New Defender News

soflorovers

Well-known member
Buy an Old defender :) Fixes all your surveillance problems
View attachment 562013
I get the tongue-in-cheek nature of this comment, but actually it's the only real solution to the entire 80+ page "Rage/hate" clusterf***. If you want an old Defender, then just buy an old one. Even here in the USA with our stupid 25 year law, there are plenty of great second-hand options. H***, want to spend new Defender money? Assuming you're liquid enough and don't need the financing, $60,000 buys you pretty much any ROW Defender build you want or a decent NAS D90. If you're willing to do a little work, a solid LHD base can be had for $15,000. Feel free to go wild with the other $45,000. Full disclosure though, your old Defender better be running triple lockers, beefier axles and 35"+ tires because otherwise you're not exceeding the potential offered by the new Defender straight out of the box. Oh, almost forgot, budget an extra $1,000 in there so you can afford in-car communication gear because there's no way you can have a civilized conversation in an ROW D110 on dedicated mud tires; my LR3 with significantly more sound insulation and creature comforts than an older Defender is super noisy on mud tires and becomes semi-unbearable after 2 hours in the driver's seat.
 

soflorovers

Well-known member
I wouldn't hold your breath for anything from ARB coming out quickly - ARB are Japper focused and LR are not a product they put much effort into.
You're correct, but I think it's for the wrong reasons. I believe ARB has strayed from LR because all of LR's offerings following the LR4/D4 simply can't be modified to accept a steel bumper in lieu of the stock bumper. There's a company in Australia that fashioned a bull bar for the D5, but it goes on top of the existing bumper cover. The L405, L494 and D5 all have essential cooling components behind the front bumper, and I assume the Defender will be the same based on what we've seen so far. So, ARB has started to focus on Japanese brands and Jeep more so than in the past because LR has simply made it impossible for them to offer products.
 

soflorovers

Well-known member
Much of the stuff on my LR is from ARB so you really don't know what of what you speak. Get some real information or hold your breath.
I responded to the original post from Garrycol, but in short...the LR3/LR4 were the last of the LR products that allowed for the fitment of an aftermarket steel bumper. The L405, L494, and D5 all have essential cooling components stuffed behind the front bumper cover and don't allow for an aftermarket solution. Shame, but that's the way it is now. Curious to see if someone can figure out a relocation kit/workaround for these trucks.
 

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krick3tt

Adventurer
I had said that ARB made lots of stuff for LR vehicles, not realizing many of the items they (virtually any manufacturer) made would not properly fit to the newer LR vehicles. I am in error.
The newer vehicles have been made that will not allow fitment of many aftermarket items. Is that a design flaw or a purposeful direction of LR? Not sure but noticing that design I am less inclined to purchase a newer vehicle that cannot be outfitted to my specifications. I have not seen any vehicle that, out of the gate, will have items I feel are necessary for my driving habits without having a price tag that is out of my range.
 

mpinco

Expedition Leader
..........The newer vehicles have been made that will not allow fitment of many aftermarket items. Is that a design flaw or a purposeful direction of LR? Not sure but noticing that design I am less inclined to purchase a newer vehicle that cannot be outfitted to my specifications. I have not seen any vehicle that, out of the gate, will have items I feel are necessary for my driving habits without having a price tag that is out of my range.
Agreed 100%. It was a significant point made in other threads that Land Rover completely ignores, by design. I think it is one aspect why Jeep is so successful and that is coming from someone who only has Land Rovers, although LR4 and older. Hoping the Ineos Grenadier addresses that shortcoming.
 

TOUGE

Active member
a purposeful direction of LR?
From LR head designer Gerry McGovern, “DNA is the DNA—don’t f**k with it.” Land Rover design boss Gerry McGovern.

I can't find the exact article I read with an interview with him pretty much saying LR are designing their cars as hard to modify as possible because they believe they are perfect of out of the factory and it destroys them to be modified.

This article is more about styling changes than technical/mechanical but the one i read was about the SVR Disco5 and Gerry was pissed off about people already modiying it and he could do better. https://www.roverparts.com/News/archive/McGovernMessagetoBespokeBuilders-WatchoutforSVO.cfm
 

DieselRanger

Well-known member
Land Rover has gone through a massive redesign campaign over the last 5 years. The Discovery line was basically two types with minor changes between generations and major changes between D2 and LR3. It takes a while for the aftermarket to catch up.

Available right now for the D5:
- No cut hidden winch tray to fit WARN winches
- Steel rock sliders w/tree bars
- No-cut light mounts
- Underbody protection
- Roof racks
- Wheels
- lifts

It has a built-in snorkel to achieve the 900mm wading depth; at somewhere north of 1m it floats. The only thing missing is a bumper.

Land Rover engaged the aftermarket in the final design phases of the Defender - as a result, there are already front A-bars and roof racks being advertised for it, and it will have a winch tray factory option - would bet rock sliders will be quick to show up as well as light kits, underbody protection, wheels, lifts, etc.

