C5500 TopKick 4x4 Crew Cab Build

jesusgatos

Explorer
Would you mind sharing some pricing information with us regarding the materials you're using to construct these boxes? The more I see of your project, the more interested I am. Thinking in terms of what's familiar to me, I have been planning on building a steel-framed and skinned trailer box. Will probably end up going that route, but was like to at least make an informed decision.
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
The autograph doors aren't that mysterious. A friend purchased an end of life coach just to get some for his camper.
It turns out to be a collection of rod ends (outer steering knuckles for golf carts) on bits of tubes. With your skills you could source rod ends and spherical bearings and rig up a parallelogram assembly quite easily.
One point to bear in mind is that these types of hatch have a latch both top and bottom, otherwise they don't stay closed.
Happy hunting.

Agreed that the mystery is not in the technology, rather the act of sourcing a relatively complete assembly in order to keep the custom fabrication (= time & money) to a minimum. But I think I've got good options for the components at this point, as well as an outfit that cranks out "build to suit" assemblies. The internet has made me so impatient: if it takes me more than a day to find anything, I start thinking it might not exist!

As for the latching, the doors will have a 3-point configuration. And I'm still on the fence about using this type of cargo door hinge vs. good ole' continous hinge. As the sketch shows, the advantage is the decreased side clearance needed to access the compartment:

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Would you mind sharing some pricing information with us regarding the materials you're using to construct these boxes? The more I see of your project, the more interested I am. Thinking in terms of what's familiar to me, I have been planning on building a steel-framed and skinned trailer box. Will probably end up going that route, but was like to at least make an informed decision.

This will be a long answer, because you may as well get enough information for it to be of value.

The primary components are PPE honeycomb panels, fiberglass pultrusions, 2 oz glass, and laminating resin. There's also a lot of specialized adhesive involved formulated for polypropylene bonding.

The cost per square foot for PPE panels varies widely and is based on the type and thickness of the skins, the thickness and density of the PP honeycomb core, and the lenth of the panels. The ballpark range would be $6-$12, not including shipping costs. Stock structural pultrusions range from $4-$12/lineal foot, depending on the profile and grade. Glass and quality resin are relatively cheap. PP adhesive is very expensive, even by the case, usually around $10-$14for a 200ml sausage.

And for those not experienced with composite panels, there's another word of warning: if you make a mistake with a large component (like cut it too short), it's not very easy to fix- possible, of course- but best to avoid that experience altogether. The material is pricey enough that you don't want to screw up.

Another consideration is tooling and an appropriate (safe and efficient) work space. As I mentioned in my last post, burning through blades is par for the course, but the least of the equipment worries. Thermally bonded PPE panels in the US are limited to 50" width (that limitation does not apply to manufacturers of adhesively-formed foam sandwich panels, which are limited by the width of the skins available), which means you need the tools and technology to join them together to make bigger sheets, as well as tool them as needed for joinery, etc. While I've been fortunate to have a nicely outfitted garage, it took a whole new level of investment to get my brother set up to do this the right way, and he already had a shop outfitted for composite work and years of experience with fiberglass and other composites.

I'm not saying that my type of build can't be done as a DIY project. But I doubt it would be very cost effective. You can use my numbers to run a pro forma and see how it turns out.

Affordability is largely driven by volume. Volume allows economical acquisition of materials, tooling, and labor. It also amortizes those costs over multiple production units. So if I haven't driven my brother crazy with this project, maybe some of you can get together and have him crank out some shells for your projects. In that scenario, it probably would be cost effective. I'm anxious to get mine out on the road to see how they do in the real world. But every day my confidence grows that this is a FAR superior approach to building a strong, light structure.

Back to the build: Among other things, the big goal for the week was to get the bottom half of the cabover "clamshell completed. Mission accomplished:

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I am very pleased with the cabover design. Even though the math said I had nothing to worry about, I was still nervous. Not anymore. The goal was a cabover floor that would be solid enough for 3 adults to stand up (because it's a pop-up) without worries. That is one bomber "box", and great illustration of beam-strength calculations. It is 8' wide (inside) and 5'4" deep. The pop-up concept was a late addition to the plan, but I'm very glad I made the move. It's really going to be a nice living space.
 
