U500 crash, two firefighters killed

toylandcruiser

Expedition Leader
He asked questions about the seat belts. Nowhere did he say there wasn't an issue with the seat belts.
huh? he asked questions and nowhere did he say it wasnt an issue?

"A question, who said anything about seat belt anchor failure ? In all I have searched and read, there was no mention of that.
The tire blowout is only an opinion so far. If you have the information on the seat belt theory, please post it. Thank you for posting
the important part, a UNIMOG and 2 1st responders died. I also agree about saving future lives. That makes perfect sense. Transparency is what the presidential race is all touting anyways. High time to exercise that thought.

I find it odd so many here have read the post, and said nothing.

Cheers Snowcat."
 

kerry

Expedition Leader
huh? he asked questions and nowhere did he say it wasnt an issue?

"A question, who said anything about seat belt anchor failure ? In all I have searched and read, there was no mention of that.
The tire blowout is only an opinion so far. If you have the information on the seat belt theory, please post it. Thank you for posting
the important part, a UNIMOG and 2 1st responders died. I also agree about saving future lives. That makes perfect sense. Transparency is what the presidential race is all touting anyways. High time to exercise that thought.

I find it odd so many here have read the post, and said nothing.

Cheers Snowcat."
That's correct. Nowhere in that post did he say the seat belt wasn't an issue. He asked questions about the source of the info. How is that saying it was not an issue?
 

toylandcruiser

Expedition Leader
That's correct. Nowhere in that post did he say the seat belt wasn't an issue. He asked questions about the source of the info. How is that saying it was not an issue?
ok guy. ITS ALL SPECULATION he's pulling **** out of his ***. Posting pics from a totally irrelevant accident as evidence of something. Until the official word comes out end this thread. Id be willing to be the cards at BLM failed. Not a truck issue.
 

kerry

Expedition Leader
It's not all speculation. There is a clear report from the truck behind that a tire failed. How is that speculation? It's empirical evidence. Erwin z was trying to get at the source for the claim that the seat belts failed. What's wrong with asking questions like that. If you think it's all speculation, why say is not a truck issue?
 

toylandcruiser

Expedition Leader
It's not all speculation. There is a clear report from the truck behind that a tire failed. How is that speculation? It's empirical evidence. Erwin z was trying to get at the source for the claim that the seat belts failed. What's wrong with asking questions like that. If you think it's all speculation, why say is not a truck issue?
he is implying its 100% impeccable evidence it failed.
 

toylandcruiser

Expedition Leader
I wasn't there, but there were people there.
Maybe one of them posted an issue with the seat belt failure and explained it fully.
However, there were autopsy's. Photos galore were taken. None made public.
Someone towed the wreck.

The tire caused the wreck. It didn't kill them. Something else did.
The dirty word, LIABILITY comes out. Someone must pay. Who ?
There are a lot of players sitting at the table.
Lets not forget, aside from the evidence that the investigation can recreate the scene, there is a witness front and center, the survivor. Three other vehicles were in that group. What did they say ?

The differences between the MB unimog elsewhere and the Daimler/Chrysler Unimog North American model are huge. The seatbelts are the major difference. The shoulder anchors are not in the seat. Who told Daimler to make the change to put mount them on the plastic cab ?
Should all be recalled to put them back in the seat ? Any other manufacturer would be told. Reminds me of the Ford Pinto in a way.
SPECULATION!!!!!!!!!! Shut your mouth until it comes out man. Damn
 

mogwildRW1

Adventurer
me or him?
Him, he's been banned on a Unimog forum for the same thing, that's him on the audio barrading some poor worker. Give it a listen.

Then if you want even more, just Google his name to find his other..."cases" http://caselaw.canada.globe24h.com/0/0/ontario/human-rights-tribunal-of-ontario/2012/12/12/zimmermann-v-tay-township-2012-hrto-2325.shtml

Example:
Application states that the by-law officers explained that the vertical siding did not meet the CIP “heritage” criteria, and the applicant (Erwin Z) threatened to paint his façade with his own heritage which included murals of the Berlin Wall and the swastika.
 
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kerry

Expedition Leader
Troll or not, his point is a good one. If I owned one I'd be looking closely at the seat belt anchors.
 

kerry

Expedition Leader
Thanks. Now that you bring up that example I have a recollection of reading that thread.
 

mogwildRW1

Adventurer
Edit: accidently deleted my post that was in-between Kerry's two above, editing on mobile is a bit clunky. It was:

Never did say he was wrong, just making sure everyone knows what they are getting into arguing or commenting on this thread with him. He did this (cryptic posting, leading up to how "the law" or "the OPP" is out to get him, his Unimog was seized and sold, everyone's wrong despite the 10 charges he was convicted of) in another thread on expo that was locked and deleted. Unimog forum was the same thing, few other places on the web as well. Any Unimog web presence will attract him and he'll start the cycle over. No sense in going down the rabbit hole with him, it always ends up the same trip

Here's some more reading
 
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kerry

Expedition Leader
Ironically, when you google the address in your 'more reading' link, the photo which appears is of a building being sided.
 

kerry

Expedition Leader
That Swedish truck is very interesting. U500 owners might be well served by giving thought to what it implies. I would think the lawyers for the two dead firefighters would also find that image valuable.
 

unirover

Observer
It's always a tragedy when there are fatalities involved in an accident but often no one person/agency/manufacturer is to blame. The cab met NHTSA regulations and Daimler Chrysler conformed to those regs. Sweden has higher truck rate fatalities than Germany or the USA so roll bars and fortified cabs are not always going to save lives. Ironically, in Germany, fire fighting Unimogs don't even come with seat belts! I think there is only so much you can expect seat belts (and roll bars) to do when a fully laden 15 ton truck rolls, especially at speed.

As an aside, I had a nasty blow out on the right rear tire of my U1300L. I think it literally blew the rear wheel off the ground. I was on a very windy mountain road going about 50mph at the time. I came very close to rolling. I'd like to say it was driver skill but really it was probably two things; the Unimog was very lightly loaded, and because the ditches were so steep and deep, I tried to keep it on the road as opposed to immediately pulling over.

I do not think it is a coincidence that roll overs happen on the right rear. After the blowout the first reaction is to pull over, while still moving. The embankment of the road, both the steepness and the usual softness, combined with the fact the vehicle is already unstable causes the vehicle to start to roll or at least gives that feeling. The tendency then is to get back on the road which just makes matter worse. Add an already loaded vehicle (usually in the rear) which are often loaded way too top heavy, and you have the perfect circumstances for a roll over. Driver training can go a long way to reducing those risks, both in terms of loading the vehicle and what to do when you find yourself close to roll over situations.

In my case it was not the Unimog (also not CTIS) or lack of training but negligence on my part. The tires were 20 years old with first stages of dry rot. While the treads were great, the actual tires were suspect. Also I was driving too fast (ironically I had a school bus on my *****) and I hit a pot hole and then bam!, the rear end gave out. Ironically when I finally found a place to pull over (1/4 mile up the road) the school bus just passed me and kept going. One benefit of steel rims is the lip it survived driving on the pavement and I was able to pound the rim relatively straight -still holds air to this day;) I don't think you could do that with Hutchinson's.
 
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