Optima Battery Problems

[Buliwyf]

IME, most Optima problems are operator error. If you drain them down to nothing a few times you're OK, but if you drain them one too many times they'll be extremely unreliable. I've noticed that a dead Optima battery, I mean dead, less than 1 volt, is never quite the same.

If you tend to leave your lights on etc; then you're better off with a Lead Acid Battery. I've been having excellent luck with Napa's batteries. (I can get part #'s if you want)

If you drive your car/truck 5 times a week and don't forget to turn things off. Then the Optima is the way to go. It all depends on your application. If your Aux batteries are inside your SUV passenger area, then the Optima is the way to go.

I drive a company vehicle, I put an Optima in it. But my personal car/truck sits alot and is only used on weekends, so I use Napa lead acid batteries in those. Since I drive Fords, those particular batteries from Napa still have removable tops to check fluid level!


For camper and emergency vehicle use, I like the sealed Napa G31 batteries with removable screw plugs to check fluid level. I avoid 4D and 8D batteries. Usually a string of G31's works better for me.

I often get 5-9 years of life out of Optima's in Fire Pump applications. Lately we use lead acid batteries and change them out every three years. Optima's last longer, but I still have to change batteries every three years, so the added cost isn't worth it. And the added life is a gamble. 3 years is the majik # for my heavy equipment if I have to promise 100% reliability from any battery.

I never had any trouble from any decent alternator with Optima's. All my engines have 14.5vdc seconds after starting. I generally set my chargers to 13.3vdc.

 

[teotwaki]

If your rig eats Optima batteries then it will eat what ever battery you put in it. A Duralast lasted 20 months in my E350. They would not replace it because I was not the original owner. My new Diehard AGM lasted 6 months brfore it left me deeply discharged. If I get 21months out of an Optima then I'd be happy. Fiqure out why your junk eats batteries and move on. I know why mine does and my fix is to buy a new battery a little more often or keep up with the warrenty paperwork. Batteries are allways going to be a maintnece item so expecting one to last forever is crazy.

It seems like you read between the lines to poke holes in what Optma Jim is saying but if you read between the lines for the good stuff then you will find plenty of spot on advise. He noted that there are a lot of batteries returned that have nothing wrong with them other than a deep discharge. That is so true and is why Autozone sells used batteries. They pick the good ones out and sell them cheap. For 20 years I never bought a new battery. I'd go behind service stations to their used battery pile and pick up batteries that still read 11.5v or higher. Charge it overnight and use it sometimes for years. I allways had a few spares. I just got four "bad" gel batteries that I picked up from work last week made in 2010 and 2011. I'm betting I find 1 or 2 that are still good and one will become my new house battery. Battery one is on the charger. Wish me luck.

I can't see that you really performed more than a cursory read of the thread. Optima Jim has had no specific advice to help with my battery so all the other repetitive advertisement he types in is useless. Lots of questions for me but no direction to head in. I've given pages and pages of technical data but all I get is words back because the nameless faceless Optima "engineer" doesn't exist. My rig does not "eat" Optimas because the Optima does not connect to anything but the fridge. The reality is that the Optima battery does not survive a real life "deep" cycle installment with an Engel fridge. The battery requires being babied with an external battery charger because the Optima battery is not compatible with OEM battery charging systems that are functioning perfectly. All of this flies in the face of the Optima "deep cycle" facade that has been so carefully nurtured since they laid off all of the American factory workers.

 

[Hilldweller]

I can't see that you really performed more than a cursory read of the thread. Optima Jim has had no specific advice to help with my battery so all the other repetitive advertisement he types in is useless. Lots of questions for me but no direction to head in. I've given pages and pages of technical data but all I get is words back because the nameless faceless Optima "engineer" doesn't exist. My rig does not "eat" Optimas because the Optima does not connect to anything but the fridge. The reality is that the Optima battery does not survive a real life "deep" cycle installment with an Engel fridge. The battery requires being babied with an external battery charger because the Optima battery is not compatible with OEM battery charging systems that are functioning perfectly. All of this flies in the face of the Optima "deep cycle" facade that has been so carefully nurtured since they laid off all of the American factory workers.

I'm using my Optimas to power a fridge and lights; I've spent weeks on the road with nothing but an alternator to charge them.
My alternator cranks 180 amps though and I've got two Optimas...
They're used mercilessly, including the multiple charger failures I endured from Little Guy.

