Looking for the right Canoe

[JeepinBear]

So, what is the right canoe? I have no clue.

But, I can share some information on how i will use it:

• I'm ~240lbs and plan on using the canoe with my wife and family.
• Primarily lakes and rivers, MIGHT take it to the coast sometime and be in some coastal waters.
• No real whitewater, but could be thin water; mostly used for touring.
• Most likely will do some canoe "camping" which means we will be hauling gear.
• I'm not really kown for packing "light and fast".
• I really like the Kevlar or graphite models.
• Willing to pay for quality boat.

So far, I like the Wenonah Champlain or Itasca models.
http://www.wenonah.com/products/temp...c31572a840fcdc


Anyone have any ideas? I did check out this thread as well, but thought I would see if there was information that was more "fresh".
http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=764

[RobinP]

We've written quite a lot about buying canoes - try

http://overlandresource.com/category/over-water

Hope this helps,

[paulj]

Years ago I had a Wenonah kevlar canoe, a Jensen 18

http://www.wenonahracing.com/maratho...18_Jensen.html

It was a nice boat, light, fast, easy paddling even for one person. Pretty too in that golden kevlar color. But much better on flat water than coastal or shallow water (i.e. with rocks).

It's hard to say just from the pictures why the Champlain 18 would be better in waves. Have you had a chance to paddle one of these boats? $2000+ is a lot to spend on boat without a test drive.

The lighter weight is worth the cost if you are going to be loading it on the car by yourself, or carrying it much of a distance. But for durability, especially in shallow water (rivers at low flow), I'd lean more toward one of their poly boats like the Northfork.

p.s. the dimensions give some idea of why the Champlain might be better in rougher water - it is wider (3"), and deeper, especially in the bow (5"). The Itasca has the tumblehome in the rear that you expect to see on racing boats, but has flare in the front to handle waves. That's an indication that this company is willing to mix and match features to fit a desired performance specification, even it yields a boat that looks a bit unusual.

[toyrunner95]

honestly i would buy one that floats.

[grahamfitter]

honestly i would buy one that floats.

... and used, and cheap, from your local newspaper or craigslist.

Canoes and kayaks are like four wheel drive expedition vehicles: the internet always suggests you get something way more expensive than you really need.

Don't skimp on the PFD though.

Cheers,
Graham

[paulj]

What's the nearest Wenonah dealer? Boise? Do they carry, or even recommend one of these boats? What lakes are you thinking of paddling? I wouldn't recommend one of these 18'+ boats for a river, not even the gentler parts of the Salmon.

As a first boat, buying used is a good idea. Like knifes, you are likely to go through several before finding one that fits your needs. A canoe isn't a one-fits-every-situation item. If buying new, I don't think you should go above $1000 for starter.

How do you intend to carry the boat? On the Jeep, or the RV? On the Jeep cross bar spacing may be limited, a point against a long boat. On the RV, I'd worry about dropping the canoe while loading/unloading.

[762X39]

I don't recommend a kevlar canoe for your purposes. Probably one fabricated from Royalex will be better. Kevlar is light but easily damaged, Royalex is nearly indestructable. I held off on having a canoe built for me for 25 years while I tried everything out there.I would suggest a Mad River Canoe in a 16' length but really, you have got to try a bunch of them out before deciding.Have a bit of fun field testing different canoes befroe you pull the trigger on a purchase.

[JeepinBear]

What's the nearest Wenonah dealer? Boise? Do they carry, or even recommend one of these boats?

I've emailed the 3 closest dealers (Bozeman, SLC, and Boise...in that order) to ask them some questions and see if we can "test drive".

After reading everyone's replies on this forum, we are leaning towards Royalex now.

Thanks for all the great advice. Keep it coming!!

[paulj]

Since you are a big guy, and want to take family (how many kids?) and gear, you probably should aim for a 17' boat, something like the Mad River Horizon 17. They describe it as a 'Royalex performance hull'. What I think that means is that they tried to made the bow and stern as sharp as Royalex will allow. It also has less rocker (bottom curvature) than their other boats, though it is more than is typical in the Wenonah canoes.

Narrow ends and a low rocker makes a boat that tracks well (paddles straight) but is harder to turn. For a contrast look at some of Mad River's whitewater boats. On a river you want a boat that turns easily so you can dodge rocks. On a lake you usually want something that travels straight so you don't have to put a lot of effort into steering. It is also easier to paddle when the wind is blowing.

In Idaho you probably see a lot of river dories or drift boats. They have a flat bottom (side to side) but extreme rocker.

[paulj]

Here are few thoughts on construction.

Fiberglass inbeds glass fibers in a plastic like polyester or epoxy. The cheapest and heaviest construction uses chopped glass strands. A more expensive form, requiring more hand work, uses woven fiber glass fabric. Kevlar uses the same idea, but involves a more expensive, but stronger, kevlar fabric. Carbon fiber is similar. Better, lighter, stronger construction uses more skilled labor.

To combine stiffness with light weight, companies like Wenonah, puts a layer of foam between layers of kevlar and epoxy. On their lightest racing constructions you can see the outline of that foam as a diamond pattern on the bottom of the boat. You might also see foam 'ribs' extending up the sides.

Royalex sandwiches a layer of foam between ABS plastic skins. I believe this material comes from the factory as a thin sandwich, when expands under heat when molded into the canoe shape. This produces a very tough and relatively lightweight object. But it can't be formed into as sharp edge as fiberglass and kevlar can. A Royalex boat comes full formed out of the mold - excess plastic just needs to be trimmed off, and wood, vinyl and metal trim screwed on.