Shrinking demand for RV Towables.

Raspy

Active member
Oh no!! It looks like ROA needs to move a bunch of Dweller units! Maybe they could throw in a small Taxa or Dweller with every Pause/Roamer1/X195 they sell.?
I keep seeing lots full of the typical Indiana style trailers. But at the same time, the higher end Caravan style or high quality brands, like Oliver and Imperial still have a waiting list or are doing fine. Black Series is one that is sort of in between. They seem exceptional and amazing when you see them, but the actual experience is extremely frustrating. And they are flailing as a result. It seems if companies offer quality and a proven reputation, they are doing fine, but the high pressure tactics and fake price cuts to make a deal, from sales guys who were selling shoes yesterday, are a dying breed. in the higher quality category, that usually is from smaller manufacturers, I don't know how much room there is to discount. Oliver is an interesting case. Their prices have doubles in the last few years and the trailers are nearly the same, so are they just charging what the market will bear and riding on reputation, or is there more to the pricing based on material and labor costs? They always have a waiting list and the owners are like a cult. The big mistake is buying a cheap trailer from a dealer who talks a good deal, but has no follow-up. Another funny part of buying is that people will be shocked and complain about the price, but they always manage to add on a list of options.
 

TGK

Active member
Escape Trailers out of BC appears to fall between Casita and Oliver on the quality/price matrix. Recently I saw that where they recently published lead times out to November 2023, they appear to now be claiming late July or early August 2023. At some point, I would think even the higher end units will also see lead times start to pull back. I've also been seeing more Oliver's show up in the classifieds. Are these from pandemic users pulling out and starting overseas trips again or moving on to bigger units?
 

vintageracer

To Infinity and Beyond!
Kinda interesting that CVT Cascadia opened a retail store in Chattanooga early in 2022 for the sale of rooftop tents. They have one store in California and then the one store in Chattanooga. The store in Chattanooga closed last November with a blow out sale on the remaining roof-top tent inventory.

Another sign of the times that this "Fad" is over?

The SHADOW knows!
 

vintageracer

To Infinity and Beyond!
I've also been seeing more Oliver's show up in the classifieds. Are these from pandemic users pulling out and starting overseas trips again or moving on to bigger units?

Pandemic buyer's realizing "Trailer Life" ain't what it's cracked up to be.

It's Hell in a campground when your part of the "Wine & Cheese Crowd", have an expensive Oliver trailer and are parked side by side next to the average unwashed & uncivilized public.

Camping is much more comfortable at the Hyatt Regency!

Just ask the Oliver owner's wife!
 

calicamper

Expedition Leader
Pandemic buyer's realizing "Trailer Life" ain't what it's cracked up to be.

It's Hell in a campground when your part of the "Wine & Cheese Crowd", have an expensive Oliver trailer and are parked side by side next to the average unwashed & uncivilized public.

Camping is much more comfortable at the Hyatt Regency!

Just ask the Oliver owner's wife!

Or nice cabin rental in the woods with hot tub. No trailer to drag, store, insure, maintain. Plus quiet neighbors. Haven’t seen a quiet publicly accessible camping area for yrs. They are all treated like cheap event housing now days
 

TGK

Active member
Of course, the primary focus of this forum is to avoid campgrounds entirely by poking around the backroads. Admittedly, however, over the past 3 years it's become more of a challenge to get away from it all due to the pandemic mania driving so many out into the boonies searching for the same thing.
 

FordGuy1

Adventurer
Of course, the primary focus of this forum is to avoid campgrounds entirely by poking around the backroads. Admittedly, however, over the past 3 years it's become more of a challenge to get away from it all due to the pandemic mania driving so many out into the boonies searching for the same thing.
There are so many National Park camp grounds that are small, and empty. My wife and I camp off grid, and alone a lot, but while traveling we stay in the small off the beaten path Natinoal camp grounds, and some are just amazing. Large RV's just dont fit, and they don't have hook ups.
 

Raspy

Active member
There are so many National Park camp grounds that are small, and empty. My wife and I camp off grid, and alone a lot, but while traveling we stay in the small off the beaten path Natinoal camp grounds, and some are just amazing. Large RV's just dont fit, and they don't have hook ups.
I do the same thing. We avoid any organized campgrounds and seek out BLM or National Forest areas. And with the X22, we can be completely off grid for extended periods. Some National Forest camps are very nice though, and off the beaten path for the most part. With a Senior Card they are free, and with a Nevada Senior Card, free too in Nevada. Also, with a Nevada library card (free), camping in Nevada is free.
 

Treefarmer

Active member
I keep seeing lots full of the typical Indiana style trailers. But at the same time, the higher end Caravan style or high quality brands, like Oliver and Imperial still have a waiting list or are doing fine. Black Series is one that is sort of in between. They seem exceptional and amazing when you see them, but the actual experience is extremely frustrating. And they are flailing as a result. It seems if companies offer quality and a proven reputation, they are doing fine, but the high pressure tactics and fake price cuts to make a deal, from sales guys who were selling shoes yesterday, are a dying breed. in the higher quality category, that usually is from smaller manufacturers, I don't know how much room there is to discount. Oliver is an interesting case. Their prices have doubles in the last few years and the trailers are nearly the same, so are they just charging what the market will bear and riding on reputation, or is there more to the pricing based on material and labor costs? They always have a waiting list and the owners are like a cult. The big mistake is buying a cheap trailer from a dealer who talks a good deal, but has no follow-up. Another funny part of buying is that people will be shocked and complain about the price, but they always manage to add on a list of options.
And Oliver has done an excellent job in building a strong brand reputation in a relatively short period of time. That brand reputation will give them pricing power closer to Airstream than to Forest River!
 

