Is Bigger Better?

[Ozarker]

Just wondering, they say that selecting a yacht, you should really go for the smallest one that really fits your needs. In other words, if a 32' boat can meet the needs go for it instead of a 50' yacht. The difference in maintenance and other expenses won't reaally offset the functionality (bigger is probably more comfortable and stores more junk) but for the money and function of it, go smaller.

Does that apply with campers? What if 2 people were to live in it for six months, would the boat anology apply? Seems it could, considering fuel and maintenace. Is there some break even point, a marginal perpensity of consumption, a point where that extra square foot is really not necessary?

 

[charlieaarons]

Campers are pretty small to live in for months.
Plus all the supplies, parts and tools.
go for the highest GVM you can get, and the biggest
"reasonable" camper.

Charlie

 

[Photomike]

You have to decide the reason that you are getting the camper first. If it is for living in and not for travel then I would go as big as possible (actually I would go with a motor home or a trailer for the extra space). If you want to travel and would like a unit that is more maneuverable and possibly easier on fuel and wear and tear on your vehicle then I would go smaller.

If you are traveling then realistically the camper is for sleeping and eating in (in bad weather), more so than living in so any size will work. I have met a number of couples that have been traveling for years in small units (both TC and other units) and they are very happy.

 

[TBRV]

IMHO the largest campers on the market with opposing slides and dry weights exceeding 4500lbs push beyond the practical limits off a pick-up with a 4x8 box. Having loaded a couple of these units on F-450's and watch as they struggle to carry the load, I question the viability of the largest campers. These packages seem to have no more capability than a smaller truck with 5th wheel or a motorhome.

I feel any camper over 4000lbs dry weight would be better in a flat bed design. This would provide the best storage and long term ability. Like boats to get better capability the bigger sizes should get wider and that's where the investment gets out of hand. Choosing a rig is a balance between affordability and capability.

 

[Capt Eddie]

You can get a small camper with addon like slides and tents. It can make all the differance in the world. Our Lance 1040 as well as the 830 has more floor space then models 2 foot longer. The tent is a great addition.

 

[Frankspinz]

I am an avid KISS fan ! And I agree with Capt Eddie, you can increase your floor space in other ways: RTT, awnings and add ons ...

 

[Ozarker]

Seems that at least part of that anology holds true then but the longer the stay is seems it would be a minimalist lifestyle for sure. I don't know what a 4500 lb camper looks like, sounds heavy.

In yachting terms, so to speak, let's say that there is a queen berth, head with sit down shower (inside shower in a pinch type), two burner stove, microwave (shore power) and ice box for the galley. Basic load maybe provisions for one week and about 200 lbs of personal gear and clothing, two chairs, table for outside, awning, 20 gal of spare gas, 28 gal of water (in jerry cans). Sounds like a small rig doesn't it? (sit down shower and ice box, lol)

So, add ons, like a small 4x8 trailer and a pickup rig, maybe a good screen tent? What would be the best setup to meet those requirements?

 

[Capt Eddie]

It will be dependant on the uses of the camper. My basic camper weighs 3890. If I was only going to use it for normal weekend uses and long road trips. That would be a small camper. I could get the largest camper at 4500. Alot more living space, dry bath ect. But that will not allow me to carry the gear that I do for off interstate, out of cell range travel. By the time I put in compressors, generators, winches, chains, cable, 3 LP tanks, 2 extra batteries, extra water, tools. My rig is now 16800LB. Max for a 2009 F450. See I could have gotten the largest camper made. But no more room for self dependant offroad travel. I did not want 3 feet of camper hanging off the end of my flatbed. When I do at the storage rack on the back it is because the trip is tailered to going from pointA to point B and I do not have to worry about tearing anything off.

 

[Photomike]

Seems that at least part of that anology holds true then but the longer the stay is seems it would be a minimalist lifestyle for sure. I don't know what a 4500 lb camper looks like, sounds heavy.

In yachting terms, so to speak, let's say that there is a queen berth, head with sit down shower (inside shower in a pinch type), two burner stove, microwave (shore power) and ice box for the galley. Basic load maybe provisions for one week and about 200 lbs of personal gear and clothing, two chairs, table for outside, awning, 20 gal of spare gas, 28 gal of water (in jerry cans). Sounds like a small rig doesn't it? (sit down shower and ice box, lol)

So, add ons, like a small 4x8 trailer and a pickup rig, maybe a good screen tent? What would be the best setup to meet those requirements?

My unit has all the above, with the exception of the microwave and fuel. Has stand up shower, fridge, stove (4 burner), oven and comes in at 1600lbs dry. I added a trailer to help carry bikes, kayak and other extras for longer trips.

 

[Ozarker]

WOW, Photomike, nice rig! You posted while I was typing! What truck is that? Looks plenty big tome!!

How as Good point Capt. Eddie, but you said long road trips would be a small camper? Last time I was "camping" with a generator was in the Army. I plan of getting one but hopefully it would be to recharge batteries....that's another topic. The KISS method pointed out by Frankspinz seems the most reliable way to go.

I'm not familiar with classes of technical difficulty for off roading, but from what I have seen where any vehicle could travel say at 20 MPH should be able to be traveled. If a duce and a half could do 20,I could do 3 or 5. Capable of fording small streams and say 2 feet of water for short crossings. No rock climbing or steep dificult climbs or decents. 90/10% off road.

Territory, say an outing from Missouri to FA, up the east coast, into Canada, and down the midwest. Or from Mo west to Ca to Ak, maybe further north, but mainly where roads will take you up there, not crossing the tundra. 90% on hard surface roads, 10% off road and wooded trails. Weekend stomping grounds would be the Ozarks. Some cold weather outings too.

