2020 Defender Spy Shots....
- Thread starter NYCRover
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Paddler Ed
Adventurer
The UK market for farm pickups has been dominated by Japanese/Thai pickups for about the last 15 years. The double cab pickup had a number of benefits, mainly that it was allowed to travel at the same speed as a car on the roads, whereas a Land Rover was classed as a commercial vehicle/van and therefore was limited to lower speeds on single carriageways and dual carriageways. Never mind that they are now up there as some of the most stolen vehicles in rural areas because of how modular they are, thus the insurance was sky high for them.
Also, if you had a Land Rover (say a 90 pickup or van, or a 110 hicap or pickup) you would need another vehicle if you wanted to take the family anywhere. The Japanese/Thai pickups? Not a problem they seat 5 quite easily.
Whilst some places still chose to run Land Rovers, by far and away the most popular option where my parents are (Welsh/English borders, sheep country) was Hilux or L200, with some Navaras. Isuzu are slowly gaining ground, but they didn't get it right at the beginning with dealer reach.
I also think that the push to the bigger flasher dealerships, which required a huge CapEx to do, meant that a lot of the smaller local dealers got pushed out and replaced by national groups which put people off buying there.
Where I am in Australia is classed as regional, and agriculture is the 3rd biggest employer; I count more 40 series Land Cruisers in daily use than I the total number of Land Rover Defenders or Series LRs here - they just don't have the reputation for work any longer here. We do have a few around (5, including a Perentie - in contrast there are about 10x 42, 45 and 47 Land Cruisers), but they are all set up for touring rather than work - in contrast, the 40 series that are around are all often work utes still, not show ponies.
The challenge for all automakers ...........
Gen Z Can’t Afford the SUVs Detroit Is Making
Focusing on large, pricey vehicles brought U.S. automakers back from the brink, but it may cost them a generation of buyers.
Bloomberg
".........Detroit has struggled to connect with young buyers ever since baby boomers defected to Japanese brands after the 1970s oil crisis. They misfired on millennials, too, rolling out gas-sipping subcompacts earlier this decade just as fuel prices plunged and SUVs became the wheels of choice. Now they’re switching gears again, exiting the sedan market and putting all their chips on high-profit SUVs and trucks—just when cash-strapped Gen Z is showing a preference for compact cars. ............
..........Price matters to the practical, passionate, and poorer generation just starting to graduate from college loaded with debt. In their formative years, they watched their parents lose jobs or struggle to make ends meet in the Great Recession. That makes them far more conservative with their money than millennials.
As they begin to cautiously open their wallets for a set of wheels, two-thirds are buying used, with most opting for compact cars or midsize sedans, according to researcher J.D. Power............
........Publicis’ Altman says Gen Z will comprise 40 percent of consumers by next year. So Detroit may have little choice but to rethink its sundown-of-the-sedan strategy if it wants to catch this youth wave. ..........."
The battle will be won or lost between $25K and $40K.
Gen Z Can’t Afford the SUVs Detroit Is Making
Focusing on large, pricey vehicles brought U.S. automakers back from the brink, but it may cost them a generation of buyers.
Bloomberg
".........Detroit has struggled to connect with young buyers ever since baby boomers defected to Japanese brands after the 1970s oil crisis. They misfired on millennials, too, rolling out gas-sipping subcompacts earlier this decade just as fuel prices plunged and SUVs became the wheels of choice. Now they’re switching gears again, exiting the sedan market and putting all their chips on high-profit SUVs and trucks—just when cash-strapped Gen Z is showing a preference for compact cars. ............
..........Price matters to the practical, passionate, and poorer generation just starting to graduate from college loaded with debt. In their formative years, they watched their parents lose jobs or struggle to make ends meet in the Great Recession. That makes them far more conservative with their money than millennials.
As they begin to cautiously open their wallets for a set of wheels, two-thirds are buying used, with most opting for compact cars or midsize sedans, according to researcher J.D. Power............
........Publicis’ Altman says Gen Z will comprise 40 percent of consumers by next year. So Detroit may have little choice but to rethink its sundown-of-the-sedan strategy if it wants to catch this youth wave. ..........."
The battle will be won or lost between $25K and $40K.
blackangie
Well-known member
Few updates and links from the latest articles, spyshots and spyvids, from AU forum thought some here would appreciate.
