On Board Hot Water Shower System

[Crom]

The Eccotemp L5 does in fact work with a small 1 lb propane bottle. It needs a small adapter ~$10 but everything hooks up nicely. We have had many showers on it so far, and it is really nice. Not sure how many showers per 1lb bottle, but I heard about 2 hrs of water flow. (I have a larger stock propane tank that will go under the van and hook to the system at some point, but until then, the little 1lb bottle is still going strong, and we keep a spare in the van for when it runs out. I do look forward to not having to recycle/throw out those little bottles, eventually.
The whole thing is quite compact, so long as you can deal with the ventilation of the eccotemp unit, it will fit in a small cabinet, including the propane bottle, pump, hoses, etc. (in the second pic, looking in the cabinet door, the eccotemp on the right and small propane bottle in the back just to the left of the eccotemp). We have ours in the back cabinet of our Vanagon Westfalia, and there is room for several other things in there, and it is not a large cabinet.
Because I have a tire swing away in the back that holds two 5 gallon jerry cans of water, we just pull out the supply line (on the left in first picture), which has about 4 feet of hose (most of the braided hose in the third and last pics is the supply hose, pushed back through the cabinet hole when not using it), and put it in the jerry can. Then pull the marine knob and it turns on two AV fans (in the black housing in the pics)- one fan in one fan out- and powers the pump to pressurize the system to 35psi. The showerhead (tucked above the cabinet for storage in the first picture) has an on/off switch built into it and the pump has a built in power switch based on pressure, so once pressurized, the pump only runs when you have the showerhead switch on, and water flows. The pump has a (very) small pressure tank built in, so there is no pulsing. When water flows, the propane unit turns on and heats it, like immediately. The two knobs on the eccotemp control flow rate and temp. we got it set how we like it and just leave it there, that way, we don't have to open the cabinet. Just pull the knob, the fans turn on, the system pressurizes itself, and you are ready to turn on the showerhead.

I actually like leaving the showerhead unattached to the vehicle, so one handed showering makes you more likely to shut off the water for full lathering, etc. The showerhead will hook onto the tire swing away while lathering. Can get two showers from one 5gallon jerry can easily that way. Pulled very cold water from a high altitude mountain river outside Telluride, into the jerry can, and still the heater got it up to temp no problem. Of course, a particle filter on the end of the supply line helps, plus an inline filter before the pump keeps everything running smoothly.
Power draw is minimal, and no starting the van. A different option from the heat exchanger approach.
-macjack

Welcome to the portal. Nice first post. Hate to be critical of your work, but I would never operate that thing while installed in the back of the rig. If it malfunctions, it could very quickly burn your rig to the ground.

 

[Bbasso]

I too wouldn't use my Eccotemp in a confined space in a van, I've seen a few gas flashes from my unit (windy days)... but I do like your idea for operating.

 

[lawdot74]

Good thread. I learned a great deal. Thank you.

I'd like to do something similar with a heat exchanger. As I would like to avoid idling in camp for showers (thirsty V8, noise pollution, exhaust, etc) I will avoid the simpler single pass systems. Like the OP, water in a holding tank would be heated by cycling through the heat exchanger while driving. Normal operating temp of this engine (Toyota 5.7L) is 212f or 100c (or so Ive read). I can't find temp range for the valterra tanks but I have requested this data. Any one have problems getting a tank like this that hot? Any use or suggest a stainless steel tank to avoid the heat issue?

I'd like to use a separate larger cold water tank that would be fed to a mixer along with the hot water to provide 110f water for shower and cleanup.

I believe I will need...
Heat exchanger, hose, fittings
"Large" Cold water tank with external fill, vent
"Small" Hot water tank, vent
PUMP #1: Cold water tank to mixer and hot water tank via check valve, solenoid valve.
PUMP #2: Hot water tank to heat exchanger and mixer

The filling of the hot water tank would need to be manually controlled, so as not to dilute the heat stored in that tank. This would require venting of the hot water tank allowing air into the tank when being depleted as well as air out of the tank when being refilled. It would be nice to push a button to fill the hot water via a solenoid valve or third pump. Anyone use something like this? I suppose I would have to observe the vent for overflowing water to know when to stop flow from cold to hot. Not automating fill of the hot water tank is a conscious decision as there will be times when water will be more strictly conserved.

