Expedition Vehicle selection thoughts?

Chorky

Observer
Ruff, well said. I was about to say something similar. Of course everyone has their own desires, and their reasons for such, which is totally fine, and in many ways good as it often pushes boundaries of new research and development, and new products, etc... But like you said I think at the end of the day, simpler is often more. It does depend on the main purpose. If the purpose of this path/lifestyle is to have some crazy fancy super cool rig to show off, that's one's choice, but if it's to have the opportunity to get out more, go more places, easier, comfortably, etc...then something that can get you out there sooner than later is pretty darn important. I often get caught up myself in going overboard and wanting to have everything set up perfectly, which results in a heavy vehicle - which of course no matter how cool it is absolutely wont do well off road. This simply isn't realistic, so I must remind myself of the old saying 'keep it simple stupid', in that you don't need all sorts of fancy things to have great experiences. Heck it wasn't long ago when we were still riding around on horses!

I really do not think the electrical vehicle situation is going to be any sort of a valid solution for a long long time, for several reasons. Electric vehicles cause more pollution than conventional ones as of now, and people are beginning to catch on to that finally, which I'm sure will lower their hasty development. Of course charging is a major issue especially for 'expedition' vehicles where often times they are in climates not conducive to solar charging. But, even if that was a valid option currently, I think that if there are troubles finding a valid solution with a budget exceeding the cost of most peoples houses, then some reevaluation of priorities may be in order. If I had even 150K to spend, I could build my dream vehicle quite easily. But like I said, to each their own, and possibly there may be life issues which require such expense.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Need better capacitors, not batteries, and/or fusion. Which is currently in the works. Alternative energy might be a complete waste of effort at this point.
 

rruff

Explorer
Electric vehicles cause more pollution than conventional ones as of now, and people are beginning to catch on to that finally, which I'm sure will lower their hasty development.
Don't believe everything you hear! Electric is still less if generating electricity the way we do now (mostly fossil fuels). https://cleantechnica.com/2018/02/19/electric-car-well-to-wheel-emissions-myth/

Pollution isn't caused by the car, it's caused by the powerplant... which can be changed to solar, wind, or nuclear if minimizing pollution and greenhouse gases are a priority.
 

GB_Willys_2014

Active member
Don't believe everything you hear! Electric is still less if generating electricity the way we do now (mostly fossil fuels). https://cleantechnica.com/2018/02/19/electric-car-well-to-wheel-emissions-myth/

Pollution isn't caused by the car, it's caused by the powerplant... which can be changed to solar, wind, or nuclear if minimizing pollution and greenhouse gases are a priority.
Unfortunately, the environmental impact of mining all the lithium and copper necessary for EV batteries (and all our other electronic gizmos) has to be taken into equation as well.

What is the harder on the environment: extraction of oil or extraction of lithium?
 

Chorky

Observer
Well not to hijack and end in an argument but there are some very misleading things in that article. For one it does not list factual numbers very well other than an synopsis. When assessing things like that scientific articles which explain the methods, materials, discussion, hypothesis and conclusion are necessary. But that aside, the key statement in the article is 'over the lifetime'. So in theory, aside from what GB said (which is a critical component) of the environmental impact of mining the rare earth materials for manufacturer of said components, a electric vehicle could in fact contribute to a total gross factor which is less than that of internal combustion engines. However, the technology to do so is a long ways off. The other thing to consider is the ability for a electric vehicle to be capable as, say, an old 90's era F350 or Ram 3500 is far out there in practical terms. The article also does not consider the manufacturer of the excessive plastics in newer vehicles as compared to older vehicles. Also to consider is the off gassing of said plastics and materials as compared to older metal components which have already released significant levels of their total. I have actually researched this, and its pretty astonishing really. Now I suppose if one was of city folk and only drove to the grocery store then a electric vehicle might be more reasonable; however, none of us here fit that description I don't think. The other thing to consider is the lifetime of the batteries and rare earth metals required for their manufacturer. I would venture to guess the materials are lower in quantity than the volume of oil still available. From a biological perspective, there is a limited amount of resources available on the earth. Even though we have the sun, even the sun's power (in terms of joules transferred to each successional trophic level of organic organisms and consumers from primary producers) is limited. But this limit relates heavily to energy developed through solar panels. P So even using rare earth metals to create batteries, no matter how good the technology, will eventually deplete the resource. Renewable resources are what should really be taken into consideration. Not non-renewable ones.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
A solar panel the size of the roof on that thing could run all my gear except AC and my compressor.