 

[Stumpalump]

The key is that if you run battery down you must recharge it right away. The sulfide in a deeply discharged battery turns to a hard sulfate in days. The hard sulfate blocks the plates and their ability to do what they do. If the battery is allready sulfated then you can nurse them back a little but other times you just need a new battery. I slam mine on concrete to help break up the sulfate but it only helps a little. As for Optima failures then just look at who buys them. People that know they are hard on batteries so they spring for a better battery. I've been down this road with marine ,hotrod and off road vehicles. When they sit they die. When left low on charge they die. Cheap batterys die faster but they all die unless kepted on a charger or used daily. My old marine batterys never lasted thru two seasons untill I started charging them every few weeks during the winter. Then I'd get two or 3 seasons. Ill shut up but just remember you cannot leave them dead for days. If you drain them then do like Jim says and put it on an AGM charger as soon as you get home. Days later is too late. Keep them fully charged as much as you can. I know it's a PITA.

 

[teotwaki]

I'm using my Optimas to power a fridge and lights; I've spent weeks on the road with nothing but an alternator to charge them.
My alternator cranks 180 amps though and I've got two Optimas...
They're used mercilessly, including the multiple charger failures I endured from Little Guy.

So your alternator is rated at 180 but what have you measured that is delivered to the batteries?


My alternator is rated at 130 Amps and I've posted what I measured going into the Optima.

 

[OptimaJim]

RusherRacing, we do not recommend charging our batteries at a rate higher than 10 amps. Stumpalump, good luck with your battery charging. I won't be surprised if you get some good use out of those batteries, although I cannot recommend dropping any battery on concrete.
.
Jim, I have encouraged you to review your wiring and verify whether your charging system is capable of maintaining any other battery you have wired for auxilliary use. If you are convinced the “nameless faceless Optima engineer” doesn't exist, I'll make a deal with you. You pick the ExpeditionPortal moderator of your choice. I will forward him my e-mail exchanges with that engineer. If I fail to do that, he can ban me and my IP address from this site forever and you'll never have to deal with me again. If the engineer and e-mails exist, then you agree to be banned from this site forever.
.
Jim McIlvaine
eCare Manager, OPTIMA Batteries, Inc.
www.facebook.com/optimabatteries

 

[bob91yj]

Rather than start a new thread, I have a similar question.

My '06 GMC Duramax has two yellow tops under the hood in the stock locations/wiring, I have a blue top in a battery box in the bed of my truck. The blue top is plugged in to the factory 5th wheel 7 pin plug in the bed of the truck. The blue top never seems to take a full charge, even after a long drive. Is the factory wiring not big enough to top the battery up?

 

[teotwaki]

What??? No "I apologize for the delay in getting back to you" ??? Awwwww. :elkgrin: LOL!

Optima Jim sets a new rebuttal speed record and a new low of desperation to discredit or silence me!

Look at the pattern in this and many other forums. You'll naively present hard data as requested, present cases where the batteries are failing, stories of reputable people dumping their Optimas, present stories of multiple battery failures and after one or two weeks OJ will come back, sidestep the issue and espouse the "state of the art factory" and the Wall Of Power, nitpick irrelevent words and generally multiquote 20 people.

Today I skip the ernest but pointless attempt to talk facts and go for the hot button, to mention the unmentionable, the sin of all sins against Optima!

Laying off American workers to increase profit margins ...... crack the sound barrier! OJ is here in barely FIVE hours to to slay He Who Speaks Evil! :ar15:

In previous posts there have been false accusations of me "selectivly quoting" or providing "dangerous" advice. This is a crafty tactic to dissuade others from even thinking that these batteries could have a real issue. Better yet, look at how the "Optima engineer" goes from validating using OEM alternators for charging....

"......that a stock vehicle charging system in proper working order will have no trouble maintaining our batteries....."

to frantically backpedaling.....!

"I don't know that the lower readings of your charging system mean it is incapable of maintaining any of our batteries, just that they are lower than what he has seen in his vehicles and what he has been told are typical."


WHAT HE HAS BEEN TOLD IS TYPICAL? What the heck? This is a real engineer?

This thread has become a nice solid record of how a big company will pay someone to litter forums with red herrings, tender false accusations and even try to silence naysayers.

Biggest laugh I've had in the whole thread OJ. Fantastic to know that I'm such an irritant to a faceless mega-company :clapsmile

Prediction: next step is for the Faceless Mega-Company to pressure the forum owners into killing the thread. How's that for vitriol? :ylsmoke:

 

[teotwaki]

Rather than start a new thread, I have a similar question.