FordGuy1

Adventurer
I do the same thing. We avoid any organized campgrounds and seek out BLM or National Forest areas. And with the X22, we can be completely off grid for extended periods. Some National Forest camps are very nice though, and off the beaten path for the most part. With a Senior Card they are free, and with a Nevada Senior Card, free too in Nevada. Also, with a Nevada library card (free), camping in Nevada is free.
Couple years before I can get the senoir card, but its only $75 or so for the year pass. I think a lot of folks don't realize how many hidden National Forest Camp grounds exist.
 

Raspy

Active member
And Oliver has done an excellent job in building a strong brand reputation in a relatively short period of time. That brand reputation will give them pricing power closer to Airstream than to Forest River!
Oliver is an interesting story. A successful private business that was already successful with other products and owned by guys who liked to camp, but saw that the fiberglass trailers they used were not built very well. They have continued the "family" atmosphere with personalized interaction with people and by respecting the warrantee. They have found a niche group and aim their product and rallies at them. Now, that group is like a cult. Everyone is trying to spot an Oliver on the road, everyone paints their hull number on the trailer and refers to themselves by that number, people talk while waiting for delivery and become friends while supporting each other during the anguish of waiting, etc. It's kind of comical, but brilliantly affective for Oliver. Meanwhile the trailers have a simple layout that is becoming dated. But they are well built and should last generations, albeit with a few shortcomings. It seems most of the people who buy them have little if any experience with trailers, or have come from a more spartan camping style, so both of those groups are happy to have an Oliver. There has been some talk about a new model coming out, but we'll see if that actually happens, and when. In order for it to be able to have a larger solar system and insulated/heated lithium batteries, and for it to have a less archaic suspension system, and better insulation, as well as a reasonable bathroom, the design will have to be radically different. The body design will also have to have a few engineering changes to better deal with the stresses. I liked my LE2, as it towed extremely well and was durable and secure inside, but before long I became aware of it's shortcomings and decided to move on. As the price was continuously increasing, I sold mine for more than I paid for it. Now, after two other trailers, I'm moving to a Roamer1.
 

calicamper

Expedition Leader
There are so many National Park camp grounds that are small, and empty. My wife and I camp off grid, and alone a lot, but while traveling we stay in the small off the beaten path Natinoal camp grounds, and some are just amazing. Large RV's just dont fit, and they don't have hook ups.
Yep a big big big reason the go bigger RV thing is so stupid. However the go bigger trend is mainly driven by “rv parking lots” errr Resorts, I mean RV side by side trailer parks.. ERrr damn I don’t know how to classify that trend??
 

Raspy

Active member
Yep a big big big reason the go bigger RV thing is so stupid. However the go bigger trend is mainly driven by “rv parking lots” errr Resorts, I mean RV side by side trailer parks.. ERrr damn I don’t know how to classify that trend??

Yep. Even the giant fifth wheel style trailers. I have to laugh when I see one on the road. It is surprising how comfortable the "little" X22 is. Very practical, very capable and very comfortable. And it will get into places those big rigs can only dream about.
 

FordGuy1

Adventurer
Oliver is an interesting story. A successful private business that was already successful with other products and owned by guys who liked to camp, but saw that the fiberglass trailers they used were not built very well. They have continued the "family" atmosphere with personalized interaction with people and by respecting the warrantee. They have found a niche group and aim their product and rallies at them. Now, that group is like a cult. Everyone is trying to spot an Oliver on the road, everyone paints their hull number on the trailer and refers to themselves by that number, people talk while waiting for delivery and become friends while supporting each other during the anguish of waiting, etc. It's kind of comical, but brilliantly affective for Oliver. Meanwhile the trailers have a simple layout that is becoming dated. But they are well built and should last generations, albeit with a few shortcomings. It seems most of the people who buy them have little if any experience with trailers, or have come from a more spartan camping style, so both of those groups are happy to have an Oliver. There has been some talk about a new model coming out, but we'll see if that actually happens, and when. In order for it to be able to have a larger solar system and insulated/heated lithium batteries, and for it to have a less archaic suspension system, and better insulation, as well as a reasonable bathroom, the design will have to be radically different. The body design will also have to have a few engineering changes to better deal with the stresses. I liked my LE2, as it towed extremely well and was durable and secure inside, but before long I became aware of it's shortcomings and decided to move on. As the price was continuously increasing, I sold mine for more than I paid for it. Now, after two other trailers, I'm moving to a Roamer1.
It will cost well over a mill to retool new molds. They will hold out as long as they can. Its why we see very few fiberglass trailers, set up cost is way to much.
 
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