Criticisms? Suggestions? I'm very early in the information gathering stages of this build.

TIA,
Law

 

[con kso]

I decided to keep it simple. I went with a propane on-demand hotwater heater (ecotemp- approx. $100) plumbed to a 20lb propane tank ($20). The heater is connected to a herbicide ATV sprayer tank that I bought from Tractor Supply ($119 I think), 30 gallons and it comes with a pump. I strapped that to the bed of my truck, I run the pump off my 31 series battery. I've had this system bolted inside my Callen camper for five years now and it's worked perfectly. The ecotemp has fittings for screwing in a hand shower wand- I attached a curly hose (ordered from McMaster) with garden spray nozzle so I can wash down wetsuits and dogs. The thing is great- the girls love a hot shower in the woods and it's got enough volume for showers everynight for three people for maybe four nights. Relatively cheap too and easy to take apart, remove, or service. My advice: Keep it simple.

 

[Redman333]

Good thread. I learned a great deal. Thank you.

I'd like to do something similar with a heat exchanger. As I would like to avoid idling in camp for showers (thirsty V8, noise pollution, exhaust, etc) I will avoid the simpler single pass systems. Like the OP, water in a holding tank would be heated by cycling through the heat exchanger while driving. Normal operating temp of this engine (Toyota 5.7L) is 212f or 100c (or so Ive read). I can't find temp range for the valterra tanks but I have requested this data. Any one have problems getting a tank like this that hot? Any use or suggest a stainless steel tank to avoid the heat issue?

I'd like to use a separate larger cold water tank that would be fed to a mixer along with the hot water to provide 110f water for shower and cleanup.

I believe I will need...
Heat exchanger, hose, fittings
"Large" Cold water tank with external fill, vent
"Small" Hot water tank, vent
PUMP #1: Cold water tank to mixer and hot water tank via check valve, solenoid valve.
PUMP #2: Hot water tank to heat exchanger and mixer

The filling of the hot water tank would need to be manually controlled, so as not to dilute the heat stored in that tank. This would require venting of the hot water tank allowing air into the tank when being depleted as well as air out of the tank when being refilled. It would be nice to push a button to fill the hot water via a solenoid valve or third pump. Anyone use something like this? I suppose I would have to observe the vent for overflowing water to know when to stop flow from cold to hot. Not automating fill of the hot water tank is a conscious decision as there will be times when water will be more strictly conserved.

Criticisms? Suggestions? I'm very early in the information gathering stages of this build.

TIA,
Law

This sounds very complicated. I get what you're trying to do but in my mind I just keep thinking about what will go wrong and it'll happen at the worst time.

 

[lawdot74]

Reading back through what I typed does sound complicated. For what its worth valterra tanks aren't meant to go over 110* F per the manufacturer.

Perhaps I should give an ecotemp system a try before building something overly complicated.

thanks,
Law

 

[fredrok]

Looking for feedback from those of you that have experience with the L5 at high elevations. Manual recommends below 4-5,000 feet (field tested to 5,500) but I live at 7,400 and most destinations are higher than that. Just inherited one with a trailer and would like to know if it's worth keeping in it now. Thanks!

 

[rossvtaylor]

Looking for feedback from those of you that have experience with the L5 at high elevations. Manual recommends below 4-5,000 feet (field tested to 5,500) but I live at 7,400 and most destinations are higher than that. Just inherited one with a trailer and would like to know if it's worth keeping in it now. Thanks!

Ditto this question! We're at 7000 (Overland Expo country).

 

[fredrok]

I've had a chance now to mess with it in my driveway. It works great, no yellow flame - nice solid blue - but will not stay lit. After 5 seconds or so, it shuts off its own gas supply. After jacking with it for a while, I found the thermocouple (upper on shield) may be bad. I can manipulate it by hand and hear the shut off valve clicking as I do. Got a replacement, will update when I get back to it.