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That One Guy

Adventurer
Sorry to hijack, but dude you make some killer handguards. Mine are just cheapie Acerbis ones. And NeverEnough, this thing is coming out awesome. It looks huge. It's gonna be a rolling fortess.
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
I could use some new fancy hand guards as well- put on your mask and start cranking them out!

I dropped by the paint shop to check progress on the trailer body. All three "colors", black, grey, and white, are on the shell and look great. I debated going with something besides a grey-scale theme, but just didn't have the guts. I'll probably end up applying some sort of wrap to dress it up. It was tricky to come up with the technique to apply the coating over such a large area, as the application techniques were engineered for small areas. Tomorrow they'll finish the personnel doors, ramp door, and the rub rails.

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We also unbolted the subframe from the chassis to do a dry fit to the camper body.

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The box is lifted by simple chain hoists hooked into 6 u-bolts on the roof of the shell. The holes for the u-bolts will be re-used for the roof rack/bars. I cannot emphasize enough how happy I am with the strength of the box, which becomes obvious when you lift it up without a single squeak, pop, or groan. The numerous corner tie-ins with the cross-members, interior and exterior walls, together with the floor sheets has created a lot of lay-up work, but the resulting strength is well worth it. Since there's not a single mechanical (read screw, staple, bolt) in the box, I sure hope the adhesives hold......

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The access and storage compartment doors got cut out of the shell, allowing a final test of our ability to insert and remove the fresh water tanks and holding tanks.

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This shows the grey (left, 40 gallons) and black (right, 65 gallons) holding tanks.

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All the tanks have a snug fit, which is good. The tanks are 3/8" welded poly, and some of the welds were a little thick, so some grinding was required to get the fit just right.

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Tomorrow work starts on the slide-out room and the cabover "pop top". Both will require finesse, so cross your fingers and wish us luck.
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
The big slide room is quite a project from a structural point of view. It's a challenge to get the needed strength out of this box, since only the floor and rear wall have any significant surface area. Without the support and insulation of a "basement", like the rest of the camper body, I added composite joists filled with foam. Here's my brother playing foam roulette:

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Foam injection has been a huge help on the project. In this case, it adds strength and stiffness to the composite joists, as well as insulative value.

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2" EPS fills the voids between the joists.

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With the PPE panel bonded on top, the floor sandwich for the slide is 4" thick. The ceiling panel was then formed up with PPE panel and pultrusions.

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The front and two side walls are basically composite moment frames built from PPE panel sections and pultrusions. With the front frame and rear panel in place, the ceiling panel was lowered into place after preparing the components with adhesive. Thank goodness for the roll-up door, since there's no manuvering room in the shop at this point.

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The color and texture of the PPE panels and pultrusions make it look heavy, and using a forklift furthers the illusion. That ceiling panel weighs less than 100lbs.

Three of my sons are teenagers, and they come down to the shop when they can to lend a hand. My 14 year-old shows promise as a laminator!

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Tomorrow we take a break from the project to head down to Moab for a little white water, biking, and climbing. I'm thinking about driving the Topkick down for a little test drive, provided I can get the back seat bolted back in place in time!
 

Ford Prefect

Expedition Leader
How much will the insulation injection run you?

I am thinking about picking up a Fuso, and I am just not sure how I will insulate the truck box... Thanks (pm me if you prefer)
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
How much will the insulation injection run you?

I am thinking about picking up a Fuso, and I am just not sure how I will insulate the truck box... Thanks (pm me if you prefer)

The foam gun setup at my bro's shop is somewhat different from the rigs used by insulators. The mix is pretty pricey, but we're only using it to fill hollow pultrusions. If you wanted to insulate a box, best bet would be to hook up with Superior Insulation or another Utah provider. If you took the box to them, it wouldn't be too expensive.

I loaded up the Topkick for a test drive down to Moab this week. We split just before another snow storm bore down on Park City.

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We did an easy lap on the Gemini Bridges road.

