A house on wheels?

[KMR]

Lots of great advice, especially that from Joaquin.
In reality I am almost positive that this could not work, it sure is fun to daydream about though.

We actually did buy a house recently, but it got pulled out from under us. We live in an odd real-estate area, property values are low, but stagnant and taxes are ridiculously high. No matter how we do the math, real-estate is a losing proposition. BEST case scenario it could be a barley break even situation with a whole lot of sweat invested to net us a house we do not really like in an area we like even less.
The simple fact of the matter is that we do not want to put down roots in this area and we are tired of wasting money on rent for a place that does not give us what we are looking for;
Privacy and a sense of connection with the outdoors.
A house here would most likely not net us those things either and the taxes alone would be almost as much as our current rent.
A mobile home could have all the space we need, an awning for a porch and the investment could stay with us so that getting that monetary return does not need to be the paramount concern.
It is a nice thought exercise to to think of this and say "why not?" this could end up being one of those things that fall into the "we should have done that when we were your age" Unfortunately in our society so much value is placed on land ownership and wasting resources that a proposal like this is actually illegal unless you can find ways around the legal issues of living in a non permanent structure.
And then lets not forget that the environmental impact of using one of these luxury vehicles as a primary residence could actually be considerably less than that of a typical home.
It is fun to be different.

 

[Bob_Sheaves]

Lots of great advice, especially that from Joaquin.
In reality I am almost positive that this could not work, it sure is fun to daydream about though.

We actually did buy a house recently, but it got pulled out from under us. We live in an odd real-estate area, property values are low, but stagnant and taxes are ridiculously high. No matter how we do the math, real-estate is a losing proposition. BEST case scenario it could be a barley break even situation with a whole lot of sweat invested to net us a house we do not really like in an area we like even less.
The simple fact of the matter is that we do not want to put down roots in this area and we are tired of wasting money on rent for a place that does not give us what we are looking for;
Privacy and a sense of connection with the outdoors.
A house here would most likely not net us those things either and the taxes alone would be almost as much as our current rent.
A mobile home could have all the space we need, an awning for a porch and the investment could stay with us so that getting that monetary return does not need to be the paramount concern.
It is a nice thought exercise to to think of this and say "why not?" this could end up being one of those things that fall into the "we should have done that when we were your age" Unfortunately in our society so much value is placed on land ownership and wasting resources that a proposal like this is actually illegal unless you can find ways around the legal issues of living in a non permanent structure.
And then lets not forget that the environmental impact of using one of these luxury vehicles as a primary residence could actually be considerably less than that of a typical home.
It is fun to be different.

Just another tidbit...there are NO issues, legally speaking, for living a mobile life. A lot of people will look at you like you are a "lowlife", will TRY to make things hard because you don't qualify as "normal people", but over all the years my wife and I lived on the road, there is not one day I would trade for anything else. Time is the one thing you cannot manufacture, make the most of it when you can.

For any amount of money.....life is more valuable. You must ask yourself, are you a blue cube?

Best regards,

Bob Sheaves
CEO
catNET Incorporated
http://www.catnetsolutions.com

 

[KMR]

No legal issues?
Where would the vehicle be registered? A legal mailing address/place of residence?
I would think that somebody would get pissed that they are not getting the taxes they think they are due, so, tax evasion?
Zoning issues? Not like you could just park a motor home on any old plot of land without pissing somebody off.
I do not know any of this stuff for sure, just seems like they would be a few of the grey areas.
The biggest one you mentioned, especially in this close minded part of the world, is the societal view of your activities.
But it can be fun to be different. However; in this part of the country they can pretty much make being different illegal if they see fit. Heck, I live outside of a city where it is illegal to ride a bike inside the city limits.
Not exactly a group of forward thinkers.

What are some of the other legal issues you would encounter in this kind of a situation?
And are there any US available/serviceable 4x4, preferably cab over, truck chassis on the market?

 

[Bob_Sheaves]

No legal issues?
Where would the vehicle be registered? A legal mailing address/place of residence?
I would think that somebody would get pissed that they are not getting the taxes they think they are due, so, tax evasion?
Zoning issues? Not like you could just park a motor home on any old plot of land without pissing somebody off.
I do not know any of this stuff for sure, just seems like they would be a few of the grey areas.
The biggest one you mentioned, especially in this close minded part of the world, is the societal view of your activities.
But it can be fun to be different. However; in this part of the country they can pretty much make being different illegal if they see fit. Heck, I live outside of a city where it is illegal to ride a bike inside the city limits.
Not exactly a group of forward thinkers.

