Tires - how aggressive do I need to go?

skiroc

Observer
I've got a 2006 Tundra 4x4, and am looking to put a Four Wheel Camper on it. Everyone seems to recommended E rated tires, so I've started looking at these. Most of my mileage is highway, and then some desert roads and Sierra east side forest service roads. Some are 4x4 rated roads but I'm often by myself and so don't I don't go on very difficult trails. In the past I've had pretty aggressive tires, but don't know that I ever really needed them. I could care less about looks - I just want whatever will meet my functional need. My question is - how aggressive of a tire should I go with? Can I get away with a M/S tire for better mpg, low noise, etc. Something like this Michelin LTX M/S2? If you think this is not aggressive enough, what would the next step be?

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...TXMS2OWL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes
 

phsycle

Adventurer
I bet for 95% of the time, those all-seasons would do you just fine. I've got all-terrain's (BFG KO), but don't really need that aggressive of a tread. For the most part. But when I need it, I NEED it. I'd say go with an all-terrain tire (BFG KO, Good Year Duratrac, Michelin AT2, Bridgestone REVO, etc.). Better tread of off-road and stronger sidewalls. Good things to have, especially if you're by yourself.
 

slus

Adventurer
I'd go with BFG AT or similar, as said above. All my Toyotas have come with various all seasons, and I have found them lacking just about everywhere except pavement, all have balled up with mud and become nearly useless on muddy roads. On the other hand, I have also ran BFG MT, MT/Rs and Toyo MTs at different times. The street manners never bothered me much, but they are expensive and I don't do the kind of wheeling that requires them. I run BFG ATs on one rig and BFG MTs on the other till they wear out, never had the ATs hold me back. In addition, the ATs are better on snowy roads, I had my MTs siped and they still are not as good as "out of the box" BFG ATs on snowy and icy roads. In my experience, both the BFG MTs and ATs have about the same lifespan, but MTs did take away 1-2 MPGs.
 

Moody

Needs to get out more
The Michelin LTX AT2 is my #2 choice in LT tire. I love them. I had a set of the old LTX AT's on a Toyota pickup that wore amazingly well, and worked as well as any other AT tire I have used.
 

keezer37

Explorer
Well, are you more concerned with trying to stop on snow/ice or trying to get out of mud/sand? For me it's stopping on snow/ice. I'm done with aggressive A/T tires. Like All Season, they are mediocre at everything, just with an off-road skew. And before I forget, Bridgestone Revo 2 sucks. At 20k they are wearing fast and I am really limiting my winter driving as their stopping ability on snow/ice is abysmal. I will probably be going with Michelin for my next purchase if I don't get dedicated winter tires. I've always trusted Michelin.
After having E rated tires on previous vehicles, I've had only P rated on this truck. I just don't see the need. I've done plenty of off-roading in SoCal on them and hauled plenty of weight. They are cheaper and the ride is generally better on the highway. Don't know about your camper weight. I suppose if I was hauling in excess of 1k for hundreds of miles, I'd go with E rated tires.
As far as traction goes in mud/snow, this is 90% driver ability, 10% tire. If you grew up driving in snow, you know what I mean.
Bottom line is, are you going to buy tires with the mindset of planning for that one apocalyptic event or for the other 99% of your life?
 

upcountry

Explorer
I have Wild Country All Terrain Sport tires and love em. Their quiet and have worn well. Have 20k on them and still hardly worn. Pljs their cheaper than BFGs.

Off topic but Keezer 37 I have been meaning to ask and i know you all are wondering too....what the heck is that in your user name pic? A guy giving thumbs up? But their is something about that pic that intruiges me.
 

downhill

Adventurer
I have not found super aggresive tires to be that big of a help in most offroad situations. In mud they all pack up. I've seen swampers packed so high the fenderwell was shaving of the mud. On icey roads they can be a big liability. You do need some lug tread to provide gripping edges on rock and other surfaces. These days I stick to medium treads like the BFG A/T. My current tires are these, and they have been outstanding:

http://simpletire.com/dean-lt235-85...urce=google&utm_medium=shop&utm_campaign=feed

They have seen thousands of miles on highway, lots of ice, snow and mud. I've done some driving over rock but less than the other conditions. Really a great tire. I prefer E rated tires too. In the taller profiles they seem to track better. They resist rock cuts better from miles on crushed rock roads. My truck weighs just over 5,000 pounds and they ride great.
 

frobuster

Observer
High heat, high payload, highway and safety; Michelin. You can get stuck or blow a sidewall on anything, but you wont be doing 70mph when it happens.
 

DirectDrive

Observer
I'm in construction and drive on crushed rock a lot of the time.
I also like to wheel into remote fishing areas.
I'm on highway more than anything else.

I need a tire that will shed small stones and I also need some lug/shoulder in case I have to run chains.
Street tread is out and so are heavy lugs.

These are getting good reviews and I just took delivery of some.
They look like they will meet expectations.
http://discounttires.com/product_de...lZjdkZjMyMWRlMWIwZjJlNTNlMTZjMWE=&prodID=9837
Be sure to check spelling or you will end up at their (more expensive) competitor.
These shipped fast and shipping was very reasonable.

The E-rated tires are 3/4T-1T tires and have stiff sidewalls to live up to their rating.
Even though you are 1/2T, the E-rating might be a good idea with your camper. I used to run a huge FSC camper and stiff sidewalls help to counter that "swimming" motion that a rig like that can produce.
The sidewalls are also tougher than C's or P's.