My '06 GMC Duramax has two yellow tops under the hood in the stock locations/wiring, I have a blue top in a battery box in the bed of my truck. The blue top is plugged in to the factory 5th wheel 7 pin plug in the bed of the truck. The blue top never seems to take a full charge, even after a long drive. Is the factory wiring not big enough to top the battery up?

You should be able to find the specs on your tow harness. (Oh wait! Is that "dangerous" advice??? LOL) IIRC, my Toyota harness has a 30 Amp breaker so your truck's specs should be published too.

A little bit of Googling references fuse slot #68 and a 30 or 40 amp fuse. Maybe you couold check yours out and see what is installed?

 

[scrubber3]

He has a point there OJ. Why did Optima leave America and source labor from other countries? I know it's for the shareholders, but what does a Rep have to say about it? Why did I serve in the US Army and defend the American people from tyranny and terrorism as well as help foreign countries stave off genocide just to come back here and see Americans being laid off for the sake of bank investments. Keeping in mind that these are the same banks that our wonderful president spent billions of tax payer money to bail out? Greed right? That Executive bonus the higher ups get, correct? Where did the intestinal fortitude of this country go? Why do we have people in this country looking for jobs when they could have the jobs that have been sourced elsewhere? Keep in mind that I have never had one issue with an optima battery, but since the subject has been brought up about the fact at hand. I now have an issue with the people of optima.

Are you guys still making batteries in the US? If not, then where? How much money are you making the investors?

If you cannot answer my questions, can you point me in the direction of someone that can?

 

[Hilldweller]

So your alternator is rated at 180 but what have you measured that is delivered to the batteries?

I'll try to measure that when I get a chance.

As an entertaining side note, the batteries won't recharge after a long weekend and short ride home; no surprise.
But when I was hopping cross-country, they did a fine job. The only time I had trouble was after a few days in Palo Duro Canyon in intense heat. I ran the batteries down to 11.5V and then only had a short ride to refresh them; I needed to use the onboard charger but that was my first charger failure...
The Optimas lasted through the night and the batteries fully recovered on the ride from Amarillo to the Wichita Mountains Wildlife Refuge.

Take a deep breath, teotwaki...
I happen to know that OJ is a real guy, real family, real petrol-head and auto enthusiast. He spreads himself thin and is out rubbing elbows with plenty of other enthusiasts. Putting out fires is just one of his hats.
I look up to Jim. Literally. I'm 6'5" and he's about 9" taller than me...

As for faceless engineers, years ago it was my job to test batteries in life-safety systems. I'd also test the batteries that were going in as replacements; many were already trashed, fresh from the box. That was my first contact with faceless engineers --- on the phone, the help lines from a variety of companies, including JCI. The engineers were very helpful.
Just sayin. Every company wants to make money but the best companies want a good product on the shelf. After having business dealings with countless battery companies in the past, I have no qualms about maintaining my relationship with Optima. I've seen the dark side of battery companies (no names but I'm looking at Asia right now) and there are companies I won't buy from.

 

[bob91yj]

You should be able to find the specs on your tow harness. (Oh wait! Is that "dangerous" advice??? LOL) IIRC, my Toyota harness has a 30 Amp breaker so your truck's specs should be published too.

A little bit of Googling references fuse slot #68 and a 30 or 40 amp fuse. Maybe you couold check yours out and see what is installed?

There is a 30A (might even be 40A) fuse that you have to install in the fuse box to get power to the 7 pin. GM has a factory harness installed at the back of the truck, they also have one that is tucked in the frame that can be used to wire a 7 pin into the bed for 5th wheels, or in my case my slide in.

I'm no electrical genius, I only know two things for sure...
1. If you touch electricity it hurts.
2. If you let the smoke out, it's broken.

I have clean connections on all three batteries, other than the pig tail from the 7 pin in the bed to the blue top battery (maybe 3ft) all wiring is factory. Now that I'm thinking about this issue, I guess I'll have to get a meter out and see what my voltages are at the batteries, etc. I'll get back to you with that info, see if we can figure out where my issue is.

Sorry for the interruption, back to the internet banter...

 

[Stumpalump]

What??? No "I apologize for the delay in getting back to you" ??? Awwwww. :elkgrin: LOL!

Optima Jim sets a new rebuttal speed record and a new low of desperation to discredit or silence me!

Look at the pattern in this and many other forums. You'll naively present hard data as requested, present cases where the batteries are failing, stories of reputable people dumping their Optimas, present stories of multiple battery failures and after one or two weeks OJ will come back, sidestep the issue and espouse the "state of the art factory" and the Wall Of Power, nitpick irrelevent words and generally multiquote 20 people.

