Bronco.

Shovel

Explorer
There are many things that seem like they've been just around the corner for a very long time.. Elio Motors, Most of the stuff that charlatan from South Africa ever promised, the new Bronco, vertebrates in the US Senate, production of commercial applications for graphene, whatever Rivian and Boler thought they were going to deliver, the Rapture, Tacocopter...

I'll just treat vapor like what it is and not get excited but of all those things only one has a real chance of happening.
 

phsycle

Adventurer
If they are trying to compete with Wranglers, makes sense they based it on the Ranger platform, like Bronco II. It will be nice to have another option for a 4x4 with a drop top.

For the record, I like the new 110's. Steel wheels, either Exp or Adv pack. Get some tires on it and it's ready for me.
 

Attachments

Martinjmpr

Wiffleball Batter
If they are trying to compete with Wranglers, makes sense they based it on the Ranger platform, like Bronco II. It will be nice to have another option for a 4x4 with a drop top.

For the record, I like the new 110's. Steel wheels, either Exp or Adv pack. Get some tires on it and it's ready for me.
When did Honda bring back the Element? And why does that Element have a Land Rover badge? :D
 

Desert Dan

Explorer
The Bronco will probably be real similar to the Everest but with some different sheet metal?


 

phsycle

Adventurer
When did Honda bring back the Element? And why does that Element have a Land Rover badge? :D
To be honest, if Honda would have stretched the wheelbase, lifted it a little bit (from the factory), I would probably have one. It'd be a modern day Eurovan/Synchro. Suicide doors or sliding door, either would have worked for me.

So I've got no problems with the new 110. I'd like to get one next year, but will wait to see what the Bronco brings.
 

Recommended books for Overlanding

Don't Go There. It's Not Safe. You'll Die.: And other mor...
by Jared McCaffree, Jessica Mans, Kobus Mans
From $19.99
Drive Nacho Drive: A Journey from the American Dream to t...
by Brad Van Orden, Sheena Van Orden
From $15.95
Long Way Down: An Epic Journey by Motorcycle from Scotlan...
by Ewan McGregor, Charley Boorman
From $7.95
Motorcycle Messengers: Tales from the Road by Writers who...
by Lois Pryce, Mark Richardson, Carla King, Sam Manic...
From $9.99

Shovel

Explorer
Why not? Wrangler sales soared when they started offering the 4 door JK.
I'm not emotionally attached to what Ford tries to sell under what name, like Jeep used to make the XJ Cherokee which had excellent approach and departure angles and rough terrain capability out of the box and could be enhanced by the owner in their driveway with bolt-ons into an absolute monster, then they started selling that awful pile of excrement with the same name which has "good" off-road capability when compared against its segment but that's a bit like saying you could beat up a 4 year old. Not real impressive - and that's as far as it goes.
Today's Cherokee can't be upgraded, runs into its limits pretty quick on extreme terrain and its transmission might as well be made of rubber bands and boogers. So Cherokee doesn't mean "pretty good SUV" anymore, the name was devalued by the milquetoast product bearing the name.

So here we have the Bronco. Broncos and Bronco2's had their quirks and problems but the essential components of that brand have still been rooted in a particular formula. It's marketable because it's distinct and there's more to that than a couple carefully reminiscent creases in the sheet metal.

Generally when you try to make a vehicle that's everything for everyone you end up with something that's nothing to no one and there's no better example of this than the Pontiac Aztek which tried to be sort of a SUV-minivan-hatchback thing. I'm sure they're insanely functional within their limits but I'll never know because they didn't sell particularly well and they almost immediately turned into a punchline and their only redemption appears to have been some TV show tie in after they were discontinued.

So Jeep Wrangler sales did not suffer from going 4 door; we can also look at what else happened in the market. Jeep extended the wheelbase of their Wrangler to accommodate CAFE requirements that tie permissable emissions to wheelbase/track width but at the same time every other manufacturer was nerfing the pants off their formerly capable SUV's or discontinuing them entirely. Jeep even got rid of their highly capable Cherokee and live axle, highly modifiable WJ in favor of Liberty and WK that never really caught on with off-roaders. A lot of people equate live axles with capability and whether they're right or wrong it's their spending decision to make.