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That is one stiff chassis. The subframe needs the camper clamped on before I torque it too much more unless I loosen up the spring mounts. When you're hanging out in Moab, it's easy to get caught up in the desire to make your rig Level 5 capable, but that will not be the mission for this truck. So far I'm pleased that it will be capable of some nasty roads and it has great ground clearance. Better yet, it cruises very comfortably on the highway at 70mph with decent gas mileage.

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After a couple of hours in the truck, we got to get to the real fun. Today it was climbing on Wall Street.

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It should be warm enough to do a float tomorrow. :snorkel:
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
We wrapped up a great trip to the Moab area and a great shakedown for the truck.

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But I must admit a preference for a mountain bike on the slick rock.

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Came home to rain and just in time to watch the main slide-out room get dry-fit.

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It fits! Not exactly something that can be easily trimmed to siz.....
 

That One Guy

Adventurer
Saw this at school today and thought of you. Except for the shorter wheelbase, it looks like a good starting point for something similar to yours. Don't see the Crew Cabs that often.
 

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NeverEnough

Adventurer
Saw this at school today and thought of you. Except for the shorter wheelbase, it looks like a good starting point for something similar to yours. Don't see the Crew Cabs that often.

Looks like 189" WB, which is pretty standard for the crew cabs, and exactly what I started with. Can't tell from the photo, but it doesn't look like a 4x4. The factory 4wd was one of the reasons I choose the Topkick as my platform. Otherwise you're looking at 15-20K for a conversion. You're right, you don't see many of the crew cabs around, especially with 4wd. There's always a handful available on TruckPaper.com. I believe the last "new" C5500 crew cab w/4wd went for around 70K last spring. They seem to be holding their value, especially since they're no longer available.
 

That One Guy

Adventurer
It was a 2wd. My girlfriends family owns two concrete companies. Her father and brother own one and .two of her other brothers own the other. They have a regular cab and NowI'm kind of wondering what they payed for it.
 

NeverEnough

Adventurer
I haven't had time to update lately, but it's not for lack of activity on the project.

At long last all of the major shell and structural components are put together. We took our time on the "tilt-up" cabover shell to make sure it would fit and ride perfectly. Once the shell was assembled, it was time to cut out the forward-facing window.

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Then we lifted it up with the forklift and carefully clamped it into it's 90-degree install position before drilling and installing the stainless continuous hinge along the bottom leading edge.

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It looks huge from this perspective, but it only weighs about 90 lbs. I went a little overboard with the hinge, but better safe than sorry. The load on the hinge isn't that great, and tilt-up will never articulate more than 30 degrees, unless I decide to take it off for some reason. Mechanical connections into honeycomb composites require some laborious techniques, such as injecting filler into surrounding cells. Maybe we could put all our experience to better use doing botox injections!

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The final shell components were the two smaller "side" slides that deploy from the large slide room. I opted for two smaller windows on the face of each rather than one large one to provide some mid-wall support for the optional bunk bed panels that store behind each sofa-bed. The windows line up with two larger windows on the main shell when the rig is in travel mode. (The photo shows the box upside down in order to get the outside pultrusions glued on tightly.)

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It's nice to have the windows on hand to make sure the cutouts are right on the money.

Here's a shot of the main galley/dining room ceiling that shows the how it is reinforced to allow the roof to serve as an observation deck. We used rafters made from pultruded tubing filled with high-density foam bonded to the ceiling. We also induced a slight camber to the rafters and then glassed in two layers of "angle" on either side. It added less than 50lbs to the structure, but the result is an amazingly strong roof that can easily supports 5-6 adults walking around.

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Speaking of adults walking around, I've had two stairwells give way on previous RVs, so I vowed to make then entry steps as bomber as possible. Here's the step structure, all glassed together. Wear treads will be applied when we install the floor coverings.

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The cavity under the steps will be filled by a custom, 27 gallon fuel tank for the generator. It will provide even more support for the steps, and seemed a good use of the space (as long as it doesn't explode). Since the camper can detach from the chassis, it needed it's own fuel tank. And since there's usually one or more motorcycles attached to our travels, it will double as a "toy" tank.

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I'm still waiting on some hardware, which I coudn't order until we had actual build measurements, and the main electrical distribution panel. Just about everything else is onsite and waiting to be installed. My hope is that most of the future posts will be of the interior!
 

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