at least the support of the body, the body itself and all the doors and windows). Once that is done no problem to continue in a small garage or in the vehicel itself. I hope to succeed the homologation (?) in spring 2016.
Meanwhile I`ll make use out of time and prepare the hole planings which later will simplify and accelerate work progression. The more I do now and the better I do now, the less I have to do and the quicker I`ll be later.


I felt the difference between driving at 2000 rpm (about 70 km/h) and 2500 rpm (about 90 km/h). At 2500 it was admissible anyhow, but in future better to ride at 2000 to go easy. The consumption at 2500 rpm was at 17,4l/100km. I think 16-16,5l/100km would be reachable at 2000 rpm.
The diff itself I`ll leave like it is (the Truck runned just 17.000 km yet- actually all parts are like new). The bigger tyres will release the rpm. In relation to this I`ll loose power which I`ll get back by installing a turbo (and adjusting the Fuel Pump). By feeling I think that it could be just the right combination... I hope.

The only problem I still got is that I don`t know which exact dimension of rims and tyres I can put on. It`s not like I can put on the same sizes like a 914AF/917AF, because there are some differences between 4x4 and 4x2 chassis. The 917AF already has 8 holes in the rims, the normal 914 only 6. So everything a bit smaller... ...and lower I think.
I got the feeling that I can put on the 19,5" from Vario without any supplementary modifications. I hope to get the right answer soon. (What is the biggest allowed size on 4x4 Varios?)

Read you soon!
Benjamin
 
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canals1164

Observer
Hi Benjamin
Sorry you a right they were already 22.5 8 hole wheels. The new super singles are bigger and have increased speed by over 10% with origional diffs. Our truck had very tight wheel clearances on rear, we increased this on new body, the front are tight but we have not managed to get them to touch the body yet!

Good luck with the research and build, please keep us posted with photos.
Cheers
Ian
 

ianc

Adventurer Wannabe
The Varios only came with 17.5" as the maximum size from the factory. Some of us have fitted custom built R19.5 rims and 285/70 R19.5 tyres (Normally Toyo M608). This allow as Vario run with single on the back instead of dual wheel set-up. Given the extra size of your vehicle - you may not wish to go for single wheels on the rear. I am pretty sure the 19.5 rims cannot be used in a dual wheel configuration as there is not enough offset and the tyres would be touching.
 

Dream

Observer
Ianc thank you for the answer.
A question I ask myself is: which parts make difference in ground clearence between the 4x2 and the 4x4 chassis in LK modells? Does anybody know that?

Anyway I evtl plan to put the chassis higher (for bigger ground clearence) by setting distance blocks between the axe and the suspention. This also will give the possibilty for bigger wheels.
And I think I'll stay with the twin wheel combination.
 

Neil

Observer
Hi Dream

Mine has the OM352A engine ( straight 6 turbo )

As I now have all the diesel heating feeding from the fuel tank it is harder to accurately put a figure on the consumption .

I weigh about 9000 kg fully loaded and from my preliminary tests I think that i am getting about 20l / 100 km ( 14 mpg )

Having discussed this with many owners of the same engine , this appears to be about right. People rarely get better on a loaded truck.

If you are down to 17l /100km then this is very good and I wouldn't alter anything. Whilst it is very nice to have a bit extra power in this day and age in europe fuel cost are a major consideration.

As I mentioned earlier we have increased the ratio in the Diffs and this has made a great improvement.

For very technical advice I have always found the German truck forum very helpful. There are some very knowledgeable people on there with regard to Mercedes trucks

You can post in English or German , someone will answer you

http://www.allrad-lkw-gemeinschaft.de

Good luck with the build , exciting times

Neil
 

Dream

Observer
Here we go... ...finally! :)

First to get rid of the old box
Weg damit.JPG

Fabrication of the working platform which will serve to produce the walls under pressure
1Presstisch mit sechs Längsstreben 2.jpg

Integration of canals so that the adhessive can evacuate
3Kanale für Kleberüberschuss fräsen.jpg

Here is one of them...
4Kanale für Kleberüberschuss.jpg

The beginning of the ground panel...
Fabrikation Bodengruppe.jpg

With insulation, I use XPS 40mm
Fabrikation Bodengruppe2.jpg

For pressuring I use those 1000l tanks. 2 tanks for a surface of 2,3m x 1,25m at a time. When the adhessive is hardened I can continue... ...but it is going quickly- I don`t get to much offtime...
IMG_20151203_154751.jpg

And here the first panel is done...
Bodengruppe fast fertig.jpg

It`s not that easy to do like I thought it would be. But it`s menageable. The work is going on slowly, but anyway I have to redo failures regulary. :/ The biggest problem is the size of panels, but at least I am lucky to have a 10t lift.

Ah... ...and yes, I decided to build the cabin out of wood. :ylsmoke:

That`s the plan:
Aufbau Siebdruck.jpg
 
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Dream

Observer
News from the front...

The front wall. I prepared the construction so that, later one day, I can make the pass through between box and cabin.
2015121520451000.jpg

Than I decided to do the pass through anyway now. I thought about how to do this later and didn't get a acceptable solution for the profiles of the door. The hole would be even smaller... ...to small actually.
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But, what happens? The cut of the square I cutted out was damn ugly- not even straight and to small.
So I announced the battle...
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...and cutted out a bigger hole... ...this time straight, smooth and big enough.
2015121520541500.jpg

So... ...the profiles needed for the door... ...how to do? Originally I wanted to order them (or those- for all doors around the box) at the carpenter. But it was Saturday. Waiting until Monday and some days more before I get them? No, the show must go on... :D
I remembered I once have seen a very helpful accessory for jobs like this on the internet. Quick re-research, two vids on youtube, and there it was... (I'm sorry, don't know this tool in English).
2015121520551800.jpg

...and soon my tests for the profile where positive...
2015121520544500.jpg

Yeah, looks much better than before...
2015121520554500.jpg

2015121520560800.jpg

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