U.S. alternative to Seitz top hinged windows

TernOverland

Supporting Sponsor Ternoverland.com
I should clarify my post for future readers, I don't have any experience with the Ternoverland roof hatch other than looking at it at overland expo. It did appear to be more robust than the Dometic roof hatch. With the customer support from Ternoverland their roof hatch also is probably better bet than dometic, it's nice to see other manufactures step up and make a better product than Dometic.

Thank you Darwin. It hurts to be lumped with Dometic :p. Especially by someone well respected! We share no parts, factories, or engineering with Dometic. I'm always open to hear how we might improve our products. So far we have had zero problems with our roof hatches. They have been tested to over 5,000 open/close cycles without failure. Our support is,..well,... ask anyone who has needed it. We even monitor our cell phones on our days off in case someone in a far flung place crashes a window or something crazy.
 

VerMonsterRV

Gotta Be Nuts
Hi David, sent you an email last evening but just thought that your answer might be better here so all can see. I see that there are a couple of options for your windows that I did not notice before. They are the "window armor" and the "arctic thermal package". Could you give me some info about these 2 options? Also, how close of a color match are you cargo doors with the Total Composites fiberglass panels? Any thoughts on offering a fiberglass cargo door panel along with the aluminum one? I will first say that I have not seen any of your products in person (so anyone reading this will know) but I am a little concerned about the roof hatch being all plastic and getting hit with a branch. Any thoughts about that, maybe I am just over thinking things?

So for other products I would love to see is a "wet bath door", this picture was taken from Cloud9's build page and I hope they do not mind. Looks like a perfect door for a Total Composites box since I am planning on using his 1" honeycomb cored panels for the interior walls.

Wetbath Door.jpg

I know, lots of questions but I appreciate any answers you can provide. We now have the subframe on the truck but am being distracted by putting our sailboat away for the summer, so a bit of a delay building the truck.
 

mog

Kodiak Buckaroo
They are the "window armor"

Whoa, I missed that on the webpage, thanks!
2nd to photos and info would be greatly appreciated. (I'm looking for an excuse to do business with you again as your customer service it the Zenith of quality)
 

Victorian

Approved Vendor : Total Composites
I hope David doesn't mind if I chip in to answer the question about the color match with our panels.
The powder coating on the door and storage hatches do not match... No idea what RAL number PC they use on the Aluminum but ours is called Traffic White. If you like to get a perfect match, you may want to consult with an autobody shop before you install the doors. door.jpg
 

TernOverland

Supporting Sponsor Ternoverland.com
I appreciate the questions Jon :), Thank you Mog!

So, let me take them one by one.

The armor option is coming as soon as I can catch my breath and hammer out the details of how and where we might manufacture them. All of the mess with steel and aluminum tariffs have put a new ripple in things. Until we find a good avenue for manufacture, we can't set pricing. Realistically, they will not be available till the end of this year or early next year. The good news is that we will have them for every size window that we carry and they will be retrofittable for anyone who already has our windows. I have all the engineering done, so I'll see if I can get at least some CAD renderings on the website soon.
Here are some of the key features:
1. All aluminum and stainless construction
2. Viewing slots allow some light and a view to the outside when the armor is locked
3. Can be unlocked and opened from the inside using a unique keyless magnetic locking system that cannot be picked (no keys to lose)
4. The attractive frame remains permanently on the vehicle, but the actual cover can be removed easily when armor is not required.
5. extreme ease of use means that a camper full of windows can go from fully open to road ready in under 2 minutes, with nothing bulky to store. Just a closing rod used for those high windows.

These are designed to add security from humans, animals, and of course brush and branches.

The thermal package is also on hold, for similar reasons. The kit will include some parts to reduce cold bridging and will also include insulated soft panels that will fill the space created by the closed blind. Something similar could be made at home, but we will offer a nicely finished product for those who would rather buy them ready made. This kit is designed for people who truly see severely cold conditions. The windows as they are, are very good in most cold condition.

Jon, We spoke some time ago about the possibility of a wet door, and I haven't forgotten. If enough people want one, we could produce it. We would make a custom size of our cargo access door, and have it made with a single latch instead of two. These doors seal extremely well, so I don't see any issues with using them for a bath. The only problem is that we would need at least 10 committed buyers to do the special run. We do have a 600 x 1500 cargo door which could be produced in smaller quantities. It's wide enough (about 24"), but it is 5 feet tall. If you positioned it a foot off the ground, which makes sense in a bath, it could be adapted. We would just have to order it properly configured, and adapt our own inside handle mechanism. If anyone else is interested, this would be the time to let us know. We will be receiving another container in the late fall. We would need to know if people need right or left hinge, as that is not easily reversible.
No plans for a fiberglass panel on the cargo doors.

As for the color, as Andreas said, the colors are a bit off between the Total Composite panels and our components. There are a million shades of white, believe it or not. If a perfect match is desired, they would not be hard to paint prior to installation.

The roof hatches are ABS and acrylic. They could withstand light brushes, but if heavier impacts are anticipated, I would install a cage around it. What some people have done is cut their roof rack around the hatch, so that the hatch is below the level of the rack. That gives it solid protection.

I think I have answered everything....
 
