Nutrition 101?

[dieselcruiserhead]

Wondering if there are any people on here who know their nutrition and/or sports nutrition very well. Carrie and I are both fairly healthy but Carrie tore her ACL last night on a mountain bike and the doctor was going over photos of different people's nutrition and how their knees looked on the inside related to diet and health (yikes) and talked a lot about diet in relation to athletics and health both in terms of injury and recovery. The doctor is the guy who did Tiger Woods knee and is local and does a hell of a job luckily... He showed us photos of a 20 year old frat boy's knee (from the inside during surgury) who had a high BMI (body mass index) aka "a little fat" and drank too much and ate pizza and booze and chicken wings.. ...and was genuinely scary.

I do the majority of cooking these days and would like to get good insight on nutrition or where to start.. We are both in our late 20's but between all the weddings and a good portion of our friends who are all great but together we sometimes drink too much and eat poorly, though its a lot of fun, we probably don't have decent health related to diet. Also both of our BMIs are a little high, about 10-15 lbs over. Not fat but a little extra fat.. So I'd like to get a good idea on where to start...

Another thing though is that we are both fairly active, we ski and bike a lot in particular.. So sports nutrition info in particular in terms of joint and muscles and tendon strength, and over all strength and energy. Thanks and any info appreciated..

We also each did a HSCRP blood test which I think will help show our health and healing in relation to diet.. I hope the results aren't so bad that I'm afraid to post them!

 

[Christophe Noel]

I'm an elite level cyclist and have been road racing (with plenty of Mnt and 'cross) for 23 seasons. Geeky as it sounds, sports nutrition was a bit of a hobby of mine for many years. It was my chosen field of study in college for the first 2 years. Since then I've been to various sports nutrition classes and seminars from the US to Europe.

The "knee thing" is new to me, but if you have questions about general sports nutrition, particularly as it relates to endurance sports, give me a buzz.

cnvivefrance@hotmail.com

If I don't have the answer, I can get it for you. One of my best friends is the US Olympic Tri coach and has written a few books on the subject.

 

[DaveInDenver]

One of my best friends is the US Olympic Tri coach and has written a few books on the subject.

How cool. The guy who helped fixed my Achilles tendinitis last year is a CU Triathlon coach. I knew him from racing CX (he's good, I'm not, so I saw his races). I went because of the CX and that I also went to CU... Anyway, Neal Henderson I think is his name. I know he coached down in the Springs for the USAT collegiate team.

Oh, yeah, nutrition. Never heard that stuff, but there's a lot I don't know. I guess you are what you eat. Be interesting to hear. I'm also going to ask my riding buddy tomorrow about it. He's a kinesiologist, so he won't necessarily know specifically about nutrition but he should know something about joints and soft tissue.

 

[DesertRose]

First, I hope Carrie is doing better! That sounds painful.

Well, after Flounder's post, I almost didn't respond, but what the heck! I'm not an Olympic class anything (except maybe being a smart-aleck, according to Jonathan), and so my perspective is a bit different.

I did a lot of research last year into diet and exercise for two reasons.

First, I started going to a naturopath doctor instead of a "regular" MD, thinking an NMD would be more in-tune with things like organic foods, exercise, etc. Wrong! I found out most naturopaths and homeopaths actually have very lucrative sidelines selling you supplements - despite the fact that my BMI was fantastic (and way below average for a 43 year old), despite that I weigh 120 after a big meal, and am 5'7" - he tried to sell me $80/month worth of supplements because I was low in iron and magnesium and calcium (what woman isn't?).

Long story short: I argued with him over the fact that I could just improve my diet and get all the nutrients I need from food (and have more fun, too!), and further, that supplements were a waste because much of them your body can't process without other natural food-derived minerals and such . . . you pee away a lot of that $80.

Second thing, I got a wakeup call - literally. Being healthy and eating right all your life won't guarantee you won't wake up to a phone call telling you the lab results show you have cancer.

So I started looking into how to track my diet and exercise. It can't be that tough, I thought.

And it wasn't. I found a fantastic online resource that I used for about 8 months to track my dietary intake and activity levels - and it's been really surprisingly easy to balance out what I need.

More magnesium? I increased dark greens and things like broccoli . . . and dark chocolate :26_34_3: . . . More iron? I increased some stuff like liver (in pate - we tried liver and onions, and it's a bit much!) and more greens . . . after a few months my leg cramps went away and my blood tests proved I had balanced the imbalance.

While I went through 6 weeks of daily radiation, which kills cells and so the body needs to be regenerating cells, I paid special attention (using a number of resources to learn what nutrients the body needs for cell building, etc) to certain foods. The techs at the hospital were impressed by how well my skin did and how little I felt the effects of high-dose radiation. I'm sure it was nutrition, and the fact I didn't stop exercising. And that Jonathan kept me supplied with Godiva chocolate.