What are some of the other legal issues you would encounter in this kind of a situation?
And are there any US available/serviceable 4x4, preferably cab over, truck chassis on the market?

Do a search on "rv fulltimer". The answers are out there and society be hanged. If anyone feels they "have to" give in to societal pressure to "conform", the fulltime lifestyle is not for them. Oregon, Texas, and other states offer choices that are quite appealing, depending on your financial situation and are not only legal, these options are promoted.

The PRNY (People's Republik of Nuevo York) is a bright and shining example of what state NOT to call home as a fulltimer.

Best regards,

Bob Sheaves
CEO
catNET Incorporated
http://www.catnetsolutions.com

 

[KMR]

The PRNY (People's Republik of Nuevo York) is a bright and shining example of what state NOT to call home as a fulltimer.

:iagree: You know it. One of the reasons this option is so appealing is so that we can get the hell out of here as quickly as possible when the time arises.
Every other day I wish I would get fired, the only reason I say that is that I have a really great, well paid job that is exactly what I want to be doing, just not the place I want to be doing it.

I searched the "fulltimer" stuff you and Haven posted, surprising amount of good info out there. I still like the views and opinions of the members of this forum since you are all somewhat more sympathetic of the remote capabilities of the kind of "home" I am envisioning.

I am starting to see all the mid-size commercial trucks around town with a new eye,.....Hummmm, that could make a good conversion............:jump:

 

[Digital Nomad]

I live full-time and love it.

I've been living a mobile lifestyle for over a year now. I didn't take the route you mentioned though. I live on a 40' Prevost bus and pull a Jeep Liberty behind it. I can park the bus and then take the jeep into a more remote area.

I like the layout of the Earth Roamer, but I'm not sure if I could live in that small of a space full-time. I could easily do it for a month or two, but would want space for my gear (winter coat, hiking books, flipflops, etc.). If I used the four door version and modified the second set of doors to accomodate more storage, then I might be able to live in it.

I was thinking of getting the newer small earth roamer to pull behind my bus, so I could go remote for a few days in comfort.

You can buy a professionally converted bus for about $130K (that would be a 20 year old vehicle... I live in a 1997, whiuch costs quite a bit more... but everyone thinks is new). It would be a VERY nice place to live and the chassis is designed to run for between one and two million miles, so it will have been underused. There is no cheap plastic or low quality gear in a professionally converted bus. Then you can pull a 4x4 behind it and live very comfortably and be able to get to remote locations via the 4x4.

I boondock (read: don't pay to park) about 75% of the time. I've explored 22 states over the last 12 months and can't imagine going back to the boring life of living in a fixed location. Owning real estate is very much over rated. Do you want to LIVE or sit around and as the price of your home creeps up in value... you'd have to sell the place and buy something cheaper to gain anything from it. ...and have to look at the same view all the time and live for the weekends/vacation instead of living a full-time vacation. I sold my house when I bought my bus and I now have no mortgage, no car payment and feel truly free. Compare that to $2000/month mortgage, property taxes, utilities, mowing the grass that I never used, etc, etc, etc.

I formed a company in Montana, which ownes the bus. Montana doesn't have sales tax. I can also permanently register the vehicle there if it's 10+ years old, which means no more yearly registration fees. I'm a resident of Texas, which doesn't have state income tax (even though I've only been in texas for about a week in the last three years). I have a mail forwarding service there that gets any mail that people send me. Texas law states that I only have to register the vehicle there if I have it in Texas for more than 30 consecutive days, which I don't plan on doing. You really have to have a tax attorney look into all the details of this kind of stuff... do not trust ANYONE you talk to on-line (including me) since you situation might be different than mine.

Living a mobile lifestyle can be like being on almost constant vacation if you play it right. Many people are scared to make the leap or simply don't understand it. Don't let those people talk you out of something that you might love. It's not for everyone, but I wish I would have figured this out ten years ago... do you know how much of the world I could have explored?

You can follow my adventures on my blog at WhereIsBen dot com.

