Eco-Roamer - F650 based Expedition Vehicle

#16
Heavy Weight Champion!

charlieaarons said:
Rob, I didn't know 365/80R20 MPT81s went that high. I thought they just went to 152K. But I doubt even 17520 in the rear will be enough. My U500 absolutely maxed out ready to travel is 8100kg in the rear or 17800 lb. His camper is roughly 10% longer than mine and he has the crewcab and a half.
Weight is always the biggest issue!

Charlie
Charlie,
I agree that weight is a heavy issue on this one! (pardon the pun)

We are running the 365 MPT81's in a super single format front / rear. We chose these because of two reasons:
1) Anybody I spoke to / read - who had run both XZL & MPT81, said that the MPT's run smoother, straighter, quieter.
2) Michelin's entire 20" XZL stock for the next 12 months has already been booked by the USA Army for Iraq. We tried to scrounge together 5 pieces, but ultimately thought it a bad idea to commit ourselves to a tyre with limited future availability possibly.

No doubt, the tires will be our weakest point.

Here's how the rest breaks down:

TIRES:
MPT81 tyres = rated at 17520 per axle = 35,040 lbs
Wheels = upgraded from Alcoas to 2-piece solid disc steel wheels

AXLES:
Front axle = upgraded to Meritor 14,000 lb drive axle
Rear axle = upgraded 21,000 lb LSD axle
Total = 35,000 lbs (I know... it's not split 50/50)

GVWR:
The truck is technically rated for 26,000 lbs from Ford
In addition to the axles, we're reinforcing the frame (sleeved)
Actual capability???

STUFF:
I'm keeping a spreadsheet with all the crap we're putting in to the vehicle, including furniture, the shell, and liquids. My current calculation puts it at: 19,000 lbs - which is probably wrong. Even if we up that by 33% it's still 25,750 lbs -- so I'm hoping that we should be ok!

No doubt it's going to be a heavy beast though...:26_13_1:

Cheers,
Jay.
 
#17
Hypocritical or Practical?

pygmyowl said:
That is one massive truck. I'm sure I will get some arrows slung at me, but can't help but see how in the world that monster is some how going to be construed as being environmentally friendly is beyond me, even given your use of mostly recycled products for the camper.
Pygmyowl,

We struggled with this question a lot too... Is it really possible to be environmentally friendly when you're driving an 11mpg truck around the world?

We looked at hybrid drives for the truck but they are WAY too much money, and too unreliable to take into the middle of nowhere.

Here's the four main reasons why we feel confident that we're doing the right thing:

1) Wherever possible we're using materials that are recycled or at least sustainable. (eg: Bamboo cabinetry and 'plyboo')

2) We are planning to be 'carbon neutral' by offsetting our carbon footprint (for the manufacturing & driving) with credits towards projects like: renewable energy or tree planting, etc. Ford actually has a pretty good partner program with: Terra Pass

3) My wife and I have spent the past 8 years flying around the world for work, racking up about 1 million miles between us. (ugh!) We want our kids to see the world, but a simple calculation shows that actually driving is a better way to do it, environmentally.

A single round trip flight from San Francisco to Singapore on a 747 with 2 adults + 2 kids contributes roughly 50,000 kg of CO2 (just our portion, not to mention the rest of the plane!) - calculation reference

On the other hand, if the four of us drive say 50,000 miles (more than triple the distance of the flight) we still emit less CO2 (about 40,000kg) - and we get to see the whole world along the way...​

4) By teaching our kids to enjoy and value the world, and contributing to development/environment projects along the way, and publicizing the possibility of building an "eco-friendly RV" - maybe we can influence some future decisions and innovations.

SO, overall are we still contributing to the polution? - yes I suppose so.

We could just stay home and watch a DVD. But if you are going to go out and explore this amazing planet of ours, then I'd like to think that we're doing it in a pretty friendly way.

...Or at least that's our justification and we're stickin' to it!