Sorry to soapbox! But my feeling personally is that you can't go wrong if you balance your caloric intake with your activity level, you really eat plenty of vegetables and fruit along with your meats and dairies and grains, and then you make sure you're eating whole and organic foods. Forget processed stuff with high fructose corn syrups and sweeteners. Go with real meat. Real veggies grown locally. Whole milk (preferably raw). Eggs, because whole eggs are the perfect food. Don't get sucked into the "low-carb, low-fat" thing, or the vegetarian thing. Forget soy, an evil crop, unless you ferment it first. Balance & knowledge are the key.

The website I used was the good old USDA's - the Healthy Interactive Eating Index. You can enter what foods you eat each day (after you input your physiological info) and it tells you pretty well how you did with eating "right." Having baseline bloodwork helps, so you can see whether you're hitting your marks. They also have an activity tracker for how much energy you burn and what calories you need to intake to maintain or lose weight.

http://www.mypyramidtracker.gov/

This website is good for looking up nutrient-specific foods:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/

Okay, that's enough - but this is a subject I feel strongly about, because I think most people don't enjoy real food (and drink!) enough, and miss out because of fad diets . . .

Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

Thanks guys.. Just checked in here quickly to see if there were any responses. Flounder I'll definitely send you an email... The joint thing is pretty basic I think across the board positive sports nutrition. The test though checks for inflammatory tissue count versus anti-inflamatory which is particularly important with recovery stuff. I guess it is an often enough issue (particularly with modern eating habits) that it can literally make or break a surgery. That is what this picture showed, almost a completely degraded knee and the ACL literally nowhere in sight after it had snapped after the guy waited a few months to address it.

Anyway, I have gotten the biking bug badly in the last month-two, been riding probably 50-100 miles a week easily on the MTB since I got it about a month and a half ago. Really sad, Carrie is a good biker and it was really our first big ride together, she fell off in sort of a weird off balance section and her Shimano clipless didn't release (we have been having all sorts of adjustment issues with them - so off they go especially now) and she tweaked her knee. Timing almost couldn't be worse as we leave (hopefully) for a trip in a week and a half...

I have sort of peaked my knowledge on cars and trucks I feel like and been moving to bikes and they are so easy.. So hopefully I can start learning and reading all about diet and sports nutrition and hopefully lose a little weight and get healthier

Cheers and thanks guys,
Andre

 

[Christophe Noel]

Desertrose just offered up a steaming plate of excellent advice! She's right on target with her advice regarding food quality. Food quality is the foundation for good sports nutrition. Whole foods and whole foods that haven't been cooked to a pulpy mush are key. It simply is a matter of balancing your three primary macronutrients: Protein, Carbs, fat(good fat)

Now, depending on your activity level, to master your diet such that you can eliminate all supplimentation....that might be tricky. I couldn't use diet alone to source all of the micro-nutrients I need to recover from hard rides day to day. I suppose I could just plan on riding an extra 4 miles (not a biggie) to offset the calories in 1/2 a cup of blue berries - OR - I can just take a sports based suppliment full of antioxidants needed for sports based recovery. Plus, I don't really want to eat berries or other such anti-oxidant foods daily. I'm using berries and antioxidants as an example. Suppliments do just that...suppliment things you miss from your diet. No one, and I do mean NO ONE PERSON can stick to a perfect diet day in and day out. *Keep in mind, this is assuming you ride at least 4-6 days a week and do so for 60-90 minutes at a moderate clip.

Another supplimentation example: Three seasons ago I collapsed in a pile during a race and spent four days in the hospital. Just an oversite on my part. My chromium, potasium and magnesium dipped enough to initiate a rather serious issue with my ticker. I had a heart rate of 225 for hours which lead to seizures...not nice. So, I suppliment those minerals as a precaution. Sure, a banana would have been a big help, but like I said...I neglected my diet for a couple days and wham...hospital.

So, don't fear suppliments, just don't expect too much from them. The key is understand nutritional concepts and know how to tweak your needs depending on the season, your activity and your objectives. If you do it well and to some extent for performance everything else just falls into place.

You can also use a strategic diet to help tweak the efficiency of your body, kind of like modifying your truck. Need more endurance? Teach your body to replace glycogens (fuel your bod uses) quicker by removing as many sugars from your diet as possible (during certain phases of a training program) and BAM...your liver becomes one serious glycogen producing machine.

It really is cool stuff. People have a tendancy to go too far to extremes with nutritional theory. My Rover has fancy traction control...over complicated...all it needs are lockers....very simple. Sports nutrition is the same. Learn the basic concepts and keep it simple.

Most importantly - If you knock out a big ride, don't forget to swing into your favorite greasy spoon once in a while and eat some of your favorite crap food. You still have to feed your soul from time to time! Once a month I go completely off the farm and eat junk. It's good for you.

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

Wow Roseann thanks for such a great post! That is great and congrats I don't think I ever recalled that you battled cancer.. I love it, some mutual information sharing in the near future

I'll post up. Tonight is the first night here.. But flying blind (sort of like obsessively changing lightbulbs trying to reduce energy costs when you could have a simple light bulb). But anyway, my first flying blind meal was (tonight):

Golden Curry (the box they sell at stores -- DElicious, but high sodium...
Sprawn. Also unfortunately prepackaged but at least raw.
Jasmine Rice
Lightly steamed fresh spinach
Mixed greens...