Today I skip the ernest but pointless attempt to talk facts and go for the hot button, to mention the unmentionable, the sin of all sins against Optima!

Laying off American workers to increase profit margins ...... crack the sound barrier! OJ is here in barely FIVE hours to to slay He Who Speaks Evil! :ar15:

In previous posts there have been false accusations of me "selectivly quoting" or providing "dangerous" advice. This is a crafty tactic to dissuade others from even thinking that these batteries could have a real issue. Better yet, look at how the "Optima engineer" goes from validating using OEM alternators for charging....

"......that a stock vehicle charging system in proper working order will have no trouble maintaining our batteries....."

to frantically backpedaling.....!

"I don't know that the lower readings of your charging system mean it is incapable of maintaining any of our batteries, just that they are lower than what he has seen in his vehicles and what he has been told are typical."


WHAT HE HAS BEEN TOLD IS TYPICAL? What the heck? This is a real engineer?

This thread has become a nice solid record of how a big company will pay someone to litter forums with red herrings, tender false accusations and even try to silence naysayers.

Biggest laugh I've had in the whole thread OJ. Fantastic to know that I'm such an irritant to a faceless mega-company :clapsmile

Prediction: next step is for the Faceless Mega-Company to pressure the forum owners into killing the thread. How's that for vitriol? :ylsmoke:

Mods please lock this thread.

 

[teotwaki]

Mods please lock this thread.

I see no logic in that request. Lots of folks have problems with these batteries and are looking to be heard. All of us including Optima Jim have a right to discuss it. Feel free to complain about me or him but locking the thread or banning someone is over the top. OJ does help some folks and they've said that here. I've got my fans too so please reconsider your request and maybe be more specific about your thoughts.

 

[teotwaki]

I'll try to measure that when I get a chance.

As an entertaining side note, the batteries won't recharge after a long weekend and short ride home; no surprise.
But when I was hopping cross-country, they did a fine job. The only time I had trouble was after a few days in Palo Duro Canyon in intense heat. I ran the batteries down to 11.5V and then only had a short ride to refresh them; I needed to use the onboard charger but that was my first charger failure...
The Optimas lasted through the night and the batteries fully recovered on the ride from Amarillo to the Wichita Mountains Wildlife Refuge.

I think that the charge regime duration and voltage & current rates are the key. It is not adressed on the Optima site and OJ is not capable of discussing it, no disrespect intended. He is a sales and customer relations guy so a lot of this swirl is either lack of skills or it is deliberate but in this venue I'm not getting solid tech info. Anyhow, a dedicated AC powered charger that is specific for AGMs can provide a complete charge in a couple of hours. It appears that an automotive charging system is not capable of such a short charge time and it takes many more hours for a car alternator to replenish the amp hours taken out of our batteries compared to the AC powered charger. That is exactly why Optima has the unexplained dividing line between "charging" or "maintaining" a battery.

Take a deep breath, teotwaki...
I happen to know that OJ is a real guy, real family, real petrol-head and auto enthusiast. He spreads himself thin and is out rubbing elbows with plenty of other enthusiasts. Putting out fires is just one of his hats.
I look up to Jim. Literally. I'm 6'5" and he's about 9" taller than me...

For the record I admire your level head and calm demeanor because I believe them to be genuine. I know that you believe that Optima should represent itself well to overlanders and that you are striving to build a real customer-vendor relationship in your area. However, nobody is paying you to do that and you don't have to hide or defend each and every overlander who makes mistakes with their battery installs.

As for faceless engineers, years ago it was my job to test batteries in life-safety systems. I'd also test the batteries that were going in as replacements; many were already trashed, fresh from the box. That was my first contact with faceless engineers --- on the phone, the help lines from a variety of companies, including JCI. The engineers were very helpful.
Just sayin. Every company wants to make money but the best companies want a good product on the shelf. After having business dealings with countless battery companies in the past, I have no qualms about maintaining my relationship with Optima. I've seen the dark side of battery companies (no names but I'm looking at Asia right now) and there are companies I won't buy from.

You at lest were able to talk to the engineers directly and could interact with them. Here we are dealing with a corporate firewall. If I were able to deal directly with an Optima battery engineer I'm sure he could point out the gaps in my knowledge, my mistakes and where I was on the correct path. I in turn could find out if this person was an engineer whether degreed or through life experience or if he was a harried customer service tech that was ill prepared to discuss real battery issues. We've all heard of the city trash collectors who are called "Sanitation Engineers" and know well that they engineer nothing.

Okay, can I let the deep breath out now?