In other words the 4 door Wrangler didn't kill Wrangler but it did have some sales help from other market pressures.

They still manufacture the 2 door.

On the topic of market pressure, if Jeep sells a lot of 4 door Wranglers then the Bronco should be 4 door. Nobody sells more of any vehicle than Ford sells F-series, so maybe the Wrangler should become a pickup truck (er.. I guess it is now).. and also every other car should become a pickup truck. Now every vehicle on the market is a fullsize pickup truck.

Coke sells 1.9 billion beverages per day so really every vehicle should be a can of cola. That's where the real sales are. Gotta drink your 2021 Bronco. It's got electrolytes.

If that sounds ridiculous that's the point. Special products are special because they're specialized. You can dilute that if you want - I think they call it homeopathy.
 
Last edited:

calicamper

Expedition Leader
They’ve been teasing for two yrs now. I will say one thing Ford has learned how to play the media and use its collection of hacked together franken cars to miss direct assumptions and guesses.

I gave up waiting. Bought an Expedition lol
 

Todd n Natalie

Observer
I'm not emotionally attached to what Ford tries to sell under what name, like Jeep used to make the XJ Cherokee which had excellent approach and departure angles and rough terrain capability out of the box and could be enhanced by the owner in their driveway with bolt-ons into an absolute monster, then they started selling that awful pile of excrement with the same name which has "good" off-road capability when compared against its segment but that's a bit like saying you could beat up a 4 year old. Not real impressive - and that's as far as it goes.
Today's Cherokee can't be upgraded, runs into its limits pretty quick on extreme terrain and its transmission might as well be made of rubber bands and boogers. So Cherokee doesn't mean "pretty good SUV" anymore, the name was devalued by the milquetoast product bearing the name.

So here we have the Bronco. Broncos and Bronco2's had their quirks and problems but the essential components of that brand have still been rooted in a particular formula. It's marketable because it's distinct and there's more to that than a couple carefully reminiscent creases in the sheet metal.

Generally when you try to make a vehicle that's everything for everyone you end up with something that's nothing to no one and there's no better example of this than the Pontiac Aztek which tried to be sort of a SUV-minivan-hatchback thing. I'm sure they're insanely functional within their limits but I'll never know because they didn't sell particularly well and they almost immediately turned into a punchline and their only redemption appears to have been some TV show tie in after they were discontinued.

So Jeep Wrangler sales did not suffer from going 4 door; we can also look at what else happened in the market. Jeep extended the wheelbase of their Wrangler to accommodate CAFE requirements that tie permissable emissions to wheelbase/track width but at the same time every other manufacturer was nerfing the pants off their formerly capable SUV's or discontinuing them entirely. Jeep even got rid of their highly capable Cherokee and live axle, highly modifiable WJ in favor of Liberty and WK that never really caught on with off-roaders. A lot of people equate live axles with capability and whether they're right or wrong it's their spending decision to make.

In other words the 4 door Wrangler didn't kill Wrangler but it did have some sales help from other market pressures.

They still manufacture the 2 door.

On the topic of market pressure, if Jeep sells a lot of 4 door Wranglers then the Bronco should be 4 door. Nobody sells more of any vehicle than Ford sells F-series, so maybe the Wrangler should become a pickup truck (er.. I guess it is now).. and also every other car should become a pickup truck. Now every vehicle on the market is a fullsize pickup truck.

Coke sells 1.9 billion beverages per day so really every vehicle should be a can of cola. That's where the real sales are. Gotta drink your 2021 Bronco. It's got electrolytes.

If that sounds ridiculous that's the point. Special products are special because they're specialized. You can dilute that if you want - I think they call it homeopathy.
I personally do not feel the 4 door JK diluted the Wrangler. I just made it more usable to a wider audience of people. Imagine trying to cram kids into the back of a 2 door JK? Now, if someone has kids (or even just more interior room) and wants a Wrangler, there is a Wrangler that works for them.