Thought it would be easier to keep all the quotes and info from JLR (and assumptions based on these) regarding the new defender in one place so we can keep updating easily. If you want a quote or info added or even think something should be removed, pm me or say so.
Will keep updating this when time permits.
ENGINES
Jaguar Land Rover insists the Defender will need a "balanced engine portfolio" in order to succeed in all global markets.
JLR has also said it will launch a three-cylinder Ingenium engine that will be used in a future plug-in hybrid version of the Range Rover Evoque compact SUV. JLR is also expected to announce a diesel straight-six Ingenium engine to replace a Ford-sourced V-6 unit.
JLR currently buys V-6 and V-8 gasoline engines from Ford’s Bridgend plant but has said it will end the agreement in 2020. Ford has no other customers for the engines and has said it will cut jobs at the factory as it concentrates on its own four-cylinder engines at the plant. JLR will stop purchasing V-6 diesel engines this year from Ford’s engine plant in Dagenham, London.
New 2020 Land Rover Defender: latest details and spy shots | Auto Express
JLR are on record as saying all of their models will be electrified by 2020, and also that MLA is the platform that will be phased in from around this time, so it is logical to assume that the new defender will be on the MLA platform which will have mild hybrid hybrid and fully electric options.
Multiple exhausts, twin one side exit and dual left and right seperate exits.
Multiple brake and wheel combos show different powered engines.
Dual fuel flaps (in snow and moab testing) and hybrid pilot stickers in moab vid confirm a 110 hybrid of some kind.
Lucky8 says straight 6 ingenium will be in defender.
BODY STYLES
JLR have released the general outline of the new defender as part of a investor presentation
"The Defender has up to ten different body styles from soft top to Utility Wagon to Double Cab Pick Up allowing you to ride around Delray Beach in the Defender that’s best for you and your driving needs."
2020 Land Rover Defender: What We Know | Land Rover Palm Beach
Land Rover's chief marketing officer Felix Bräutigam told Auto Express: "One of the exciting things for us is that we are not launching a car, we are launching a family of cars."
design boss Gerry McGovern has hinted that a performance SVR version of the forthcoming 4x4 could also be on the cards. Such a car would be developed by Jaguar Land Rover’s newly formed Special Vehicle Operations (SVO) division, and would allow the brand to tap into demand in Russia and China for powerful and luxurious rugged off-roaders, currently dominated by the Mercedes-AMG G 63.
It's also likely that a hardcore Defender SVX will join the range at some stage and we could even see a luxurious SVA version in line with the Range Rover SVAutobiography.
New 2020 Land Rover Defender spied testing at the Nurburgring | Auto Express
Rear wheel carier.
Full side swinging rear door
Roundish head lights.
Small square red rear lights on each side.
Left and right defender style vents
Panoramic glass roof option (as seen on nurburgring tester and moab.
Boxy body style
Sloping front roof matching current defender (as seen on latest nurburgring tester)
Some or all pilots seem to have both left and right fuel flaps on for electric point.
Rear solid recovery point, front middle recovery point and bash plate.
Great approach, ramp and departure angles.
Coolers up higher in engine bay compared to disco (according to lucky8)
INTERIOR
JLR are on record saying that the leaked images are older pre-production photos however by saying this it is logical to assume that the general layout and seating will be very similar.
2 dealers from 2 different forum members have confirmed leaked images of dash including middle seat are general layout.
Latest tech, info screen, digital binacle, multifunction steering wheel
Heads up display
Middle seat.
Moab spy video shows very similar steering wheel to leaked interior.
Floor looks like rubber and rugged in lea ked images, however there will no doubt be levels of trim to suit all.
SUSPENSION
As can be seen on the pilots will have long travel air bag suspension with a coil version option.. one of the original Range Rover Sport mules was spotted with coils.
Rear mechanical sway bar.
TYRES AND WHEELS
Multiple wheel and tyre sizes seen on mules, moab testers running on 255 / 60 R20 (32 inch tyre) 34inch looks possible with little to no mods
CAPABILITY
Departure (approx50deg) approach (approx 45deg) angles can be ascertained from the new Defender photos. (Alloy and grit)
Terrain response, rear diff lock, possible front.