Survivability of 4 to 6 months on the road, I'm not homeless but I'm sure it would feel like it. Comfort level should be above the level of Ranger training, but don't need a recliner and 32 inch flat screen. A small TV would probably be a requirement to keep the lady happy for a couple hours a day. Radio/CD. Lap top, cell phone, ham radio. Probably propane heater. Shore power A/C?

This is two years off. I'm in good shape, the other half had a hip replacement, so I doubt there will be any repelling or 10 mile runs! Stairs not a problem, ladders would be a pain.

Is bigger better? Difference in costs and expenses justify the difference between a large frame vehicle with a box vs a small pick up (F-150)? Do you sell the F-150 and the old 4x4 and add to it for a box, or build around the smaller vehicle and add ons like a small trailer for that intended use? Oh, big constraint too is money, say 50K, maybe more, but after a year it would be sold and taking a hit is understood.

 

[Photomike]

The truck is a 2002 GMC 2500 HD, the camper is a 1992 Northern Lite.

A couple things reading your last post. One reason that I like my TC is that the bed goes from side to side, not front to back. I find the other bed too hard to maneuver in with messed up knees. Try the bed out, both of you, and lay down and try and get up. Drawback is with my set-up that someone would have to sleep against the wall.

I would also look at solar. A couple batteries and solar will help a lot with the power. Add to that some LED lights to reduce the draw and you would really cut down on needing to run a generator.

For heat get a vented cat heater as a extra/ main heat source. No electric draw like the furnace and extra security should the weather get REAL COLD.

 

[Ozarker]

Absolutely, but your truck is larger than an F-150. I didn't really want the thread to be about me, but rather justifications for bigger units and more gadgets on board. Boats are a different matter too, as bigger is ofetn more safer, but not always.

Climbing out of a V berth really requires you to crawl or slither out. I agree that rolling out is much easier and that would be what I would want too. The lady of the camp will probably want to sleep next to the wall so the bears don't get her!

I can sell my truck without any problem, a slick old 99 with 71K 4x4, extended cab with the Triton 8. I would rather keep it, but if it just won't work, then so be it. But I would want to hear the justifications why it would not work.

Looking at other threads with Jeeps and flippack tops, very nice, but obviously not like your unit Photomike! But I could get by with a smaller unit/rig.

And like Photomike, I have a small trailer to pull and wouldn'tknow it was back there. I would pull my Transalp to run around on, short trips in areas visted. That's why my truck doesn't need to climb cliffs. I could also run for supplies without breaking camp. There is plenty of space for gear on the trailer too. How it would be set up, I have no idea, but that is probably the first project.

Hopefully I will have a plan and a goal for things to work together to make it all work. My budget is not in the Unimog range, I don't think.

Reliability is a big thing for me, I'm not going to try to replace a radiator on the woods, unless my life depends on it. A smaller one would be easier to work on in the bush I would think, even if I called for help.

As mentioned above, the intended use would need to cover that terrain and maybe up to 500 highway miles in one jaunt, then stop for at least a day, maybe more.

So, do we really need to go bigger? Suggestions/comments??

 

[dwh]

I don't know what size you are, but I'm a gigantic mutant gorilla. 6'4" and a fat bastard to boot.

Because of that, I'm always very aware of this thing called "elbow room". My little, old, class B camper van is built on a standard length Ford full size van with a 24" fiberglass bubble top. 6' wide at its widest point, 6'2" inside height (at its highest point) and 13' from dash to back doors. Its got all the "self contained" stuff - sink, toilet, shower, fridge, stove (with oven, no microwave), furnace and water heater.

It has a 6'4" couch lengthwise behind the driver's seat. Across from that, behind the passenger's seat is a clear space of about 4', and then the galley. The toilet is rear center (pun intended) and the shower in the rear corner, behind the galley, passenger's side. The aisle between the couch and the galley cabinet is 16" - and it is NOT enough.

When sitting on the rear half of the couch that is across from the galley, I cannot stretch out my legs. When sitting on the front half of the couch where the open space is, I can. When spending days in the camper, this becomes a major issue.

When standing up, the 6'2" height is not so bad - I barely notice it. When trying to turn around while standing up, I REALLY notice the lack of space in the aisle to put my feet. That clear space, which is roughly 4'x4' is CRITICAL to me. I can stand up, change clothes, put on or take off my jacket - there is enough elbow room.

Now, that's with just 1 person in the camper. With two, it would quickly become intolerable, as we would be regularly poking each other with our elbows and stepping on each other's feet.

Rig size is always a tradeoff. My little van camper is only 2WD, but its still a truck and it goes a LOT of places. It's fine for one person. If I was going to spend a year in a box with another person, I'd want more elbow room. A bigger truck would give me that, and still get to just about anywhere this one can go. If it was 4WD, it would get to even more places than this one.

 

[Capt Eddie]

Yes, I went with a smaller camper. That way I can have more of the items I need to be self dependent. If you stay on the normal roads, there is always a WalMart or another store near by. If you have just traveled two day to get somewhere off the beaten path, You are two days from help. A 4500 lb unit takes up alot of your weight just to have a dry bath.

 

[haven]

Bigger can be very successful if done right. Here's Bob Lynch's custom camper on a flatbed F550. The camper was extended to add space for bunk beds in the rear.

The build thread is here.
http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23173

Forum member carlyle worked with Alaskan Campers to build a custom pop-up that's great for a smaller number of people
http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9502

This build appeared in Truck Camper Magazine
http://www.truckcampermagazine.com/carl-isner:-offgrid-gear-report/