Air Bag suspension Assist

revor

Explorer
So I figured I'd give it a try..
Using standard Firestone 8.5" travel bags I figured I could shim my way to about a 1200# load balancing system without suffering the swaying problems I would have if I used the Boge Self leveling mounting points.

It works quite well. Sitting unloaded the truck is .5" taller in the rear, it has a nice ride and handles as good as a box on wheels ought to.

Putting 35PSI to the air bags raised the truck a good 2 inches! I figure this should easily compensate for most any load I put in the truck. It was a balance of what I figure full compression will be as to what I needed for airbag compression, so with it contacting the lower bump sitting lever I gave it 6" up travel.

The biggest trouble I had was trying to build it into a spring retainer system as well. The thing with springs is that they are a spiral right? That makes it hard to mount the airbag to the lower retainer and keep it parallel to the lower bump..

Anyway it get's a little crooked and does not line up as well as I'd like to so It's time to add an alignment sleeve, I didn't want to use another fitted piece to the puzzle but I am afraid I will need to.. But that will keep things straight.

Here's a few pic's of the initial installation.

Nearly there...
 

stevenmd

Expedition Leader
revor said:
It's time to add an alignment sleeve, I didn't want to use another fitted piece to the puzzle but I am afraid I will need to.. But that will keep things straight.
what does an alignment sleeve look like?
 

revor

Explorer
Alignment sleeve

If you look at that 3rd pic I used a rubber bumper to bump against the lower bumps (kind of a spring spacer like thing that mounts above the lower spring retainer to take up a bit of additional space.

The problem is that the bumper doesn't always contact and hold the airbag perfectly straight (as I'd like to to) to solve this that lower bumper will need to be a rather longish piece of metal bolted where you see it but it will be made to align the extension piece on the air bag (above the rubber bumper) and keep everything straight upon compression.

Almost like havinf cones to reseat you springs where they need to go.. The crazy part with this is I have to consider the articulation this thing has! I'm all about flexy in my Discos but it seems that these 110's flex even more (!?!)

Jackstand under the frame, no tire on the axle and I can droop that side almost 9" by simply taking the floor jack down, that's spring retained and in addition to the 6-7" of uptravel available!!!

It's going to be a challenge to get that boy part and that girl part of the air spring system to meet in proper fashion!

But then I know an expert.. Hey Steve? Sorry couldn't help it:)
 

stevenmd

Expedition Leader
revor said:
It's going to be a challenge to get that boy part and that girl part of the air spring system to meet in proper fashion!

But then I know an expert.. Hey Steve? Sorry couldn't help it:)
:victory:
 

Michael Slade

Untitled
Are you selling those upper shock mounts with custom sizing on top? I need a pair...

I have some air-spring ideas I bounced around on PBB about 6 years ago. I came up with a complete air-spring replacement, but ended up not using any of the custom parts. Am thinking about re-visiting the idea...

EDIT: Nice photoshop skillz in that pic #2. Keeping the background from blowing out is tricky. ;)
 

kellymoe

Expedition Leader
Keith,

Where did you source the bags? I had soem cheap air bags on the 130 for a while until one blew out. I have ben wanting to do something more substantial and this is just the trick.

Kevin
 

revor

Explorer
I haven't made front shock mounts in a while. I suspect I could whip up a few sets in the coming months.. They take a bit of time to make but they sure work nice. I've been using D2 towers on most everything that uses a 12" short body Bilstein.

Photoshop Skillz? Me? Sorry it was the camera, the tiny Olympus. Works pretty good for photo illiterate's like me:D

You can pick up the air springs from MSC industrial supply

http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/GSDRVSM?PACACHE=000000056311919

My setup needs some refinement for sure I'll post up the next stage.
 

maxingout

Adventurer
On my Land Rover Defenders, I always installed adjustable air springs that I got from JC Whitney. This was our standard suspension upgrade for carrying the weight in the back of our Defenders.

View attachment 19164

We got a bag size that fit exactly inside our rear springs and put the black bushing above and below the red air bag to protect it.