As part of an investor presentation they showed that the defender will be durable, practical, functional and have offroad expertise.
JLR executive Dr Ralf Speth told Carbuyer that the design and engineering of the new model is all but finalised, and promised that the new model will be “even more capable” than the previous Defender when the terrain gets challenging.
Clearly confident as to the new Defender's abilities, he went on to reveal: “I have driven test mules already… and also tried the car against competitors, in on and off-road environments. It’s sensational.”
Moab testers told spyvideo recorder that they are impressed with the defender there.
Some of the Trails reportedly driven in Moab:
Hells revenge
Fins and things
Golden spike
Poinson spider (including the most dificult section
Lucky 8, say they have seen engine bay and coolers are up in engine bay higher.
RELEASE DATE
JLR AU are on record saying released Sept 2019, available Jan/Feb 2020.Refundable preorders/build slots are avail now.
GENERAL JLR ON RECORD COMMENTS
The Land Rover Lineup: Land Rover will have three branches to their model lineup: the luxury Range Rover branch, the versatile Discovery branch, and the Defender branch, which aims to offer the “world’s most capable off-road vehicles.”
2019 Chicago Auto Show Recap | The Largest Auto Show in North America
Speaking from the 2018 Paris Motor Show, Jaguar Land Rover's chief marketing officer Felix Bräutigam said: "The new Defender will not simply be a copy-cat, something retro. It will be something that moves the game on for Land Rover."
JLR executive Dr Ralf Speth informed us that early development mules were undergoing testing by bosses back in 2017.
Rather excitingly, the JLR boss assured us that the new car will be “even more capable” than the outgoing Defender when the terrain gets challenging.
Teasing further, he said: “I have driven test mules already… and also tried the car against competitors, in on and off-road environments. It’s sensational.” He would not put a timeframe on when the new Land Rover Defender would debut but he did say: “It is coming. We are working an authentic successor of the predecessor.”
New 2020 Land Rover Defender: latest details and spy shots | Auto Express
Gerry McGovern said: “The Defender is all about durability – that indestructible, durable vehicle which is what a family of Defenders would be.”
Revolutionary design
ASSUMTIONS BASED ON FACTS ABOVE
Safe onroad on/offroad
Very Capable on/offroad
Comfortable on/offroad
Will be durable and will hopefully reasonably reliable comsidering its dual focus.
Low to high power engines petrol, diesel, electric, hybrid (multiple exhaust, brake and wheel pilots combos seen)
Auto with 9 or 10 gears
900mm or more wading ( let's face it the defender will have the same or more capability on then the Discovery or Range Rover
6 seat 110 based on leaked interior shot and 2 dealer confirmations.
8 seat 130 possible.
WILL EVERYONE LIKE IT?
JLR says some diehard fans expecting a carbon copy will may not.
VIDS AND PICS
YouTube
Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
Thought it would be easier to keep all the quotes and info from JLR (and assumptions based on these) regarding the new defender in one place so we can keep updating easily. If you want a quote or info added or even think something should be removed, pm me or say so.
Will keep updating this when time permits.
ENGINES
Jaguar Land Rover insists the Defender will need a "balanced engine portfolio" in order to succeed in all global markets.
JLR has also said it will launch a three-cylinder Ingenium engine that will be used in a future plug-in hybrid version of the Range Rover Evoque compact SUV. JLR is also expected to announce a diesel straight-six Ingenium engine to replace a Ford-sourced V-6 unit.
JLR currently buys V-6 and V-8 gasoline engines from Ford’s Bridgend plant but has said it will end the agreement in 2020. Ford has no other customers for the engines and has said it will cut jobs at the factory as it concentrates on its own four-cylinder engines at the plant. JLR will stop purchasing V-6 diesel engines this year from Ford’s engine plant in Dagenham, London.
New 2020 Land Rover Defender: latest details and spy shots | Auto Express
JLR are on record as saying all of their models will be electrified by 2020, and also that MLA is the platform that will be phased in from around this time, so it is logical to assume that the new defender will be on the MLA platform which will have mild hybrid hybrid and fully electric options.
Multiple exhausts, twin one side exit and dual left and right seperate exits.
Multiple brake and wheel combos show different powered engines.
Dual fuel flaps (in snow and moab testing) and hybrid pilot stickers in moab vid confirm a 110 hybrid of some kind.