Helium is the only material I know of that floats away. Everything else is renewable, eventually.

Don't forget about the huge amount of power loss in electric transmission lines. It takes twice as much power at the generator, than it takes for your car to recharge. That's why fusion is such a huge break through. Put one in at every sub station. Get rid of transmission lines forever.

https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/compact-fusion.html

http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/19652/lockheed-martin-now-has-a-patent-for-its-potentially-world-changing-fusion-reactor
 

Peter_n_Margaret

Adventurer
In my (very biased) view, many German vehicles (including those above) are too big, at least for many of the tracks in Oz.
Those that do venture here typically have significant tyre troubles simply because the tracks are kept clear by Toyotas and wider tracks pick up lots of new tyre destroying stakes.
That is apart from the obvious problems caused by encroaching scrub.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
 

rruff

Explorer
Don't forget about the huge amount of power loss in electric transmission lines. It takes twice as much power at the generator, than it takes for your car to recharge.
8 to 15% is typically lost in transmission lines: https://blog.schneider-electric.com/energy-management-energy-efficiency/2013/03/25/how-big-are-power-line-losses/

But all this is pretty far off topic. Even though the OP mentioned it, we aren't going to be seeing electric overland vehicles for a long time. Maybe ever.
 

waveslider

Outdoorsman
I like the idea of that yellow rig above with the mounting channel along the length of the box that the marsden mats are secured to. I can think of a lot of things you could use those mounting strips with - such as securing a table, or a temp shower curtain for outside showers, or a fish/game cleaning station. Very interesting.
 

Zybane

Member
I'd just be afraid to import anything MAN. Getting parts in NA would be a huge hassle to ship from Europe for everything.
 

Peter_n_Margaret

Adventurer
Our 24 year old OKA was built in Australia.
Simple mild steel rigid ladder frame chassis, superb bush performance from very long leaf springs. All glass is flat all body panels easily remade. Any part you can't buy you can make.
The Perkins was from the UK, but is often replaced with a Cummins 6BT and 5 speed Allison.
The diffs are Dana 60 front and 70 rear, sometimes replaced with 80s. Can be maintained forever.
1.9m overall width (our body is 2.16m x 6m overall including spare wheels). Small enough to go anywhere, big enough to provide some comfort and carry some fuel and water.
Would seem to be ideal for you guys in the States where these parts are cheap and still being made new.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
 

gregmchugh

Observer
Our 24 year old OKA was built in Australia.
Simple mild steel rigid ladder frame chassis, superb bush performance from very long leaf springs. All glass is flat all body panels easily remade. Any part you can't buy you can make.
The Perkins was from the UK, but is often replaced with a Cummins 6BT and 5 speed Allison.
The diffs are Dana 60 front and 70 rear, sometimes replaced with 80s. Can be maintained forever.
1.9m overall width (our body is 2.16m x 6m overall including spare wheels). Small enough to go anywhere, big enough to provide some comfort and carry some fuel and water.
Would seem to be ideal for you guys in the States where these parts are cheap and still being made new.
Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
That does look like a good chassis for an expedition truck, simple with standard parts so relatively easy to maintain over a long life. In the US you see older motor homes from Bluebird that live on forever for the same reason.
 

gregmchugh

Observer
I like the idea of that yellow rig above with the mounting channel along the length of the box that the marsden mats are secured to. I can think of a lot of things you could use those mounting strips with - such as securing a table, or a temp shower curtain for outside showers, or a fish/game cleaning station. Very interesting.
Looks like they have more airline track on the rear and the other side too for additional mounting points.

I added track to the interior walls of the rear garage storage area to allow hanging stuff from the sides.

I put together a clothes/towel drying rack that attaches to the side of the truck with suction cups but you could do the same using the track for mounting it.
 
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