Need help finding an electrical component

[WhereTheHellIsJames?]

Looking for a 4-post 12V 100A Continuous Duty Solenoid... anyone know where I can find one of these?

My local Auto parts store ordered one for me ($23.00), but the part came with no markings or paperwork to identify it. I declined the part because in the future if the unit fails, whomever is operating the vehicle needs to be able to identify the part somehow, and without any accompanying paperwork nor stamp or sticker on the unit that describes what it is, it would be impossible to tell it apart from any other solenoid.

 

[jcbrandon]

This what you're looking for?

West Marine, Cole Hersee, 12-volt solenoid, continuous duty:

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...3?&cid=chanintel&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=50263

 

[GlennA]

Looking for a 4-post 12V 100A Continuous Duty Solenoid... anyone know where I can find one of these?

My local Auto parts store ordered one for me ($23.00), but the part came with no markings or paperwork to identify it. I declined the part because in the future if the unit fails, whomever is operating the vehicle needs to be able to identify the part somehow, and without any accompanying paperwork nor stamp or sticker on the unit that describes what it is, it would be impossible to tell it apart from any other solenoid.

You can probably find them through Tessco, Grainger, or NAPA.

We used those heavy duty high current solenoids at work. My experience is that unless you have a continuous high current condition, carbon builds up on the contacts and you get intermittent power up conditions. My records indicate approximately 30% failure rate. When maintaining 2500 vehicles, this is significant. If you choose to use the solenoid, buy a spare.

I would suggest using Bosch high current relays. We have had success with the Bosch 75A relay.

 

[DarkHelmet]

You can find them from one of the site sponsors... if you'd like to support them.

http://www.sierraexpeditions.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=188

 

[SunTzuNephew]

Is that relay different at all from a generic starting relay?

 

[ntsqd]

Is that relay different at all from a generic starting relay?

Yes, it is. It is rated for continuous duty. Starting solenoid/relays are not. I've used the starting solenoid for winch control, but I would not leave one on for a significant time period. They get hot!

 

[SunTzuNephew]

Yes, it is. It is rated for continuous duty. Starting solenoid/relays are not. I've used the starting solenoid for winch control, but I would not leave one on for a significant time period. They get hot!

OK, thanks for the explanation...

 

[WhereTheHellIsJames?]

Well I called Wil at Sierra Expeditions, and he's only got a 3-post. He told me to try Extreme Outback, so I did, and they too only have a 3-post. I think jcbrandon's link to West Marine is the closest to what I'm looking for, but I don't understand what "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Rated at 750A make/100A break" [/FONT]means in their description... is there someone here who could help me better understand?[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]

 

[jcbrandon]

...I don't understand what "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Rated at 750A make/100A break" [/FONT]means in their description...?[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]

From the Cole Hersee website:

http://www.colehersee.com/04resource/index.htm

"Make and break are terms which apply to any switching situation, but particularly to Intermittent Duty Solenoids, where the buildup of heat can cause failure of the component. Make and break are RATINGS. A particular component, such as a solenoid, may be rated for duty at a given amperage and voltage that should not be exceeded. Make is when the switch (or solenoid) is turned On (the circuit is 'made'), and break is when the switch is turned Off (the circuit is 'broken'). Such values would need to be checked with an instrument such as a meter."

 

[WhereTheHellIsJames?]

From the Cole Hersee website:

http://www.colehersee.com/04resource/index.htm

"Make and break are terms which apply to any switching situation, but particularly to Intermittent Duty Solenoids, where the buildup of heat can cause failure of the component. Make and break are RATINGS. A particular component, such as a solenoid, may be rated for duty at a given amperage and voltage that should not be exceeded. Make is when the switch (or solenoid) is turned On (the circuit is 'made'), and break is when the switch is turned Off (the circuit is 'broken'). Such values would need to be checked with an instrument such as a meter."

It sounds like solenoid that you linked to would take 750A to make the circuit, and would not be energized below 100A? Doesn't seem right... I bet I'm understanding this wrong.

I need it to complete the circuit when the 12V is sent to the 'trip lead' of the solenoid, weather there is 0A being pulled, or 99A being pulled- above 99A I don't care, as I have a 100A circuit breaker in-line that would (if working properly) interrupt the circuit.

 

[jcbrandon]

James-

It is a confusing explanation. The way I read it is that the solenoid may fail if it carries more than 75 amps at the moment it closes the circuit or more than 100 amps when it opens the circuit.

Hunt around on the Cole Hersee website in the "resource center" section. They've got gobs of information there.

 

[GlennA]

It sounds like solenoid that you linked to would take 750A to make the circuit, and would not be energized below 100A? Doesn't seem right... I bet I'm understanding this wrong.

I need it to complete the circuit when the 12V is sent to the 'trip lead' of the solenoid, weather there is 0A being pulled, or 99A being pulled- above 99A I don't care, as I have a 100A circuit breaker in-line that would (if working properly) interrupt the circuit.

Your second paragraph is exactly why we switched to heavy duty relays. I am not referring to typical plug in relays. After an extended time (months) without significant amp draw, the contacts get carbon build up and cause intermittent "power up" for the accessories connected to the solenoid. Our solenoids were/are rated for 100A, but we typicallly only have about a 5 amp load on them. Like I said in my original post, if you use a solenoid, carry a spare. Not that you wouldn't carry a spare relay, but the solenoid failure rate is unacceptable. I have yet to experience a relay failure.

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

[/B]


Your second paragraph is exactly why we switched to heavy duty relays. I am not referring to typical plug in relays. After an extended time (months) without significant amp draw, the contacts get carbon build up and cause intermittent "power up" for the accessories connected to the solenoid. Our solenoids were/are rated for 100A, but we typicallly only have about a 5 amp load on them. Like I said in my original post, if you use a solenoid, carry a spare. Not that you wouldn't carry a spare relay, but the solenoid failure rate is unacceptable. I have yet to experience a relay failure.

I like the idea of the Bosch 75A relay but it is not a sealed unit, does that limit where it can be mounted? How do you connect a #4 wire to the screw terminal.

 

[WhereTheHellIsJames?]

[/b]


Your second paragraph is exactly why we switched to heavy duty relays. I am not referring to typical plug in relays. After an extended time (months) without significant amp draw, the contacts get carbon build up and cause intermittent "power up" for the accessories connected to the solenoid. Our solenoids were/are rated for 100A, but we typicallly only have about a 5 amp load on them. Like I said in my original post, if you use a solenoid, carry a spare. Not that you wouldn't carry a spare relay, but the solenoid failure rate is unacceptable. I have yet to experience a relay failure.

What kind of relays are you using for that kind of load? I looked around a bit (admittedly, just a quick look), but didn't really see anything that I thought would work.

It sounds like you're in a situation similar to mine, where you want to be able to run 100A if you have a reason, but that the typical load will be significantly less.

 

[KG6BWS]

http://www.texasindustrialelectric.com/relays.asp

Look at item #24143. Sounds like that might work for you.

5th item down on the left.