Lucky8 says straight 6 ingenium will be in defender.
BODY STYLES
JLR have released the general outline of the new defender as part of a investor presentation
"The Defender has up to ten different body styles from soft top to Utility Wagon to Double Cab Pick Up allowing you to ride around Delray Beach in the Defender that’s best for you and your driving needs."
2020 Land Rover Defender: What We Know | Land Rover Palm Beach
Land Rover's chief marketing officer Felix Bräutigam told Auto Express: "One of the exciting things for us is that we are not launching a car, we are launching a family of cars."
design boss Gerry McGovern has hinted that a performance SVR version of the forthcoming 4x4 could also be on the cards. Such a car would be developed by Jaguar Land Rover’s newly formed Special Vehicle Operations (SVO) division, and would allow the brand to tap into demand in Russia and China for powerful and luxurious rugged off-roaders, currently dominated by the Mercedes-AMG G 63.
It's also likely that a hardcore Defender SVX will join the range at some stage and we could even see a luxurious SVA version in line with the Range Rover SVAutobiography.
New 2020 Land Rover Defender spied testing at the Nurburgring | Auto Express
Rear wheel carier.
Full side swinging rear door
Roundish head lights.
Small square red rear lights on each side.
Left and right defender style vents
Panoramic glass roof option (as seen on nurburgring tester and moab.
Boxy body style
Sloping front roof matching current defender (as seen on latest nurburgring tester)
Some or all pilots seem to have both left and right fuel flaps on for electric point.
Rear solid recovery point, front middle recovery point and bash plate.
Great approach, ramp and departure angles.
Coolers up higher in engine bay compared to disco (according to lucky8)
INTERIOR
JLR are on record saying that the leaked images are older pre-production photos however by saying this it is logical to assume that the general layout and seating will be very similar.
2 dealers from 2 different forum members have confirmed leaked images of dash including middle seat are general layout.
Latest tech, info screen, digital binacle, multifunction steering wheel
Heads up display
Middle seat.
Moab spy video shows very similar steering wheel to leaked interior.
Floor looks like rubber and rugged in lea ked images, however there will no doubt be levels of trim to suit all.
SUSPENSION
As can be seen on the pilots will have long travel air bag suspension with a coil version option.. one of the original Range Rover Sport mules was spotted with coils.
Rear mechanical sway bar.
TYRES AND WHEELS
Multiple wheel and tyre sizes seen on mules, moab testers running on 255 / 60 R20 (32 inch tyre) 34inch looks possible with little to no mods
CAPABILITY
Departure (approx50deg) approach (approx 45deg) angles can be ascertained from the new Defender photos. (Alloy and grit)
Terrain response, rear diff lock, possible front.
As part of an investor presentation they showed that the defender will be durable, practical, functional and have offroad expertise.
JLR executive Dr Ralf Speth told Carbuyer that the design and engineering of the new model is all but finalised, and promised that the new model will be “even more capable” than the previous Defender when the terrain gets challenging.
Clearly confident as to the new Defender's abilities, he went on to reveal: “I have driven test mules already… and also tried the car against competitors, in on and off-road environments. It’s sensational.”
Moab testers told spyvideo recorder that they are impressed with the defender there.
Some of the Trails reportedly driven in Moab:
Hells revenge
Fins and things
Golden spike
Poinson spider (including the most dificult section
Lucky 8, say they have seen engine bay and coolers are up in engine bay higher.
RELEASE DATE
JLR AU are on record saying released Sept 2019, available Jan/Feb 2020.Refundable preorders/build slots are avail now.
GENERAL JLR ON RECORD COMMENTS
The Land Rover Lineup: Land Rover will have three branches to their model lineup: the luxury Range Rover branch, the versatile Discovery branch, and the Defender branch, which aims to offer the “world’s most capable off-road vehicles.”
2019 Chicago Auto Show Recap | The Largest Auto Show in North America
Speaking from the 2018 Paris Motor Show, Jaguar Land Rover's chief marketing officer Felix Bräutigam said: "The new Defender will not simply be a copy-cat, something retro. It will be something that moves the game on for Land Rover."
JLR executive Dr Ralf Speth informed us that early development mules were undergoing testing by bosses back in 2017.