-Ben
The Digital Nomad

 

[haven]

state of residence

One benefit of living full-time in an RV of some sort is that you can choose which state to declare is your home state. Factors to consider include state income tax rates, sales/excise taxes, personal property tax, motor vehicle registration cost, driver license fees and renewal frequency, vehicle/emissions inspection rules, and vehicle insurance rates. In addition to expenses related to the vehicle, things like health insurance rates, life insurance, and estate tax laws (we all will die sometime) should be considered.

After looking into these factors, most people find that three states offer the best advantage: Texas, Florida and South Dakota. Of the three, South Dakota seems to have the least red tape.

Several companies with headquarters in South Dakota support the needs of the full-time traveler with services like a physical address for mail and voter registration, and mail forwarding. A quick Internet search turned up these names:

Alternative Resources
http://www.alternativeresources.net/

My Dakota Address
http://www.mydakotaaddress.com/

My Home Address Inc.
http://www.myhomeaddressinc.com/

South Dakota Mail Forwarding LLC
http://www.sdrvmail.com/

America's Mailbox
http://www.americas-mailbox.com/

Supporting full-time RVers is a cottage industry in South Dakota. There are a number of campgrounds in the state that offer the option of being your full-time physical address for mail and voter registration. So shop around for the best deal.

It's entirely possible to establish your home residence in South Dakota, and then use services in other states to support your travel. Two services that full-time RVers recommend are:

Escapees RV Club (Texas)
http://www.escapees.com

Good Sam Club (Florida)
http://www.goodsamclub.com

Chip Haven

 

[Scott Brady]

Ben,

Thank you for taking the time to post your impressions. The new EarthRoamer Jeep behind the Prevost would be most impressive.

Welcome to Expedition Portal!

 

[KMR]

Cool, so first off, BenTheDigitalNomad, welcome to the forum and thanks for the insights, nice website.

Hummm, I like South Dakota:sombrero: I have been searching "fulltimer" like you suggested haven, lots of info. I feel quite out of place looking at the boards and sites. Everything is almost entirely geared to managing your retirement and things on the other end of the life spectrum from where my wife and I are at the moment. Bus conversions can be pretty cool (some I have come across are quite hideous as well ) But, they can not leave the pavement AT ALL and we would never want our house to be on a patch of pavement, the whole point of this line of thinking is to gain a connection with the outdoors, not with a paved parking lot. So much of the info on the web is (understandably) geared to extended campground stays. We would want to figure or how to be almost self sufficient.
One idea we entertained was to purchase a house that was in completely unrepairable condition on a plot of land, demolish the house, utilize the well, sewer and electric but use our mobile box as "home" In that scenario we could have just property, no house, houses depreciate, property around here does not. Then, when we want to go someplace else, pull in the steps drive away, all the investment in our physical "house" can go with us and the property could sell at its leisure, or be hung onto as a long term investment. With no house on the land, the property taxes are not bad and if the situation allows we could hang onto it as an investment.

Dave, given the short time we talked, your observation is incredibly astute. You are absolutely right, I am much more interested in a shop than in a house. Right now we live in a small apartment and even that is more than large enough for our needs. The only thing that keeps us living here is my job, which just happens to be in an incredibly large shop. I have an office there where I store all my projects and parts, I leave my cruiser and my motorcycle there, our snow boards and our mountain bike are stored in my trailer that is stored at the shop. The shop consists of a full automotive shop, full metal shop, full wood shop (actually way more than a "full" shop, we have stuff we dont even know what it does) Basically we have almost everything the make almost anything, and if we do not have it I know someone who does and I teach at Rochester Institute Of Technology, so I have access to a great deal there as well.
So, as long as we live here, I will have access to that stuff, I can not see myself getting a different job and staying in this area so a move would consist of loosing all that anyway. In addition, if we got a house there is no way around the fact that we would loose money on it, more money than we are loosing by renting. The taxes alone are almost as much as our rent and any house we get will require almost the same amount of materials and investment as appointing the interior of a mobile box would. In both cases we can not get a return on the investment in time and materials, so why not invest it in something that we can drive away with?

 

[KMR]

Oh, I was wondering if anyone thinks this thread should be moved to "general discussion"?
It has moved a bit past cab over/unimog talk and is certainly no longer tech

 

[etbadger]

I don't have a lot to add to the thread, other than to say that we find the ability to randomly pick a side road, use excessive momentum to blast through a few remaining snow-drifts (showing us to be the first up the road this year), randomly pick a few turns, and end up with a front-yard like this, to be a wonderful freedom.