I am hoping if a 4 door Bronco is offered it will be similar in spirit to a 4 door wrangler as opposed to the Everest. But, we will see. In like ten years when the Bronco is actually released...
 

calicamper

Expedition Leader
I personally do not feel the 4 door JK diluted the Wrangler. I just made it more usable to a wider audience of people. Imagine trying to cram kids into the back of a 2 door JK? Now, if someone has kids (or even just more interior room) and wants a Wrangler, there is a Wrangler that works for them.

I am hoping if a 4 door Bronco is offered it will be similar in spirit to a 4 door wrangler as opposed to the Everest. But, we will see. In like ten years when the Bronco is actually released...
As a dad with two kids. We did a 2700 mile Yellowstone trip 2 yrs ago and a 2600mile 6 National Park trip this past June. And having spent several months trying to find a replacement for our First Gen Sequoia. I was initially really excited about a US version of the Everest. Given other than the 4runner we gave ZERO mid sized boxy roomy true SUVs left. Absolutely ZERO....

We have lots of tall AWD Wagons designed to replace Mini vans with car capabilities not truck capabilities.

So after lots of frustration I simply said screw it and bought the biggest, most modern 2spd Transfer case truck based SUV that existed.

2019 Expedition

Most active/ adventurous families do not road trip Jeeps for all the obvious reasons.
 

85_Ranger4x4

Well-known member
As a dad with two kids. We did a 2700 mile Yellowstone trip 2 yrs ago and a 2600mile 6 National Park trip this past June. And having spent several months trying to find a replacement for our First Gen Sequoia. I was initially really excited about a US version of the Everest. Given other than the 4runner we gave ZERO mid sized boxy roomy true SUVs left. Absolutely ZERO....

We have lots of tall AWD Wagons designed to replace Mini vans with car capabilities not truck capabilities.

So after lots of frustration I simply said screw it and bought the biggest, most modern 2spd Transfer case truck based SUV that existed.

2019 Expedition

Most active/ adventurous families do not road trip Jeeps for all the obvious reasons.
Most do not road trip $70k SUV's either...
 

Shovel

Explorer
I agree the 4 door Wrangler didn't really dilute the Wrangler much; but if there's some subtext to what vehicle you drive a CJ or TJ enforced a certain exclusivity by their limitations. Tall step-in height, limited rear seat access, limited plushness meant you were definitely compromising on comfort so the image projected is one of physical health and resilience. A frail person simply couldn't get in and a greenhouse flower wouldn't tolerate the discomfort.

You drive a TJ if you're the sort of dude or dudette who drives a TJ. That message is vacant for the 4 door Wrangler as it's totally accessible to everyone.

That's fine. Vehicles aren't actually required to project anything if they're a commodity product. I think what we're distilling here is the essence of a brand - it's either distinct or it's a commodity interchangeable with everyone else's version and your biggest decision making factor is like when you rent a car and you pick the one parked closest to where you're standing.

Imagine trying to cram kids into the back of a 2 door JK?
Imagine or remember? I remember hopping into the back of all sorts of 2 door vehicles and single cab pickup trucks throughout my childhood, have some vague memories of being in a car seat in the back of a Beetle. Never struck me as a problem and my parents didn't seem bothered?

You'd think 2 door vehicles would be selling like crazy in an era with same-sex marriages, increasing numbers of deliberately childfree adults, active empty nesters who are in their 40s and 50s with the kids grown and gone... the only reason these folks might truly need 4 doors is so they can drive for Uber.

I'm not waxing nostalgic here, in a lot of ways the world is better and definitely cars are safer now than ever before but people act like you can't use the back seat of a 2 door vehicle at all .. maybe kids need to eat less hot pockets and run around outside more :unsure:
 

Todd n Natalie

Observer
Well, with any luck there will be a 2 door Bronco for the people who want exclusivity and a 4 door as well.

Yep, my folks had many 2 door cars growing up. The car I learned to drive in was a 2 door LeSabre. So even as teens my folks still had 2 door cars.

I'm actually suggesting when it's time to replace our Tucson we look at an AWD Chanllenger GT....
 
Top