Water Bladders vs Water Tanks

[BlackPearl]

Hey guys I've been watching and reading around for a while now and I can't seem to find anyone that has used a water bladder in place of a water tank.

My thinking is that a bladder would be a better choice for storage inside the cab of an SUV simply because the sloshing water wouldn't make any noise if the system was sealed without any air from the start. If you were to fill the bladder and force the air out as the water level rose then closed a valve to keep it air tight, as you used water the bag would just deflate and the sloshing of the water would no longer be audible.

I was planning on putting 2 20 gallon water bladders (made by husky) in the foot wells of my SUV's back seat. You can order custom bladders with what ever fittings you want, along with anchor points for tie downs. I think they would conform to the floor much better than a rigid tank, they can be plumbed together with an RODI unit in the middle so that one bladder can be filled from a river or source of water on long trips and then filtered over to the fresh water bladder, and the biggest seller for me would be that the noise of water moving around would be illuminated. I believe the only issue I would face would be the bag collapsing over top of the outlet to the pump due to suction and sealing itself shut, cutting off the water supply. I think that could be fixed by installing an anchor point on the bag directly above the water outlet to keep the bag from ever collapsing in that way.

I think the bag would act a lot like these collapsible jugs that I had as a kid when we went camping, so long as you don't let any air bag in it will just collapse until the water is gone - well almost gone.


Does anyone see a problem that I'm not aware of? Is it just not done because rigid tanks are readily available and easy to install?

 

[rayra]

Puncture resistance or lack thereof is the only downside. The rest of your plan seems perfectly suitable.

The only other downside is either the water bag is on top of stuff, or stuff is on top of it. See earlier remark about punctures.

BUT

it's quite easy to find or craft a suitable outer bag made of 1000D nylon fabric / Cordura. Even heavy cotton canvas will do. Not an issue for you in Alberta, but such a canvas duck outer bag could even serve to cool your water supply, a la a lister bag / desert canteen.


ripstopbytheroll.com has cordura fabric at good prices. No affiliation, just a very satisfied customer. See my awning project thread in my sig. Would be easy to sew an appropirate shape bag and even add flat webbing carry handles or anchor points. Then you could use any bag, like those 100gal 'bathtub bob' preparedness bags -
https://www.amazon.com/waterBOB-Emergency-Drinking-Storage-Gallons/dp/B001AXLUX2

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Maybe a water bag design roughly shaped like an ARB fridge. Narrow frontage, deep footing, tall. So initially it stands tall and doesn't take much floor space. Then as it is consumed it sags downward.




eta2

7.5gal / cubic foot. Make the bag 1' wide, 2' deep, 2.5' tall. 37gals. 300-lbs. It's going to want to blob out. Needs some kind of adjustable. girdle-strapping.


COPYRIGHT TRADEMARK ALL RIGHTS RESERVED NOT FOR COMMERCIAL EXPLOIT

/heh

eta the aforementioned idea is available for licensure to commercial interests at an exorbitant price. Enquire within.

 

[BlackPearl]

Those are very good ideas! I never thought about putting a canvas or other material bag around the bladder but it does make sense.

I was going to weld up a panel that would run from the drivers side across the "hump" to the passenger side right behind the front seats to keep the bags from accidentally contacting that structure under the seats. The bags would take up a large foot print and a smaller height, i have not done the math yet but I can see myself allowing about 10-12 inches of height. Then I would be putting a self system above the bladders to store pelican cases with whatever in side of them. The bags would be isolated from FOD and would be quite safe in there little compartment. The floor pan of the truck has a "built in" wall on the back side of the bags already where the bed of the truck starts. its a little hard to see i think picture but I think you can get the idea

 

[BlackPearl]

Having the bags contained inside of a box would help hold the shape, and having the anchor points on the bag about half the height would allow for the bag to keep relivily secure until you've used half of the water stored inside. bungie cord or some form of elastic could be used as well to help the bag expand and shrink the way I want it to without having to adjust straps every time I use water

 

[rayra]

A nice aspect of a bag design across both footwells is as you consume the water you can lift then end opposite the tap and shift everythign into one fotwell, opening up the space.

