Old College Kid (re)builds a Camper/Moto Van-1989 Ford EB SMB Penthouse

Flagster

Expedition Leader
Nice Van...if it were me i would skip the bold graphics...
IMO it is better to stay as low profile as possible...easier to stealth camp...
That being said I do like the jumping bikes...:ylsmoke:
 

Mwilliamshs

Explorer
Yeah, Flagster, I've been torn by that too and given the very limited time I have to work on the van I'd say it'll be quite low profile for some time.

That being said...here are some other ideas I've been playing with.

Hey I gotta do something during these 80 hour work weeks!









as always I'm open to suggestions!
 

frig84

Observer
Have you given any thought to simply finding a wrecked out 250/350 with a good frame and drive train. Then swapping bodies.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
 

86scotty

Cynic
Dig the project, dig the name. Dig the 2nd take on graphics, but I would pass for stealth camping reasons as well. I know, plain white vans just seem to need something though. Watching this thread with interest!

:coffee:
 

Mwilliamshs

Explorer
Have you given any thought to simply finding a wrecked out 250/350 with a good frame and drive train. Then swapping bodies. and engine.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Yeah, I'd considered. Way more trouble finding the appropriate frame in condition equal to mine considering that:

a) pick-n-pull junkyards have the axles reasonably priced whereas vans of the appropriate year and weight class, priced low enough to make the swap/resale feasible are tough to find

b) axles fit in the bed of my pickup but 2 vans do not fit in my driveway (this should probably be #1)

c) will replace bushings, check kingpins (I'm hoping -1992 axles fit 1991- vans so balljoints replace kingpins), bearings, brakes, etc at the time of swap and any frame of the appropriate year likely needs the same attention, so swapping/building axles only is less time/labor than body swap+axle rebuilds.

d) my frame is kuh-leen (real spotless, daddy-o)
 
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Mwilliamshs

Explorer
THANKS

I appreciate the interest. Keeps me motivated to check this thread and find someone besides me thinking about it!

Things are at a stand-still. Hydroplaning female wrecked my truck I was planning to sell to fund Phase 1 of this project and finding used Ford Ranger parts to fix it (just body panels and a bumper) is basically impossible around here because a Ranger of any condition is way more likely to be Mexico-bound than junkyard-bound. I've seen folks sitting in the junkyard parking lot buying Rangers, Tacomas, etc off the backs of wreckers rather than let them be sold to the yards-very frustrating. When a vehicle is worth $3000, then it hits a wall, it's tough to stomach spending $1500 to fix it just to so you can then sell it for $3000...but it's worth practically nada as-is. Makes me kinda angry but so do taxes and barry hussein nobama.

I'll get this dumb truck fixed and sold and back on the van someday. Till then more planning and saving!
 
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Mwilliamshs

Explorer
Looks like the van has lost a fuel pump, I think. Didn't spend much time on diagnostics but I couldn't hear the pump run when the key was cycled and it cranked normally but never did start. I think (haven't dug into things yet had an already busy weekend then got called in to work) the van has 2 pumps so gotta figure out which is down, etc.
 

medicfernando

Adventurer
Cool project! Im not a big fan of graphics but thats the beauty of vehicles, you do what you like and thats all that matters. Good luck with the project!
 

Mwilliamshs

Explorer
Thanks for the comments! I'm probably skipping graphics for a good while. Considering a trip to South America in a year or so and don't think I want any attention-getters added before that. Maybe never. I'm getting more comfortable with a big white box than I expected.
 
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Mwilliamshs

Explorer
My boss quit, leaving me to fill in till a replacement is hired then school started back and I just haven't had time or cash to deal with the van. I attend college full-time and pay tuition and buy books out of pocket (no loans, grants, etc) so fun money is basically nonexistent during the school year. It sucks but I live entirely debt free and save heavily so when I graduate I can do what I want, no need to get a job just to pay back loans. Plan to move somewhere cheaper than the state capitol when I graduate, save up all I can in a year, and hit the PanAm highway in the Art for a year or so. If my progress seems slow now you know why.
 