I would love to start posting and reporting on it hopefully as I have time. Wouldn't mind getting into this a lot more including what you guys are eating maybe if you don't mind. It would be neat to turn this into a big thread.. PS -- right on Roseann.. On all of it!!

 

[DaveInDenver]

Golden Curry (the box they sell at stores -- DElicious, but high sodium...
Sprawn. Also unfortunately prepackaged but at least raw.
Jasmine Rice
Lightly steamed fresh spinach
Mixed greens...

This is the one and only lucky result of having a wife with high blood pressure. We eat very little sodium ever and for the most part not a lot of packaged stuff. Personally hate spinach, though. Yuck. We go thru jasmine rice by the crate it seems, she loves sticky rice. So we just try to eat balanced and beyond we don't over think it. Lots of scratch made stuff, albeit simple, I think is the key. You have some more control over what goes into it at least.

 

[bigreen505]

Excellent advice, I agree with all of it and have little to add. Chris Carmichael has a podcast you can download off iTunes that is worth a listen. There is a Web site called the Organic Athlete that has some recipes for veggies.

On slightly OT add is that I would recommend a doctor that will do a hamstring tendon graft over a patellar graft to repair the ACL. I have one of each and I definitely prefer the hamstring and recovery was faster and post recovery balance and coordination was better. I recently ran into a grad-student at CU doing some research on which method is better and his rather qualitative research seemed also to point to the hamstring graft as the method of choice. Fewer and smaller scars too, which I'm sure she would appreciate.

 

[Christophe Noel]

We go thru jasmine rice by the crate it seems, she loves sticky rice. .

One of the best kept secrets in sports nutrition is whole grain BROWN rice. If white rices are gasoline, brown rice is rocket fuel. I find it truly helps in boosting weight loss, plus it has improved fiber, protein and other bennies not found in white rices. Personally, I hate it, but it really is worth it's weight in gold.

My other secret weapon is Acai berry juice. I'm really conflicted on that stuff. I'm not wild about the socio-enviro-political implications of buying Acai berry products but the stuff is UN-REAL. It has more antioxidants than FRS or Athlete Octane sports suppliments plus it has Omega 3 fats and lots of protein. Pretty much a perfect food. Unfortunately it comes from Brazil and has become a hot topic on the political radar. Tastes like poo, but if mixed in a smoothy, it's great.

Brown rice. Acai juice. Wild salmon. Whole grains. Yogurt. Chicken breasts. Veal. Whole grain pasta. Flax seed. Fresh fruits and dark colored veggies. Those are things I invite to every meal or snack.

 

[bigreen505]

My other secret weapon is Acai berry juice. I'm really conflicted on that stuff. I'm not wild about the socio-enviro-political implications of buying Acai berry products but the stuff is UN-REAL.

I was unaware of the socio-enviro-political implications and I will definitely have to look into it. The stuff is rocket fuel, but is also an acquired taste.

Wild salmon with a nice teriyaki or misoyaki sauce (PM if you need a recipe) over brown rice with lightly steamed asparagus and an Acai smoothie is about as good as it gets.

What has been touched on, but maybe not pounded in hard enough is quality food is important -- wild salmon not farm raised, brown rice and whole grains over processed, organic vegetables (preferably from a local farmers market). You are what you eat, but that goes for what you are eating. "Organic" and free range* animals (beef, buffalo) is better than hormone enhanced. Stay away from processed foods. Stay away from nitrates.

*If you live and or travel in an area with a lot of free range farming, buy an ARB bumper. Cows may be tasty, but they are not smart.

 

[xcmountain80]

So in a sudden realization, the organic, free range, and fresh foods are like way back when. When food was un fooled around with?

Aaron

 

[DaveInDenver]

Acai juice. Veal.

My man, you are a political nightmare waiting to happen!

 

[bigreen505]

Flounder, what is your take on whole eggs vs. just egg whites.

 

[Pskhaat]

...going over photos of different people's nutrition and how their knees looked on the inside related to diet and health (yikes)...

In your example--despite the booze and wings--would not one assume that fats on the body would not be a detriment to joints? Was it just simply the extra weight, or the effect on the joints by the fats themselves in the diet? And...what were those effects? You said `scary' but can you elobrate? I'm curious :O

My fully-deep-midwestern wife cooks all the wrong things I've been told. She's an organic meats with real gravy from cooking remains, non-nitrate and non-cured bacon, whole milk, eggs, extra-heavy on the raw farm cheese please kind of girl. I'm definetely heavier now than ever (which is due I believe in my own caloric quantity intake) but my heart rate and blood pressure is way down (vs. when I was effectively a partying vegetarian) and I feel really good. (Crossing fingers and praying it lasts).