Putting a bag in a box negates all the advantages of a bag, except the noise reduction. Part of having a soft-sided bag allows for greater flexibility (pun intended) in packing and storage constraints. The bag can conform to an odd space.

On the earlier product description I posted (TM) (R) (C) (lol), might as well make it a cylinder, as it wants to be round anyway. No point in sewing a rectangular fabric structure, it will just go round anyway. Something like a modified seabag would be just the place to start with a prototype. Make a reinforced slit or small contain pouch on the side of the bottom, for your dispensing hose / spigot arrangement, tapped into the bottom of your water bag / liner. Then the top end is your fill point, at the top of the bag. The eyelets and shoulder straps or something like them could facilitate mounting or suspending your bag from some interior vehicle structure or even hanging it from a tree, like the aforementioned lister bag. And for securing the bag in the vehicle during movement. Then the bag just collapses down on itself as you drain it. And you can even re-pack and crowd it some as it empties over time.

I'm not joking this time - COPYRIGHT TRADEMARK ALL RIGHTS RESERVED NOT FOR COMMERCIAL EXPLOIT

I'm starting to think this is a viable product idea and here I am practically giving it away for free.

A normal seabag is (I just happen to have one right here) ~40" around and about ~30" of usable height. That's a cylinder ~12.75" in dia. That's a cross-sectional area of ~132sq". Times height, is just under 4,000cu". Or about 2.3cu' (I KNEW seabags were too damned small). 7.5gal/cu' = 17.3 gal. Which is about 140-lbs. That's doable. Just need a flexible bladder akin to what you first pictured, but shaped roughly like a seabag / cylinder. There are similar barrel liners made of clear LDPE. There's probably ready made sheet materials that could be heat welded into any shape you want. Then just rig up a zippered puncture resistant tote bag for it. Basically just re-invented the CamelBak, albeit 30x larger.

 

[rayra]

Make the bag liner and its outer shell sturdy enough and you'd WANT to pack stuff on top of it, as a way of increasing the hydrostatic pressure. But that invites disaster.

 

[NatersXJ6]

sea bag... Dry bag???

The cylindrical water bag idea is interesting. Not really for me... But interesting none the less.

My question is: why not use a roll-closure dry bag? Basically, a bag designed and manufactured to keep water out also does a remarkably good job of keeping water in. My last canoe trip helped confirm that.

The only immediate drawback I see would have to do with the weight rating of the stitching. Water is heavier than almost anything else that goes in a dry bag.

I would add a trademark to this idea, but I'm pretty sure my employer would claim it as their intellectual property next year when the California water situation requires pricing on a per unit-bag basis!

 

[Kerensky97]

Anchoring the would be more important than it seems at first. If you're on an angle or make sudden sharp turns the bladders will want to shift.
You could put them in a hard container but now you're basically back to using a water tank. Just make sure they actually strap or hold in the footwells with some kind of anchor.

 

[lqdchkn]

Just so you know I though this was a great idea and started searching; which lead me to these 20L Swiss military water bladders:

Close up use video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrq6waEpAqw

Durability video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3FoE7V9SH8

So I picked up a few from Amazon to try

https://www.amazon.com/BudK-Swiss-Liter-Black-Water/dp/B003P43Q5Y


If they work out well, I'll replace my Scepters with these

 

[emtmark]

I've used them and kept
One it's more useful as an in camp water source hanging from a tree than it was packed. I was leery of poking it and put it on the floorboards in front of the car seats. Threw blankets over them kept them protected and cool.


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[jschmidt]

Doesn't it say "Not for drinking water."

 

[emtmark]

Hahahahahahahahaha maybe but I'm not dead so theoretically you can do it once


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[emtmark]

A YouTube commentor for the link above said that those were shower bags and not potable water bags


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[toy_tek]

Look at marine water bladders. They are not crazy expensive, and are very heavy duty. Not like that flimsy water bag pictured in this thread - that thing will bust with enough sloshing around. I've seen it.

I was going to use a 14 gallon marine bladder, but ended up using one of those blue 7 gallon water jugs plumbed with a hose & valve (for a few reasons).

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/lalizas--flexible-water-tanks--P015004229

 

[Retired Tanker]

A YouTube commentor for the link above said that those were shower bags and not potable water bags


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"Nur fur Trinkwasser"

"Only for Drinking Water"