Rather excitingly, the JLR boss assured us that the new car will be “even more capable” than the outgoing Defender when the terrain gets challenging.
Teasing further, he said: “I have driven test mules already… and also tried the car against competitors, in on and off-road environments. It’s sensational.” He would not put a timeframe on when the new Land Rover Defender would debut but he did say: “It is coming. We are working an authentic successor of the predecessor.”
New 2020 Land Rover Defender: latest details and spy shots | Auto Express
Gerry McGovern said: “The Defender is all about durability – that indestructible, durable vehicle which is what a family of Defenders would be.”
Revolutionary design
ASSUMTIONS BASED ON FACTS ABOVE
Safe onroad on/offroad
Very Capable on/offroad
Comfortable on/offroad
Will be durable and will hopefully reasonably reliable comsidering its dual focus.
Low to high power engines petrol, diesel, electric, hybrid (multiple exhaust, brake and wheel pilots combos seen)
Auto with 9 or 10 gears
900mm or more wading ( let's face it the defender will have the same or more capability on then the Discovery or Range Rover
6 seat 110 based on leaked interior shot and 2 dealer confirmations.
8 seat 130 possible.
WILL EVERYONE LIKE IT?
JLR says some diehard fans expecting a carbon copy will may not.
VIDS AND PICS
YouTube
Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
blackangie
Well-known member
Spotted
anorra mountains
Colorado mountains hybrid
Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
anorra mountains
Colorado mountains hybrid
Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
DieselRanger
Well-known member
Exactly my point. Hiluxs, L200s, Navaras are all way cheaper than the last "generation" of the Defender. If you want a farm truck, you want something cheap and you won't care if a bull rubs horns on the fender, or if you side-slip into a tree stump trying to gun it out of a mud pit.
The Defender hasn't been that for many decades.
blackangie
Well-known member
Single speed and coils are standard on the S (most likely for commercial applications were low range is not nessesary)
However both Air and Dual speed transfer can be optioned. Pic from LR AU website
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DieselRanger
Well-known member
I in fact have air and low range transfer case with center locker. Didn't bother with the rear locker - that was not available unless I went to the HSE Lux, then I had to get a 3rd row, which I didn't want, and with that you sacrifice the full-sized spare under the butt.
REDROVER
Explorer
Haha for years Land Rover boys laughed at other brands
Karma is a **********.
new land rovers look like somebody kicked them in the ass and smashed them in the head.
and now you guys also lost your beloved defender.
most of you talked ******** about Jeep but don’t realize Jeeps ********** on rover, and it’s been going on for 20 years,
Watch gladiator sells and new defender sells side by side.
Every single gladiator was sold before it was delivered to dealers, and here you are still in la la land about how new defender will be and how great it will be.
The fact that it will have air suspension tells you it’s over.
I am not a purist or brand bias, facts don’t lie.
when you go to sleep, think about this, WHY DO YOU SUPPORT A BRAND THAT DOESNT SUPPORT YOU anymore,
you are adventurous outdoor enthusiasts, Land Rover is moving away from you, but your still in denial and Keep sugar coating it,
Refinement and comfort doesn’t mean fun,
When I go snowboarding it’s comfortable to be on the ski lift, but the fun starts when I come down the mountain raw, old defender was that raw unrefined fun, stand on the hood, stand on the roof push with a bumper, pull with a bumper awesome vehicle, but ITS OVER.
Jeep stood by its enthusiasts and every time makes something even better.
Karma is a **********.
new land rovers look like somebody kicked them in the ass and smashed them in the head.
and now you guys also lost your beloved defender.
most of you talked ******** about Jeep but don’t realize Jeeps ********** on rover, and it’s been going on for 20 years,
Watch gladiator sells and new defender sells side by side.
Every single gladiator was sold before it was delivered to dealers, and here you are still in la la land about how new defender will be and how great it will be.
The fact that it will have air suspension tells you it’s over.
I am not a purist or brand bias, facts don’t lie.
when you go to sleep, think about this, WHY DO YOU SUPPORT A BRAND THAT DOESNT SUPPORT YOU anymore,
you are adventurous outdoor enthusiasts, Land Rover is moving away from you, but your still in denial and Keep sugar coating it,
Refinement and comfort doesn’t mean fun,
When I go snowboarding it’s comfortable to be on the ski lift, but the fun starts when I come down the mountain raw, old defender was that raw unrefined fun, stand on the hood, stand on the roof push with a bumper, pull with a bumper awesome vehicle, but ITS OVER.