The trade-offs with E's would be:
Stiffer unloaded ride
Heavier....less fuel economy
More expensive to purchase

Here's another one that is getting good reviews and was on my short list :
http://tirecrawler.com/shop/detail_tire.php?product_id=10788
 
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Well, are you more concerned with trying to stop on snow/ice or trying to get out of mud/sand? For me it's stopping on snow/ice. I'm done with aggressive A/T tires. Like All Season, they are mediocre at everything, just with an off-road skew. And before I forget, Bridgestone Revo 2 sucks. At 20k they are wearing fast and I am really limiting my winter driving as their stopping ability on snow/ice is abysmal. I will probably be going with Michelin for my next purchase if I don't get dedicated winter tires. I've always trusted Michelin.
After having E rated tires on previous vehicles, I've had only P rated on this truck. I just don't see the need. I've done plenty of off-roading in SoCal on them and hauled plenty of weight. They are cheaper and the ride is generally better on the highway. Don't know about your camper weight. I suppose if I was hauling in excess of 1k for hundreds of miles, I'd go with E rated tires.
As far as traction goes in mud/snow, this is 90% driver ability, 10% tire. If you grew up driving in snow, you know what I mean.
Bottom line is, are you going to buy tires with the mindset of planning for that one apocalyptic event or for the other 99% of your life?

Not true at all. I've lived my whole life (48) in snow areas and I can say without a doubt that statement is wrong. I have had everything from stock to aggressive tires and for past 6 years I have a second set of tires and wheels just for winter. Until you run a true winter tire you have no idea what you are missing. The soft compound and sipping realy makes a huge differance and I mean huge on snow and ice covered roads. I will never again not run snows in the winter.
 

DirectDrive

Observer
Not true at all. I've lived my whole life (48) in snow areas and I can say without a doubt that statement is wrong. I have had everything from stock to aggressive tires and for past 6 years I have a second set of tires and wheels just for winter. Until you run a true winter tire you have no idea what you are missing. The soft compound and sipping realy makes a huge differance and I mean huge on snow and ice covered roads. I will never again not run snows in the winter.
Yes, it's amazing how the new compounds get "stickier" as they get colder.

Ran Revo's on the Grand when they first came out.....not impressed with that tire for the price at all.
Switched to Dueler 693's and that Grand was like on tracks in the snow. Very impressed with that one.
 

downhill

Adventurer
I do alot of ice/snow driving too, sometimes with a trailer in tow. I would agree that if you do alot of that you need to think about tire choice. I always get a M/S rubber compound and I also pay for machine siping. Tire width is also a big factor. Wide tires are bad news no matter what the tread or rubber compound, unless you have studs. That being said, some people can't seem to drive on ice with snow tires, studs, AND chains. For them I would recommend tracks :sombrero:

As far as harsh ride from E rated tires, I've never felt that. It's just a matter of proper inflation. E rated tires don't have a higher rating because the sidewalls are stiffer. They have the higher rating because they can run at higher pressures. They are a sturdier tire, but the extra stiffness from the added cords and rubber is a drop in the bucket with the weight of a truck on it. It's the pressure that makes it stiff,..or not. The added weight of the tire can produce a harsher ride if you are running stock shocks. The more unsprung weight you have, the more shock capacity you need. In theory a heavier tire should hurt gas mileage. On identical tires I'm sure it would. I haven't seen that though with E rated tires. Maybe they have less rolling resistance, or maybe I've been lucky, I don't know, but that's how it has worked out for me. I've run Es in both narrow truck tires and wider Swampers with good results.

Downhill
 

DirectDrive

Observer
As far as harsh ride from E rated tires, I've never felt that. It's just a matter of proper inflation. E rated tires don't have a higher rating because the sidewalls are stiffer. They have the higher rating because they can run at higher pressures. They are a sturdier tire, but the extra stiffness from the added cords and rubber is a drop in the bucket with the weight of a truck on it. It's the pressure that makes it stiff,..or not. The added weight of the tire can produce a harsher ride if you are running stock shocks. The more unsprung weight you have, the more shock capacity you need. In theory a heavier tire should hurt gas mileage. On identical tires I'm sure it would. I haven't seen that though with E rated tires. Maybe they have less rolling resistance, or maybe I've been lucky, I don't know, but that's how it has worked out for me. I've run Es in both narrow truck tires and wider Swampers with good results.
Downhill
Yes, the E rating is achieved through higher pressures but the tire also has be to more robust to take those pressures, including a more rigid sidewall and tough bead.
You cannot safely air down an E enough to run like a C or P. They are different tire classes.

If you have a rig like the OP's 1/2T, you would be able to tell the difference in ride with E's coming from P's and possibly from C's, but less likely.

Been running E's since the days of the 7.50 x 16 split rims, and I love E's, but they're not the end-all do-all in light truck tires.
 

Scott Brady

Founder
Given your application, I would favor an AT style tire with sufficient load capacity. An agressive MT tire is quite useful in technical rock (the lugs grab the irregularities of the rock) and in mud (as expected). For the most part, we have stopped using mud tires unless we are purposefully going to a muddy region, like Central America.

The ride comfort, improved tread life, reduced noise and vibration and improved fuel economy just makes an AT the better choice for most exploration/travel/camping needs.
 

Redline

Likes to Drive and Ride
Given your application, I would favor an AT style tire with sufficient load capacity. An agressive MT tire is quite useful in technical rock (the lugs grab the irregularities of the rock) and in mud (as expected). For the most part, we have stopped using mud tires unless we are purposefully going to a muddy region, like Central America.

The ride comfort, improved tread life, reduced noise and vibration and improved fuel economy just makes an AT the better choice for most exploration/travel/camping needs.

Amen!

This discussion is very timely, as earlier this week I wrote a long introduction for a tire article that will start on my blog next week, and address many of these points.
 

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