Rocky Mt Instinct BC Edition - this is a fun one

frojoe

Adventurer
Hehe.. I designed that one, glad you're enjoying it! Fun bike for sure.. the Pike fork and Monarch Debonair shock just bring it to a whole 'nother level of playfulness!
 

Christophe Noel

Expedition Leader
Hehe.. I designed that one, glad you're enjoying it! Fun bike for sure.. the Pike fork and Monarch Debonair shock just bring it to a whole 'nother level of playfulness!
Well, you did a bang up job with it! I assume it won't be long before it gets the same treatment you gave the new 2017 Element?
 

frojoe

Adventurer
Thanks! Yes, we are currently overhauling the majority of our model line, since we try to operate around a 3 year lifespan per model, but sometimes that gets stretched to 4 or 5 years! Instinct is in the works by a fellow engineer; I just completed Altitude and am now just starting on Thunderbolt.
 

Stumpalump

Expedition Leader
Why is the rear suspension pivot so far foward and above the crank? I'm thinking it minimizes pedal energy being transferred into shock compression but I can't wrap my head around it.
 

frojoe

Adventurer
Are you referring to the "main pivot".. the one around the front derailleur/BB area? Suspension kinematics can be very sensitive or very insensitive to pivot location depending on the overall layout and many other factors. For the Instinct and some of our other bikes for which the suspension design is several years old, the main pivot (MP) location is mainly driven by sizing and physical constraints. Because of the diameter of the main pivot bearing, and diameter of the bottom bracket (BB) bearings & cups, there's a minimum height that the main pivot must be from the BB. The rearward location of the MP is driven by front derailleur mounting points, as well as suspension kinematics. The MP could move further forward and affect the suspension rate curve, but that also increases the distance between suspension pivots, opening up the size of the "rear triangle" and makes the rear end flexier.

There's a whooole lot more to suspension design than this, especially from what Rocky has learned from prototyping in the last ~2years, but the above generally describes the reasoning for the MP location on that specific Instinct suspension design. Modern suspension design for pedalling efficiency depends on almost all aspects including all pivot locations, tire diameter, BB height relative to rear axle, front and rear gear sizes/diameters (for average or instantaneous chain line), virtual swing arm, etc.. all this sums up to anti-squat percentage, which is a very good indicator of how efficiently a design will pedal under a steady-cadence seated rider.
 

Stumpalump

Expedition Leader
Dirt motorcycles are so easy to tune and dial in. Set sag to manufactures spec to within a mm. Just enough air in tires to save your rims and not be squishy. Click around on compression until it feels like you are not taking a beating and not wallering. Play with rebound until you find one click too little then add one click. The mt bikes are so light that everthing is dependent on the rider, terrain and whether sitting or standing. How do you know what to build for or buy and how do you tune it? Are the dirt bike basics the way to go?
 

frojoe

Adventurer
Mountain bikes are pretty damn similar for setup. Through the evolution of coil spring and now air spring suspension over the last ~15 years, suspension tunability started pretty basic with just coil spring rate and rebound, then over years high and low speed rebound and high and low speed compression came in, along with shim stack tuning for the "base" tune on top of that, as well as air chamber size for "ramp" in the shock, etc. But now it appears things have come full circle.. the standard for mountain bike suspension in the rear is a Fox Float shock which you pretty much just set the air pressure for your weight and style of riding, then adjust the rebound to what feels comfortable. For the various stages of lockout, those compression tunes are tuned into the shock from the factory, so you just have to flip the lever to ride in fully open, semi-firm, or full firm, on the spot. For front suspension, it's the same idea with air pressure and rebound speed, but most forks will have some low speed compression adjustment to add platform to the overall front suspension feel.
 

Co-opski

Expedition Leader
bumping this because I appreciate the bike and bike rack reviews by flounder for ExPo keep it up!!!
 

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