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Mwilliamshs

Explorer
I'm still working on Art. Got a 2nd job (at a parts store!) so that should help (extra income AND employee discount) and also scored a nice compact stainless bar sink and Delta faucet for free and what I'm hoping turns out to be an A&E Trans Awn 2000. All I have of the awning is some very grainy pics but based on description it's very similar to the TA 2000: fits in a case, has flip latches, etc. It's wider than a garage door (it's hanging above one in the pics) so it's gotta be at least 9' long. Hope it's not too big but with 22' of van I think I can make it work.
 

Mwilliamshs

Explorer
I'm officially in the planning stages of a propane system for cooking and heating in the van now. Having determined the feasibility of refilling a US propane tank with either propane, butane, or a mix thereof while traveling Central America (which is darn good btw, check it: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/133982-Propane-Butane-adapters?p=1696201#post1696201) I've realized how important it is to be able to anticipate when you'll need to refill the tank. Since I'm starting from a clean slate here, no appliances or tank purchased yet, I can figure out what my ideal package would be and shop accordingly.

Appliances:

I'd like to have a stove. Two or three burners, propane/butane compatible, and either permanently installed or portable but usable while secured inside.

I'd like to have a heater. Propane/butane compatible and prefer permanently installed for safety concerns like tipping over, etc.

I'd like to have a permanently mounted tank. The portables can be more convenient for refilling or exchanging but I'd prefer to not exchange tanks when quality/safety is such a concern and in my opinion a portable tank's advantage in being filled is lost when you have only 1 vehicle to transport the tank anyway. The size of the tank and where to put securely it if not under the van as seen on motorhomes and Westfalias is also a concern. Permanently mounted under the van takes up no extra space and is most secure in my opinion.

Gasses and Tanks:

Okay so permanent tank, stove, and heater...but there are dozens of each available, so which ones to choose? This is where sizes and specifications come into play...as do math and guessing.

Pure propane, which I'll fill with in the US and anywhere else I can, has 91,500 BTUs per gallon and weighs 4.23 lbs per gallon.

Pure butane, which I'll avoid if possible due to elevation and temperature limitations, has 102,600 BTUs per gallon and weighs 4.86 lbs per gallon.

Mixtures of the two are just that, mixtures and since I'll not be starting each refill with a completely empty tank (hopefully!) the mixtures will change even from bulk tank to my tank to flame. I'll assume 70/30 (less propane). Remember, I already said guessing was involved.

Stove selection:

So, we know a little about the gasses but to know how much of either or both we need we must know how we'll use them. First, the stove. I'm WIDE open to whatever bargains popup but I've got to start somewhere so I've looked around what's likely to be available used and since I've no desire for an oven (permanent anyway, a folding Coleman oven might be cool) the 2 and 3 burner stoves from popup or tent style camping trailers seem to be the most prevalent on the used market due to the unfortunately disposable nature of these trailers. A common stove in this application is the Atwood Dv30. It's a 3 burner with piezo ignition (no matches!) and retails around $150 new but I see them on Craigslist and what not for ~$50.

Stove Consumption:

These stoves have 1 burner of 7,200 BTUs on max and 2 burners of 5,200 max BTUs. That's an expression of their ability to produce heat and is really a measure of power, which is energy over time, in this case BTU/hour so if all 3 burners were lit and turned all the way up the stove would produce 7,200 + 5,200 + 5,200 = 17,600 BTUs per hour. Now in reality I'd say common usage for me would be 1 burner, the big one, turned up maybe 75% and a 2nd on at maybe 50% such as when boiling eggs (big burner) and frying some bacon (small burner). So 7,200 x .75 = 5,400 and 5,200 x .50 = 2,600 and 5,400 + 2,600 = 8,000 BTUs for less than 15 minutes each morning (10 minutes eggs + unfrozen bacon). 8,000 BTU/hour x .25 hours (15 minutes) = 2,000 BTUs for breakfast. Add to that boiling 16 oz of water for coffee, before starting the eggs so it has time to steep of course, and I'm gonna get REAL technical here, cuz I enjoy the exercise. That 16oz of water (2 cups) is conveniently 1 lb and a BTU is conveniently the measure of how much heat it takes to raise the temperature of 1 lb of water by 1 degree, Fahrenheit. Let's say my tank is at 70F (inside the van, so heated in winter, shaded, insulated, and slightly cooled in summer) and to boil it I need it to reach 212 (not compensating for water purity or elevation) so 212 - 70 = 142 BTUs. Since we know that my thereotical stove's little burner(s) puts out 5,200 BTUs in a hour on high, 5,200 / 60 minutes = 86.66 BTU a minute on high and 142/87 = 1.6 mintues is all it would take to boil 16 oz of water on the small burner on high if all the surface area of the water was exposed to the heat and the thermal load of the pot/kettle was zero. For reality's sake (finally, right?!) let's say it takes 5 minutes or less on a small burner at 50%, so that's 2,600 BTUs/Hour x .083 percent of an hour (60/12 = 5 and 100/12 = 8.33) or 215.8 BTUs for coffee. Small # but not in significant over the course of a year. (365 x 216 = 78,840 BTUs for coffee per anum) Now add the 216 BTU for coffee to 2,000 for bacon and eggs, and pad it by 25% cuz I'm neither the best mathematician nor cook in the world, and you get 2,770 BTUs per morning.

Daily Cooking Consuption:

I'm not going to do that math for each meal of the year because I'm lazy and like a little variety in my diet but it does help my estimations to have done what I did because frankly I was prepared to estimate 3,000 BTUs per day for cooking and CLEARLY that would've been far too low. In light of the breakfast calculations I'll just double, make that triple, 2,770 and think I've got quite a healthy cushion considering I've already added 1/4 and lunches will likely be roadside cafes (or at least no coffee) and dinners will vary wildly between open fire steaks and restaurant fodder, so 2,770 x 3 = 8,310 BTUs per day for meals.

How long will a tank last?

I'll forego the heater math for now since this is already VERY long and go straight to the "how long will a tank last?" stuff. Since I don't have a tank yet I'll work backwards. I'd like to go ~90 days on a tank if I can (we'll find out together) so 90 x 8,400 (more padding) BTU per day = 756,000 BTUs per tank to last 90 days. I'd really only go maybe 60 before starting to watch for fuel but this gives some cushion and allows buying more than needed if I find it cheap or of excellent quality (high % of propane).

Now we already know that pure propane holds 91,500 BTUs per gallon so...

756,000 (90 day BTU supply) / 91,500 = 8.25 gallons of pure propane.

756,000 / 102,600 (pure butane) = 7.36 gallons for 90 days.

756,000 / 99,270 (70/30 mix, less propane) = 7.62 gallons of mix for 90 days

That 70/30 number is entirely a guess on my part at what mixes are likely available down south. I got the 99,270 by 91,500 (propane) / 10 = 9,150 (.1 gal BTU) x 3 (30%) = 27,450 (BTU in .3 Gal propane) and 102,600 (butane) / 10 = 10,260 x 7 (70%) = 71,820 (BTU is .7 Gal butane) and 27,450 + 71, 820 = 99, 270 BTU per gallon of 70 % Butane and 30% Propane. Again, a total WAG.

Given those 90 day requirements, which vary from 7.36 to 8.25 gallons I can find a tank and easily guess about how long it'll last me. I see Vanagon Westfalia tanks from time to time and I think they're 3.3 gallons (<45 days use for me) for the slightly larger aftermarket versions and a variety of 1980s-1990s class B motorhomes (swollen vans basically) have frame mounted tanks of ~8 gallons (~90 days use for me). If I just use the rough estimate of 1 gallon per 10 days I should be very very safe in not running out, barring use of the heater.
 
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