New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

Pilat

Tossing ewoks on Titan
No the us website states us49k msrp starting price, check your facts

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I think he was referring to the new G-Wagon. I don't know how much it is in the US, but here in Denmark we have 180 percent taxes on cars, plus extra for luxury vehicles (progressive).
 

blackangie

Well-known member
I could count ten-thousand pickup trucks, Jeeps, and old-school SUVs for every single Land Rover I see off-roading, in industry, or just loading something at Home Depot. Of Land Rovers, I see pristine LR3s and LR4s driving around the medical district most often. It's night and day.
Has nothing to do with the fact the old def couldn't be sold in the US for last 20 years

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Pilat

Tossing ewoks on Titan
I could count ten-thousand pickup trucks, Jeeps, and old-school SUVs for every single Land Rover I see off-roading, in industry, or just loading something at Home Depot. Of Land Rovers, I see pristine LR3s and LR4s driving around the medical district most often. It's night and day.
Presumably you live in the US where "rock crawling" is the only "offroad" there is according to some. Hence the brodozers.
But, you're right, even the old defender was not as cheap a start vehicle to modify for "crawling" and other such boulderdashing.
 

blackangie

Well-known member
I think he was referring to the new G-Wagon. I don't know how much it is in the US, but here in Denmark we have 180 percent taxes on cars, plus extra for luxury vehicles (progressive).
If so my bad and apologies to ol mate

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EricTyrrell

Adventurer
Presumably you live in the US where "rock crawling" is the only "offroad" there is according to some. Hence the brodozers.
But, you're right, even the old defender was not as cheap a start vehicle to modify for "crawling" and other such boulderdashing.
Here in the PNW, there's very little rock crawling. It's mostly dirt, mountains, light snow, and ruts. A stock Defender would be perfect here, which is why I have one. I'd really like a modern one though. Again, the luxury Defender isn't it though. The Wrangler/Gladiator is closest, but yet so far. I'll stick with my F150 for now, even though it's kind of boring and mediocre off-road, but at least its utility is unquestioned, is safe enough, and is somewhat minimally complicated. If I squint while looking at the hood, remember its aluminum body, solid axle, ZF trans (same as LR3/4), then I can almost imagine what a Defender 130 might have been.
 

blackangie

Well-known member
Here in the PNW, there's very little rock crawling. It's mostly dirt, mountains, light snow, and ruts. A stock Defender would be perfect here, which is why I have one. I'd really like a modern one though. Again, the luxury Defender isn't it though. The Wrangler/Gladiator is closest, but yet so far. I'll stick with my F150 for now, even though it's kind of boring and mediocre off-road, but at least its utility is unquestioned, is safe enough, and is somewhat minimally complicated.
When you actually check the new defenders stats on paper its hard to ignore. Its very very impressive.

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mpinco

Expedition Leader
Something selling well is not a good argument for if something is good and worth buying.

Usually the best products are in lower numbers and bought by decerning buyers.
You need to rethink what you wrote. Is the goal of a business to make a profit or is it to make the 'best product' at a $3.5 Billion loss, write off $4B, cut 4,500 workers and consolidate departments? What would JLR look like without Tata bailing them out?

Or should the business figure out where to compromise such that their product volumes justify continued viability?
 

Pilat

Tossing ewoks on Titan
You need to rethink what you wrote. Is the goal of a business to make a profit or is it to make the 'best product' at a $3.5 Billion loss, write off $4B, cut 4,500 workers and consolidate departments? What would JLR look like without Tata bailing them out?

Or should the business figure out were to compromise such that their product volumes justify continued viability?
Coming from someone who wants LR to make the old Defender which sold in abysmal numbers that means very little.
But, anyway, look up "lowest common denominator". And in the case of Jeep, Wrangler is the result. It truly is built to the lowest common denominator. Cheap, unsafe, and can't carry a load or tow. But it IS easily lifted and its solid axle can easily be welded.
 

blackangie

Well-known member
You need to rethink what you wrote. Is the goal of a business to make a profit or is it to make the 'best product' at a $3.5 Billion loss, write off $4B, cut 4,500 workers and consolidate departments? What would JLR look like without Tata bailing them out?

Or should the business figure out where to compromise such that their product volumes justify continued viability?
JLR are back in profit and i stand by what i wrote

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