(that's us about 2/3 of the way across on the hill)

The ability to do it nearly every day is even more awesome.

There are draw-backs: We miss some of our toys (sportbikes, RC planes); I don't have room for my larger tools (lathe, mill, etc); Amy likes showers for some reason.

Conversly, we don't have mortgage or rent payments, utility payments, etc. Each day we can step outside for a hike or bike ride and within minutes be somewhere we have never been before, with hot-chocolate (winter) or cold juice(summer) waiting immediately when we return.

The hardest part was just commiting and doing it. Once you have done it once it provides such freedom to realize that you don't need a house, a yard, an address, or any of that, to be comfortable. Even with our relatively small vehicle/home we still manage to carry quite a few toys, and our never-ending front-porch makes up for the somewhat cramped quarters within.

For refrence in the toy department, in the van we have managed to fit (all at one time): 2 person inflatable pack raft & paddle, 2 paragliders & gear, 250cc dirt-bike & gear, 2 mountain bikes & gear, 2 snowboards & gear, tent & hiking backpacks, good stack of books, computer for playing movies on the dreary days, and innumerable smaller things like kites, frisbies, etc. So there is no loss of entertainment options, and the small confines prompt you to get out there and actually do something.

In summary, there is a lot to see, even in our back-yard of North America. Get out there, do it, and there is nothing to regret...

-e

 

[KMR]

Badger, I've had your site bookmarked for awhile, I showed it to my wife when you first linked it at Expo, she too thought what you guys are doing is awesome. If the careers we had would allow it, we would be out there doing the same.

What do you use for a mailing/registration address? How often do you have to return to get the van inspected? Any tax issues?
Love the van and what you guys have done with it. :clapsmile

 

[etbadger]

Badger, I've had your site bookmarked for awhile, I showed it to my wife when you first linked it at Expo, she too thought what you guys are doing is awesome. If the careers we had would allow it, we would be out there doing the same.

What do you use for a mailing/registration address? How often do you have to return to get the van inspected? Any tax issues?
Love the van and what you guys have done with it. :clapsmile

For mailing addresses we are fortunate enough to have family in WA, OR, and UT. Urgent stuff (CC bills, med bills) are handled online or by phone. Vehicle is registered in rural OR since that is where it sits the most when we are elsewhere, no inspections, 4 year tabs.

We are still WA residents, I'm employed in WA, and just get work-related correspondence sent to the WA address to keep things simple. We pick the mail up every few months when I have to fly back for a periodic appointment at work. Simplifies taxes too (no income tax in WA).

If we need something ordered online (repair parts usually), we get it sent to a friend or family or RV park near our intended path, and pick it up there. Also urgent mail can be forwarded to "General Delivery" at a local post-office, though we have never had need.

A lot of our complications would be much simplified if I did not retain my job, but the income is worth the extra hassle, and it sure helps with the fuel cost.

Most of the advantages we get from our familys' addresses could be duplicated with a mail forwarding service without too much trouble.

-e

 

[DaveInDenver]

For mailing addresses we are fortunate enough to have family in WA, OR, and UT.

If we need something ordered online (repair parts usually), we get it sent to a friend or family

Not to make a big deal of this, because what Erik and Amy are doing is simply punk rock. But it's surely a good thing that they have family and friends who have decided to stay put, eh? I think the idea of being nomads is way cool, but it's not necessarily easy to do without significant support of people who have a permanent address. That's not to say it can't be done, picking up mail at post offices, using rental space or paying for work to be done. Just that it would be a lot tougher if we didn't have someone like a good pal or our parents to lean on.

 

[njtaco]

Not to make a big deal of this, because what Erik and Amy are doing is simply punk rock. But it's surely a good thing that they have family and friends who have decided to stay put, eh? I think the idea of being nomads is way cool, but it's not necessarily easy to do without significant support of people who have a permanent address. That's not to say it can't be done, picking up mail at post offices, using rental space or paying for work to be done. Just that it would be a lot tougher if we didn't have someone like a good pal or our parents to lean on.

Friends of ours have been full-timing for 5 years now. The entire time they have had a storage unit. Simply put, 5 years x 12 months x $120 (estimated) per is $7200, plus taxes. I wonder if they have $7200 of stuff stored...I'd guess not. The emotional value of these possessions is probably what keeps them paying.