 

[fredrok]

Replaced the upper thermocouple (attached to the shield) and it stays on now, seems to work great in my driveway (7,400ft).

 

[KE7JFF]

Interesting hot water setups here...I'm researching on how I want to go about doing mine for my '89 Suburban. Primary use of it would be for showers.

What I am leaning towards is using one of those 6L Instant Tankless water heaters that run on propane; I would mount it on the inside of my rig's barn doors so I can just open the door, and connect it to water and propane and voila!

However, I am reminded of a redneck setup for hot camping water. I saw this once at a USFS campground; the guy had an aluminum tank that looked about 30L in capacity that was sitting on a propane mantle and he had a hose ran to it to a sprayer nozzle mounted on the side of his Wells Cargo trailer with a curtain. I'm sure that water was probably ultra hot.....

 

[andyfordceo]

Using coolant from rear heater system? 4Runner

I have been reading up on all the available information on everyone's approach to on-board and hot water systems. I have decided on and have now got all the parts to install my 30 plate heat exchanger, shur-flo pump , anti-scald value and on board tank.

When considering the pipe routing I had a thought - can I use the coolant from the rear heater system? My truck is a 2000 4Runner and under the passenger seat there is the coolant lines for the rear heater element.

This would cut down my complexity of tubing/routing and reduce the heat loss.

Does anyone have experience or wisdom on this?

 

[ab1985]

There are a couple of threads on mud in the 80 section where people discuss/attempt this. I don't recall seeing a completed setup, but there's probably some good info there.

 

[Bozman1]

Bringing this back. Just getting around to my own setup. I have pretty much the exact same setup as toyotech pictured on post #112 (10 plate exchanger, shurflo 3.0) and had a couple questions. We'll try simple first without mapping out my build. I noticed the exchanger and pump all have 1/2" mpt, with the pump specifically stating not to use anything different, but I have seen 3/8" id tube in other builds. I tried using 3/8" id and I have absolutely no pressure. Questions:

1) Can i really get away with using 3/8" id tubing with a shurflo 3.0 pump that has 1/2" mpt input and output?

2) Should the majority of the tubing be before or after the pump? Or does it matter? Such as tank - pump - long hose to heater - long hose to shower (vs.) tank, long hose to heater - long hose to pump - pump - shower?

3) leading on, should the pump be before the heat exchanger? Are these pumps more designed for push or pull?

Appreciate the info! Trying to get setup for a 10 day long trip from central utah through the mojave into barstow in about a month so I need to get on this.

 

[toyotech]

Bringing this back. Just getting around to my own setup. I have pretty much the exact same setup as toyotech pictured on post #112 (10 plate exchanger, shurflo 3.0) and had a couple questions. We'll try simple first without mapping out my build. I noticed the exchanger and pump all have 1/2" mpt, with the pump specifically stating not to use anything different, but I have seen 3/8" id tube in other builds. I tried using 3/8" id and I have absolutely no pressure. Questions:

1) Can i really get away with using 3/8" id tubing with a shurflo 3.0 pump that has 1/2" mpt input and output?

2) Should the majority of the tubing be before or after the pump? Or does it matter? Such as tank - pump - long hose to heater - long hose to shower (vs.) tank, long hose to heater - long hose to pump - pump - shower?

3) leading on, should the pump be before the heat exchanger? Are these pumps more designed for push or pull?

Appreciate the info! Trying to get setup for a 10 day long trip from central utah through the mojave into barstow in about a month so I need to get on this.

I'll have to check my hoses I used but I'm pretty sure I used 1/2 for all the hoses but the output I used a smaller hose because I didn't want a heavy shower hose with shower head.
I put my pump before the heat exchanger. Pump can push or pull it doesn't matter from my use. Pump can run dry as well. I probably have at least 10 feet of hose each way on the pump. It has to pull water from 10 feet away. Push it into a heat exchanger and back to where it came from 10 away. Than probably another 5 feet of shower hose.
Both my input and output is in the rear of my bumper. The pump and heat exchanger is under the hood.


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