AFFORDABLE SAND LADDERS FOR EXPEDITIONARY VEHICLES - MAXINGOUT

[maxingout]

Great write up and pics...and nice that you include real world demos of them in action.

Now I have a question, based on your experience it is worth it to have 4 of them or would 2 be enough?
Any idea how much a set of 2 or 4 wgt?

thanks for taking the time to write this stuff up, many of us are really enjoying it.

I just weighed the four sand ladders on my bathroom scale. Their total weight was 35 pounds. So two of them would weigh about 17.5 pounds in the present dimensions.

When I constructed these sand ladders, I wasn't sure how big I wanted to go with them. These are about six inches longer than the ones I typically used in Arabia. I decided to make them a bit larger in all dimensions, because I wasn't sure how and where I was going to be using them. I am planning a driving trip around the world, and so I built them bigger, because it remains to be seen the type of conditions I will encounter on the trip - sand- mud - snow etc. I can easily cut them down by eight inches of length and still have a very functional ladder in the sand. My thought was to go large, but if the length isn't need, then cut them down to lighten the load. It would be possible to have three inches less width and eight inches less length if I was only going to use them in sand. In mud or snow, a longer and larger ladder could be beneficial. So my constructed length may not be the final length. A few minutes with an angle grinder and a cut off disc can shorten them to any length.

We always used four sand ladders when bogged down in the sand since we had four wheel drive. But if a person has only two wheel drive, I see no benefit from carrying four sand ladders. That's what the large water trucks do in the sand dunes. They have only two wheel drive and so they use only two sand ladders.

I have been amazed what you can accomplish with two wheel drive in the sand dunes if you know what you are doing. Twice in the Empty Quarter of Arabia, I have seen Defenders driven in two wheel drive without too much difficulty. One Defender broke a front half shaft at base of a dune after descent down a slip face. The other Defender had a broken rear differential, and they disconnected the rear prop shaft and removed the diff from the vehicle, and it still drove around in the dunes for another week using only front wheel drive.

If you only have two wheel drive, there is no point carrying four sand ladders unless you are laying down a track in the sand on which the vehicle will drive.

[maxingout]

Max, would there be any value in having 2 of them being slightly longer? When a tire is buried, longer can be cumbersome to get properly angled, but with the other tires, it gives you one more rung of traction. Just pondering.


Sent from my iToaster

The longer the sand ladder, the greater the chance that it will flip up and hit the frame or the underside of the vehicle when the tire engages the first rung of the sand ladder. Usually you clear some sand away from the bogged tire and jam the sand ladder in front or behind the tire depending on the direction of the recovery. When the tire rides up on the first rung of the sand ladder, the ladder tilts upward (just like when you put weight on a teeter totter). If you have a big body lift, you can use a longer steel sand ladder without it engaging the frame or body of the vehicle. If you are a water truck, you can use a really long sand ladder because the sand ladder will never rise up and hit the underside of the vehicle.

So for our types of vehicles, I would say that the amount of body lift on the truck determines how long you can make your sand ladders without them engaging the underside of the truck.

[Antichrist]

I am planning a driving trip around the world, and so I built them bigger, because it remains to be seen the type of conditions I will encounter on the trip

I would think that something which could also be used as a bridging ladder would be advisable when you're likely to encounter a great variety of terrain types.

[tacr2man]

JMHE but have only had to use sand ladders for bridging once , and just put rocks under to support , and then could have found a way round but just decided easier to do what we did, with sand its just a matter of spreading the weight footprint , and getting back on top so to speak, so a well made short ali ladder works OK its the rung to side rail fixing that is the biggest factor . Most times I have used its because had not aired the tyres down for soft sand , but hard for faster travel , if you are down to say 18-20psi and are still sinking in then its time to reconsider your route in view of your weight( groundpressure) .

[maxingout]

I would think that something which could also be used as a bridging ladder would be advisable when you're likely to encounter a great variety of terrain types.

I have been looking at bridging ladders for a long time, and I can see their benefits when they are needed. It all comes down to the type of wheeling you do as to whether you need to invest in bridging ladders.

Most of what I know about driving off-road comes from my experience in Saudi Arabia, and that limits my perspective to a significant degree. I spent 90% of my off-road driving in the sand (which is not surprising since Arabia is one of the largest sand boxes in the world). Whenever I drove on dissected terrain, I followed bedouin tracks that made quick business of the complications associated with dissected terrain. In ten years I never needed to use bridging ladders in Arabia because we followed tracks through the dissected terrain. On rare occasions we might move a few rocks around to smooth the way, but bridging ladders never were needed. So my bias is slanted in favor of sand ladders and away from bridging ladders because of where I drive and how I drive. Other people live in locations where dissected terrain rules their off-road experience, and bridging ladders are an important part of their standard operating procedures. They attack dissected terrain and go where no one has gone before, and bridging ladders are an important part of what they do off-road.