View attachment 19165

We led the black air hose out through the upper bushing and then mounted the inflation points either on the bumper or just inside the rear doors.

When we got ready to make an expedition into the Empty Quarter of Saudi Arabia, we would inflate the air springs to about thirty psi. Then we would fill our long range fuel tanks, put eight jerry cans on the Brownchurch roof rack, and put five jerry cans in a secure box in the back of the truck so they couldn't come adrift. (The box had a lid on it). That made 420 litres of fuel plus 200 liters of water, plus two boxes of firewood, plus camping gear and enough food for four people to last in the desert 8 to 9 days offroad. After we loaded all the stuff into the Defender, we usually let some air out of the airbags to put the suspension/springs in the middle of their range of travel.

In five years of heavy expeditionary travel, I have had only one red airbag failure, and I easily replaced it in camp at night. A high lift jack to raise the truck body and a bottle jack to support the axle makes it easy to pop out the back spring and put in a new bag.

Members of the Riyadh Rover Register had used heavy duty springs, springs within springs, and red airbags for expeditionary travel. We finally settled on the red airbags because they were easy to install, affordable, easy to replace, reliable, and they made it easy for us to adjust suspension travel so the suspension didn't bottom out in really rough conditions.

The other big difference these bags did for us is that they largely eliminated body sway when cornering in our Defenders. When you consider that the roof rack had eight full jerry cans, fifty liters of water, firewood in boxes, and other associated gear, you quickly appreciated the elimination of body sway.
 

kellymoe

Expedition Leader
I had the same set up on my 130 for a few years. On one trip both bags failed from friction on the bags causing a hole. I am looking for something a little more robust but may just get new bags in the meantime.



maxingout said:
In five years of heavy expeditionary travel, I have had only one red airbag failure, and I easily replaced it in camp at night. A high lift jack to raise the truck body and a bottle jack to support the axle makes it easy to pop out the back spring and put in a new bag.

Members of the Riyadh Rover Register had used heavy duty springs, springs within springs, and red airbags for expeditionary travel. We finally settled on the red airbags because they were easy to install, affordable, easy to replace, reliable, and they made it easy for us to adjust suspension travel so the suspension didn't bottom out in really rough conditions.

The other big difference these bags did for us is that they largely eliminated body sway when cornering in our Defenders. When you consider that the roof rack had eight full jerry cans, fifty liters of water, firewood in boxes, and other associated gear, you quickly appreciated the elimination of body sway.
 

revor

Explorer
The failure thing is exactly why I wanted to try these industrial versions. Tey are the same design/material as what is used in bus suspensions and Semi cab suspension.

In those applications they are retained at both ends. Not finding a bag that has the extreme amount of travel that I can squeeze out of my 110's rear suspension I want to let the bag droop.
 

Dmarchand

Adventurer
Very nice.

Now start selling them.

And package them with the pneudraulic bump stops.

;)

I'd buy a set for both the DII and D-90.
 

kellymoe

Expedition Leader
At work we have the huge air bag suspension under the tiller section of the fire truck. When your in the back tillering you can feel the truck rise a few inches at startup and then it levels out. We have to be really careful when moving up into different fire stations. One station we backed into just fine but when we got a call and headed out the tiller cab height was just a inch too tall:yikes: Nice long gouge along the top of the cab.

revor said:
The failure thing is exactly why I wanted to try these industrial versions. Tey are the same design/material as what is used in bus suspensions and Semi cab suspension.

In those applications they are retained at both ends. Not finding a bag that has the extreme amount of travel that I can squeeze out of my 110's rear suspension I want to let the bag droop.
 

Michael Slade

Untitled
Scouring disk for images...came upon these.

Here's my LWB's one with air springs in the front. I liked playing around with them, but decided that when they were pumped up enough to give me the ride height I liked, they were far too stiff. They would be perfect for the rear of the 145 though.

Anyway, thought you would get a kick out of the images.
 

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