Jay.
 
#18
Seems to be some delusion here - using precious fossil fuels (ie, diesel) to burn your human waste, and then touting this as one of your "Eco Components", when you could simply go to an RV dump and get it treated properly - I must be missing something - even overseas, in most places if you put forth the effort you can dispose of your waste an a proper treatment facility.
 
#19
Jay, Congratulations on the project. My wife, kids, and I are following your build progress with much excitement. For now we’re planning a smaller setup for domestic travel. However we would love to meet on the road later in life driving Eco-Roamer version 2.0.

As far as “Eco”, IMHO anyone on this board that meticulously specs out a rig (however large), lives within the confines of the small storage space and water storage capabilities, spends extended time in the backcountry, and leaves as small a footprint as possible is “Eco” in my book.

Long term expedition travelers are probably not heating/cooling large homes, sitting in traffic for hours a day in our v8 luxury SUV, shopping endlessly to fill our house and garage with crap we’ll later donate to charity, watering our large chemically treated lawns to keep them greener than the neighbors, ignoring our kids while they play video games on the big screen TV, and flooding the world with security lights so the “wrong kind of people” don’t intrude on our manicured lifestyle. Don’t look down on these folks at least they recycle their water bottles and are better than the neighbors 10 feet away who drive the dreaded H2.

Thanks for all the PMs, encouragement, and inspiration. Best of luck on the build!

Bob
 
#20
pygmyowl said:
Seems to be some delusion here - using precious fossil fuels (ie, diesel) to burn your human waste, and then touting this as one of your "Eco Components", when you could simply go to an RV dump and get it treated properly - I must be missing something - even overseas, in most places if you put forth the effort you can dispose of your waste an a proper treatment facility.
Maybe Scott or one of the other 'experienced' travellers could let me know the GPS coordinates for the best KOA RV parks and dumping stations in the Sahara or Serenghetti!

:oops:

;-) Jay.
 

kcowyo

ExPo Original
#22
boblynch said:
As far as “Eco”, IMHO anyone on this board that meticulously specs out a rig (however large), lives within the confines of the small storage space and water storage capabilities, spends extended time in the backcountry, and leaves as small a footprint as possible is “Eco” in my book.

Long term expedition travelers are probably not heating/cooling large homes, sitting in traffic for hours a day in our v8 luxury SUV, shopping endlessly to fill our house and garage with crap we’ll later donate to charity, watering our large chemically treated lawns to keep them greener than the neighbors, ignoring our kids while they play video games on the big screen TV, and flooding the world with security lights so the “wrong kind of people” don’t intrude on our manicured lifestyle. Don’t look down on these folks at least they recycle their water bottles and are better than the neighbors 10 feet away who drive the dreaded H2.
Well said Bob.

The most eco-friendly thing any of us could do is to not be born, but it's a little late for that now isn't it?

I find it admirable that Jay is taking into account the effects his build and trip will have on the environment, while showing his children the world and presumably teaching them about being eco-friendly as well. Within the parameters of what Jay is trying to achieve, I see no harm or hypocrisy in labelling his build as eco-friendly or an eco-roamer or an eco-big truck with recycled parts.

He should be commended for taking these things into account. For every action there is an opposite and equal reaction, right? Taking into consideration the reactions before they occur, and passing that mindset onto the next generation, is being eco-friendly in my eyes.

:beer:
 

Willman

Supporting Sponsor - Sierra Expeditions
#23
Very nice!

Here's a great rig to check out!

EarthRoamer



Wonder if they could help........

Good luck and i'll be watching this sweet built!

Oh and Welcome the ExPo!!!

:)
 
#25
boblynch said:
Jay, Congratulations on the project. My wife, kids, and I are following your build progress with much excitement. For now we’re planning a smaller setup for domestic travel. However we would love to meet on the road later in life driving Eco-Roamer version 2.0.