When driving in Africa and Australia, heading cross country without following tracks is hazardous to your tires. Thorns make Africa into the land of a thousand tire punctures. If you drive off the developed tracks and head cross country, you better have lots of spare tires, tubes, patches, and tire repair kits. In Australia you discover how efficiently mulga stumps penetrate the sidewalls of your tires when you get off the tracks in the outback.

In a driving trip around the world, I would expect to spend the majority of my time on tracks where bridging ladders would not be necessary when traversing dissected terrain. I would let the desert tracks do the work for me. I would also stick to existing tracks as I don't like flat tires in remote locations when I am only carrying two spare tires. When I did an externship in Kenya in medical school, we made a safari out to Masai Mara game reserve, and I will never forget all the flat tires. The person I was with told me that on one trip he had to repair five flat tires punctured by thorns in a single day. Rightly or wrongly, that has left a lasting impression on my approach to the African off-road experience, and it is one of the reasons I want to run Michelin XZL tires in Africa because of their resistance to thorn punctures.

I can see myself leaving existing tracks in the sand dunes of Namibia or in the Sahara, or the sand dunes of the Middle East. But I don't see many circumstances where I would actually need bridging ladders.

When my Land Rover is fully loaded in an expeditionary configuration, I will spend most of the time on well-defined tracks unless leaving the track for a couple of miles to find a secluded camping spot.

Wheeling here in the USA is very different from what I experienced in Arabia. In the American south west there is much more off camber driving, and dissected terrain and rock crawling are routine experiences. I never saw a rock slider on a truck until I returned to America and purchased my H1 Hummer which has a massive rock slider going from wheel well to wheel well and a web like network of underbody protection. When I first looked under my H1 Hummer and I saw all that damage control gear underneath, I wondered what people were doing with their trucks that merited all that protection. Then I came to the American southwest, and I discovered that they do things differently here. They eat dissected terrain for breakfast and devour rocks with their trucks for lunch. The rules of engagement are entirely different in this part of the world.

If I was going to do dissected terrain and rock crawling, I would get myself some bridging ladders that were big enough to stand up to my H1 Hummer, and I would air down to 12 psi, and I would be working out my rock sliders and underbody protection as the H1 went where no one has gone before.

My Land Rover 110 is for driving on tracks around the world and enjoying sand wherever it is found. I will never drive on dissected terrain on purpose or do rock crawling with my truck loaded in expeditionary configuration. I will let the tracks of the world get me through the rock and the hard place as I drive around the world.

That's a very long answer to why I chose sand ladders over bridging ladders. Time will tell whether I have chosen well or poorly.

Thanks for your comment.

[maxingout]

JMHE but have only had to use sand ladders for bridging once , and just put rocks under to support , and then could have found a way round but just decided easier to do what we did, with sand its just a matter of spreading the weight footprint , and getting back on top so to speak, so a well made short ali ladder works OK its the rung to side rail fixing that is the biggest factor . Most times I have used its because had not aired the tyres down for soft sand , but hard for faster travel , if you are down to say 18-20psi and are still sinking in then its time to reconsider your route in view of your weight( groundpressure) .

My experience is similar to yours. When the weather is hot and the sand is dry and like powder, route finding and tire pressures become supremely important. I automatically dropped tire pressure to 16-18 psi before going into the sand, and getting stuck at those pressures is much less frequent.

Route finding makes you look like a hero or an idiot, and it involves an element of luck. When conditions are really tough and you are in a sea of soft sand, sometimes you have to get out of your truck and walk around your vehicle on foot to discover the direction that has the most firm sand.

If you go into the dunes right after the winter rains and the sand is firm, you look like a sand driving genius because you never get stuck. If you head into the dunes after four months without rain and the ambient temperature is 110 degrees Fahrenheit, the sand will make you look like a fool.

[Antichrist]

That's a very long answer to why I chose sand ladders over bridging ladders.

I didn't mean for "off-roading", but even tracks, and bridges, can wash out and effectively stop your progress. There's a lot of the world that isn't sand.

[oryxexpeditions]

I didn't mean for "off-roading", but even tracks, and bridges, can wash out and effectively stop your progress. There's a lot of the world that isn't sand.

I agree here. I would prefer to carry something that can double as a sand or bridging ladder if I'm going to the trouble, like the Mantec bridging ladders or similar home made.

David

[t4rman]

I'll bet if you stacked all 4 angle iron sand ladders they would work just fine for bridging.

[Sirocco]

I'll bet if you stacked all 4 angle iron sand ladders they would work just fine for bridging.

that was my thought. Yes bridging capability is handy but there are ways around it.

we are going to take 4 GRP 'waffle' boards when we cross Central Asia/Mongolia/Siberia next year. These have proved to be good in mud here in the UK and used in the sand in Morocco. We also tried them out bridging a small wash out in the Italian Alps (was not strictly required). They cost around £30 a pair in the UK so are the only economic solution to traction aid.

G