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VerMonsterRV

Gotta Be Nuts
Hey David, thanks for the info and you did answer all the questions. But now I have another :). One of the things I have been thinking about is security of the habitat. That is one of the reasons I inquired about the "armor option". One other option I am considering is copying what Neil on Cloud9 did (once again Neil, thanks for the great build site). I am attaching a picture from the Cloud 9 build site on what it looks like they did for added security. I think they used the Seitz windows but added some stainless bars. Any thoughts on me being able to do something similar with your windows?

Cloud 9 Window Bars.jpg
 

Victorian

Approved Vendor : Total Composites
Jon,

I have been thinking about window safety also. When traveling in certain parts of Europe or South America it make makes sense for more safety measures. In the USA or Canada I would not worry about it too much. 1. both countries are very safe 2. the windows are so high up that anyone breaking in needs to drag a ladder around with them.
In my mind, it's more important not to have a "ladder" or other climbing contraption installed on your truck. Because a roof hatch would be an easy access point.
 

1aquaholic

Adventurer
Jon you're last paragraph of your last post bummed me out. I was planning on incorporating a couple of fixed ladders into my rack for easy roof access, I guess I'll have to rethink that.....

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

Coachgeo

Explorer
Jon you're last paragraph of your last post bummed me out. I was planning on incorporating a couple of fixed ladders into my rack for easy roof access, I guess I'll have to rethink that.....

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
easy solution.... hinged door that covers the ladder. Just like all the ones you see at fast food joints and other buildings. Search via favorite search engine for "ladder security door cover guard"
 

VerMonsterRV

Gotta Be Nuts
Jon,

I have been thinking about window safety also. When traveling in certain parts of Europe or South America it make makes sense for more safety measures. In the USA or Canada I would not worry about it too much. 1. both countries are very safe 2. the windows are so high up that anyone breaking in needs to drag a ladder around with them.
In my mind, it's more important not to have a "ladder" or other climbing contraption installed on your truck. Because a roof hatch would be an easy access point.

I agree, about North America (though in the cities...). We just finished sailing around the world and now have set the goal to drive around. My biggest concern is when we have to leave the truck unattended, either for shipping or storage while we visit "home". This is the only time we have had theft issues in our travels. Unfortunately you even need to plan for small children to be used for the theft (I am sure adults put them up to it). We had friends leave a very small hatch open in the bathroom on their boat for ventilation. No way an adult could fit through. When they returned to the boat in the afternoon a bunch of electronics went missing with no other sign of forced entry.
 

TernOverland

Supporting Sponsor Ternoverland.com
Jon,
I have imported several panels of aluminum security mesh, that is strong, light and attractive. It is used as a security panel on RV doors. I can sell that by the square foot. Unfortunately the pictures are on my computer, and it died. I'll be getting it back in a few days. All of these things are just to slow people down you know. They can take an axe to the walls and chop a hole in minutes.
 

Coachgeo

Explorer
hmm....... actually...... sounds like a good place to store a sand ladder.... gives it a dual purpose.... ladder block... and well.... as a "sand" ladder.
 

TernOverland

Supporting Sponsor Ternoverland.com
Ok, so here is the security mesh that I have. I have a limited supply, and with the new tarifs, I'm not sure if getting more will be feasible. The mesh is .278" thick, so it is much more substantial than perforated metal. It is very rigid. It looks to me like it is forged into shape. It is quite light, which is nice, and it is easy to look through. Anyway, I grabbed it because it looked cool to me, and I have plans for some of it. If anyone is interested, email me at info@ternoverland.com. This is not on the website. It's one of those "behind the counter" things. You can cut through it with heavy wire cutters, but again, it's about slowing people down.

Here is another tip! I don't know if this film is compatible with acrylic, but I intend to find out. Check out Ace Security films! It is an adhesive film that can be applied to glass and makes it bullet proof to handgun bullets up to .44 magnum. It is not cheap, but I would consider it strongly as part of your security plan. If it proves feasible, and we can get a break on cost, we will be offering it in small quantities

DSCN0418_0133.JPG
 

mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
Updated resources;

KCT is still around; http://www.kctechnik.com/en/index.html
All the "big players" seem to use them; http://www.kctechnik.com/en/retailers.html
(interestingly, the US dealer, GXV, refers to the KCT's as their own "Armor Vision" windows, so if you hear the name Armor Vision, know they're really KCT).

Outbound is still around; http://www.outbound.eu/en/index.php

EuroVision via ArcticTern in USA; https://www.ternoverland.com/arctic-tern-window

Can someone confirm details?;
KCT are dual pane(clear tempered safety glass), steel reinforced frame, what outer frame?
Outbound are dual pane(tinted glazed glass), aluminum window frame, fiberglass/polyester outer frame, built-in pressure system?
EuroVision/ArcticTern are dual pane(acrylic), aluminum frame.
 
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bahncamperworks

Supporting Sponsor: Bahn Camper Works
We have an order of Outbound windows coming in next month and I am happy to report on them when I have them, we are looking into being a NA distributor for them if we determine that they are a good alternative to other US available options. The other windows we use and can sell are polyvision, dual pane acrylic and similar quality to the seitz. The only rub is that they not come with a shade/screen system. There are some systems out there that we used but they tend to be more expensive than the windows. The advantage is that they are recessed or hidden in the wall panels so you don't end up with a bulky plastic window trim on the inside of the camper.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
 

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