As far as “Eco”, IMHO anyone on this board that meticulously specs out a rig (however large), lives within the confines of the small storage space and water storage capabilities, spends extended time in the backcountry, and leaves as small a footprint as possible is “Eco” in my book.

Long term expedition travelers are probably not heating/cooling large homes, sitting in traffic for hours a day in our v8 luxury SUV, shopping endlessly to fill our house and garage with crap we’ll later donate to charity, watering our large chemically treated lawns to keep them greener than the neighbors, ignoring our kids while they play video games on the big screen TV, and flooding the world with security lights so the “wrong kind of people” don’t intrude on our manicured lifestyle. Don’t look down on these folks at least they recycle their water bottles and are better than the neighbors 10 feet away who drive the dreaded H2.

Thanks for all the PMs, encouragement, and inspiration. Best of luck on the build!

Bob
Perfect! You hit the nail on the head. There is a huge difference between the people here on this forum and the guy in the lifted H2 with large chrome wheels, and tv's in every head rest. With my fiance being a marine scientist we both have a great understanding of the environment and what it means to be "Eco". He probaly has a smaller foot print then these people here in Eugene driving VW buses that are 30+ years old, pieces falling off, and have not had an oil change in years who drive around preaching about the environment when they have no clue.
 
#27
finished bumper!

Who says you can't be "eco-friendly" and "mean-looking" at the same time!?

Here's a picture of the just finished Bull Bar...





I'm really happy with how it came out!

- just to give a sense of size, those are 8" lights in the center!

- there's a Warn 16.5ti winch hidden behind the bumper.

It was custom built by Layne Wright at Denver Offroad Bumpers [tel: (970)464-5566] He's already got at least one more order off the back of this one. I researched around and couldn't find any good alternatives for the F-650, so we went down this route. Layne was recommended to me by MarcXP on ExPo.

The truck is now finally in Tulsa to have the axles changed and the frame stretched. Stay tuned...

Cheers,
Jay.
 

Jeep

Supporting Sponsor: Overland Explorer Expedition V
#28
Cool rig, very much alongside the needs and plans for my family. Way back in the days of the GM motorhomes they had a macerator that would burn the sewage off through the exhaust while driving, I don't know if that appeals to you but I just thought I would bring it up.
 
#29
Jay,

What toilet are you looking at? I considered one and looked into the Espar diesel incinerator toilet and they said they are not available in the US. I found a number of electric incinerators but they require something like 2000W at 110v for a fair amount of time. Ultimately, I found one called "Ecojohn WC16" which is a US made diesel incinerator, the same company also makes a propane version if you are going down that path.

keep me posted

Rob
 
#30
Toilets...

Robthebrit said:
Jay,

What toilet are you looking at? I considered one and looked into the Espar diesel incinerator toilet and they said they are not available in the US. I found a number of electric incinerators but they require something like 2000W at 110v for a fair amount of time. Ultimately, I found one called "Ecojohn WC16" which is a US made diesel incinerator, the same company also makes a propane version if you are going down that path.
Hi Rob,

I suppose it's a small industry... We're using the EcoJohn WC16 also. We started looking at the options and found the Espar/ Eberspacher WC16, which seems to be the exact unit that EcoJohn is selling in North America.

We're attaching it to a "Raritan Atlantes Freedom" 12v Self Macerating toilet.

I feel that the WC16 is overkill for our needs and is bigger / heavier than we would like, but as you pointed out, the smaller WC5 is only available in a propane version and not diesel. All along we've been struggling to remain (bio-)diesel only - with no propane on board, but at several thousand dollars more and a fair bit of space, the incinerator is starting to make me question that...

I've been justifying it to myself so far by saying "well at least we save space / weight on having a black water tank" - but I'm not sure if that's enough.

If we did carry propane, then I could run the Jackson BBQ off it as well, as opposed to the tiny tanks.

I think I'm open to being swayed on this one... :(

Cheers,
Jay.