The TrEK finals this Spring will be using fully kitted Defenders, which will preview the aftermarket accessories to be made available for it.
 

mpinco

Expedition Leader
........This article is more about styling changes than technical/mechanical but the one i read was about the SVR Disco5 and Gerry was pissed off about people already modiying it and he could do better. https://www.roverparts.com/News/archive/McGovernMessagetoBespokeBuilders-WatchoutforSVO.cfm
"..........Land Rover design chief Gerry McGovern has spoken out against the practice, telling the aftermarket companies that JLR’s Special Vehicle Operations (SVO) will put them all out of business........."

Argh. I had read that perspective somewhere else on Gerry. Arrogance always ends badly. This will reduce JLR volumes, revenue and profit.

Edit add: Thinking more about 'arrogance' .........

- Gerry telegraphs that SVO will put the aftermarket out of business
- LR design becomes less receptive to aftermarket changes
- Volumes decrease as buyers view LR as much more difficult to customize. The 'hobbiest' walks away.
- JLR financial performance declines
- JLR writes off $4B
- SVO is downsized, previous announced SVO models deleted.

Talk about a self-fulfilling outcome created by arrogance.
 
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DieselRanger

Well-known member
"..........Land Rover design chief Gerry McGovern has spoken out against the practice, telling the aftermarket companies that JLR’s Special Vehicle Operations (SVO) will put them all out of business........."

Argh. I had read that perspective somewhere else on Gerry. Arrogance always ends badly. This will reduce JLR volumes, revenue and profit.

Edit add: Thinking more about 'arrogance' .........

- Gerry telegraphs that SVO will put the aftermarket out of business
- LR design becomes less receptive to aftermarket changes
- Volumes decrease as buyers view LR as much more difficult to customize. The 'hobbiest' walks away.
- JLR financial performance declines
- JLR writes off $4B
- SVO is downsized, previous announced SVO models deleted.

Talk about a self-fulfilling outcome created by arrogance.
Um, OK, so why did LR give drawings, specs, and invite-only previews to major aftermarket outlets before the official debut?

Why is the aftermarket speccing the Defender TrEX editions?

Why is Land Rover releasing a special Hillary Edition in NZ kitted out with aftermarket parts that Land Rover makes themselves?
 

mpinco

Expedition Leader
I'm pretty sure the aftermarket is listening when the chief design lead says:

McGovern’s hope is that customers looking to personalize their Land Rovers will be drawn to the quality of Land Rover’s own customizations, rather than turn to third-party tuning companies.

We’re going to put them out of business through SVO,” he added.


If you were the CEO of an aftermarket company wouldn't you invest in a product line that has potential for growth vs an organization that says they will put you out of business? You would as a minimum downsize investment in any products for Land Rover. Land Rover can share drawings/specs all day long. The aftermarket will listen to JLR's stated goals and invest accordingly. Will it be zero investment? No. Will it be at a scale of a company that welcomes aftermarket partnerships? No.

It was a arrogant statement by Gerry that JLR doesn't need at this point in their restructuring.
 
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DieselRanger

Well-known member
McGovern can hope in one hand and **** in the other and see which one fills up faster.

There's a little thing called the free market. Lucky8 isn't just going to pack up and call it a day because Gerry said so, any more than ARB has because Yota has TRD or any of the hundreds of tuners have because Subaru has STI. RUF is still making tuned Porsches.

Land Rover has the harder challenge in that they need to make better accessories for their vehicles than the aftermarket, or if they can't make them better, they need to make them cheaper. The market will decide. And OBTW, they better have them ready and in dealers or on the website at launch or they'll lose out.

Lucky8 is claiming they'll have sliders for the Defender ready in a few weeks. Matzker is still making a ton of Land Rover bits for the new Discovery - dont think they'll stop. Can't wait to see what they come up with for the Defender.

If Land Rover made aftermarket parts as good or better than aftermarket ones, and they were less expensive, and I could order them with the vehicle perhaps at a discount as a factory-installed option, then I sure as hell would consider them.
 

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Fivespddisco

Supporting Sponsor
From LR head designer Gerry McGovern, “DNA is the DNA—don’t f**k with it.” Land Rover design boss Gerry McGovern.

I can't find the exact article I read with an interview with him pretty much saying LR are designing their cars as hard to modify as possible because they believe they are perfect of out of the factory and it destroys them to be modified.

This article is more about styling changes than technical/mechanical but the one i read was about the SVR Disco5 and Gerry was pissed off about people already modiying it and he could do better. https://www.roverparts.com/News/archive/McGovernMessagetoBespokeBuilders-WatchoutforSVO.cfm
I guess that's why Gerry did not like our D5.
 

rlynch356

Defyota
Gerry's sentiments are par for the course....

While everyone else (Jeep, Toyota, GM, Ford, Subaru, Etc) are embracing the aftermarket and going after the overland dollar, Land rover is over in its corner saying it knows how to do it best does not want to play.

Lets see if they are right and there loads of new road road equipment for a brand new platform is world class..

I think we can see how this will turn out, but hey the profit margins on the dealer add-ons will be great for a while.
 
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