Jeep stood by its enthusiasts and every time makes something even better.
Last edited:
blackangie
Well-known member
We still laugh and for good reason.
By better you mean worse ramp over, terrible departure angle (even on 40s), ugly dash, terrible 1star safety. Jeep are taking buyers for fools, the only way to get reasonable off-road ability will be on 40s, then it will be so high you cant get in, and have to trailer it to the trail.
The fact that LR are using Air susp is why it will be a better all around product.
Payload equalization, level and safe towing.
The D4 LR guys in AU(one of the harshest environments) are getting 125,000miles or 200,000kms out of their bags.
Safe onroad, instant lift off-road and more capable than previous models.
Yes the glad will sell well in the states but nearly everywhere else they wont. Its just a bad design.
In AU and europe more LR's are sold than jeeps, why? Because they Jeeps are dinosaurs, soon to be extinct. Having said that i love the look of a modded JK
, but wouldn't buy one for multiple reasons.Imo the glad is jeep trying to grab the last buyers before they have to fix their safety, efficiency and emissions, does its name justice, gladiator, fight to the death.
Now LR not supporting thier fans, please
.They kept ptetty much the same body shape for 70 years even when it was not financially viable to keep going, forget about that?
They started LR classic to support parts and remake all LR's 10years old + right back to the Series 1.
Im a Classic Rangie fan, but what LR have done with the new Defender so far is turning me too Defenders when I never thought I would. What does that say about their potential sales? They will sell like hot cakes if they get the styling right.
So far there is nothing I have seen that is a fundamental issue.
Great approach ramp and departure angles.
Looking like 3 front seats. (6seats with best in class offroad angles)
Simplistic but modern Dash.
Leg room
Comfort
Utilitarian floor
Heavy duty front and rear recovery points.
Long travel airbags
Has no trouble with any of the trails at MOAB.
Wide stance, the wheels seem to stick right outside the main body like a bowler bulldog.
Having said all this as JLR say, will the new defender suit everyone? "Not if they are expecting a carbon copy of the current Defender".
I really love the old defender for what it is and respect anyone that has one, the new one won't be for everyone but one things for sure it will bring many more 4x4 buyers over from other brands than the old defender ever could.
Its going to be a true dual purpose vehicle from what I can see.
What other vehicle could you drive across America in new LR comfort, then hit up MOAB and drive serious trails on Highway pressures and drive home again?
Trails reportedly driven, although they were there for 2 weeks.
Hells revenge
Fins and things
Golden spike
Poinson spider (including the most dificult section)
Mate I love your passion for the old Defender however this reminds me of a family bringing up a child in a house that he loves, now because the family can see that their child loves the house they are in, they maintain the house and keep it going even when it should have been demolished years ago, why? just because you love it.
Then as the child becomes a teen the house gets to a point where maintaining it is no longer financially viable, they decide to build a new one next door but make it better than before in many ways, but still keeping as much of the heritage of the old house as possible.
However out of their love for the child they let him keep the old house and offer to help keep it going in any way they can even though it might not make financial sense to do so.
The teen cannot handle the change and kicks up a stink so bad that he wants to find a new family that lives in a house just like his old one, however he is never happy with his new family because nothing will ever be the same.
Give Land Rover some credit where it is due, they kept your house going for as long as they could and are building you a new one right next door whilst keeping as much heritage as possible within the latest regulations for building worldwide + keeping your old one going.
Why you might ask I go to all this effort to respond to you , Well Land Rover have enabled me to purchade the cars I love, 5x classic LR's, I'm a Pay It Forward kind of guy so happy to stick up for them when warranted.
Again love your passion but there's certainly positive ways of looking at the new Defender.
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Murphypants
Member
@blackangie - are you being paid by the post or by the word? You like it and are excited, fine. And you’ve shared a lot of useful information, thanks! But for the love of Christ, man, people can have different opinions than you, and that’s alright. Pls stop with all the proselytizing!
luckyjoe
Adventurer
Thank you for the recap. My ears perked up when I read the above comment, only to find it comes from a dealer. So is it a leaked truth, or over inflated dream.
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